Frank vs. Koch

[Man Soo Lee]

From beat writer Scot Gregor in a Daily Herald year-in-review piece:

This story was never reported, but enough details have emerged and enough time has passed to reveal a minor scrap between White Sox designated hitter Frank Thomas and relief pitcher Billy Koch.

On a late July bus ride to the team hotel in Kansas City, Koch was acting like, well, Koch. Even though he was in the midst of a horrible season, the reliever continued his incessant poking and jabbing. Problem was, he picked the wrong time to pick on Thomas.

Some heated words were exchanged and some punches were thrown, but Koch and Thomas finally cooled off by the time they reached the hotel lobby.

"I was just trying to get him fired up,'' Koch said. "I didn't think he'd get that mad.''

Not a big deal, but maybe incidents like this led to Ozzie's comments about needing Frank to be a better teammate next year.

[SluggersAway]

Does anyone else have stories like this of Koch "poking and jabbing" other folks on the team or the opposing side?

(Maybe he ain't so bad after all)

[gosox41]

Originally posted by SluggersAway
Does anyone else have stories like this of Koch "poking and jabbing" other folks on the team or the opposing side?

(Maybe he ain't so bad after all)

Or maybe Koch should shut up and pitch better. That's great that he hasn't lost his personality that everyone claims makes him so great in the clubhouse, but one thing I believe is that if you're unable to walk the walk, then don't talk the talk. Last year the only person Koch should have been taking jabs at was himself. He needs to shut up and correct why his fastball lost 10MPH and is straight as an arrow.

Any Frank bashers going to blame Frank for this?

Bob

[Tragg]

The Sox should just give Koch to the Mets. We would never sign him at his salary, so just consider him a free agent.
Send Maggs to the Mariners in the deal in another string.
Sign a starter and find 2 more relievers.
Competitive team, on budget

[jshanahanjr]

Did Frank cry when Koch slapped him? Remember when Davey Martinez pinned him down at Yankee Stadium when Frank was going after Ventura?

[jeremyb1]

Originally posted by gosox41
Or maybe Koch should shut up and pitch better. That's great that he hasn't lost his personality that everyone claims makes him so great in the clubhouse, but one thing I believe is that if you're unable to walk the walk, then don't talk the talk. Last year the only person Koch should have been taking jabs at was himself. He needs to shut up and correct why his fastball lost 10MPH and is straight as an arrow.

Any Frank bashers going to blame Frank for this?

Bob

If Koch was playing around and Frank threw punches at him I'm certainly going to place a lot of the blame with Frank and I'm not a Frank basher. I have no problem with a guy that likes to poke fun and lighten things up. How well he's pitching is a seperate issue in my opinion. If Frank is that uptight in the clubhouse and is causing tension then I do have a problem with that.

[boog_alou]

What is up with a pitcher having one of the worst seasons in baseball "poking and jabbing" verbally with another player? When you stink that bad, it is time to shut the hell up. I think Billy needs to try leading by example, by playing well on the field. I certainly wouldn't respond well to a horrible pitcher trying to "fire me up" with his verbal BS.

[Brian26]

Originally posted by jshanahanjr
Did Frank cry when Koch slapped him? Remember when Davey Martinez pinned him down at Yankee Stadium when Frank was going after Ventura?

Actually, I'm not sure I remember this story. This had to have been in '95 or '96 if Martinez was on the team. Any other details?

[poorme]

Wonder if Frank got in any good hits. Funny.

[jshanahanjr]

It was August 1996 and Frank was yelling @ the ump about a called third strike. Ventura told Frank to cool it because the team couldn't afford him thrown out of the game. Frank went after Ventura and Martinez put Frank in a leg lock and sat him on the bench.

[boog_alou]

Originally posted by poorme
Wonder if Frank got in any good hits. Funny.

He's lost some fist speed in recent years, and can't handle the inside jab. But, he's still got a good power right hook.

[jabrch]

Originally posted by gosox41
Any Frank bashers going to blame Frank for this?

For throwing a hissyfit when a teammate is making fun of you? Yes Bob, I do. Part of being in a MLB clubhouse is the regular poking and jabs that men make at eachother. If Thomas can't handle it and has to get in a physical confrontation with someone over that, then yes, he should be blamed for it?

Any Frank-Blowers want to give him a free pass for poor behaviour cuz he can hit?

[Deadguy]

Originally posted by jshanahanjr
It was August 1996 and Frank was yelling @ the ump about a called third strike. Ventura told Frank to cool it because the team couldn't afford him thrown out of the game. Frank went after Ventura and Martinez put Frank in a leg lock and sat him on the bench.

I remember that game at Yankee Stadium, but I don't remember Martinez pinning Frank down. The cameras did pick up the altercation, and I did see Thomas shove Ventura. It was kind of reminiscent of the altercation between Bonds and Kent in 2002.

BTW, Koch should just ****. Show some respect to one of the veterans on the team with the longest tenure. He should have a feel for who to poke fun at, and who doesn't like joking around.

[Deadguy]

Originally posted by jabrch


Any Frank-Blowers want to give him a free pass for poor behaviour cuz he can hit?

I'd give a free pass to Aaron Rowand, Willie Harris, Miguel Olivo, Joe Crede, Jose Valentin, etc. Koch was in the clubhouse for months, and he should have gotten a feel for the personalities of the players, and who likes to joke around and who doesn't.

Frank obviously doesn't take criticism too well, and if it's coming from someone who was having as terrible a season as Koch was, I don't blame him for getting upset.

[hold2dibber]

Originally posted by jabrch
For throwing a hissyfit when a teammate is making fun of you? Yes Bob, I do. Part of being in a MLB clubhouse is the regular poking and jabs that men make at eachother. If Thomas can't handle it and has to get in a physical confrontation with someone over that, then yes, he should be blamed for it?

Any Frank-Blowers want to give him a free pass for poor behaviour cuz he can hit?

Ha! What a crock. You have no idea what Koch said, how offensive it was or how it escalated, yet it's all Frank's fault? Just about everyone on earth has a boiling point when verbal "jabbing" becomes so irritating that you lose your cool. Does Frank have a low "boiling point"? I don't know and neither do you. It sounds obvious to me that Koch was the instigator. Did Frank overreact? Again, I don't know and neither do you. We weren't there. So simply saying its Frank's fault seems absurd to me (as does simply saying it's Koch's fault).