White Sox Interactive Forums
Sox Clubhouse
 Soxogram: 
And away we go...

Welcome
Go Back   White Sox Interactive Forums > Baseball Discussions > Sox Clubhouse
Home Chat Stats Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-16-2017, 09:57 PM
sunofgold sunofgold is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,221
Default Rebuilding WHITE SOX Division and Wild Card Race watch

WC -3.5 from MIN
Div -4.5 from CLE

We are playing pretty good considered an unbalanced schedule (ton of road game). Our RD is +7 . No Rodon and no Shields and other pitching injuries. Off year for Q.

No rule against rebuilding and winning.

Big series against Twins upcoming,

#WSRAW

Last edited by sunofgold; 06-18-2017 at 09:48 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-30-2017, 11:26 PM
sunofgold sunofgold is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,221
Default Wildcard

Only 5.5 GB in the wildcard. Anything can happen.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:04 AM
Noneck Noneck is offline
The Blind Squirrel that finally found an acorn.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Nw Side
Posts: 10,310
Default

And tied for the worse record in the A.L.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:48 AM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Palos Hills, IL
Posts: 8,007
Default

Run differential by month:

April: +15 (98, 83)
May: +4 (140, 136)
June -30 (123, 153)

At the end of April, James Shields, Derek Holland, and Miguel Gonzalez each were top-10 starters in the AL in terms of ERA. When that situation predictably ended with the arrival of warmer weather, the team's fortunes reverted to the level we expected to see before the season started.

It is plain to see that the rotation is in shambles, so it's not really worth discussing, but something that is worth mentioning is that the lineup as a whole does not hit enough balls out of the ballpark. The team is only 10th in the AL in runs scored despite being 5th in batting average because of a decided lack of power (13th in extra-base hits).
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horsemaster Fred
This is the major leagues so get it how you live and let’s fight tomorrow.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-01-2017, 02:03 AM
TDog TDog is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Modesto, California
Posts: 17,832
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
Run differential by month:

April: +15 (98, 83)
May: +4 (140, 136)
June -30 (123, 153)

At the end of April, James Shields, Derek Holland, and Miguel Gonzalez each were top-10 starters in the AL in terms of ERA. When that situation predictably ended with the arrival of warmer weather, the team's fortunes reverted to the level we expected to see before the season started.

It is plain to see that the rotation is in shambles, so it's not really worth discussing, but something that is worth mentioning is that the lineup as a whole does not hit enough balls out of the ballpark. The team is only 10th in the AL in runs scored despite being 5th in batting average because of a decided lack of power (13th in extra-base hits).
The 2017 White Sox were put together to have an in-shambles rotation and and a thin bullpen. The offense is better than most expected, and so is the record. If the trade-off for home runs is more contact and higher batting averages, the Sox are probably better off and would be able to win more games if they played in closer games where they could manufacture meaningful runs.

I thought the Sox had a good chance of beating the Yankees Wednesday night when I saw that Cabrera cut the New York lead to 3-2 in the fifth with two on and none out. The next time I checked the game, it was just the next half inning, and the Yankees were leading 8-2.

The White Sox are going to win more games than fans projected here during that offseason because the better teams have a lot of flaws. But, obviously, if you don't try to build a winner, you even weaken major league team in the offseason, you aren't going to contend. And the lack of putting any effort into building a winner will keep the White Sox rebuilding for a while.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-01-2017, 03:29 AM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Palos Hills, IL
Posts: 8,007
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog
The White Sox are going to win more games than fans projected here during that offseason because the better teams have a lot of flaws.
Not likely. They are on pace to go 71-91, they have trended noticeably downward with each successive month, and they are likely to be sellers at the trade deadline. Evening out the road-heavy schedule is not likely to make much difference to a team that is capable of getting swept at home by teams like the A's and had a below-.500 season record at home as recently as Thursday morning.

To quote the immortal Dennis Green:

"They are who we THOUGHT they were!"

Just for reference, here are the predicted win totals from the preseason prediction thread. It looks like many people were right on target.

70, 70, 82, 70, 65, 72, 75, 78, 77, 68, 66, 67, 75, 74, 68, 69, 64, 75, 67, 65, 71, 71, 70, 70, 68
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-01-2017, 04:57 AM
Grzegorz Grzegorz is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Western Suburbs
Posts: 2,700
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
The White Sox are going to win more games than fans projected here during that offseason because the better teams have a lot of flaws. But, obviously, if you don't try to build a winner, you even weaken major league team in the offseason, you aren't going to contend. And the lack of putting any effort into building a winner will keep the White Sox rebuilding for a while.
I don't know about that. This pitching staff is not very good and the defense is poor at best.

Those are the two components winning baseball is built on.

That said I like Renteria's sitting of Anderson and Davidson. Anderson's attitude is refreshing as is his approach to adding in extra work w/McEwing. My assumption is Davidson is working extra too.

I am positive about Renteria: he's been a plus.
__________________
“There were a few hard rules, but everybody was unique, and he understood that. George’s great strength was he didn’t overcoach. There’s no place for panic on the mound.” - Jim Palmer on George Bamberger “Arms and the man,” Sports Illustrated, April 19, 2004

Last edited by Grzegorz; 07-01-2017 at 05:21 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:01 PM
TDog TDog is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Modesto, California
Posts: 17,832
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
Not likely. They are on pace to go 71-91, they have trended noticeably downward with each successive month, and they are likely to be sellers at the trade deadline. Evening out the road-heavy schedule is not likely to make much difference to a team that is capable of getting swept at home by teams like the A's and had a below-.500 season record at home as recently as Thursday morning.

To quote the immortal Dennis Green:

"They are who we THOUGHT they were!"

Just for reference, here are the predicted win totals from the preseason prediction thread. It looks like many people were right on target.

70, 70, 82, 70, 65, 72, 75, 78, 77, 68, 66, 67, 75, 74, 68, 69, 64, 75, 67, 65, 71, 71, 70, 70, 68
Like many, I ignored the predictions thread. There was a lot of talk before the season began about the White Sox losing 100 games and securing the worst record in baseball.

The idea that the team hovering around 10 games below .500 halfway through the season, which would be on apace to be 20 games below .500 for the full season -- 90-loss territory. You would expect that as prospect come up, you'll see see more wins, but sometimes it doesn't work that way

There are games they are going to win because other teams aren't competent enough to win every day. This is a frustrating team to watch. I'm not sure why Avisail Garcia had to get hit with a pitch to get a day off when he had just one hit on the homestand.

Still,congratulating yourself for being right about a team that did nothing to improve its pitching after a season where the nightmarish bullpen was a fatal flaw, isn't much of a take. Bad teams in major league baseball can be occasionally good, and .500 doesn't put you out of contention in the American League.

But the GM should be working to improve the team, and he seems too interested in rebuilding with players with no successful major league experience to do that.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:14 PM
RCWHITESOX's Avatar
RCWHITESOX RCWHITESOX is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Placentia, California
Posts: 1,779
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunofgold View Post
WC -3.5 from MIN
Div -4.5 from CLE

We are playing pretty good considered an unbalanced schedule (ton of road game). Our RD is +7 . No Rodon and no Shields and other pitching injuries. Off year for Q.

No rule against rebuilding and winning.

Big series against Twins upcoming,

#WSRAW
I absolutely give you credit for your undying faith, but the facts are in that the only race the Sox are in is for the best draft pick possible. I was like you at one time and I'm sure many of the posters here were also.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:44 PM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sebring Florida
Posts: 10,030
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunofgold View Post
WC -3.5 from MIN
Div -4.5 from CLE

We are playing pretty good considered an unbalanced schedule (ton of road game). Our RD is +7 . No Rodon and no Shields and other pitching injuries. Off year for Q.

No rule against rebuilding and winning.

Big series against Twins upcoming,

#WSRAW
I'd love to agree with you but we just don't have the starting pitching to make the post-season though I do think the hitting is pretty decent this year.
__________________
Coming up to bat for our White Sox is the Mighty Mite, Nelson Fox.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-01-2017, 01:01 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chubbuck, Idaho
Posts: 31,245
Default

It really doesn't matter much what happens on the field (as strange as that sounds).

Hahn has repeatedly told the media what the plan is, JR is on-board with it, the Sox are probably going to trade at least a few guys, they can't stay healthy and don't have the pitching.

It is what it is, which means a high draft pick next June.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-01-2017, 01:42 PM
slavko slavko is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: North Suburban
Posts: 7,147
Default

Ya know, I posted that Engel would never hit a fastball with that stance and he singled on a 100 MPH one to lead off last night's winning rally. The difference is that he has the bat moving when the pitcher starts his motion now and two weeks ago he held it away from his body until the ball was by him. There's some coaching going on.
__________________
Slogan for 2017: The kids can tank.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-01-2017, 03:14 PM
guillensdisciple guillensdisciple is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 16,843
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
It really doesn't matter much what happens on the field (as strange as that sounds).

Hahn has repeatedly told the media what the plan is, JR is on-board with it, the Sox are probably going to trade at least a few guys, they can't stay healthy and don't have the pitching.

It is what it is, which means a high draft pick next June.
Ye. Honestly, at least this seems like a planned rebuild. I thought all of reinsdorf's frachises were incompetent, especially after the bulls trade of butler, but this is feeling right to me. Stay the course.
__________________
http://arsenalist.com/video/?id=xh2dx6

Greatest Arsenal goal I have ever witnessed. Chills to this day watching it.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-01-2017, 04:15 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Deep in the heart of Dixie
Posts: 5,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
Not likely. They are on pace to go 71-91, they have trended noticeably downward with each successive month, and they are likely to be sellers at the trade deadline. Evening out the road-heavy schedule is not likely to make much difference to a team that is capable of getting swept at home by teams like the A's and had a below-.500 season record at home as recently as Thursday morning.

To quote the immortal Dennis Green:

"They are who we THOUGHT they were!"

Just for reference, here are the predicted win totals from the preseason prediction thread. It looks like many people were right on target.

70, 70, 82, 70, 65, 72, 75, 78, 77, 68, 66, 67, 75, 74, 68, 69, 64, 75, 67, 65, 71, 71, 70, 70, 68
Mean 70.68 Median 70 Mode 70
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-01-2017, 04:27 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Deep in the heart of Dixie
Posts: 5,249
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDog View Post
Like many, I ignored the predictions thread. There was a lot of talk before the season began about the White Sox losing 100 games and securing the worst record in baseball.

The idea that the team hovering around 10 games below .500 halfway through the season, which would be on apace to be 20 games below .500 for the full season -- 90-loss territory. You would expect that as prospect come up, you'll see see more wins, but sometimes it doesn't work that way

There are games they are going to win because other teams aren't competent enough to win every day. This is a frustrating team to watch. I'm not sure why Avisail Garcia had to get hit with a pitch to get a day off when he had just one hit on the homestand.

Still,congratulating yourself for being right about a team that did nothing to improve its pitching after a season where the nightmarish bullpen was a fatal flaw, isn't much of a take. Bad teams in major league baseball can be occasionally good, and .500 doesn't put you out of contention in the American League.

But the GM should be working to improve the team, and he seems too interested in rebuilding with players with no successful major league experience to do that.
I grant you have been right before when going against the grain. I have no doubt that you have a broad base of knowledge beyond baseball. It sounds like you have had an interesting or at the very least well traveled career. I have agreed with you, disagreed and occasionally stuck up for you against the howling mob. I never met you but I wlll take a chance. At this point you are sounding both preachy and a bit churlish. The Sox have a plan. It may work and it may not. It may get aborted due to circumstances like having no willing trade partners or changing their minds and going back to the same old same old that never worked. Whatever they were doing wasn't working. I could use up the remaining bandwidth on the internet repeating that statement ad nauseum. So this is where we are. It's even harder for us old farts who remember 17 straight winning seasons and sound fundamental baseball. Nothing lasts and things continually change. Without breaking the rules here look at the world today, change at warp speed. Just got to roll with it. Enough of my rant and hope you did not take offense, just one old Sox fan to another not quite as old.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Forum Jump




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:52 PM.




Design by: Michelle

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Site-specific editorial/photos Copyright ©2001 - 2008 White Sox Interactive. All rights reserved.