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  #151  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:13 AM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
Don't forget the ability to cheat the draft by offering over slot $$$ to any player that fell to later rounds.
When it was within the rules, it was not really cheating. I mean, shouldn't they be commended for investing in the draft/minors?
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  #152  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:15 AM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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Originally Posted by cards press box View Post
Last year, in 403 at bats, Dunn hit .226 against righties with 28 HR and 64 RBI and in 99 at bats, Konerko hit .313 against lefties with 5 HR and 16 RBI.

Combined in 2013 (which was a down year for Konerko), in 502 at bats of lefty v. righty and righty v. lefty, they hit a combined .243 with 33 HR and 80 RBI.
Exactly, therefore Konerko would have to hit about .350 to pull them up to .260. Actually, it would have only got them to .250...

If Konerko went 35 for 100, they would have gone 126 for 503 for a .250 average.
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  #153  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:17 AM
slavko slavko is offline
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Originally Posted by BainesHOF View Post
Love this trade. I can't believe we received such a good prospect for Reed, who was nothing special. His competiveness was great, but his stuff wasn't. I can't remember a Sox closer blowing so many big leads.

Now if Hahn can remove the nonsense that is De Aza, Ramirez, Dunn and Beckham...
His best stuff, when he could control it, was a tight slider that broke in on the fists of LH hitters. That is why LH hitters had a worse BA off him than RH hitters. His other stuff was blah and when he wasn't pinpoint, KABLOOWIE! He's better than he looked at the end of the year when he was tired out. AZ got a working part.
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  #154  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:17 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Originally Posted by oldcomiskey View Post
whats mediocre about a guy who saved 40 games on a team that won only 63
Saves are only one metric, and a lot of saves are luck-related in the sense that there are opportunities, and a team that stunk that much likely has a lot of close games.

His metrics show some level of doubt that he can be "elite."
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  #155  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:19 AM
34 Inch Stick 34 Inch Stick is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
Saves are only one metric, and a lot of saves are luck-related in the sense that there are opportunities, and a team that stunk that much likely has a lot of close games.

His metrics show some level of doubt that he can be "elite."
There is a lot of room between mediocre and elite. I think both teams got themselves nice players
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  #156  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:21 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Originally Posted by 34 Inch Stick View Post
There is a lot of room between mediocre and elite. I think both teams got themselves nice players
No question. Reed is not a mediocre reliever. He's good.
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  #157  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:26 AM
hawkjt hawkjt is offline
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Clearly, this group of fans are tired of the same old faces on the Sox...it seems.
I hope they do not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Guys like Beckham, Gilespie and Phegley are not problems on this team.

DeAza was a fav until last year, but he could rebound...still he probably needs to go.

Keppinger could rebound, but I do not like his game much anyway.

This team might lose even more games next year, but it will probably look different...is that really enough for Sox fans?
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  #158  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:34 AM
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asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by PeoriaSoxFan View Post
Keppinger and Gillaspie can go fight it out with Royce Clayton, Mark Teahen, et. al. for worst White Sox player of all time. Beckham gets one more chance in my view, but I believe Semien may be the real deal.
Gillaspie does not belong in this group. He's just ok, but no worse than that. I'd much rather keep him than Keppinger.

As for the trade itself, I like it, if for no other reason it is a continuation of Hahn's efforts this offseason to shore up our most glaring weakness: lack of MLB-ready or near MLB-ready prospects who will likely contribute in the near future. I liked Reed, but didn't like his tentativeness at times. He is a quality pitcher that Arizona should feel good about getting.
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  #159  
Old 12-17-2013, 10:43 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by hawkjt View Post

This team might lose even more games next year, but it will probably look different...is that really enough for Sox fans?
We might, unless we rush pitchers, which we better not do. We may have to go through another year of Veal in the bullpen, for example.
But we'll get better pretty quickly.
We actually have some of our own talent that should be ready by 2015 or 2016 (which is why I'm not so anxious to get rid of Beckham unless he will bring us a real upgrade at another position; he's not terrible and we have middle infield prospects, that I think need at least another year in the minors). We should have a real manager in here by 2015.
And we have a GM that knows how to execute trades.
Things are looking up.
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  #160  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:04 AM
kobo kobo is offline
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Originally Posted by hawkjt View Post
Clearly, this group of fans are tired of the same old faces on the Sox...it seems.
I hope they do not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Guys like Beckham, Gilespie and Phegley are not problems on this team.

DeAza was a fav until last year, but he could rebound...still he probably needs to go.

Keppinger could rebound, but I do not like his game much anyway.

This team might lose even more games next year, but it will probably look different...is that really enough for Sox fans?
It's enough for me. Finally, after years of being fed bull**** about contending every year and watching KW make trades for guys he really liked instead of for guys who could actually help and contribute, the team seems to be moving in a specific direction. They're getting younger, there doesn't seem to be an emphasis on guys who can hit the long ball, and they seem to realize now you have to invest in the draft and international signings. I like everything that has been transpiring and already know I will be going to more games next year than I did this past season. I'm also considering heading out to AZ in March to catch some spring training games which I haven't done for a few years.
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  #161  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:14 AM
eriqjaffe eriqjaffe is offline
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Originally Posted by asindc View Post
Gillaspie does not belong in this group. He's just ok, but no worse than that. I'd much rather keep him than Keppinger.
Keppinger, flawed as he is, at least has more defensive versatility. Gillaspie is a third baseman, and has never played any position other than third and first since he was drafted. A roster that is carrying a dedicated part-time DH has to place a premium on bench players who can reliably (or at least passably) play multiple positions. DH and first base are two positions where the 2014 Sox will not be lacking for depth.
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  #162  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:17 AM
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asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by eriqjaffe View Post
Keppinger, flawed as he is, at least has more defensive versatility. Gillaspie is a third baseman, and has never played any position other than third and first since he was drafted. A roster that is carrying a dedicated part-time DH has to place a premium on bench players who can reliably (or at least passably) play multiple positions. DH and first base are two positions where the 2014 Sox will not be lacking for depth.
If 2014 was the only season worth planning for, I'd agree with you. I see more medium-term value in Gillaspie.
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  #163  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:19 AM
cards press box cards press box is offline
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Originally Posted by TheVulture View Post
Exactly, therefore Konerko would have to hit about .350 to pull them up to .260. Actually, it would have only got them to .250...

If Konerko went 35 for 100, they would have gone 126 for 503 for a .250 average.
O.K., let me rephrase my statement: I am more than fine with a DH platoon that hits .243 with 33 HR and 80 RBI in 502 at bats.

My guess is that barring injury, the Dunn/Konerko platoon will get more than 502 at bats in 2014 and will exceed the 33 HR and 80 RBI marks.
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  #164  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:21 AM
cards press box cards press box is offline
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Originally Posted by asindc View Post
If 2014 was the only season worth planning for, I'd agree with you. I see more medium-term value in Gillaspie.
I read somewhere that the Sox might view Gillaspie as a Ross Gload type, except that he gives the team depth at 1B and 3B.

I think that Gillaspie will be on the 2014 Sox roster but I expect that Keppinger will be dealt. I also think that the Sox will bring in another catcher.
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  #165  
Old 12-17-2013, 11:22 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by asindc View Post
If 2014 was the only season worth planning for, I'd agree with you. I see more medium-term value in Gillaspie.
Does anyone know what Gillaspie's contract situation is? Can the Sox stash him away in AAA this year? Feels like he might have more roster value on the 2015 team that will be sans Dunn and Konerko. Or, rather, if the Sox start Davidson in AAA to start the year, what are the chances Gillaspie can be sent down if Davidson warrants a mid-season promotion?

That said, Conor Gillaspie sucks and I'm not going to lose sleep over it.
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