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  #16  
Old 10-24-2018, 11:56 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is online now
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This isn't the point of the original post in this thread, but it's related. I'd like to see the Sox - because we all know they won't be contenders next year - try something different with their bullpen. No more of this "let's burn through three pitchers to play matchups to get through the seventh inning" business.



It's time to see if young Sox pitchers can hack it as starters or relievers.


In the rotation, go with Rodon, Lopez, Giolito, a veteran innings eater (maybe Shields on a cheaper contract?) and one among Adams/Stephens/Guerrero.



As for the bullpen, I want Fulmer and Covey each to pitch 2-3 max effort innings max effort, every third day. Bummer, Burr, Hamilton, Fry, and Frare all can be mixed and matched, but they each ought to pitch a full inning during each outing, regardless of L/R matchups.


This allows Davidson to be the emergency mop-up guy.


I realize this leaves Nate Jones as the odd man out. Maybe he'll have a little bit of value to team that could use a cost-controlled veteran reliever this offseason.


Having 12 pitchers thus allows the Sox to carry 12 position players, with Davidson as the 25th man.


As for Davidson's bat, he's much better against LHP (.882 OPS in 2018, .823 OPS in 2015-2017). Meanwhile, while he can switch-hit, Yolmer is much better hitting left-handed (.724 OPS in 2018; .729 OPS in 2015-2017). So I'd have those two platoon at 3B, in the hopes that one or both of them might become interesting to a contender in July.


As for DH, let's let Palka DH exclusively v. RHP, and - again in an effort to build some trade value - have Avi DH against LHP, and get 50% of the RF starts v. RHP. This would reduce the injury risk to Avi.


Keep in mind that none of this is designed to get the Sox to win games in 2019. It is designed to figure out what we have among our young players, and to build as much trade value as possible for players who don't figure to be with us when we get good again.


Since Davidson could go either way, let's see what he can do as both a 13th pitcher and as a part-time third baseman against LHP.
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  #17  
Old 10-24-2018, 04:50 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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If Davidson ends up succeeding at this pitching endeavor, is it against the rules for an AL pitcher to move to a position after he is done pitching and stay in the game? I know a pinch-hitter who pinch-hits for a position player and then pitches forfeits the DH for the remainder of the game, but if Davidson went in to pitch, would he be able to take the place of a 3B or 1B later in the game and take that spot in the order? Hypothetically, the DH was never changed in any way.
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  #18  
Old 10-24-2018, 05:05 PM
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If Davidson ends up succeeding at this pitching endeavor, is it against the rules for an AL pitcher to move to a position after he is done pitching and stay in the game? I know a pinch-hitter who pinch-hits for a position player and then pitches forfeits the DH for the remainder of the game, but if Davidson went in to pitch, would he be able to take the place of a 3B or 1B later in the game and take that spot in the order? Hypothetically, the DH was never changed in any way.
Under the American League DH rule, a pitcher who moves to play a position would forfeit the DH for his team. He would take the place in the batting order of the defensive player he replaced and the pitcher would hit in the DH spot.

This is addressed in MLB Rule 5.11, most relevantly in paragraph 8.

Rule 5.10 specifies that if a pitcher leaves the game, say in the 6th inning, he cannot return to the game in the 8th to play a position or pinch hit, but I don't believe that is what you were asking.

Under the NCAA rules, the pitcher can serve as his own designated hitter, remaining in the lineup after he is replaced on the mound. Additionally, a designated hitter can come in to pitch in relief.
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  #19  
Old 10-24-2018, 07:13 PM
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Under the American League DH rule, a pitcher who moves to play a position would forfeit the DH for his team. He would take the place in the batting order of the defensive player he replaced and the pitcher would hit in the DH spot.

This is addressed in MLB Rule 5.11, most relevantly in paragraph 8.

Rule 5.10 specifies that if a pitcher leaves the game, say in the 6th inning, he cannot return to the game in the 8th to play a position or pinch hit, but I don't believe that is what you were asking.

Under the NCAA rules, the pitcher can serve as his own designated hitter, remaining in the lineup after he is replaced on the mound. Additionally, a designated hitter can come in to pitch in relief.
Interesting. What about the flip side? When Davidson starts the game at 3B and then takes the mound, is the DH forfeited and the new 3B hits in the slot of the player who started the game as DH or does the DH remain and the new 3B doesn't bat (as if he's the pitcher)?
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  #20  
Old 10-24-2018, 11:46 PM
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Interesting. What about the flip side? When Davidson starts the game at 3B and then takes the mound, is the DH forfeited and the new 3B hits in the slot of the player who started the game as DH or does the DH remain and the new 3B doesn't bat (as if he's the pitcher)?

A starting position player who changes position keeps his spot in the batting order. If the third baseman takes the mound, the pitcher becomes a part of the batting order. The replacement third baseman would take the place of the designated hitter in the lineup.
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  #21  
Old 10-25-2018, 08:46 AM
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A starting position player who changes position keeps his spot in the batting order. If the third baseman takes the mound, the pitcher becomes a part of the batting order. The replacement third baseman would take the place of the designated hitter in the lineup.

Thanks.
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  #22  
Old 10-27-2018, 11:50 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Keep in mind that none of this is designed to get the Sox to win games in 2019. It is designed to figure out what we have among our young players, and to build as much trade value as possible for players who don't figure to be with us when we get good again.
So the question is whether platooning is the best way to develop them. If the Sox were trying to win, then platooning them is the answer. At this point, they are fairly mature players, so it may be best to accept their splits and platoon them anyway. Not sure.
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  #23  
Old 10-27-2018, 11:55 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is online now
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So the question is whether platooning is the best way to develop them. If the Sox were trying to win, then platooning them is the answer. At this point, they are fairly mature players, so it may be best to accept their splits and platoon them anyway. Not sure.
I think the bullpen arms are young enough that we need to have them pitch full innings, regardless of whether the batters they face are right-handed or left-handed, so that we can see what they do.

As for position players like Davidson, Yolmer, and Avi, I think they have been around long enough that we know what they are with the bat. Yolmer hits better against RHP; Avi and Davidson hit better against LHP. The age/years of service also puts them at the upper edge of being part of our contention window, so to me itís worthwhile to platoon them and thus inflate their stats, in the hopes that we can deal them.
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  #24  
Old 10-27-2018, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
The age/years of service also puts them at the upper edge of being part of our contention window, so to me itís worthwhile to platoon them and thus inflate their stats, in the hopes that we can deal them.
Teams know that they are platoon inflated and the trade value reflects that.
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  #25  
Old 10-27-2018, 04:31 PM
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Teams know that they are platoon inflated and the trade value reflects that.
And at the deadline, a team may need a RH or LH bat, and Davidson or Garcia or Yolmer might be just what they need.
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  #26  
Old 11-28-2018, 01:05 PM
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Brian Anderson made the switch, as well.
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  #27  
Old 11-28-2018, 01:42 PM
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Brian Anderson made the switch, as well.
I would say he made an attempt to switch.

Never pitched at The Show. https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...nderbr03.shtml
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  #28  
Old 11-28-2018, 02:12 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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Good luck to him, will be a story to follow. I remember hearing I think it was Todd Helton years ago was a great pitcher before focusing entirely on hitting and he asked to pitch and was told ok pack his backs for single A.
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  #29  
Old 11-28-2018, 02:47 PM
Zisk77 Zisk77 is offline
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Good luck to him, will be a story to follow. I remember hearing I think it was Todd Helton years ago was a great pitcher before focusing entirely on hitting and he asked to pitch and was told ok pack his backs for single A.
When John olerud first arrived in the big leagues he contemplated pitching as well. He supposedly had a wicked left handed knuckle ball.
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  #30  
Old 11-30-2018, 04:12 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Apparently, Davidson is being non-tendered.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2018/...-davidson.html

My gut says this is a prelude to a Moustakas deal.
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