White Sox Interactive Forums
Sox Clubhouse
 Soxogram: 
GO SOX! DSNB!

Welcome
Go Back   White Sox Interactive Forums > Baseball Discussions > Sox Clubhouse
Home Chat Stats Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 04-13-2018, 06:52 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 19,272
Blog Entries: 1
Default

This is a rebuilding team, filled with young players who need major league reps, and veteran filler. We know what to expect with the veteran filler.

Expecting the young players, as talented as they are, to perform like All Stars is unrealistic.

Even Tim Anderson, while this is his third season with the Sox, didnít spend many years in the minors and didnít play a lot of baseball as an amateur. Heís still young, learning, and developing.

Moncada is in his first April in the majors in a decidedly non-tropical climate. Heís proven everything he needs to prove in the minors; he just needs to learn to make adjustments to major league pitchers adjusting to him, and that can only happen in major league games.

It was completely justifiable to criticize Alexei Ramirez, for instance, for his boneheaded plays in his fourth season with the Sox. By then, he was a veteran player who by then should have adapted both to the cold and to major league pitchers.

Weíve been patient with Yolmer Sanchez, perhaps because no one ever had any pretense of All Star expectations for him. And now, heís becoming a decent major league starting infielder. Heís a White Sox organizational developmental success. Letís give Anderson and Moncada, and Giolito for that matter, the same courtesy of patience. If not for them, then four ourselves and our sanity.

Letís all get a grip here, and accept that the 2018 Sox always were destined for 90+ losses.
__________________
The universe is the practical joke of the General at the expense of the Particular, quoth Frater Perdurabo, and laughed. The disciples nearest him wept, seeing the Universal Sorrow. Others laughed, seeing the Universal Joke. Others wept. Others laughed. Others wept because they couldn't see the Joke, and others laughed lest they should be thought not to see the Joke. But though FRATER laughed openly, he wept secretly; and really he neither laughed nor wept. Nor did he mean what he said.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-13-2018, 07:08 AM
guillensdisciple guillensdisciple is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 17,326
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shes View Post
Giolito has now looked like a AA pitcher three starts in a row. Bad stuff, bad command, low velo. You have to hope it's just the weather.

Thankfully the other two pieces we got for Eaton are looking fantastic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
I watched a couple of his outings from spring training, and he was terrific in those games. He seems to have left his stuff in Arizona.

I don't think the 95-96 mph fastball is every coming back, but in spring training, he was commanding pitches and throwing his breaking ball for strikes. That has not been the case in the early going of regular-season play.

It's been disappointing that Giolito has been mediocre at best in each of his three starts. Mediocre is probably being kind.
He pitched well yesterday.

Bummer ruined the state line. Should have been taken out in the seventh.
__________________
http://arsenalist.com/video/?id=xh2dx6

Greatest Arsenal goal I have ever witnessed. Chills to this day watching it.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-13-2018, 07:44 AM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Antioch, IL
Posts: 6,566
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
This is a rebuilding team, filled with young players who need major league reps, and veteran filler. We know what to expect with the veteran filler.

Expecting the young players, as talented as they are, to perform like All Stars is unrealistic.

Even Tim Anderson, while this is his third season with the Sox, didnít spend many years in the minors and didnít play a lot of baseball as an amateur. Heís still young, learning, and developing.

Moncada is in his first April in the majors in a decidedly non-tropical climate. Heís proven everything he needs to prove in the minors; he just needs to learn to make adjustments to major league pitchers adjusting to him, and that can only happen in major league games.

It was completely justifiable to criticize Alexei Ramirez, for instance, for his boneheaded plays in his fourth season with the Sox. By then, he was a veteran player who by then should have adapted both to the cold and to major league pitchers.

Weíve been patient with Yolmer Sanchez, perhaps because no one ever had any pretense of All Star expectations for him. And now, heís becoming a decent major league starting infielder. Heís a White Sox organizational developmental success. Letís give Anderson and Moncada, and Giolito for that matter, the same courtesy of patience. If not for them, then four ourselves and our sanity.

Letís all get a grip here, and accept that the 2018 Sox always were destined for 90+ losses.
Thank you for the sanity check. I think there's also a real difference between being a young player/rookie as part of a team with veterans (2017, White Sox up untll trade deadline) or in August/September (2017, post trade deadline) and now being part of a team of mostly young/rookie players coming out of spring training.

No excuses for any of this- but it may be some time before they get their legs underneath them.
__________________
TomBradley72
http://sabr.org/bioproj/person/334c0314
Players that are an important part of the rebuild:
Anderson, Fulmer, Giolito, Lopez, Moncada
Players that might be or could have trade value:
Abreu, Bummer, Castillo, Davidson, Delmonico, A. Garcia, Jones, Sanchez
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-13-2018, 08:21 AM
guillensdisciple guillensdisciple is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 17,326
Default

I think White Sox fans are, fairly and unfairly, expecting the world of Moncada because of what we gave up to get him. We're not treating him like a normal prospect, and that's not a healthy way to go. I have my moments with him, and I am sure you have seen me panic on the boards. Still, at the end of the day, I really think a smarter approach would be to ease up on him and let him figure it out.

Very rare that a consensus number one overall talent doesn't pan out one way or the other.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-13-2018, 08:23 AM
Zakath Zakath is offline
Co-Winner WSI 2016 & 2018 NFL Pick'em Contests
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: In the water barrel off the now-finished Borman Expressway
Posts: 8,850
Default

Almost 30% of the runs we've scored this year came in one 5-inning stretch in KC on Opening Day.

Not a good stat when you're 12 games into the season. But at least we're not the Reds, who are 2-10, -40 run differential, and have only scored 38 all year.
__________________
I want my $2.

Obligatory 2017 attendance record: 0-1 (5-3 loss to Oakland on 6/25)

If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 04-13-2018, 09:48 AM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 14,676
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by guillensdisciple View Post
I think White Sox fans are, fairly and unfairly, expecting the world of Moncada because of what we gave up to get him. We're not treating him like a normal prospect, and that's not a healthy way to go. I have my moments with him, and I am sure you have seen me panic on the boards. Still, at the end of the day, I really think a smarter approach would be to ease up on him and let him figure it out.

Very rare that a consensus number one overall talent doesn't pan out one way or the other.

The Moncada thing to me goes beyond who we traded. It more has to do with his status as a prospect. He was the #1 damn prospect in the game and is considered near can't miss material. We've never had something like this to be excited for. Not even Frank Thomas was the top dog prospect in the game. It's alarming to not only see his swing and miss trend but also some of his lackadaisical play on defense. It worries me more not knowing if this team is equipped with the staff to help him get right.


Ask most Sox fans around, Eloy, Kopech, Robert draw more excitement at this point (based on the unknown) and Moncada is closing in on just being another guy of the bunch next to Tim Anderson. I don't think that's fair since it's early, but I do caution because of the lack of history of this team ever doing much good with young position player talent.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 04-13-2018, 10:05 AM
hoosiersoxfan hoosiersoxfan is offline
Co-Winner WSI 2018 NFL Pick'em Contest
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,119
Default

It's been 12 games in mostly 30 degree weather. Can we at least let the calendar flip to May before jumping all over the guy?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 04-13-2018, 10:45 AM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 14,676
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoosiersoxfan View Post
It's been 12 games in mostly 30 degree weather. Can we at least let the calendar flip to May before jumping all over the guy?
Sox opponents are playing under the same weather conditions.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 04-13-2018, 10:47 AM
voodoochile's Avatar
voodoochile voodoochile is offline
Soda Jerk/U.P.W./Lester Pooh Bear
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 53,965
Blog Entries: 9
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
Sox opponents are playing under the same weather conditions.
Which is great, but each player is an individual. These trite, off the cuff replies completely ignore the fact that young players who might well be playing their first games in these conditions ever could well be prone to struggling.

Is it really that surprising that Latin-American hitters might struggle trying to hit when the temperature is around freezing, especially in their first few games doing it?
__________________

Riding shotgun on the Sox bandwagon since before there was an Internet...
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 04-13-2018, 11:15 AM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chubbuck, Idaho
Posts: 32,194
Default

Story on Moncada today in the Sun-Times with quotes:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/...-early-season/
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 04-13-2018, 11:30 AM
cards press box cards press box is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,694
Default

I agree with Frater and Tom Bradley. No one should expect the rebuild to be complete 12 games into the 2018 season. And, if I may add, the recent performances of Dylan Cease, Michael Kopech and Dane Dunning throwing no-hit ball into the 7th are cause for great optimism. I was at spring training this year and, from what I saw, the rebuild is going very well. My advice: take the Sox' growing pains in 2018 with a grain of salt.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 04-13-2018, 12:20 PM
shes shes is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,999
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by guillensdisciple View Post
He pitched well yesterday.

Bummer ruined the state line. Should have been taken out in the seventh.
He really didn't. He was all over the place missing his spots, wasn't inducing many whiffs, and his fastball was sitting at 90 most of the game. Like I said, he looked like an unseasoned minor leaguer. I'll grant you that he looked decent in the fifth and sixth, but that was it. He was hot garbage in every other inning last night.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 04-13-2018, 12:36 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lakeview
Posts: 22,353
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shes View Post
He really didn't. He was all over the place missing his spots, wasn't inducing many whiffs, and his fastball was sitting at 90 most of the game. Like I said, he looked like an unseasoned minor leaguer. I'll grant you that he looked decent in the fifth and sixth, but that was it. He was hot garbage in every other inning last night.
This is true. His performances thus far are uninspiring, and yesterday was not good.
__________________
Ridiculousness across all sports:

(1) "You have no valid opinion because you never played the game."
(2) "Stats are irrelevant. This guy just doesn't know how to win."
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 04-13-2018, 01:23 PM
Harry Chappas Harry Chappas is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Logan Square
Posts: 978
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shes View Post
He really didn't. He was all over the place missing his spots, wasn't inducing many whiffs, and his fastball was sitting at 90 most of the game. Like I said, he looked like an unseasoned minor leaguer. I'll grant you that he looked decent in the fifth and sixth, but that was it. He was hot garbage in every other inning last night.
I didn't watch the game but he scattered 5 hits in 6 1/3 so it's not like he got lit up either. Much like Fulmer, I think their control is a work in progress which is typical for young pitchers. I'll be more discouraged if they're getting pounded.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 04-13-2018, 01:56 PM
IronFisk's Avatar
IronFisk IronFisk is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Clown Point, IN
Posts: 1,068
Default

Hahn has said it best about 2018 to look at individuals, and not the team as a whole. I also realize those key individuals are starting slow, but young talent takes time to mold. Call it weather, or nerves, but getting used to big league pitching doesn't happen overnight.

If by August they are still having issues, then I'll start to grumble - then again we have some really decent prospects ready to come up as well.

All-in-all I'm good.
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Forum Jump




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:58 PM.




Design by: Michelle

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Site-specific editorial/photos Copyright ©2001 - 2008 White Sox Interactive. All rights reserved.