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  #31  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:06 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
No one would have moved to the outfield. Machado would have played 3B, Anderson and Moncada would have stayed at SS and 2B respectively, Yolmer would have moved to the bench, and Rondon would have been gone.

Yolmer’s 0.4 WAR would be replaced by Machado’s 1.9 WAR, and Rondon’s -0.2 WAR would have been replaced by Yolmer’s 0.4 WAR. Machado would have been a 200-point OPS upgrade to the everyday lineup and provided some much-needed thump to the middle of this order.

There is absolutely no way we are a better baseball team without Manny Machado than we would have been with him.
You're assuming that Machado would have stepped aside to 3B and give SS to Tim Anderson.

The demands he had were he wanted to play SS wherever he landed. The Padres somehow convinced him that Tatis was the real deal, and he bought into that . The Sox had nothing to sell Tim Anderson on, he's been a terrible ML SS up until this year.
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  #32  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:14 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Originally Posted by HomeFish View Post
... They could easily be 3-4 games over .500 at this point.

Not with this pitching staff.

But if you're looking for production from an infielder this year, you could have gotten more from Moustakas for a fraction of the commitment.
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  #33  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:29 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
You're assuming that Machado would have stepped aside to 3B and give SS to Tim Anderson.

The demands he had were he wanted to play SS wherever he landed. The Padres somehow convinced him that Tatis was the real deal, and he bought into that . The Sox had nothing to sell Tim Anderson on, he's been a terrible ML SS up until this year.
The Padres convinced him with a nine-figure deal that began with a “3.” We tried to convince him with Yonder Alonso, Jon Jay, and a $50 million pay cut.
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  #34  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:32 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
The Padres convinced him with a nine-figure deal that began with a “3.” We tried to convince him with Yonder Alonso, Jon Jay, and a $50 million pay cut.
That's not the point.

If money is equal, there is no way he's stepping aside for Tim Anderson at SS.
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  #35  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:36 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by LoveYourSuit View Post
That's not the point.

If money is equal, there is no way he's stepping aside for Tim Anderson at SS.
We have no way of knowing that. I can just as easily say that if the White Sox just offered him $300 million from the get-go instead of slow-playing it and trying to save a few bucks, the Padres never even enter the fray.
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  #36  
Old 06-19-2019, 10:58 PM
JermaineDye05 JermaineDye05 is offline
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if the White Sox just offered him $300 million from the get-go instead of slow-playing it and trying to save a few bucks, the Padres never even enter the fray.
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  #37  
Old 06-19-2019, 11:06 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
We have no way of knowing that. I can just as easily say that if the White Sox just offered him $300 million from the get-go instead of slow-playing it and trying to save a few bucks, the Padres never even enter the fray.

That would have been a bad move for the White Sox. The $300 million commitment will prove to be a bad move for the Padres.
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  #38  
Old 06-20-2019, 12:58 AM
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Dear lord, talk about a rehashing of the same stuff that was talked to death at the beginning of the season.
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  #39  
Old 06-20-2019, 04:18 AM
Grzegorz Grzegorz is offline
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post
That would have been a bad move for the White Sox. The $300 million commitment will prove to be a bad move for the Padres.
Of course it will be a bad move for the Padres. But you forget this was all about others spending someone else's money. Being that it's JR's money spend all the more. After all money is manna is it not?
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Originally Posted by Nellie_Fox View Post
Dear lord, talk about a rehashing of the same stuff that was talked to death at the beginning of the season.
As if the current team does not have a number of issues to discuss. Today's issues are a little tougher to debate than the appeal to emotion the MM issue resurrects.
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  #40  
Old 06-20-2019, 08:14 AM
Heffalump Heffalump is online now
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Originally Posted by mohoney View Post
cole will set the market. The white sox do not sign players who set the market. They sign whoever is left in the next tier down when the dust settles.

With regards to signing cole, i see the white sox doing what they always do:

1) claiming to be “in the mix” to keep the team’s name in the news during the winter

2) offering 70 or 80 cents on the dollar

3) losing cole to another team who doesn’t treat the mlb free agency process like putting in a lowball bid on a house

4) trying to suggest that signing the less-talented pitcher we sign instead of cole is somehow a better overall choice for the team.
this
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  #41  
Old 06-20-2019, 08:15 AM
GoSox2K3 GoSox2K3 is offline
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Originally Posted by Nellie_Fox View Post
Dear lord, talk about a rehashing of the same stuff that was talked to death at the beginning of the season.
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Originally Posted by Grzegorz View Post
As if the current team does not have a number of issues to discuss. Today's issues are a little tougher to debate than the appeal to emotion the MM issue resurrects.
Bingo!

Lots of beating to death the whole Machado fiasco and lots of crystal balling declaring with certainty that the Sox will never acquire anyone good in the future.

We've got Moncada and Anderson anchoring the left side of the infield and both looking pretty good this year. Time to move on.

I'll worry about the Sox roster moves for next offseason after the final out of World Series this fall.
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  #42  
Old 06-20-2019, 08:32 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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I really think the point of the original post was to express satisfaction with the progress of Anderson and Moncada, who continue to develop into legitimate hitters who also play important defensive positions on the left side of the infield.
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  #43  
Old 06-20-2019, 08:55 AM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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I really disagree with the assumption that Yoan could have stayed at 2nd base and been a quality 2nd baseman- he was pretty bad last year- and I think he would have really struggled at 2nd creating a problem in the longer term (exacerbated when Madrigal is ready).

I think Yoan will be an All Star caliber 3rd baseman without being the tool that Machado is and allowing us to avoid all the potential issues of a 10 year, $300M deal. I'll take Moncada's .860 OPS, at age 24 with the $30M/season available to solve real problems vs. Machado's .816 OPS at age 26 along with the commitment to $270M after this season.
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  #44  
Old 06-20-2019, 09:09 AM
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voodoochile voodoochile is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
I really think the point of the original post was to express satisfaction with the progress of Anderson and Moncada, who continue to develop into legitimate hitters who also play important defensive positions on the left side of the infield.
And if the title was "How about that Tim and Yoan?" or something similar this thread would have survived and references to Machado would have been kicked to the curb. But when the OP decided to bring up Manny in the title the rest was inevitable.
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  #45  
Old 06-20-2019, 09:16 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
Cole will set the market. The White Sox do not sign players who set the market. They sign whoever is left in the next tier down when the dust settles.

With regards to signing Cole, I see the White Sox doing what they always do:

1) Claiming to be “in the mix” to keep the team’s name in the news during the winter

2) Offering 70 or 80 cents on the dollar

3) Losing Cole to another team who doesn’t treat the MLB free agency process like putting in a lowball bid on a house

4) Trying to suggest that signing the less-talented pitcher we sign instead of Cole is somehow a better overall choice for the team.
All 4 of these "points" have zero factual basis. Just made up stories based on innuendo and gut feelings...
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