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  #91  
Old 12-05-2017, 01:49 PM
Andrew C White Andrew C White is offline
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Originally Posted by Mohoney View Post
Honestly though, neither does Abreu. 1B and middle-of-the-order production for two non-competitive seasons is no more urgent of a “need” than anything else, so you may as well cash in the asset at its highest value. That may take place now, or that may take place in July if nothing materializes this offseason, but waiting until 2019 will result in a loss of trade value.

Besides, elite cost-controlled pitching is always a need.
I hear you on that but I'm also going to disagree a little bit because I value the presence of an on-field leader of his nature during the rebuild. Abreu takes his job very seriously and I think the younger guys, not just the Cubans, see that and take it seriously.

I also think Abreu will still be producing at a high level in 2019-2020-2021, his age 32-33-34 seasons. The White Sox should be entering contention during those years and having a veteran presence in the middle of line-up will help take some of the pressure off of young guys like Jiminez and Robert.

That said, if someone makes an offer that provides overwhelming return in prospects then I agree the Sox should cash out at peak value. I just don't see something along the lines of Bradley-Groome being better than keeping him. In my opinion he fills short and long term needs while they don't.

(And yes, pitching is always a need but I don't see Groome as anything particularly special that we couldn't obtain in a better deal or by giving up less)
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  #92  
Old 12-06-2017, 04:54 PM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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Since Benintendi is already in the lineup anyway, the real difference is between Bradley Jr. and the new corner OF inserted into the lineup. The sum total of the two defensive downgrades, plus whatever offensive downgrade may exist, would be the basis for comparison.

Once again, I’m not interested in keeping Bradley Jr. once he is acquired. I don’t think Hahn is, either.
What's to stop them from acquiring a superior hitter in left though? Wouldnt be too difficult; Bradley is a below league average hitter. And imagine the numbers Abreu would put up bashing that wall in Fenway along with practically non existent foul territory. Probably hit .350
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  #93  
Old 12-09-2017, 01:02 PM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is offline
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Does Stanton to the Yankees make the Red Sox more desperate for Abreu?
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  #94  
Old 12-09-2017, 01:09 PM
ChiSoxNationPres ChiSoxNationPres is offline
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Does Stanton to the Yankees make the Red Sox more desperate for Abreu?
Doubt it. This was never really a match.
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  #95  
Old 12-09-2017, 01:17 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by A. Cavatica
Does Stanton to the Yankees make the Red Sox more desperate for Abreu?
Hopefully. The only other big-time option would be to drive a Brinkís truck to Eric Hosmerís house.
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  #96  
Old 12-09-2017, 01:32 PM
KRS1 KRS1 is offline
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Really don't want Bradley. He's the type of hitter we should be getting away from, IMHO. I'd much rather just keep Abreu unless they throw in something substantial.
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  #97  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:17 PM
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Really don't want Bradley. He's the type of hitter we should be getting away from, IMHO. I'd much rather just keep Abreu unless they throw in something substantial.
Agreed. I think his leadership - especially as a well respected Cuban star will pay big dividends for this team down the road, IMO.
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  #98  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:31 PM
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Agreed. I think his leadership - especially as a well respected Cuban star will pay big dividends for this team down the road, IMO.
Not to mention, he still is by far the most productive hitter the Sox have. Leadership alone isn't a reason to keep a guy, but you look at the numbers Abreu puts up year after year with very little help and it's hard not to be impressed.

It's not that I wouldn't trade him -- everything has a price. But I don't think Boston can meet that price.
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  #99  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:40 PM
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Not to mention, he still is by far the most productive hitter the Sox have. Leadership alone isn't a reason to keep a guy, but you look at the numbers Abreu puts up year after year with very little help and it's hard not to be impressed.

It's not that I wouldn't trade him -- everything has a price. But I don't think Boston can meet that price.
You are correct. I should have made it clearer. I am not advocating keeping him just for his intangibles, but it's one more reason to be sure the offer is a great one.
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  #100  
Old 12-10-2017, 01:29 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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You are correct. I should have made it clearer. I am not advocating keeping him just for his intangibles, but it's one more reason to be sure the offer is a great one.
I hope he stays- this team played ~.500 ball after the trade deadline, and I believe with a full season of Tim Anderson (after grief counseling), Moncada, Castillo behind the plate, promising young pitchers in the rotation, etc.- that this team can start to move up the ladder back to contention (not saying they will contend in 2018, but I think 2019 is a possibility for a Wild Card). And without moving away from the rebuild strategy- start to "learn how to win", and build on the fan interest generated in 2017.

IF we get blown way with an offer- I would make the move- BUT, he doesn't have long term, club favorable contract (like Sale, Eaton and Quintana) that created alot of trade value for those guys- I don't anticipate 2 years of Abreu control at arbitration salary levels makes him that attractive to other teams.

When we're contending again- we'll be looking for that veteran presence in the clubhouse and on the field- might as well keep the guy that fills the bill to a tee- vs. going back out on the market to find him in 2 years.
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  #101  
Old 12-10-2017, 03:16 PM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72
When we're contending again- we'll be looking for that veteran presence in the clubhouse and on the field- might as well keep the guy that fills the bill to a tee- vs. going back out on the market to find him in 2 years.
If you want Abreu past 2019, then youíre going back out on the market regardless. At that point, the White Sox are just another potential employer for Abreu, just like any other team in baseball. Itís not like the White Sox can count on having some sort of preferred status when it comes to negotiations.
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  #102  
Old 12-11-2017, 02:06 AM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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If you want Abreu past 2019, then you’re going back out on the market regardless. At that point, the White Sox are just another potential employer for Abreu, just like any other team in baseball. It’s not like the White Sox can count on having some sort of preferred status when it comes to negotiations.
Not if they sign him now or in near future. My impression is that Abreu likes the status he has built within the organization and his mentorship role he has developed, considers himself something of an uncle to Moncada, prefers stability, and is fully on board with the rebuild, so I disagree that the Sox are not in a favorable position. Not everybody is motivated to maximize their finances at the expense of everything else.
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  #103  
Old 12-11-2017, 02:29 AM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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Really don't want Bradley. He's the type of hitter we should be getting away from, IMHO. I'd much rather just keep Abreu unless they throw in something substantial.
I'd take him for his defense if I could hide him in the bottom of the order, but I wouldn't give up Abreu for him. Sorry but I cant help but imagine a 2020 lineup something like:

Anderson SS
Moncada 2b
Robert CF
Jimenez LF
Abreu 1b/DH
Garcia RF
Maybe Abreu retains 3rd slot, maybe Garcia slides down. Other third comprised of:
Collins/Zavala/Castillo C
Burger/Gillaspie/collins 1b/dh/3b
Possible free agent 3b, Rutherford or Basabe in OF with Garcia to DH, guys I'm forgetting, etc

Last edited by TheVulture; 12-11-2017 at 02:40 AM.
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  #104  
Old 12-11-2017, 09:41 AM
Mohoney Mohoney is offline
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Originally Posted by TheVulture
Not if they sign him now or in near future. My impression is that Abreu likes the status he has built within the organization and his mentorship role he has developed, considers himself something of an uncle to Moncada, prefers stability, and is fully on board with the rebuild, so I disagree that the Sox are not in a favorable position. Not everybody is motivated to maximize their finances at the expense of everything else.
All of this is conjecture, though. I have no idea where this concept of Abreu signing a below-market-value extension comes from, but it sure seems to have taken on a life of its own around here. I hope this is not being considered an important part of the post-rebuild success strategy.
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  #105  
Old 12-11-2017, 10:42 AM
kittle42 kittle42 is online now
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All of this is conjecture, though. I have no idea where this concept of Abreu signing a below-market-value extension comes from, but it sure seems to have taken on a life of its own around here. I hope this is not being considered an important part of the post-rebuild success strategy.
Itís just home cooking fan thought. It happens with every team.
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