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  #46  
Old 06-08-2014, 01:50 PM
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Brian26 Brian26 is offline
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Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
Wasn't it a changeup that Trout hit out of the ballpark? I was listening on the radio, and that's what Ed and DJ said. If that's true, I'll be the prick who questions the pitch selection in that situation.

I feel like whenever a Sox pitcher gets to a full count against a good hitter, our catcher always calls for something offspeed. Always. It's to a point where I feel like opposing hitters are sitting on it. Call me old-fashioned, but I like to throw the heater on 3-2 with the bases loaded, especially when you've got a pitcher who throws as hard as Sale.

Some might say Trout would be expecting a fastball in that spot, but I'm not so sure. I think a lot of your better hitters look offspeed in those situations, figuring the pitcher doesn't want to give in with a fastball. So throw him the fastball, especially if you're Chris Sale. If you're John Danks and don't have a good fastball anymore, OK, maybe the changeup is the right pitch. But I would prefer to see Sale attack with the heater in a spot like that.
I'm with you. My only thought on this is maybe Flowers didn't think they could get a fastball by Trout. Every fastball in that sequence had been fouled off by Trout. I'm going by memory here. I think Trout went down 0-2 early by fouling pitches away. Sale backed him off the plate with a fastball up and in, then he tried to get Trout to chase one away but missed too far outside, evening the count at 2-2. Trout fouled off one or two more fastballs, and then Sale missed again to make it 3-2. I just thinking they were trying to trick him with a changeup since he hadn't seen anything offspeed yet in the at-bat, and Trout was all over it.
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  #47  
Old 06-08-2014, 02:20 PM
CoopaLoop CoopaLoop is offline
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I am tired of hearing that these moves are Cooper's call.

No the manager has final say. He needs to make that decision. I have yet to see any reason why Robin Ventura should be a major league manager except for the fact that he lights up every room he enters.
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  #48  
Old 06-08-2014, 02:20 PM
MISoxfan MISoxfan is offline
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I couldn't come on here and post about this last night, I thought it was better just go to bed. I had to gameday this one as I often do for CSN games, so I couldn't actually watch how Sale looked, but the results in the bottom of the 7th had me nervous. I got the feeling he was laboring, but you can never really tell following on gameday.

After the first two hitters in the Angels had hits for 4 out of the last 5 batters after being helpless for the first 7 2/3rds. I know this is Chris Sale we're talking about, but he was over 100 pitches, pitched a complete game last game on short rest, and already did his job at that point.

After 6 hits and a fielder reaching on an error over 8 at bats and the pitch count nearing 120 I am just glad I didn't wake up to find out he was injured. Not because I think he'll break after 110 pitches, but because of the count combined with the result. It's not usual to see him knocked around like that.
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  #49  
Old 06-08-2014, 02:52 PM
captain54 captain54 is offline
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I think Detroit will eventually wake up and create some distance in the division.. the White Sox's bullpen is a work in progress, and the defense is continually coming back to chew up any sort of progress in the pitching staff overall..

When the Sox were 2 1/2 games back of Detroit after being 8 or 9 out, I started to think this could be another 2012, but its games like Saturday nite that bring me back to reality..
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  #50  
Old 06-08-2014, 03:21 PM
SCCWS SCCWS is offline
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Pretty much mirrored my feelings as well-

BUT- Sale was hitting mid-90's during Trout's AB, Alexei's error was the difference between getting out of the inning up 5-4 (assuming Trout still homers, with a base open you might pitch around Trout) v. down 6-5- and Petricka didn't do his job once he came in.

If Sale is throwing mid- 90's- it's a tough call on letting one of the best pitchers in MLB face one of the best hitters or going to the pen.

Leaving Petricka in to face Aybar vs. Downs didn't make any sense at all- LH's hit way better vs. Petricka and Aybar hits better from the LH side vs. RH-

(Viciedo now 0-9 in the series, .206 over the past 30 days, Flowers .197 over the past 30)
Maybe worse. Flowers strikes out more than anyone is baseball based on AB. Last I saw, he was close to 40% and no one else is over 35%. He is starting to make Dunn look really good in strikeouts.
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  #51  
Old 06-08-2014, 09:17 PM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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Originally Posted by cards press box View Post
One more point: Ventura defers to Don Cooper on pitching decisions or at least he has. So I have to wonder -- was Cooper on board with how the 8th inning was handled tonight?
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Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
I think you are correct, everyone is crucifying the wrong guy.
Regardless, Ventura is the manager. The buck should stop with him. Cooper may be behind the bad decision, but if the Sox still need him to be shadow managing for Ventura into his 2nd season at the helm, then there is something wrong with the way Sox management is running their ballclub.
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  #52  
Old 06-08-2014, 09:28 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by Hitmen77 View Post
Regardless, Ventura is the manager. The buck should stop with him. Cooper may be behind the bad decision, but if the Sox still need him to be shadow managing for Ventura into his 2nd season at the helm, then there is something wrong with the way Sox management is running their ballclub.

Look at the number of managers hired with managerial experience under the current ownership. Ownership is and always has been hands on in the day to day operation of the club. This will only change when the current chairman is dirt.
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  #53  
Old 06-08-2014, 09:30 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by CoopaLoop View Post
I have yet to see any reason why Robin Ventura should be a major league manager except for the fact that he lights up every room he enters.

And that is why he is where is, he is doing what ownership wants him to do.
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  #54  
Old 06-08-2014, 11:34 PM
slavko slavko is online now
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Originally Posted by CoopaLoop View Post
I am tired of hearing that these moves are Cooper's call.

No the manager has final say. He needs to make that decision. I have yet to see any reason why Robin Ventura should be a major league manager except for the fact that he lights up every room he enters.
If you can light up a room by being a lousy interview, you've nailed it. Robin's a horns guy, Coop's a halo guy. Who's a fan supposed to blame? If it wasn't for these guys, we'd be blaming each other, and that's never a good idea.
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  #55  
Old 06-09-2014, 01:46 PM
#1swisher #1swisher is offline
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With one night to think about it, Ventura still had no misgivings about leaving Sale in the game Saturday night to face Mike Trout with the bases loaded, nobody out and the White Sox leading by four runs in the eighth. Trout hit a 3-2 changeup, located low and away, for a game-tying grand slam to the rocks in left-center.

"It's tough. You go in there last night and the way the eighth inning happened, if you're going to have anybody face that guy, I'd rather have Chris Sale face that guy," Ventura said. "That's the way it goes. They won that round and we have to come back ready to go."



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  #56  
Old 06-09-2014, 04:27 PM
tstrike2000 tstrike2000 is online now
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Maybe worse. Flowers strikes out more than anyone is baseball based on AB. Last I saw, he was close to 40% and no one else is over 35%. He is starting to make Dunn look really good in strikeouts.
He stinks.
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  #57  
Old 06-09-2014, 04:42 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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As a team, we strike out currently about 25% of the time, that is not a good stat at all.
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  #58  
Old 06-09-2014, 05:24 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Originally Posted by #1swisher View Post
With one night to think about it, Ventura still had no misgivings about leaving Sale in the game Saturday night to face Mike Trout with the bases loaded, nobody out and the White Sox leading by four runs in the eighth. Trout hit a 3-2 changeup, located low and away, for a game-tying grand slam to the rocks in left-center.

"It's tough. You go in there last night and the way the eighth inning happened, if you're going to have anybody face that guy, I'd rather have Chris Sale face that guy," Ventura said. "That's the way it goes. They won that round and we have to come back ready to go."



http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/mlb/...1&mode=preview
I agree it was a tough call- vs. Trout, do you go with your ace still throwing in the mid- 90's or do you go with Petricka- either choice could be justified.
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  #59  
Old 06-09-2014, 06:52 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
As a team, we strike out currently about 25% of the time, that is not a good stat at all.
I believe we're first in MLB in strikeouts.
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  #60  
Old 06-09-2014, 07:40 PM
Domeshot17 Domeshot17 is offline
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I believe we're first in MLB in strikeouts.
Yup, and not in a good way
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