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  #16  
Old 03-26-2014, 12:34 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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They shouldn't have to sit Dunn down on Opening Day. There's still time to either release hem or trade him by Opening Day. The dynamics of the team would change overnight if Dunn is not on the team. You could have a rotating DH with Konerko, Viciedo, DeAza and Abreau. If the Cubs can move Zambrano, Bradley and Soriano the White Sox should be able to move Dunn. I'm hoping that Hahn will do the right thing and get Dunn off this team by Opening Day.
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
I am with you 100%-
Just out of curiosity, you guys are aware Dunn was the best offensive player the Sox had last season, correct? I'm not going to shed a tear for him when his White Sox tenure inevitably ends one way or another this season, but from a pretty basic numbers perspective, without Dunn the Sox probably would have lost several more games last year, right?
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  #17  
Old 03-26-2014, 01:04 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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Just out of curiosity, you guys are aware Dunn was the best offensive player the Sox had last season, correct? I'm not going to shed a tear for him when his White Sox tenure inevitably ends one way or another this season, but from a pretty basic numbers perspective, without Dunn the Sox probably would have lost several more games last year, right?
Yes- I'm aware- falls into the "tallest midget" category.

For this year's team- I think Dunn's salary is a sunk cost- the market for Dunn is very limited (American League contender, who needs a DH vs. right handers, and is willing to take on some of his salary or trade something of value to get him).

I'd rather have De Aza/PK/Abreu/Viciedo rotate as DH and use Dunn's spot to add Danks or L. Garcia to the roster- and eliminate all of those strike outs and a "station to station" guy when he's on the bases. I know it's completely subjective- but I just think the guy brings a loser mentality to the team chemistry- he doesn't work his ass off to get in shape in the offseason, he hit .159 last September and is hitting .200 with no home runs in spring training- he seems "defeated" to me.

Last year he hit .248 with RISP and hit .184 as DH (he won't get many ABs at a 1st baseman this year)- so I don't really think we lose much if we let him go-
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  #18  
Old 03-26-2014, 01:28 PM
WhiteSox5187 WhiteSox5187 is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Just out of curiosity, you guys are aware Dunn was the best offensive player the Sox had last season, correct? I'm not going to shed a tear for him when his White Sox tenure inevitably ends one way or another this season, but from a pretty basic numbers perspective, without Dunn the Sox probably would have lost several more games last year, right?
That's really a testament to how bad the Sox were last year. This might be a case where perception is not in line with reality but it seems like a lot of his home runs and his production was when the game was already out of hand.
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  #19  
Old 03-26-2014, 01:49 PM
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That's really a testament to how bad the Sox were last year. This might be a case where perception is not in line with reality but it seems like a lot of his home runs and his production was when the game was already out of hand.
You're free to manipulate the numbers all you want, but at the end of the day, production is still production. Dunn was one of a very few hitters on the team that posted a positive oWAR last season and an above-average league OPS+. Had Dunn not been around last season, the Sox probably would have replaced him with some miserable combination of Jordan Danks, Dewayne Wise, Tyler Greene, Lars Anderson, etc. They certainly would have only added to the hole they dug as the least proficient offense in the AL.
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  #20  
Old 03-26-2014, 03:16 PM
TomBradley72 TomBradley72 is offline
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You're free to manipulate the numbers all you want, but at the end of the day, production is still production. Dunn was one of a very few hitters on the team that posted a positive oWAR last season and an above-average league OPS+. Had Dunn not been around last season, the Sox probably would have replaced him with some miserable combination of Jordan Danks, Dewayne Wise, Tyler Greene, Lars Anderson, etc. They certainly would have only added to the hole they dug as the least proficient offense in the AL.
Can't argue with you as far as 2013 goes- but I don't see how that's relevant for 2014-

Dunn has been on the market since last June- it's very telling that 29 MLB teams have no interest in him at all- if the Sox outright release him- I'm not sure anyone picks him up- he's an aging, platoon DH, in decline, with a .197 aggregate batting average from 2011-2013.
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  #21  
Old 03-26-2014, 06:34 PM
Golden Sox Golden Sox is offline
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This is 2014 with new hopes, new dreams AND new White Sox players. We have Garcia, Eaton and Abreau in our Opening day lineup this year. 3 years of Adam Dunn is enough. The team would be better off at DH with a rotating crew of Konerko, Viciedo and DeAza. All three of these guys are better than Dunn. I'm still hoping Dunn won't be with the White Sox on Opening Day 2014. The main objective in baseball is to win games. I think the White Sox have a better chance of winning games if Konerko, Viciedo and DeAza are the teams DH. I have seen enough of Dunn and his 197 batting average.

Last edited by Golden Sox; 03-26-2014 at 09:45 PM.
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  #22  
Old 03-26-2014, 06:54 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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This is 2014 with new hopes, new dreams AND new White Sox players. We have Garcia, Eaton and Abreau in our Opening day lineup this year. 3 years of Adam Dunn is enough. The team would be better off at DH with a rotating crew of Konerko, Viciedo and DeAza. All three of these guys are better than Dunn. I'm still hoping Dunn won't be with the White Sox on Opening Day 2014.
You do realize dunn cleared waivers last year and no one claimed him? Suddenly now after telling the media he did the same thing this off season as he has done in all his previous off season and then proceeded to have a bad spring training, some team is willing to take him off the Sox hands? Please let it rest, the Sox will not salt and pepper his contact at this point and hes on the roster.
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  #23  
Old 03-26-2014, 07:58 PM
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You're free to manipulate the numbers all you want, but at the end of the day, production is still production. Dunn was one of a very few hitters on the team that posted a positive oWAR last season and an above-average league OPS+. Had Dunn not been around last season, the Sox probably would have replaced him with some miserable combination of Jordan Danks, Dewayne Wise, Tyler Greene, Lars Anderson, etc. They certainly would have only added to the hole they dug as the least proficient offense in the AL.
The fact that you can make a statistical argument to show that Adam Dunn helped the White Sox last year when it was apparent to anyone watching the team that he hurt the team (offensively as well as defensively) speaks to how meaningless, or at least deceptive, the statistics can be.
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  #24  
Old 03-26-2014, 08:03 PM
BainesHOF BainesHOF is offline
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Leave it to Konerko to be more realistic than many here. He just said on the Score he expects to be on the bench on Opening Day.

The Sox are not the Cubs. It's not about being cute. Play every game to win, not to pander.

If you're in favor of junking the game plan already on Opening Day, let's go ahead and start Minnie Minoso in left. That would entertain the crowd, too.
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  #25  
Old 03-26-2014, 09:15 PM
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I hope they do- he deserves it- sit Dunns ass down-
Now this is an idea I can get used to! Dunn needs to become one with the bench.

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You absolutely start Konerko on opening day of his final year .. it's going to be a long year, with sellouts being few and far between .. i wouldn't be surprised to see "Paulie" get a standing ovation when he comes to bat the first time..
I couldn't agree with either of you more. After everything Paulie has given and meant to this organization, the least he deserves is a place in the starting lineup on what will be his final Opening Day. This is Konerko's final go-around with the Sox; start it off right by putting him in the lineup on Monday.
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  #26  
Old 03-26-2014, 10:37 PM
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Leave it to Konerko to be more realistic than many here. He just said on the Score he expects to be on the bench on Opening Day.

The Sox are not the Cubs. It's not about being cute. Play every game to win, not to pander.

If you're in favor of junking the game plan already on Opening Day, let's go ahead and start Minnie Minoso in left. That would entertain the crowd, too.
On the surface, this may seem strong, but really what is the difference between the standing ovation Konerko gets if he's penciled in at DH versus the standing ovation he gets as the last bench guy? Everybody is annoucned by Gene Honda on Opening Day and gets to go out and stand on the chalk and tip their cap (at least I remember that happening, but I could be wrong). Perhaps Konerko gets to pinch hit late in the game...he gets another ovation. I don't think it's a slight at Konerko not to start to get Dunn the ABs against the righty, at least early in the game. Don't get me wrong, as I don't care for Dunn at all, but I'm in favor of sticking with the plan for all 162 games.
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  #27  
Old 03-26-2014, 10:44 PM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
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On the surface, this may seem strong, but really what is the difference between the standing ovation Konerko gets if he's penciled in at DH versus the standing ovation he gets as the last bench guy? Everybody is annoucned by Gene Honda on Opening Day and gets to go out and stand on the chalk and tip their cap (at least I remember that happening, but I could be wrong). Perhaps Konerko gets to pinch hit late in the game...he gets another ovation. I don't think it's a slight at Konerko not to start to get Dunn the ABs against the righty, at least early in the game. Don't get me wrong, as I don't care for Dunn at all, but I'm in favor of sticking with the plan for all 162 games.
I agree. He's lucky he was brought back at all; a testament to the sometimes loyal to a fault organization. That said, I think the best plan for DH this season is a L/R platoon between Dunn and Konerko, and I wouldn't be surprised if that ends up being the case. At 1B, I hope Abreu starts as many games as he can.
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  #28  
Old 03-26-2014, 10:47 PM
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I agree. He's lucky he was brought back at all; a testament to the sometimes loyal to a fault organization. That said, I think the best plan for DH this season is a L/R platoon between Dunn and Konerko, and I wouldn't be surprised if that ends up being the case. At 1B, I hope Abreu starts as many games as he can.
Exactly. And...if you're going strictly by the numbers, the two-headed monster of PK and Dunn vs. LHP/RHP respectively in 2013 put up nice numbers. I'm looking forward to seeing how this plays out if both guys stay healthy. It's all a moot point if Konerko's wrist goes south or Dunn becomes Greg Luzinski 1984, if he hasn't already.
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  #29  
Old 03-27-2014, 12:44 AM
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Agreed.
Thirded.
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  #30  
Old 03-27-2014, 01:05 AM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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You're free to manipulate the numbers all you want, but at the end of the day, production is still production. Dunn was one of a very few hitters on the team that posted a positive oWAR last season and an above-average league OPS+. Had Dunn not been around last season, the Sox probably would have replaced him with some miserable combination of Jordan Danks, Dewayne Wise, Tyler Greene, Lars Anderson, etc. They certainly would have only added to the hole they dug as the least proficient offense in the AL.
If Dunn wasn't around, they would have had 15 million to spend on actual decent baseball players.
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