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  #211  
Old 12-08-2013, 06:45 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
a) He didn't fit any of our needs
b) He carried an astronomical price tag

I can't see how anyone would think that signing Granderson in their current state would benefit the Sox.
Can he hit? Because then he fills a major need of this team.
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  #212  
Old 12-08-2013, 08:22 AM
cws05champ cws05champ is offline
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Can he hit? Because then he fills a major need of this team.
But he doesn't hit well enough for 4 @ $15M/per IMO. We are just in the last year of a contract that most here wish the Sox didn't get into with Dunn that is basically the same deal. Most want Dunn traded at all cost just to get him out of here....and now people want to sign another guy on the wrong side of 30, with low average high power? That is not what this teams needs. If it were Granderson circa 2008, OK that's one thing. But look at his numbers....they are worse than Dunn's were prior to signing his deal with the Sox, and he was hurt. I'm glad the Mets took on the risk with him.
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  #213  
Old 12-08-2013, 10:12 AM
Stanley Stanley is offline
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Originally Posted by WhiteSox5187 View Post
It seems like that's where the market is right now. Those kind of contracts MIGHT become the new normal.
Right. MLBT projected Granderson earning slightly more in FA, and Fangraphs doesn't understand why more (Mets) people aren't happy about the deal. That is what wins cost today.
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  #214  
Old 12-08-2013, 12:08 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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In that offseason, the White Sox in 2006 improved on Thomas in trading for Jim Thome. I don't think it's going out on too far of a limb to say that it seems unlikely that Konerko will outperform Dunn and Abreu in 2014, although if anything hopefully the platoon split will help the team.
I think it very likely Konerko will outperform Dunn. I hope Abreu sets the bar much, much higher.
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  #215  
Old 12-08-2013, 01:19 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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I think it very likely Konerko will outperform Dunn. I hope Abreu sets the bar much, much higher.
Konerko's going to outperform Dunn? Teal?
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I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
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  #216  
Old 12-08-2013, 03:51 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
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I think it very likely Konerko will outperform Dunn. I hope Abreu sets the bar much, much higher.
It is very likely almost everyone will. One more year of this misery.
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  #217  
Old 12-08-2013, 06:59 PM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Can he hit? Because then he fills a major need of this team.
Ha! Okay fine, he can hit the long ball. But he's not going to hit for much of an average or get on base at a high level, as his OBP has been pretty bad for four out of the past five years.

I just don't see how signing a guy who will be 33 at the beginning of the season will help this team in the short or long run, especially at 4 years $50 million. Let us also not forget that signing Granderson would have cost us a high draft pick as well, something this team needs as many of as possible.
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  #218  
Old 12-08-2013, 11:09 PM
ZombieRob ZombieRob is offline
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Konerko's going to outperform Dunn? Teal?
LOL right? and for all the moaning and pissing about Dunns contract. Why does Danks get a pass with his contract and production output? 4and 14 and a contract worth 14 mil per. Yet lets cry and bitch about Dunn.
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  #219  
Old 12-09-2013, 03:43 AM
TDog TDog is offline
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LOL right? and for all the moaning and pissing about Dunns contract. Why does Danks get a pass with his contract and production output? 4and 14 and a contract worth 14 mil per. Yet lets cry and bitch about Dunn.
In the context of this thread, John Danks really isn't relevant. That is, in the context of signing Konerko for $2.5 million, Adam Dunn's $15 million contract seems particularly relevant.

In broader terms, the complaining about Dunn is at a different level than the complaining about Danks. The Whtie Sox picked up Danks as a minor leaguer and locked him up because of his success with the team. As he continues to come back from injury, he could be looking at better seasons.

Dunn was signed as a free agent and has had a truly aweful career in a White Sox uniform. Every offseason, I hope Dunn will come back with a better approach to hitting, and one can only hope that 2014 being his last contracted year will motivate him, but every season with the White Sox he has been, except for a few moments, an offensive black hole.

The chances of Danks earning his salary next year seem better than the chances of Dunn earning his contract next year. It's true that if both were free agents this offseason, neither would command what the White Sox have committed to them in 2014. But I would expect more demand for Danks.

Konerko's contract, on the other hand, isn't far off from what he would be getting elsewhere as a free agent.
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  #220  
Old 12-09-2013, 08:18 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Why does Danks get a pass with his contract and production output? 4and 14 and a contract worth 14 mil per. Yet lets cry and bitch about Dunn.
A couple reasons...

1) He was coming back from a pretty substantial injury in a lost season, it's not like the team fell apart because Danks couldn't perform. I think most rational people knew he was going to struggle and are holding their opinion of him until probably this season.

2) He's clearly been surpassed by Sale and Quintana in the Sox starting rotation, and could be passed by Johnson and Santiago (if they're all here) by the end of next year. I know he gets the big paycheck of the group, but he's at best a back-end rotation pitcher now, and it's hard to get worked up over those guys.

3) He actually posted 0.9 WAR last year, a year in which he was still clearly recovering from surgery and the time off. 0.9 WAR was the 8th highest total on the team, and 6th best of the guys returning (Rios and Crain were above him). So he's actually not one of the bigger problems the Sox face this year. ****ing frankly, if he does indeed become the #3 or #4 SP on the team, that's actually a testament to the Sox's pitching depth. There are plenty of teams out there that would take a guy like Danks (obviously not his contract) at the end of their rotation.

4) He's got one of the bigger deals, yeah, but the Sox don't appear to be impeded by it. Their current payroll is still projected to be tens of millions of dollars less than Opening Day 2012's was.
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  #221  
Old 12-09-2013, 09:16 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by ZombieRob View Post
LOL right? and for all the moaning and pissing about Dunns contract. Why does Danks get a pass with his contract and production output? 4and 14 and a contract worth 14 mil per. Yet lets cry and bitch about Dunn.
Because Danks was coming back from a significant injury. That's really not so hard to figure out.
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  #222  
Old 12-09-2013, 11:33 AM
Deadguy Deadguy is offline
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Question, what is Paulie's motivation to return? The money, the fame, improving his stats. Paulie has accepted a diminished roll to mentor and help off the bench. Why can't we simply solve this controversy for what has been said by those making the decision. The expectations for this team are low, but I believe they can be much more competitive than last year. I know that is not saying much. If Paulie is contributing as his roll is defined, and the team is playing relatively well. Great. However, If we are dead in the water by all star break, I'm sure he would gracefully retire.
Who cares about why he wants to come back? The question is why are the White Sox are accommodating him? The problem is that calling him useless is actually giving him too much credit since he hurts the team. He's not even AVERAGE at any aspect of them game.
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  #223  
Old 12-09-2013, 11:38 AM
Deadguy Deadguy is offline
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post

The Konerko signing for a fraction of his recent annual salries, for less money than he has made in at least a decade, isn't at all a bad one for the White Sox. He isn't a drain on the payroll and doesn't figure to be close to being the worst DH on the 2014 White Sox.
Konerko would have gotten nothing on the free agent market since no team would have been dumb enough to sign him.
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  #224  
Old 12-09-2013, 11:52 AM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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Dunn's been a better hitter his entire career and especially the last 2 years. Yet, people actually believe 37 year old, 2 1/2 years of steady regression Paul Konerko is going to have a better year than Dunn?
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  #225  
Old 12-09-2013, 12:12 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Dunn's been a better hitter his entire career and especially the last 2 years. Yet, people actually believe 37 year old, 2 1/2 years of steady regression Paul Konerko is going to have a better year than Dunn?
In fairness, Dunn's never had a two-year run as good as PK's 2010-2011 run
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