White Sox Interactive Forums
Sox Clubhouse
 Soxogram: 
Congratulations on winning the AL ROTY award unanimously, Jose!

Welcome
Go Back   White Sox Interactive Forums > Baseball Discussions > Sox Clubhouse
Home Chat Stats Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 06-30-2013, 09:34 PM
tstrike2000 tstrike2000 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: 'Burbs
Posts: 6,127
Default

The explanation we'll get will be taking offers for pretty much every player except for whoever the Sox said, I think Sale and Konerko. Underperformance, bad players, coaching, chemistry, or whatever, we just have to accept at this point that this is what it is. Mentally, this team reminds me a little of 2011. We all of a sudden can't catch the ball and we can't hit the ball. There's blame to be shared from Hahn all the way down. With the team closing in on 50 losses in the first week of July, it's not going to get any better once we trade guys like Jesse Crain. Just hope we get some good return and see what happens in '14.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 06-30-2013, 09:37 PM
mahagga73 mahagga73 is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Downs, Il.
Posts: 585
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tstrike2000 View Post
The explanation we'll get will be taking offers for pretty much every player except for whoever the Sox said, I think Sale and Konerko. Underperformance, bad players, coaching, chemistry, or whatever, we just have to accept at this point that this is what it is. Mentally, this team reminds me a little of 2011. We all of a sudden can't catch the ball and we can't hit the ball. There's blame to be shared from Hahn all the way down. With the team closing in on 50 losses in the first week of July, it's not going to get any better once we trade guys like Jesse Crain. Just hope we get some good return and see what happens in '14.
They need to change managers too because if they get some new players or youngsters that are going to be part of the solution there is no point keeping a lame duck manager around. I don't think Ventura want's this gig past this year anyway.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 06-30-2013, 09:51 PM
tstrike2000 tstrike2000 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: 'Burbs
Posts: 6,127
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mahagga73 View Post
They need to change managers too because if they get some new players or youngsters that are going to be part of the solution there is no point keeping a lame duck manager around. I don't think Ventura want's this gig past this year anyway.
Because Robin is mild mannered, it's hard to tell what he's thinking. Personally, he looks defeated and ready to move on, but who knows.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 06-30-2013, 09:54 PM
canOcorn canOcorn is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Iowa
Posts: 657
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Domeshot17 View Post
The Sox owe us nothing, and we owe them nothing. As much as I love the White Sox, and will never cheer for another team, they are a product that I can choose to enjoy or ignore. Like an expensive car that is a disaster and breaks down all the time, the price they spend means nothing to the fan base. They may as well have a 30 million payroll if this is the results they get. They pay executives a lot of money to find talent and put out a competitive team. Kenny Williams did his job a couple times over his GM tenure and got promoted. Rick Hahn was highly touted, but yet to prove he can find young talent (will take a few years to see the results of this).

For almost 6 years now the White Sox have given us a product that has the talent of a .500 ball club and they hope everything goes right and we sneak into the playoffs.

Until they figure it out, Fans will just continue to ignore them. If Sony kept putting out TV's that were the 10th most expensive in a market of 100 options, and the picture just sucked, year after year, people would stop buying them until Sony proved they could make a good TV. Sony would then have 2 options, sell the ****ty TV for less money, or make a better TV.

The White Sox choose to sell us a ****ty tv for less money this year. Maybe in the future they will figure it out.
Pretty much spot on....JR has made gigantic profits on a yearly basis, let alone considering the profit on his groups initial investment of $30M. He's grown that to $500M+ in 30 years. Actual butts in the seats are just extra bucks in their pocket with the way the TV contracts are these days.

Jerry might put enough into payroll to look like they're being legit, but then they cut everything else to the bare bones. Our MiLB 'organization' is basically clown shoes. I'd be very happy if he just took his profit and went away. Sadly, the Sox are a cash cow and that doesn't look likely.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 06-30-2013, 09:54 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Washington & Talman
Posts: 4,251
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
Any "explanation" would be awkward since it would involve Hahn highlighting the mistakes his boss made- ****ed up, barren farm system, overpriced veteran contracts for Dunn, Danks, etc., weak talent assessment or development (Viciedo, Flowers) and hiring a manager with zero experience at any level.

Like if Hoyer and Epstein were reporting to Hendry.
While not great, the farm system isn't barren and the draft philosophy has been completely overhauled.

Dunn and Danks signed market to below market value deals. Few could have predicted Viciedo was going to regress this much. They had to see what they had in Flowers. If the rest of the lineup was playing to expectations, they could afford to hide him in the lineup or replace him.

Pretty much every move the Sox have made in the last couple years went horribly wrong, but they weren't necessarily bad moves. It sucks that we're in this position, but I'm not mad about the approach of management. I certainly don't expect a ****ing explanation, let alone an apology. I'm a big boy. I can figure it out for myself.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by shoota
I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 06-30-2013, 10:13 PM
BainesHOF BainesHOF is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oak Park, IL
Posts: 2,951
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WLL1855 View Post
Seems like everyone wants the manager's head on a stick. How's that going to fix things?
It will help fix things because the managing will improve.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 06-30-2013, 10:47 PM
Brian26's Avatar
Brian26 Brian26 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Chicago
Posts: 29,503
Blog Entries: 52
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Chappas View Post
Don't hold your breath. Unlike the Sox, the Hawks front office isn't going to let this opportunity pass them by. These kids that are sporting Kane jerseys are future season ticket holders. And for the life of me, and can't understand the resentment some feel over the Hawks newfound popularity. As a Sox fan, it's upsetting that the organization failed to capitalize on '05. I couldn't care less if people jumped on the bandwagon. The more the merrier...
No resentment here. Kids don't play hockey here though like they do in Michigan. It's still a niche sport. You have no idea what's going to happen in the future. The '85 Bears only won the title one time. One injury mucks it all up. I am surprised that so many people have a hard time with the concept of cyclical success in sports. It is quite a grand statement though to say hockey will be more popular than baseball. Ain't going to happen. I love the Hawks though.

It's silly to say the Sox are at fault that they couldn't capitalize. They went all-in with Thome and Vazquez in 2006. They won 90 games. It's just some bad luck considering what happened. 2007 was an anomaly because of the injuries. They rebounded in 2008 and could have easily gone to the World Series if Quentin and Crede were healthy. The series with the Rays was winnable. Crap happens. Now they suck again like they did in the late 80s. The bad part is that Frank and Robin are not waiting in the wings.
__________________
2014 Attendance Record: 4-5; 0.444
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 07-01-2013, 12:30 AM
WLL1855 WLL1855 is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Peoria, IL
Posts: 606
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BainesHOF View Post
It will help fix things because the managing will improve.
You could bring in Sparky Anderson and things wouldn't be any better.
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 07-01-2013, 02:11 AM
captain54 captain54 is offline
WSI Personality
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Evergreen Park
Posts: 1,238
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
I am surprised that so many people have a hard time with the concept of cyclical success in sports.

It's silly to say the Sox are at fault that they couldn't capitalize. .
This is a major market franchise with money to spend playing in a weak division. For all the breaks that didn't go their way since 06', a lot went their way in 05'. The state of the Sox has more to do with other factors, rather than the baseball Gods smiling or frowning down upon them. Like putting people in positions of authority based upon loyalty rather than performance

This is a lot worse than just the normal cycle of being bad once in a blue moon. This is a deeply flawed organization that got exposed.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 07-01-2013, 03:34 AM
fungo bat fungo bat is offline
WSI Regular
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Jeff Park
Posts: 33
Default Earth Calling Rick Hahn

Yesterday you had no comment as to whether the Sox are buyers or sellers in the marketplace.

Hey Rick, the Sox are 15 games under .500, playing miserable baseball and sitting in last place in the AL Central.

What exactly are you watching? How naive do you think Sox fans are? The Sox as buyers? You have got to be kidding.

You currently own the rights to several players that are attractive to contending teams - guys like Crain, Rios, Thornton, Konerko, Peavy (when he's healthy). The Yankees may even be willing to take Dunn's fat contract off our hands (or at least be willing to pay a portion of it) with the loss of Texiera.

Time to back up the truck and start looking toward the future. Don't try to bull**** us or anyone else. This team is going nowhere. It's time to start listening to any and all offers.

Last week you stated that every player was available with the exception of Sale and Konerko. And now you have no comment regarding whether the Sox are sellers or buyers?

Come on. Get real. Sox fans deserve better than this.
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 07-01-2013, 05:03 AM
DrCrawdad DrCrawdad is online now
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Valley Of The Malls
Posts: 7,604
Default

This article makes it clear to me that Hahn knows what's up with the Sox and that he's ready to deal.
__________________

DrCrawdad
"In time you can turn these obsessions into careers...Hurry Down Doomsday the bugs are taking over." - Elvis Costello
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 07-01-2013, 07:33 AM
asindc's Avatar
asindc asindc is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Washington, DC area
Posts: 7,615
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaylorStSox View Post
The point is that the team continues to have a high payroll despite struggling to get fans into the park. They don't owe us ****. The players aren't living up their end of the bargain. It's that simple.
Post of the thread. There seems to be a segment of fandom that are adamant in blaming management for the players' subpar play instead of blaming the people most responsible for such.
__________________
"I have the ultimate respect for White Sox fans. They were as miserable as the Cubs and Red Sox fans ever were but always had the good decency to keep it to themselves. And when they finally won the World Series, they celebrated without annoying every other fan in the country." Jim Caple, ESPN (January 12, 2011)


"We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the (bleeding) obvious is the first duty of intelligent men." George Orwell
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 07-01-2013, 07:38 AM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sebring Florida
Posts: 7,916
Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by asindc View Post
Post of the thread. There seems to be a segment of fandom that are adamant in blaming management for the players' subpar play instead of blaming the people most responsible for such.
Good point but when a player is going bad and needs a benching, management has done such a bad job with the farm system that the best we can do when we bring someone up is Jordan Danks and Tyler Greene. when we need a pitcher we get Brian Omogrosso. So sad.
__________________
Coming up to bat for our White Sox is the Mighty Mite, Nelson Fox.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 07-01-2013, 08:15 AM
asindc's Avatar
asindc asindc is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Washington, DC area
Posts: 7,615
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LITTLE NELL View Post
Good point but when a player is going bad and needs a benching, management has done such a bad job with the farm system that the best we can do when we bring someone up is Jordan Danks and Tyler Greene. when we need a pitcher we get Brian Omogrosso. So sad.
Oh, I wasn't speaking of your posts in particular, but those who blame management for the poor play of Dunn, Alexei, and other veterans who have performed much better in the past and who management had no reason suspect would perform this badly now. Management should be held accountable for things squarely within their control like the farm system and bad trades, but blaming them for underperforming vets is Monday morning QBing. What they do about it is within their control. We will see.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 07-01-2013, 08:18 AM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Plano, Texas
Posts: 18,253
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Yes, Hahn definitely should repeatedly announce to the world, in no uncertain terms, that all his trade chips are available to the first bidder, just to satisfy the meatball bloodlust.


Impulsiveness is part of the reason we are where we are now. I hope Hahn is quiet, methodical and thorough.
__________________
The universe is the practical joke of the General at the expense of the Particular, quoth Frater Perdurabo, and laughed. The disciples nearest him wept, seeing the Universal Sorrow. Others laughed, seeing the Universal Joke. Others wept. Others laughed. Others wept because they couldn't see the Joke, and others laughed lest they should be thought not to see the Joke. But though FRATER laughed openly, he wept secretly; and really he neither laughed nor wept. Nor did he mean what he said.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Forum Jump




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:17 AM.




Design by: Michelle

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Site-specific editorial/photos Copyright ©2001 - 2008 White Sox Interactive. All rights reserved.