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  #61  
Old 06-30-2013, 11:09 AM
nsolo nsolo is offline
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Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
Honestly, I think Robin will leave on his own at season's end. I don't see any point in firing him. This team has a Triple-A roster, and it's only going to get worse when a couple of the bullpen guys and a couple of the regulars get traded within the next month.

Is the manager accountable for this mess? Sure, but nothing is going to change this year if someone else is placed in charge of the team. This will be a 95- to 100-loss team, and that's that.
Emotionally, I want to accept your opinion to let Ventura, a fan and personal favorite, save face and be allowed to leave at the end of this season. But I want to see the rebuilding of talent, climate and culture to begin asap.

Would improvement on the field negatively affect next years draft. Maybe. But even if it lowered our picks, I doubt our ability to evaluate talent. That's an area that needs BIG improvement.

My opinion is that wholesale change, top to bottom, needs to happen.
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  #62  
Old 06-30-2013, 11:12 AM
nsolo nsolo is offline
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Originally Posted by WLL1855 View Post
If nothing else, it can't get much worse from here, right?
Yee of little faith.
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  #63  
Old 06-30-2013, 11:53 AM
Irishsox1 Irishsox1 is offline
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Robin should be fired. He was a reaction hire from Ozzie. Robin is a great guy, great with the fans, great teammate, very even keeled guy but this team has picked up his quiet go with the flow temper.

But, there is a bigger issue and that is Dunn, Konerko and Peavy. Nobody can fix those three guys.
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  #64  
Old 06-30-2013, 02:25 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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But, there is a bigger issue and that is Dunn, Konerko and Peavy. Nobody can fix those three guys.
What exactly on Peavy needs to be fixed, he was one of the top 5-6 pitchers in the AL last year...
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  #65  
Old 06-30-2013, 02:32 PM
LITTLE NELL LITTLE NELL is offline
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What exactly on Peavy needs to be fixed, he was one of the top 5-6 pitchers in the AL last year...
The only thing I could think is that he thinks that Jake is injury prone which seems to be the case. I'm a big fan of Jake and hope he comes back stronger than ever.
As far as PK, we can't fix his age.
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  #66  
Old 06-30-2013, 02:45 PM
Stanley Stanley is offline
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Robin shouldn't have been given the job in the first place, so I don't care if he gets fired. That being said, this is a bad team and the record reflects that. I'll never get myself into a debate about how much a manager is responsible for a team's record. But at the very least, I don't believe there is any good evidence that tells us that going against convention here (hiring a guy who's coached at AAA and worked his way up for, etc) is a smart move. As far as I know, Robin was not even the head coach of a high school team before he took the Sox job. And it's not hard to see where his inexperience has led to undesirable results.

The way this organization has done things the past 10 years or so, it would be shocking to see him fired before season's end. Given his personality and the way he does his job, there'd have to be a pretty dramatic Ozzie-like shift in how he handles things moving forward to be canned.
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  #67  
Old 06-30-2013, 05:06 PM
Dan H Dan H is offline
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Robin Ventura should not have been hired in the first place, but that is a bigger reflection on the front office than him. And it is a front office that I have no faith in. The losing will continue long after Ventura is gone and the only thing management will do is complain about attendance.
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  #68  
Old 06-30-2013, 08:07 PM
mahagga73 mahagga73 is offline
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I agree that the Robin hiring was out of left field and a move that has failed miserably . Being a very good player doesn't predispose you to having the ability to manage lineups and pitching staffs , keep the finger on the pulse of the team, or when and how to get the point across to players that don't have their head in the game properly. It's obvious Robin has been suspect to bad in all categories, But I don't blame him, they talked him into it ,ignoring all previous convention on what makes a guy major league manager ready . I would be shocked if he didn't regret taking the job by now. My opinion of him will always be high. That being said this season has been one for the ages , like every 20 years or so.
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  #69  
Old 06-30-2013, 10:39 PM
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JB98 JB98 is offline
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Agree on the talent level. But the fundamentals are woefully lacking. So is accountability. That falls on Robin.
Well, to a point. I just don't think Robin has a lot of options. If someone wants to argue Ramirez should be benched for a game or two, it's hard to disagree. But, I don't think putting Beckham at SS and Keppinger at 2B gives the team a better chance to win.

Does benching Rios or De Aza for a couple days and playing AAAA Wise or Danks give the team a better chance to win? I don't think so.

The manager has to put the best lineup on the field to win that day's game. I feel for the most part Robin has done that. As for as the managing goes this year, I'm more bothered by his handling of the pitching staff. He's stretching guys out needlessly. There is no need to throw Sale 123 pitches in a game that was over the moment Chris gave up a run in the fourth inning.

If we want to talk about accountability, the front office is most accountable. The manager doesn't have many good choices. He's choosing among a host of players who are bad. When he puts his bench guys in, they make dumb mistakes too. What can you do? This team stinks. They will be just as terrible if Robin is fired. Bringing in some ****-kicking manager who is going "to hold guys accountable" won't make any difference whatsoever, IMO.
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  #70  
Old 06-30-2013, 11:14 PM
SoxThunder SoxThunder is offline
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Is it time to fire Robin???

"EVIDENTLY!!!!!"
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  #71  
Old 07-01-2013, 08:52 AM
TheVulture TheVulture is offline
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Originally Posted by SoxThunder View Post
Is it time to fire Robin???

"EVIDENTLY!!!!!"


I've been waiting for the right time to bust that out but you caught me napping!
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  #72  
Old 07-01-2013, 06:53 PM
amsteel amsteel is offline
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The team is obviously going to go into rebuild mode as soon as the next few weeks and if the organization has already decided that Ventura is not the man for the rebuild he needs to go now.

You need a manager that has a single vision for the foreseeable future. Not a lame duck marketing ploy.
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  #73  
Old 07-01-2013, 08:55 PM
SCCWS SCCWS is offline
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Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
Well, to a point. I just don't think Robin has a lot of options. If someone wants to argue Ramirez should be benched for a game or two, it's hard to disagree. But, I don't think putting Beckham at SS and Keppinger at 2B gives the team a better chance to win.

Does benching Rios or De Aza for a couple days and playing AAAA Wise or Danks give the team a better chance to win? I don't think so.

The manager has to put the best lineup on the field to win that day's game. I feel for the most part Robin has done that. As for as the managing goes this year, I'm more bothered by his handling of the pitching staff. He's stretching guys out needlessly. There is no need to throw Sale 123 pitches in a game that was over the moment Chris gave up a run in the fourth inning.

If we want to talk about accountability, the front office is most accountable. The manager doesn't have many good choices. He's choosing among a host of players who are bad. When he puts his bench guys in, they make dumb mistakes too. What can you do? This team stinks. They will be just as terrible if Robin is fired. Bringing in some ****-kicking manager who is going "to hold guys accountable" won't make any difference whatsoever, IMO.
I agree the backups are awful. But when players make boneheaded plays, you need to sit them down to get a message across. The heck with the best lineup to give them a chance to win. They don't win anyway. The team lacks talent. But fans deserve to see players who are putting the effort in. When a player does not put the effort in, sit him even if the sub is less talented.
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  #74  
Old 07-01-2013, 10:10 PM
gosox41 gosox41 is offline
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Originally Posted by TomBradley72 View Post
This is team plays in a "fog", ongoing mental and fundamental mistakes across the board- Viciedo, De Aza, Beckham, Ramirez, Flowers,etc. Three players run through the 3rd base coach yesterday- no consequences.

More injuries than usual this year, and players are always accountable- but this is approaching "Bevington" territory- and Robin does not seem to be in control.

He's one of my all time favorite Sox players- and even without experience- I thought he would be a good manager- but this is a disaster.

Doesn't matter. He'll quit after this year. He'll find away to come out looking good with rep in tact and he will leave on good terms. Fans will still love him.

We'll then hire another inexperienced manager to see what we can do.


Bob
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  #75  
Old 07-02-2013, 01:22 AM
Medford Bobby Medford Bobby is offline
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While watching yeterday's Sox game on WGN (Sunday)I got a wiff of what Hawk was thinking when he talked about Terry Francona being hired as the Tribe's manager, that they need a whole culture change with the whole organization with new coaches, players etc.

Honestly folks as much as we like having old Sox guys around, Ventura, Baines, Thigpen....maybe some outside blood with NO ties to any White Sox history. Hey this happened with a change with Tanner and Hemond many years ago.......


I guess if the Sox had hired Francona, they would be bringing in an old organization guy too.....
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