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View Poll Results: Is the season lost already?
Yes 176 95.14%
No 6 3.24%
No, because I can still get churros at the ballpark. 3 1.62%
Voters: 185. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old 06-16-2013, 07:43 PM
Iron Dragon2 Iron Dragon2 is offline
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LOL! 67-1-1 when I voted. I've never seen a poll so one-sided. They just lost the first 3 in Houston. This team sucks.
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  #32  
Old 06-16-2013, 07:50 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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I'm all for dumping our veterans for prospects, but Hahn shouldn't just dump them to the first buyer just to satisfy the unthinking knee-jerk faction. He should hold out for the best return possible.

Also, while it would be tempting to trying to acquire "hitters," Hahn would be better served acquiring position players who can field their positions well and execute fielding and hitting fundamentals.

Finally, Sale should be untouchable.
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  #33  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:00 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
I'm all for dumping our veterans for prospects, but Hahn shouldn't just dump them to the first buyer just to satisfy the unthinking knee-jerk faction. He should hold out for the best return possible.

Also, while it would be tempting to trying to acquire "hitters," Hahn would be better served acquiring position players who can field their positions well and execute fielding and hitting fundamentals.

Finally, Sale should be untouchable.
When does he become a free agent?
Agree 100% with the rest.
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  #34  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:09 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post

Finally, Sale should be untouchable.
If thats the case then you wont get much for the few guys that actually have some worth.
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  #35  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:16 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
I'm all for dumping our veterans for prospects, but Hahn shouldn't just dump them to the first buyer just to satisfy the unthinking knee-jerk faction. He should hold out for the best return possible.
These veterans you speak of have very little worth. Rios probably has the most and that wont be a top level prospect. Crain, Thornton, are both aging and FAs, they wont get you much, Dunn, Paul, Ramirez, DeAza, J. Danks get you nothing. Peavy maybe in off season if he has a good last 2 months. Its between a rock and a hard place time.
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  #36  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:18 PM
cv sox fan cv sox fan is offline
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i blame kenny for a lot of this debacle but hahn gets some blame flowers as every day catcher and keppinger at third both of these guy stink. heres my 2 cents. pk. is done,dunn just sucks were still waiting on beckham,alexi could be brilliant but has head the sun won't shine left field experiment needs to get sent down or traded, center fielder couldn't be a back up on a good club rios i just wish he would hustle but i think he is frustrated, starting pitching has been good we have two good guys in the bullpen. i think they lose near 100 games. there mental weakness and lack of discipline no hustle and no hitting thats on robin and staff.iwould trade any of them except sale.
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  #37  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:34 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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Sale just signed a long-term deal. He won't hit free agency for years.

Trading your young, cost-controlled ace pitcher isn't the only way to fix the mess, and makes the mess worse definitely in the short term, and likely in the long term as well. It would be like the 1989 Sox dealing Jack McDowell.

Thankfully we have a couple more decent pitchers in the pipeline, and have done a good job producing pitchers, so the "pitcher development system" doesn't need an overhaul.

But we need to fix our position player development system. Build through the draft, and develop draftees better. Augment with international signings.

While waiting for the system to produce players, sign/trade for stopgap position players who can field their positions well.
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  #38  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:54 PM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
These veterans you speak of have very little worth. Rios probably has the most and that wont be a top level prospect. Crain, Thornton, are both aging and FAs, they wont get you much, Dunn, Paul, Ramirez, DeAza, J. Danks get you nothing. Peavy maybe in off season if he has a good last 2 months. Its between a rock and a hard place time.
After Sale and Peavy, the value is in Quintana and Santiago, two capable, young, cheap, lefty starters. Just extract full value.

It's a shame Peavy's hurt - even if he recovers in time, another injury depreciated his trade value. And it's a shame Thornton is pitching poorly this year, although we should have let him go a couple of years ago at his peak.
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  #39  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:58 PM
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roylestillman roylestillman is online now
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You know, in 2007, 2009, 2011 and this year we took some solice in the fact that some of these players would come around and play "lke the back of their baseball card" except now the back of their baseball card includes 2007, 2009, 2011 and soon 2013.

I'm at a total loss as to where the Sox go from here. I can't blame the we're too cheap crutch given payrolls in recent years. It seems to all come down to bad scouting and a philosophy that the front office could pick up former first round draft choices and former phenoms who were coming off bad years and fix 'em. What you ended up with were maddeningly inconsistent and streaky ballplayers.

In all my years of watching the Sox not only is this team the worst, but solving its problems long term just looks hopeless.
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  #40  
Old 06-16-2013, 08:59 PM
SCCWS SCCWS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Sox View Post
Anybody who thinks this season isn't lost is absolutely dreaming. I still have to be positive about the future. I've always been good at spending other peoples money so here is what I'm hoping for. I'm thinking the White Sox won't have the salaries of Floyd, Konerko and Thornton next year. I 'm also thinking that Dunn and the Tank won't be on the team in 2014. I'm hoping JR opens up his checkbook for the following 3 free agents: Jacob Ellsbury, Brian McCann and most of all Kendrys Morales. Just adding these 3 players on this team will put us back in contention next year. Our pitching is good enough for the White Sox to contend next year. Rather than trade any of our pitchers, wouldn't it be easier to sign the 3 players I just mentioned?
They would be excellent additions. But most reports have McCann resigning w Atlanta. Ellsbury is a Boras guy and rumors in New England media say he will most likely not re-sign in Boston and will go to the Cubs. Not sure where Morales is rumored to.
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  #41  
Old 06-16-2013, 09:24 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
After Sale and Peavy, the value is in Quintana and Santiago, two capable, young, cheap, lefty starters. Just extract full value.
Yes Quintana and Santiago have value but both are young and very cheap. These are the type of players that the Sox should be trying to acquire. But I dont think they could bring in more than what they currently bring to the Sox now.

Btw: I hope you had a good one and many more to come.
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  #42  
Old 06-16-2013, 09:32 PM
cards press box cards press box is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoG19 View Post
Most analysts and fans thought the Dunn signing was great at the time. It just hasn't worked out.
That is true -- the Dunn signing was popular at the time. And, for whatever reason, it hasn't really worked. Of course, trades and free agent signings don't always work. It doesn't mean that a team should stop making moves.

And that brings me to the question of whether this is a lost season. It is in terms of making the playoffs in 2013. But the Sox can still make progress by starting the process of making moves to infuse the system with talent. Some deadline deals may be in order. The draft seemed to go well. When some payroll comes off the roster at the end of the season, the Sox will have the opportunity to upgrade their roster, particularly in terms of offense.

It is too early to say whether 2013 is "lost" in terms of improving for the future.
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  #43  
Old 06-16-2013, 09:35 PM
cards press box cards press box is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
After Sale and Peavy, the value is in Quintana and Santiago, two capable, young, cheap, lefty starters. Just extract full value.

It's a shame Peavy's hurt - even if he recovers in time, another injury depreciated his trade value. And it's a shame Thornton is pitching poorly this year, although we should have let him go a couple of years ago at his peak.
For what it is worth, I would not move Sale, Danks, Santiago or Quintana. Or Reed. And I am OK with the Sox having to keep Peavy. The starters (and a few regulars) are the nucleus to build around.
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  #44  
Old 06-16-2013, 10:07 PM
chaotic8512 chaotic8512 is offline
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I was at the first game of the Houston series, my first Sox game in 4 years, proudly wearing my #49 Sale t-shirt jersey. This season being what it is, I've never been less excited to go to a Sox game, and that saddened me. You'd think with Sale striking out fourteen, a win would be a completely reasonable thing to expect. Well, it would be... if it weren't this team and this horrifying offense.

I vote a resounding yes.
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  #45  
Old 06-16-2013, 10:19 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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I hate speculating about trade value, but I'll do it anyway. Crain should have very good value. His age doesn't matter. Lights out set up guys are valuable to contenders. Rios should have decent value. His contract isn't bad anymore and he can help at the plate and in the field. Peavy should have good value. He's locked up for a couple more years and can still dominate. A desperate team will take the chance.

The Sox will never go into a full rebuild, but if they do, I would move both Reed and Jones. There's no point in having a good closer if there aren't games to close.
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I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
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