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  #46  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:24 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
You dont give them away at that point but then what do you do in the offseason if the return is similar? I doubt the Sox would carry 37M of extra salary knowing the team is going nowhere. My hope is that there actually is value in these 3, either at the trade deadline or offseason.
At that point, you might as well move Sale too. What's the point of having an ace if you don't plan on competing for the next 5 years? What's the difference between 72 wins and 62?
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Originally Posted by shoota
I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
  #47  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:24 PM
Bobby Thigpen Bobby Thigpen is offline
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Originally Posted by Moses_Scurry View Post
If I could have flipped a switch to stop liking the Sox and start liking a different team, I would have done it a long time ago. If it were that easy we would all be Yankee and Laker fans.
I did it once. What's so hard?

I also wouldn't want to root for those two teams because, well, I don't want to be a douchebag.
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  #48  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:26 PM
Golden Sox Golden Sox is offline
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Does anybody out there in WSI land know why Beckham started at shortstop last night? If the White Sox think he can play shortstop, have we seen the last of Ramerez on this team?
  #49  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by TaylorStSox View Post
At that point, you might as well move Sale too. What's the point of having an ace if you don't plan on competing for the next 5 years? What's the difference between 72 wins and 62?
Why would they not plan on competing for the next five years?
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  #50  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:26 PM
Hitmen77 Hitmen77 is offline
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White Sox Baseball: Waiting for fat all-stars on other teams to falter.

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I'm in this camp, too. I don't believe the White Sox MLB roster is "terrible" or "pathetic." Underachieving? To this point, yes. Frustrating? Sure. The Sox have several hitters producing below their career norms. In addition, the team has been hurt by injuries to key personnel. Despite that, they've managed to hang around. They are one winning streak away from being right back in the division race.

I'm not sure people know what "terrible and pathetic" means. I don't think the Sox have had a team that has fit that definition in some years. Probably 2007 would be the closest, but it's been awhile since this organization has had a 95- or 100-loss season.

If they trade Peavy, Rios, Konerko, Ramirez, Crain and Thornton, as some here seem to want, they will become "terrible and pathetic" because they don't have any MLB-ready prospects to replace them.

I just can't support the nuclear option. I don't see how it makes sense. The organization is better served to ride it out with these guys and see if they can turn it around. If they stay in the hunt into July, Hahn should try to add a bat and maybe a bullpen arm and take a shot at it. Why not?

It's real easy to sit here and say the Sox should trade any and all veterans who have value. But who exactly do you want to replace them with?
I agree. All "blowing it up" this season will do is make the Sox truly terrible. Worst of all, I have my doubts that doing so will exactly land us a bunch of top-notch prospects. More likely, we'll just end up with another batch of mediocre players that won't amount to much.

I wish the organization would improve their success in developing minor league players into solid MLB players, but I don't think trading players like Rios and Peavy should be their plan for doing this.
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  #51  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:29 PM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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Originally Posted by JB98 View Post
Why would they not plan on competing for the next five years?
If we're gonna blow it up, it will take that long. The team would be starting over with few MiLB assets. You'd need an organizational wide rebuild.
  #52  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:30 PM
Paulwny Paulwny is offline
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Originally Posted by SI1020 View Post
Rick Reuschel, Smokey Burgess, Terry Pendleton, CC Sabathia, Mickey Lolich, Boog Powell, Kirby Puckett (sidelined by glaucoma), Tony Gwynn, Babe Ruth. There are others I'm sure and I left out some borderline cases. Sabathia will be 33 this year but looks to have staying power. I believe when it's all said and done Miguel Cabrera and Prince Fielder will be added to the list. I think you are correct in asserting that most overweight guys break down prematurely, but I'd say maybe not as young or across the board that one might assume.

Add Frank Howard to the list.
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  #53  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:31 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by Golden Sox View Post
Does anybody out there in WSI land know why Beckham started at shortstop last night? If the White Sox think he can play shortstop, have we seen the last of Ramerez on this team?
I sincerely doubt it, Gordon is a fine 2B but he does not appear to have the skills to play SS at this level. I would suspect more than anything else, they were trying to get Gordon his rehab PT in while keeping Carlos Sanchez, one of the team's top prospects, in the lineup, as well. I suspect Beckham can play SS at AAA better than Sanchez.
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  #54  
Old 05-21-2013, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
You dont give them away at that point but then what do you do in the offseason if the return is similar? I doubt the Sox would carry 37M of extra salary knowing the team is going nowhere. My hope is that there actually is value in these 3, either at the trade deadline or offseason.
Then you keep them and try to win next year. It isn't real hard to put together a roster capable of competing in the AL Central. I think Sox fans are a little too eager to throw in the towel. I understand the team hasn't played well this season, but I wouldn't give up on this year yet, let alone next year or the next five years.

We have people who are already resigned to the team being bad for the foreseeable future, and I just don't see it that way.

Can you tell I'm not one of the people who wants to trade places with the Cubs? At least we know the Sox organization can scout and develop pitching.
  #55  
Old 05-21-2013, 02:26 PM
hawkjt hawkjt is offline
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The Sox have the most important thing in the sport....a young,solid rotation,with Danks,Sale,Quintana,Axe and Santiago...even without Peavy.

They can build around that rotation,and a solid bullpen,adding parts like Gilaspie and Keppinger,to stay competitive.

Sox are not the Cubs,where they can actually go ahead and tell their fans that the plan is to lose over 100 games three years in a row to acquire good draft picks and not even pretend to try to compete until 2016..5 year plan. Cub fans will still attend during this dry stretch.

If the Sox try that, there will be tumbleweeds blowing around the park by year 2 of such plan.
  #56  
Old 05-21-2013, 02:37 PM
SI1020 SI1020 is offline
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Originally Posted by Paulwny View Post
Add Frank Howard to the list.
Yes "Hondo" is definitely a good addition to that list. How about HOF catcher Ernie Lombardi? If I had time, there are others I'd bet.
  #57  
Old 05-21-2013, 03:14 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by TaylorStSox View Post
Except every other fat ass that did the same at that age, including his dad.

His dad was still pretty good till he was 32. Thats 3 more years for prince.
  #58  
Old 05-21-2013, 03:21 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by Noneck View Post
His dad was still pretty good till he was 32. Thats 3 more years for prince.
That would leave them with only 4 years and $96 million left on his contract.

Nobody can say for certain when Prince's physical abilities will wane, but it seems like with these bigger guys, when they're done, they hit a WALL. A lot of them don't seem to taper off the way other ballplayers do, I'm guessing these guys' freakish athletic skills are able to compensate for their physical prowess for a certain amount of time but when those abilities begin to wane, there's no lingering athleticism to guide the plane to the ground safely. They just crash.

That's a bit of a scary circumstance for a guy owed $24 million annually for another 6 seasons.
  #59  
Old 05-21-2013, 03:24 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
That would leave them with only 4 years and $96 million left on his contract.
Oh Im not supporting the contract, just saying that detroit isnt falling off the face of the earth anytime soon.
  #60  
Old 05-21-2013, 03:31 PM
russ99 russ99 is offline
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Seems like our cheapness in the draft and development his bit us on the behind (at least where position players are concerned) and we're going to have to do well under the new rules for 3-4 years to catch up to even think about a tear-down rebuild.

Yet there reasons to stick with the majority of the roster, keep the gate relatively high, our players' overall low trade value, and that there's nothing on the farm to replace these guys.

We're a big market team, and with the young arms on the staff and in the pen, shouldn't need to tear it all down Astros-style.

Hahn just needs to make smarter moves than Kenny did when we get a bunch of salary room to work with the next few offseasons. One-dimensional hitters need not apply.
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