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  #31  
Old 04-28-2013, 12:39 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
1. Yes, the game would have turned out differently. The Rays would have had all 10 runs in the first four innings.

2. It is not hard to leave with a higher ERA when you came in with a 1.04 or whatever it was. 1 run in 8 innings would raise that ERA. Not exactly a bright spot to point out.
I wouldn't say it's not hard for the Sox to send Moore out of the game with a higher ERA than he had coming in. If it was easy, he wouldn't have such a low ERA against the rest of the league.

If your bullpen gives up eight runs, it's not a winnable game. If Floyd isn't hurt and only gives up two or three, or your long reliever comes in and shuts down the offense, as it very much is. Moore has been vey good this season, but a pitchng duel would have been winnable, despite Moore's ERA. Even with a comfortable lead, Moore seemed to have gone as far as he could go, at least at that level, Saturday night. If the game is close when he leaves, the Sox have a good,although not great, chance in the game.

This game could be compared with a game last year in St. Petersburg when Quintana had to come out in the fourth. I think we remember why. In that game the Sox had a 2-1 lead at the time, but the bullpen didn't let the game get out of hand. The Sox won that one 4-3.

I don't know why Ventura put in Santiago or left in Santiago. It appeared the A relievers needed the rest and he needed Santiago to step up. It didn't happen. I don't think Ventura wasn't trying to win the game. It looked like he didn't want to overuse relievers in a situation where he wasn't protecting a lead.
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  #32  
Old 04-28-2013, 12:51 PM
MarksBrokenFoot MarksBrokenFoot is offline
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Originally Posted by asindc View Post
If the Sox's record was reversed and the optimists were being loud and proud, many if the dark clouds would point out that it is only April 28.
You mean like last year? When they said Detroit was gonna catch us and Detroit caught us? It's kinda sad that being correct isn't a defense around here.
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  #33  
Old 04-28-2013, 01:04 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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You mean like last year? When they said Detroit was gonna catch us and Detroit caught us? It's kinda sad that being correct isn't a defense around here.
Or in 1964 after sweeping the Yankees in four in August to reach first place. The dark clouds were right. Move along, nothing to see here. In the end that White Sox team lost, like they always do.

Why bother?
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  #34  
Old 04-28-2013, 01:25 PM
SephClone89 SephClone89 is offline
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I wouldn't say it's not hard for the Sox to send Moore out of the game with a higher ERA than he had coming in. If it was easy, he wouldn't have such a low ERA against the rest of the league.
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  #35  
Old 04-28-2013, 01:35 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by MarksBrokenFoot View Post
You mean like last year? When they said Detroit was gonna catch us and Detroit caught us? It's kinda sad that being correct isn't a defense around here.
WSI rules:

If you make an optimistic prediction, you are fine. If you are right, you will be praised, if you are wrong, nothing will be said.

If you make a pessimistic prediction, you will be called a dark cloud. If you are wrong, you will be reminded as such, if you are right, you better not say anything or else you will be told to shut up and move along.

The sooner you learn these rules, the better off you will be.
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  #36  
Old 04-28-2013, 01:44 PM
TDog TDog is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post
WSI rules:

If you make an optimistic prediction, you are fine. If you are right, you will be praised, if you are wrong, nothing will be said.

If you make a pessimistic prediction, you will be called a dark cloud. If you are wrong, you will be reminded as such, if you are right, you better not say anything or else you will be told to shut up and move along.

The sooner you learn these rules, the better off you will be.
If you're gloating over being right about the Sox not winning the division in 2012 in this forum, you're pretty much being a jerk.
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  #37  
Old 04-28-2013, 01:48 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post
WSI rules:

If you make an optimistic prediction, you are fine. If you are right, you will be praised, if you are wrong, nothing will be said.

If you make a pessimistic prediction, you will be called a dark cloud. If you are wrong, you will be reminded as such, if you are right, you better not say anything or else you will be told to shut up and move along.

The sooner you learn these rules, the better off you will be.
You forgot one.

If you predicted a bad move , you can pat yourself on the back for years to come. And remind everyone of this even though others also predicted but dont have arms long enough to pat themselves on their back.
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  #38  
Old 04-28-2013, 02:59 PM
MISoxfan MISoxfan is offline
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Last year there were 5 playoff teams for the first time ever. To gloat over being right about a team that even the most optimistic fans hoped could maybe just barely sneak into the playoffs is awful. You're bragging about being right when the odds were heavily in your favor.
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  #39  
Old 04-28-2013, 03:34 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post
If you're gloating over being right about the Sox not winning the division in 2012 in this forum, you're pretty much being a jerk.
No, but if people are going to give you **** for making an honest prediction, they deserve to get **** on themselves when it comes true.
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  #40  
Old 04-28-2013, 03:36 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by MISoxfan View Post
Last year there were 5 playoff teams for the first time ever. To gloat over being right about a team that even the most optimistic fans hoped could maybe just barely sneak into the playoffs is awful. You're bragging about being right when the odds were heavily in your favor.
It isn't a matter of gloating. No one here wants to see the Sox lose. But it gets tiresome when anyone who happens to think differently than the majority gets called a dark cloud and is marginalized with regularity.
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  #41  
Old 04-28-2013, 04:14 PM
Frater Perdurabo Frater Perdurabo is offline
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I joined WSI in 2003. IIRC, "dark cloud" or "pants pissing dark cloud" began being used in 2005 to mock the people who were cynical despite the Sox remaining in first place throughout the year. The "dark clouds" were out in force in August and September 2005, when the Sox were playing .500, the Indians were playing .900, and the lead shrunk from 15 games to 1.5 games.

IMHO, the proper context to call someone a "dark cloud" is if/when he/she is crapping all over a first place club, or one that has a winning record and is within striking distance of first place.

Expressing cynicism during a losing season is entirely appropriate. Just don't overdo it.
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  #42  
Old 04-28-2013, 04:51 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
Lip is right; every third year since 2001 seems to get detailed by injuries.

A dose of realism for the chicken littles: With his contract up after this season and his inconsistency, even a healthy Floyd was never going to bring much more than a B prospect in return.

If the season is going to go down the drain due to injuries, better that it happens now, before we get emotionally invested.

I had planned to watch Sunday's game on WGN, but I'd rather go to Costco.
Frater:

Complicating the situation is that the Sox don't have the minor league players who can step in and actually perform when injuries happen and they don't have the financial payroll ability to buy players at the deadline (in essence) to replace guys who are hurt or slumping.

Just another 'caught in the middle between a rock and a hard place' situation.

Also the Sox make a lot of the fact that over the past 10 years or so they have had a remarkable ability to keep guys healthy and on the field and that's exactly correct especially when you compare it to other teams.

However when the Sox have got hit by injuries as in the previous seasons I mentioned, they basically were done with little to no hope of being able to overcome them. Other clubs (the Cardinals come to mind) have been able to.

Lip
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  #43  
Old 04-28-2013, 05:40 PM
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asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by TDog View Post
If you're gloating over being right about the Sox not winning the division in 2012 in this forum, you're pretty much being a jerk.
Isn't it bizarre that some members here make posts that would be considered trolling if a Tigers or Royals fan made them?
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  #44  
Old 04-28-2013, 05:46 PM
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asindc asindc is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post
I joined WSI in 2003. IIRC, "dark cloud" or "pants pissing dark cloud" began being used in 2005 to mock the people who were cynical despite the Sox remaining in first place throughout the year. The "dark clouds" were out in force in August and September 2005, when the Sox were playing .500, the Indians were playing .900, and the lead shrunk from 15 games to 1.5 games.

IMHO, the proper context to call someone a "dark cloud" is if/when he/she is crapping all over a first place club, or one that has a winning record and is within striking distance of first place.
Expressing cynicism during a losing season is entirely appropriate. Just don't overdo it.
Well said on all accounts. If someone can't bring themselves to temper his pessimism enough to at least be hopeful, I think he might as well post here: http://www.motownsports.com/. What come across as troll-like comments here would fit right in over there.
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  #45  
Old 04-28-2013, 07:52 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo View Post

Expressing cynicism during a losing season is entirely appropriate. Just don't overdo it.
My point exactly in much better terms than I could put it in. And just don't overdo the criticism of those who express an appropriate level of cynicism.
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