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  #16  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:36 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post

This team is in really bad shape right now, it's definitely going to be muliyear process.
Reading this board, I thought we were World Series bound. This is the most level-headed thing anyone's said in a while.

Cue the negative post bashing...
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  #17  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:40 PM
gobears1987 gobears1987 is offline
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Rebuilding is going to be a multi-year process. We'll stink this year (next year too), but if the right move are made I can live with it.
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  #18  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:46 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
Reading this board, I thought we were World Series bound. This is the most level-headed thing anyone's said in a while.

Cue the negative post bashing...
Oh ****ing please. I would say the vast majority of posters here realize the Sox are at best, on paper, the 2nd best team in the division and nowhere near the leader board for favorites in the A.L. There is, however, a gulf between a realistic view of this team and whatever nutbag, over the top, depressing melodrama you've been peddling i.e. Sale's arm IS DEFINITELY GOING TO EXPLODE because brainiac scouts say it will (no mention those same scouts once upon a time deemed Mark Prior to have "perfect mechanics") and Dayan Viciedo needs to have his swing completely rebuilt at the AAA level. Give me a break. Just because people don't think this team is the train wreck you've been trying to tell us it is, doesn't mean they have unrealistically wild expectations.
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  #19  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:55 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Oh ****ing please. I would say the vast majority of posters here realize the Sox are at best, on paper, the 2nd best team in the division and nowhere near the leader board for favorites in the A.L. There is, however, a gulf between a realistic view of this team and whatever nutbag, over the top, depressing melodrama you've been peddling i.e. Sale's arm IS DEFINITELY GOING TO EXPLODE because brainiac scouts say it will (no mention those same scouts once upon a time deemed Mark Prior to have "perfect mechanics") and Dayan Viciedo needs to have his swing completely rebuilt at the AAA level. Give me a break. Just because people don't think this team is the train wreck you've been trying to tell us it is, doesn't mean they have unrealistically wild expectations.
I think we'll finish second too.

I just feel the gap between first and second is a lot larger than people are realizing.

Edit: oh, and viciedo sucks.
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  #20  
Old 02-11-2013, 04:00 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Originally Posted by blandman View Post
I just feel the gap between first and second is a lot larger than people are realizing.
Yawn, I heard that same line in February 2012, too.
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  #21  
Old 02-11-2013, 05:03 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Yawn, I heard that same line in February 2012, too.
Not from me (I wasn't here). There was a gap last year. But this offseason the Tigers went out and got a lot better. And we got a little worse. So...yeah. I don't really feel my evaluations are negative so much as they are realistic. Saying we've got a very small chance of winning the division is only negative if you aren't aware of the talent levels of the respective teams. If people call me negative, I don't mind because in truth it says worlds more about them than it does about me.
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  #22  
Old 02-11-2013, 05:45 PM
LoveYourSuit LoveYourSuit is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Yawn, I heard that same line in February 2012, too.
The Sox will be much better than people are giving credit because of their pitching.

The thing to see is will the Tigers play like team they are on paper?

They didn't do it last year and left the division open for our taking. And we all know more than anyone how you can't win a division by having the best paper roster.

Have to play the games.
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  #23  
Old 02-11-2013, 06:18 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
I'm really not sure how much more anyone could have expected the Sox do to this offseason. Payroll's already stretched thin and the farm system is absolutely atrocious, there's not much wiggle room. But they will be chipping $32 and $41 million of salaries off the books in the next two years so there will be some money then, and hopefully Hahn is a little more proactive at building something in the minors.

This team is in really bad shape right now, it's definitely going to be muliyear process.
Here's the thing I don't understand with that line of thinking, which seems to be a majority view on the matter. If we are in that bad of shape, why did we re-sign Peavy then? You could save an additional $29 million that way if we really aren't going to go all out to try and win the division. This isn't basketball or football where there is a real salary cap. If the Sox have their own personal salary cap in mind, why not be under it now, pocket the extra cash, and then use it to go over their personal cap in 2 years then? It isn't like the money disappears if they don't spend it this year. I'm not advocating a full rebuild, but that signing doesn't seem to fit the narrative of a team waiting around for contracts to come off the books.
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  #24  
Old 02-11-2013, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post

Here's the thing I don't understand with that line of thinking, which seems to be a majority view on the matter. If we are in that bad of shape, why did we re-sign Peavy then? You could save an additional $29 million that way if we really aren't going to go all out to try and win the division. This isn't basketball or football where there is a real salary cap. If the Sox have their own personal salary cap in mind, why not be under it now, pocket the extra cash, and then use it to go over their personal cap in 2 years then? It isn't like the money disappears if they don't spend it this year. I'm not advocating a full rebuild, but that signing doesn't seem to fit the narrative of a team waiting around for contracts to come off the books.
Because they know the team has to be somewhat competitive to draw.

The Cubs are already arguably the more exciting team in Chicago NOW, just imagine if the Sox went out and punted the next 2-3 seasons in the hope of rebuilding. Hello 15K per night!

Extending Peavy two years and keeping the flicker of hope alive they might catch lightning in a bottle doesn't really change the long term plans, IMO. And anyways, its not like Peavy is keeping some young stud SP buried in Charlotte. Somebody's gotta pitch every fifth day.

Last edited by doublem23; 02-11-2013 at 06:56 PM.
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  #25  
Old 02-11-2013, 06:39 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Jinx View Post
Here's the thing I don't understand with that line of thinking, which seems to be a majority view on the matter. If we are in that bad of shape, why did we re-sign Peavy then? You could save an additional $29 million that way if we really aren't going to go all out to try and win the division. This isn't basketball or football where there is a real salary cap. If the Sox have their own personal salary cap in mind, why not be under it now, pocket the extra cash, and then use it to go over their personal cap in 2 years then? It isn't like the money disappears if they don't spend it this year. I'm not advocating a full rebuild, but that signing doesn't seem to fit the narrative of a team waiting around for contracts to come off the books.

The Sox are gambling that they will be in the hunt the next few years. Peavy is one of the pieces they hope will keep them in the hunt. If the team tanks, Peavy can be traded, the only way the Sox lose is if them team tanks and Peavy gets hurt or just plain stinks.
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  #26  
Old 02-11-2013, 07:41 PM
shingo10 shingo10 is offline
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The sad thing is that we don't really have a choice between rebuilding or not...there isn't an alternative to rebuilding that I can see. We just have to kind of watch this thing fizzle out and then hope by that time we have more options. Frustrating.

Pitching and defense can take a team a long way as we saw last year but at some point there has to be some hitting too. And being able to score with RISP.
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  #27  
Old 02-11-2013, 08:46 PM
blandman blandman is offline
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Originally Posted by shingo10 View Post
The sad thing is that we don't really have a choice between rebuilding or not...there isn't an alternative to rebuilding that I can see. We just have to kind of watch this thing fizzle out and then hope by that time we have more options. Frustrating.

Pitching and defense can take a team a long way as we saw last year but at some point there has to be some hitting too. And being able to score with RISP.

Eh...there's tradable pieces on this club and teams always pay more at the deadline. If the team tanks, Peavy, Gavin, Konerko, Thornton, and possibly even Rios (if he has another strong year) could all fetch some decent prospects.
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  #28  
Old 02-11-2013, 09:07 PM
Mr. Jinx Mr. Jinx is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Because they know the team has to be somewhat competitive to draw.

The Cubs are already arguably the more exciting team in Chicago NOW, just imagine if the Sox went out and punted the next 2-3 seasons in the hope of rebuilding. Hello 15K per night!

Extending Peavy two years and keeping the flicker of hope alive they might catch lightning in a bottle doesn't really change the long term plans, IMO. And anyways, its not like Peavy is keeping some young stud SP buried in Charlotte. Somebody's gotta pitch every fifth day.
15k per night means I less traffic, cheaper seats, and less *******s around me at the game, sign me up!

Seriously though, I suppose it does keep a bit of hope alive.
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  #29  
Old 02-11-2013, 09:22 PM
RKMeibalane RKMeibalane is offline
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Originally Posted by Lip Man 1 View Post
Am very, very surprised the Sox haven't done more to this point.

For right now, Hahn is taking a chance, we'll see how it turns out. Apparently all his talk about things in the works around Sox-fest time were simply BS.

Not a good start by him in my opinion.


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  #30  
Old 02-12-2013, 02:03 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shingo10 View Post
The sad thing is that we don't really have a choice between rebuilding or not...there isn't an alternative to rebuilding that I can see. We just have to kind of watch this thing fizzle out and then hope by that time we have more options. Frustrating.

Pitching and defense can take a team a long way as we saw last year but at some point there has to be some hitting too. And being able to score with RISP.
I really don't think the Sox need to go into a full blown, bottom out rebuild. With over $70 million coming off the books over the next two seasons there is going to be plenty of payroll flexibility for Hahn to work with and in his time as AGM and now GM he's shown some pretty nice creativity to work deals that maximize the team's resources.
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