ESPN's top 100 MLB players.

[chicagowhitesox1]

Originally Posted by DoItForDanPasqua

Great point about Arky Vaughan; I think he should be ranked higher than Jeter. I'm also a little surprised about Berra not being given a better ranking.

I still can't believe they didn't include Mickey Cochrane. I have the best catchers as...

1. Johnny Bench
2. Yogi Berra
3. Mickey Cochrane...I guess he was kind of a jerk at times but great all around catcher.
4. Ivan Rodriguez.....Not deducting steroids
5. Mike Piazza....He actually called a good game. Defense hurts him a bit but he wasn't as bad as some think.
6. Gay Carter
7. Gabby Hartnett....Pretty underrated, He threw out 50% of base stealers.
8. Bill Dickey
9. Roy Campanella....Hate to put him so low.
10. Carlton Fisk.....I hate to rank him so low but I really feel these guys were better.

[Zakath]

Originally Posted by Boondock Saint

Same here. I don't think he belongs nearly that high. He certainly isn't the greatest pitcher of all time.

+1. Definitely have Gibson, both Johnsons, and possibly Seaver and Carlton ahead of him (and it's a close call on Ryan).

[chicagowhitesox1]

Originally Posted by Zakath

+1. Definitely have Gibson, both Johnsons, and possibly Seaver and Carlton ahead of him (and it's a close call on Ryan).

Walter Johnson, Tom Seaver, Randy Johnson and Bob Gibson are usually ranked in the top ten for all time pitchers. Steve Carlton is usually 15-20. Nolan Ryan is not really close to Roger Clemens. Without deducting Clemens for steroids he has a case for being the best pitcher of alltime. 354 wins, over 4000 strikeouts, a career era+ over 140 and the second highest career war among all time pitchers. (Cy Young has the highest career war but he pitched in a totally differant era.) Clemens pitched in Fenway Park and Yankee Stadium, Ryan pitched in a pitchers paradise most of his career. Clemens pitched in the steroid era and he had to pitch alot of games in a tough AL East division, Nolan Ryan pitched in a pitchers era against some pretty weak AL West and NL West teams. Now I'm guessing your deducting Clemens for his steroid use. I think everyone knows Clemens used but i'm pretty sure Nolan Ryan was using too. Ryan somehow gets a pass from using steroids. Fact #1 Nolan Ryan pitched for the Texas Rangers who were known for rampant steroid use. Fact #2 Nolans Ryans horse trainer got into trouble with the law for supplying steroids to a Texas college football team. Fact #3 Theres not too many pitchers who pitch effectively in there 40's unless your Roger Clemens or a knuckle ball pitcher. Nolan Ryan should be ranked in the 70's-80's range. He never won a Cy Young and he only made like 4 all star teams which tells you he wasn't even respected by his own generation. Meanwhile Roger Clemens has 7 Cy Youngs and Probably 15 all star appearances, I don't think theres any question Clemens is better.

I know the 7 no hitters Ryan threw look good but seven games shouldn't put you as a top 10 pitcher. Sammy Sosa has the most 3 homerun games and I doubt anyone will be calling him a top ten hitter anytime soon.

[slavko]

They were in love with longevity as a criterion.

[Deadguy]

Originally Posted by RKMeibalane

Frank Thomas should be higher on that list. The DH may have been held against him.

I thought his ranking was fair. There are some guys behind him that should be ahead of him, and vice a versa.

He is in the 80s in career WAR.

[palehosepub]

How could Bagwell be ahead of Frank? Ask 100 knowledegable, unbiased baseball fans who was the better player and I'll bet 80 would pick Thomas.

Thomas will be a Hall of Famer, Bagwell will not be.

[asindc]

Originally Posted by palehosepub

How could Bagwell be ahead of Frank? Ask 100 knowledegable, unbiased baseball fans who was the better player and I'll bet 80 would pick Thomas.

Thomas will be a Hall of Famer, Bagwell will not be.

Actually, Bagwell might be selected for the HoF, but Frank was the better player. I think Frank should be higher on this list and Jeter lower.

[SephClone89]

Originally Posted by palehosepub

How could Bagwell be ahead of Frank? Ask 100 knowledegable, unbiased baseball fans who was the better player and I'll bet 80 would pick Thomas.

Thomas will be a Hall of Famer, Bagwell will not be.

Originally Posted by asindc

Actually, Bagwell might be selected for the HoF, but Frank was the better player. I think Frank should be higher on this list and Jeter lower.

They're a lot closer than you think...

Thomas was a better hitter, but Bagwell played better defense and was a great baserunner, especially for a first baseman. Plus, Thomas DHing for a large part of his career is a knock against him as an overall player.

I'll take Thomas, but I'm not going to throw a fit if someone picks Bagwell.

They're both among the best 1B of all time and both should make the Hall.