2012 player grades

[asindc]

Originally Posted by TaylorStSox

The shift killed Dunn. I've actually never seen it work so well against a hitter.

Dunn being bad doesn't excuse Konerko from also being bad. PK had trouble getting the ball out of the infield.

All the more reason why the "Hulk Smash" approach to hitting needs some refiining. Hell, I wanted to see him lay down a few bunts to the left side when the shift was on until they adjusted. With his all-or-nothing approach, defenses had no reason to adjust.

[TDog]

Originally Posted by asindc

All the more reason why the "Hulk Smash" approach to hitting needs some refiining. Hell, I wanted to see him lay down a few bunts to the left side when the shift was on until they adjusted. With his all-or-nothing approach, defenses had no reason to adjust.

If Dunn had bunted for a few hits to beat the shift, the shift would have ended.

[Konerko05]

Originally Posted by TDog

If Dunn had bunted for a few hits to beat the shift, the shift would have ended.

No, it wouldn't have. A big reason Dunn has over 1000 walks in his career is because pitchers are scared he is going to hit the ball 500 feet. If pitchers are not scared to put Dunn on base via base on balls, they will definitely not be scared to put Dunn on base via bunt. Bunting essentially takes away Dunn's main strength as a hitter- putting runs on the board with one swing.

I have absolutely no problem with him driving the ball opposite field. There is no excuse for him not trying this more often. His opposite field swing isn't bad at all, and it does not limit him to a single.

[TDog]

Originally Posted by Konerko05

No, it wouldn't have. A big reason Dunn has over 1000 walks in his career is because pitchers are scared he is going to hit the ball 500 feet. If pitchers are not scared to put Dunn on base via base on balls, they will definitely not be scared to put Dunn on base via bunt. Bunting essentially takes away Dunn's main strength as a hitter- putting runs on the board with one swing.

I have absolutely no problem with him driving the ball opposite field. There is no excuse for him not trying this more often. His opposite field swing isn't bad at all, and it does not limit him to a single.

The shift is only exagerated on the infield. The shft only addresses singles. Outfielders shade Dunn to pull, but they don't put on an exaggerated shift. I would guess Dunn reached base on about three-quarters of his line drives, even with the infield clustered on the first base side of second base. If he hits line drives, it doesn't really matter what field he hits them to.

Dunn only lost singles hitting into the shift. Maybe a few doubles, but they would have been doubles he would have had to run out. That is all defenses are defending against when they employ the shift. If Dunn hits ground balls down the third base line, teams would adjust their defenses accordingly.

It is true, though, that if he is trying to hit to hit to the opposite field, he isn't trying to hit a home run. But often when he is trying to hit a home run, he is striking out.

[Frater Perdurabo]

Lets say it more simply. If Dunn is going to strike out 200 times, he needs to hit 50 HRs and 40+ doubles.

[doublem23]

Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo

Lets say it more simply. If Dunn is going to strike out 200 times, he needs to hit 50 HRs and 40+ doubles.

Since Dunn was nowhere near the top of the Outs Made in the AL, the strikeouts really don't matter.

And 50 HR, 40 doubles... That has happened... twice in AL history (Babe Ruth 1921, Albert Belle 1995). Might want to lower them standards.

[Frater Perdurabo]

Originally Posted by doublem23

Since Dunn was nowhere near the top of the Outs Made in the AL, the strikeouts really don't matter.

And 50 HR, 40 doubles... That has happened... twice in AL history (Babe Ruth 1921, Albert Belle 1995). Might want to lower them standards.

We've been lowering standards for too long. We need to hold this organization and its players to higher standards.

[doublem23]

Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo

We've been lowering standards for too long. We need to hold this organization and its players to higher standards.

Nice empty rhetoric.

Asking someone to have a season that is practically unprecedented in history isn't "raising standards." It's being a ****ing moron.

[sullythered]

Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo

We've been lowering standards for too long. We need to hold this organization and its players to higher standards.

So the standards we should expect from an individual player is to have one of the few greatest offensive seasons in the history of the game?

[Frater Perdurabo]

Originally Posted by sullythered

So the standards we should expect from an individual player is to have one of the few greatest offensive seasons in the history of the game?

OK, I exaggerated. But with that many strikeouts and that low of an average, he should hit for more power. Otherwise he's Rob Deer in a smaller park.

[Frater Perdurabo]

Originally Posted by doublem23

Nice empty rhetoric.

Asking someone to have a season that is practically unprecedented in history isn't "raising standards." It's being a ****ing moron.

Thanks for the classy name calling invective. It makes your point so much more effective.

[doublem23]

Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo

Thanks for the classy name calling invective. It makes your point so much more effective.

Adam Dunn needs to bat 1.000 next season OR HE'S A FAILURE

[Frater Perdurabo]

Originally Posted by doublem23

Adam Dunn needs to bat 1.000 next season OR HE'S A FAILURE

Exaggerating to absurdity also is an effective strategy.

See my earlier reply. He needs to hit for higher average and/or more extra base hits. So many strikeouts, plus a lack of productive outs, plus such a low average, plus his defensive limitations, limits his effectiveness.

[doublem23]

Originally Posted by Frater Perdurabo

Exaggerating to absurdity also is an effective strategy.

Now you know how I felt when I saw someone saying a guy had to hit 50 HR and 40 doubles. Completely absurd standard to hold a player to.

[TDog]

Originally Posted by doublem23

Adam Dunn needs to bat 1.000 next season OR HE'S A FAILURE

He didn't come close to that this year, and he was a miserable failure. Suggesting that he would be a failure even if he put up Miguel Cabrera numbers misrepresents the position of those who would prefer he didn't create a black hole in the White Sox lineup, which is exactly what a player who hits less than .220 and strikes out more than 220 in a season presents.