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  #46  
Old 10-01-2012, 08:40 AM
russ99 russ99 is offline
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Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
In terms of marketing the team, Steve Stone is the worst thing to happen to the Sox in the past four years.

I'm surprised so many people are oblivious to this fact.

I'd take Hawk and DJ back in a heartbeat over Stone being in the booth. I don't think at this point that is the solution to the problem, but it's a statement to the fact that the Sox fanbase wants to listen homer announcers, either on the radio or tv side. Even John Rooney was a homer announcer. Steve Stone has gone out of his way to be as anti-homer and unenthusiastic about the Sox product as anyone possibly could, whether goofing on how bad the bobbleheads looked this year, to making fun of fans eating food in the stands when the tv cameras are on them, to refusing to show any enthusiasm after a big Sox hit or homer. Steve Stone hasn't sold a ticket to a Sox game since he joined the radio side in 2008.

My dream would be for Rooney to come back to Chicago. Team him back with Farmer and try to rekindle that magic.

Second choice would be for the Sox to raid the Mariners broadcast booth and bring Rick Rizz and Dave Sims over.

Third choice would be to get Dave Wills back to town.

A house-cleaning is in order. Stone and Farmer should be the first ones to go. Hawk may need to go after that. I'm the biggest Harrelson supporter there is, but his behavior over the past two weeks have been inexcusable and is pretty much a basis for firing. I know 1-9 in ten games is awful, but at least show up and try to do a professional broadcast. Of the four announcers, amazingly, the one guy I might consider keeping is DJ.

In the back of my mind, I still remember the series from Oakland in 2003 when Rooney went over to the tv side and teamed with DJ. Hawk was out for some reason. It was a great series. Unfortunately, I think DJ's been relegated to the goofy sidekick role with Hawk and Farmer for the past 13 years. If he was ever teamed up with a real announcer, he'd probably be able to shine.

Ok - that went longer than I thought. Point is, Stone sucks and he can go back to the Cubs.
+1, my sentiments exactly.

Seems like they hired Stone due to history as being the #2 guy with iconic broadcasters, and he wants to be the main guy.

If Hawk does hang it up (hopefully not too soon), then they should clean house and start over with a new crew.
  #47  
Old 10-01-2012, 08:58 AM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Just out of curiosity, and I don't like Hawk very much, either, but do people really think the TV and radio announcers bring fans to the park? Like, do you actually think there is this subgroup of Sox fans that want to go see the team live and in person, but don't because Hawk Harrelson and Ed Farmer are butchering the games on TV and the radio?
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  #48  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:02 AM
SephClone89 SephClone89 is online now
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Just out of curiosity, and I don't like Hawk very much, either, but do people really think the TV and radio announcers bring fans to the park? Like, do you actually think there is this subgroup of Sox fans that want to go see the team live and in person, but don't because Hawk Harrelson and Ed Farmer are butchering the games on TV and the radio?
I'm more likely to see the team live and in person because Hawk and Farmer are butchering the games.

If we had a great broadcasting team I'd probably go to fewer games.
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  #49  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:14 AM
KyWhiSoxFan KyWhiSoxFan is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Just out of curiosity, and I don't like Hawk very much, either, but do people really think the TV and radio announcers bring fans to the park? Like, do you actually think there is this subgroup of Sox fans that want to go see the team live and in person, but don't because Hawk Harrelson and Ed Farmer are butchering the games on TV and the radio?
In many respects, this is the most important question facing Sox brass. If the announcers can be seen as part of the marketing arm of the team (which I believe), then in my opinion some of the blame on the attendance problems over the past decade can be traced to Harrelson. He is one of the biggest homers when it comes to announcers on in TV (from a recent poll), so you can draw a conclusion that he has not been successful in creating new fans, since the Sox have had attendance problems for years.

Fandom is not all created merely by wins and losses (as can be seen by the support of teams like the Cubs) but by latent and nurtured feelings about a team, what it stands for, its public perception, how it plays to a person's feelings and sense of belonging. Harrelson creates a feeling of persecution, made up of bad calls, bad luck, and incessant woe-is-me play by play. People tune it to baseball as a diversion and they don't want to hear all this negativity.

Harrelson has not created new fans because he only preaches to the choir. And the choir does not like him universally, either.

Would we be having this discussion if Vin Scully were the announcer for the past 20 years?
  #50  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:21 AM
lpneck lpneck is offline
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The deal with Hawk is simple: (and generally I like him, but he does do some things that make me cringe...)

When the Sox are winning, he typically makes it more fun.
When the Sox are losing, he typically makes it even worse.

The issue is on everyone's mind because the last 2 weeks have been so awful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyWhiSoxFan View Post
Would we be having this discussion if Vin Scully were the announcer for the past 20 years?
I can't staaaaaaaand Vin Sc.... zzzzzzzzzzzzz
  #51  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by KyWhiSoxFan View Post
Would we be having this discussion if Vin Scully were the announcer for the past 20 years?
Once people woke up from their Vin Scully enduced nap, probably

  #52  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:37 AM
shingo10 shingo10 is offline
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One guy who I thought had a really bright future broadcasting in the Sox family was BlackJack McDowell. His insights were awesome and he was never afraid to let his true opinions be known even when it went directly against the manager (Ozzie at the time) Maybe him and the Sox can mend fences and he can get back into it. He is very knowledgeable and would be a great addition next to Hawk. The two of them would be very passionate but very informative IMO.
  #53  
Old 10-01-2012, 09:55 AM
russ99 russ99 is offline
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Originally Posted by shingo10 View Post
One guy who I thought had a really bright future broadcasting in the Sox family was BlackJack McDowell. His insights were awesome and he was never afraid to let his true opinions be known even when it went directly against the manager (Ozzie at the time) Maybe him and the Sox can mend fences and he can get back into it. He is very knowledgeable and would be a great addition next to Hawk. The two of them would be very passionate but very informative IMO.
I think Black Jack was only filling in on the west coast because he lived there and wasn't willing to travel. Not sure if he'd move his family and his other interests just to broadcast the Sox, even if it were a full-time gig.
  #54  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
I think Black Jack was only filling in on the west coast because he lived there and wasn't willing to travel. Not sure if he'd move his family and his other interests just to broadcast the Sox, even if it were a full-time gig.
That's kind of what I thought, too, although, a lot of people said the same thing about Robin when he was doing fill-in broadcasting for the Sox, too; that he was happy to help when convenient for him but wasn't interested in a full-time gig. Who knows?
  #55  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:18 AM
kba kba is offline
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Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
Like, do you actually think there is this subgroup of Sox fans that want to go see the team live and in person, but don't because Hawk Harrelson and Ed Farmer are butchering the games on TV and the radio?
Of course not. The announcers aren't keeping established fans from buying tickets, but they're also not doing much to attract new fans to the team. Just like if you're an established Budweiser drinker, you're not going to stop drinking it because Anheuser-Bush is running annoying TV commercials. But bad ads won't attract new customers.

I would guess the Sox have done market research on their announcers, and I have no idea what it's found. But it's hard for me to imagine that either the TV or radio crews are increasing the fan base -- even when the team is playing well.
  #56  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
Like I said, I've defended Hawk for years. His behavior over the past two weeks has been pretty despicable. The dude had no business being on the air this weekend. He was unfit to broadcast.
Can I ask what he did? I didn't hear or see the games though I am sure I could guess. A lot of silence and overall pouting?
  #57  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:30 AM
dwalteroo dwalteroo is offline
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Originally Posted by lpneck View Post
The deal with Hawk is simple: (and generally I like him, but he does do some things that make me cringe...)

When the Sox are winning, he typically makes it more fun.
When the Sox are losing, he typically makes it even worse.
This.

And you can't separate the two. When the Sox are winning I love him. When the Sox are losing I can't stand him.

I have no idea what they should do, but I don't like the thought of losing Steve Stone.
  #58  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:36 AM
TaylorStSox TaylorStSox is offline
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Can I ask what he did? I didn't hear or see the games though I am sure I could guess. A lot of silence and overall pouting?
Somewhere between angry old cuss and petulant child.
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I'm not counting this homerun or his 3 RBI from today's game because of the game situation. I'm not counting his pinch hit solo homerun in a blowout win in Colorado. In my book, Crede has 2 less home runs than his statistics show, 4 less RBI, and one less walk (the one where he pinch hit for Uribe after coming in with a 3-0 count and taking one pitch).
  #59  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:37 AM
jdm2662 jdm2662 is offline
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Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
I think Black Jack was only filling in on the west coast because he lived there and wasn't willing to travel. Not sure if he'd move his family and his other interests just to broadcast the Sox, even if it were a full-time gig.
Yes, he was only doing fill in games when the Sox were on the west coast. Of course, he had a blog and wasn't 100% pro-White Sox or Hawk didn't care for his opinion. Since he went against the ol Hawk, "He will never work in the booth with me again." Those were Hawk's exact words.
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  #60  
Old 10-01-2012, 10:44 AM
jdm2662 jdm2662 is offline
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Originally Posted by SephClone89 View Post
I'm more likely to see the team live and in person because Hawk and Farmer are butchering the games.

If we had a great broadcasting team I'd probably go to fewer games.
I guess since Harry sold the brand like none other, announcers are suposed to do the same. My father wasn't a huge baseball fan and the White Sox were pretty terrible in the 70s. Yet, my father would watch the White Sox games just to listen to Harry and Jimmy. I'm certainly not going to watch the Sox just to listen to Hawk, that's for sure. Hell, I barely can watch if the Sox are losing. He's that unbearable.

Hawk is nothing but a kiss ass and spokesperson for the chairman. That has what he has been for years. Not that it's the worst thing in the world. The chairman signs his paychecks. It sucks the Sox fell apart in the end. But, you still have a job to do.
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