White Sox Interactive Forums
Sox Clubhouse
 Soxogram: 
Congratulations on winning the AL ROTY award unanimously, Jose!

Welcome
Go Back   White Sox Interactive Forums > Baseball Discussions > Sox Clubhouse
Home Chat Stats Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #91  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:07 PM
Lip Man 1 Lip Man 1 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chubbuck, Idaho
Posts: 26,379
Default

Spivak:

You are confusing me with someone else.

My bottom lines for success are in order (lowest to highest)

1. Have a winning season
2. Make the playoffs

Anything above that is gravy to me. I've never said it's World Series title or bust, that's ludicrous.

That's saying a 95 win season in 2000 was a failure, that's ridiculous.

Double:

Glad I can entertain you. At least I do it without personally insulting people which is by far your M.O. It must be a burden being smarter than anyone else and having all the answers all the time isn't it?

Lip
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:23 PM
russ99 russ99 is offline
WSI High Priest
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,753
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOldRoman View Post
My point was, it's a little disingenuous to go back to 1996 to say the Rangers are a bad franchise. Since Ryan became president, the team has improved every year. After missing the playoffs the first two years, they will have made it the last three (with two pennants). The Rangers in 2012 are a completely different franchise than the Rangers of 2004. The only thing they share are hats.
And yes, they results need to come on the field for the expected impact of the Rangers to be realized, but difference here is they have more resources than the Sox and leverage those resources better than the Sox. TV deals are now a big part of it. Any word on if the Sox are going after that?

The Rangers go after the very best players and invest in their minor league systems, while the Sox mostly do it on the cheap, and blame the fans for not coming to the park.

And sadly, it doesn't seem that changing the GM will really change any of that.
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:26 PM
doublem23's Avatar
doublem23 doublem23 is offline
MMXXIII
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Roscoe Village
Posts: 54,244
Blog Entries: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
The Rangers go after the very best players and invest in their minor league systems, while the Sox mostly do it on the cheap, and blame the fans for not coming to the park.
This is the first year since 2003 the Rangers have outspent the White Sox on payroll
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:45 PM
kobo kobo is offline
WSI Church Elder
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Mount prospect
Posts: 4,468
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
This is the first year since 2003 the Rangers have outspent the White Sox on payroll
Payroll is just one aspect of the MLB franchise. I think what Russ was referring to was the lack of money being spent on the minor league system and player development, and not going after many high priced free agents. In that regard, the Sox are cheap.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:49 PM
doublem23's Avatar
doublem23 doublem23 is offline
MMXXIII
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Roscoe Village
Posts: 54,244
Blog Entries: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kobo View Post
Payroll is just one aspect of the MLB franchise. I think what Russ was referring to was the lack of money being spent on the minor league system and player development, and not going after many high priced free agents. In that regard, the Sox are cheap.
The irony, of course, is that I think the White Sox and Rangers have about an equal number of exclusively homegrown players on their roster.
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 09-21-2012, 04:52 PM
Noneck Noneck is offline
The Blind Squirrel that finally found an acorn.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Nw Side
Posts: 7,267
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kobo View Post
Payroll is just one aspect of the MLB franchise. I think what Russ was referring to was the lack of money being spent on the minor league system and player development, and not going after many high priced free agents. In that regard, the Sox are cheap.

Thats a good point the Sox should be able to keep their payroll in the top 1/3 and spend on minor league signings and of course scouting and player development.
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 09-21-2012, 11:56 PM
Tragg Tragg is online now
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Gonzales LA
Posts: 12,953
Blog Entries: 2
Default

Other than perhaps some of the current year trades to prop up this team of declining veterans, Williams hasn't made a quality trade in years.
Time for a change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
The irony, of course, is that I think the White Sox and Rangers have about an equal number of exclusively homegrown players on their roster.
The Rangers have far more usable or marketble prospects, and a superior current team.
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:15 AM
WhiteSox5187 WhiteSox5187 is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Southside
Posts: 14,365
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doublem23 View Post
The irony, of course, is that I think the White Sox and Rangers have about an equal number of exclusively homegrown players on their roster.
That is true but the Rangers were also able to identify and trade for young prospects like Feliz, Harrison, and Andrus, when was the last time the White Sox were able to identify and trade for young players? Part of the White Sox problem isn't just the inability to develop young guys we draft but also an inability to identify and trade for young prospects in other organizations. As such the Sox are forced to rely on free agents (who are usually in their 30s) or failed prospects and washed up veterans.
__________________

Go Sox!!!
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:20 AM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Evanston
Posts: 29,006
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteSox5187 View Post
That is true but the Rangers were also able to identify and trade for young prospects like Feliz, Harrison, and Andrus, when was the last time the White Sox were able to identify and trade for young players? Part of the White Sox problem isn't just the inability to develop young guys we draft but also an inability to identify and trade for young prospects in other organizations. As such the Sox are forced to rely on free agents (who are usually in their 30s) or failed prospects and washed up veterans.
Funny you mention those three together! All acquired in that Mark Teixeira trade. Man, would the Braves love a do-over on that one. How good would the Rangers be without those three?
__________________
Attendance records:
09 : 3-2.
10 : 2-3.
11: 0-1.
12: 2-1.
14: 2-3.
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:23 AM
Brian26's Avatar
Brian26 Brian26 is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Chicago
Posts: 29,478
Blog Entries: 52
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSpivack View Post
Funny you mention those three together! All acquired in that Mark Teixeira trade. Man, would the Braves love a do-over on that one. How good would the Rangers be without those three?
That's one of the great trades of the last 20 years when you consider they also got Salty who is now with Boston.
Reply With Quote
  #101  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:25 AM
WhiteSox5187 WhiteSox5187 is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Southside
Posts: 14,365
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSpivack View Post
Funny you mention those three together! All acquired in that Mark Teixeira trade. Man, would the Braves love a do-over on that one. How good would the Rangers be without those three?
Seeing as how the Braves have a playoff spot all but locked up and made the playoffs two years after making the trade, I would argue it hasn't hurt them terribly. It was a terrific trade by the Rangers and an excellent job by their scouting department.
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:26 AM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Evanston
Posts: 29,006
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian26 View Post
That's one of the great trades of the last 20 years when you consider they also got Salty who is now with Boston.
It reminds me the Randy Johnson to Houston trade. Help build another team for a 3-month rental. Teams don't undervalue their prospects anymore like that.
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:27 AM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Evanston
Posts: 29,006
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteSox5187 View Post
Seeing as how the Braves have a playoff spot all but locked up and made the playoffs two years after making the trade, I would argue it hasn't hurt them terribly. It was a terrific trade by the Rangers and an excellent job by their scouting department.
They gave up 4 good, if not great, prospects, for a 3-month rental. I'd say that's a pretty disastrous trade for Atlanta.
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:39 AM
WhiteSox5187 WhiteSox5187 is offline
WSI Prelate
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Southside
Posts: 14,365
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSpivack View Post
They gave up 4 good, if not great, prospects, for a 3-month rental. I'd say that's a pretty disastrous trade for Atlanta.
That was a bad trade but it didn't destroy the future of the franchise. They were back in the playoffs within two years. Most organizations couldn't recover from a trade like that, that was my point.
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 09-22-2012, 12:45 AM
DSpivack DSpivack is offline
WSI Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Evanston
Posts: 29,006
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteSox5187 View Post
That was a bad trade but it didn't destroy the future of the franchise. They were back in the playoffs within two years. Most organizations couldn't recover from a trade like that, that was my point.
Of course not, but the Braves certainly would have had a much better last few years had they never made that trade.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Forum Jump




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:21 PM.




Design by: Michelle

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Site-specific editorial/photos Copyright ©2001 - 2008 White Sox Interactive. All rights reserved.