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  #31  
Old 07-27-2010, 01:50 PM
Lillian Lillian is offline
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I knew that my post would get this kind of response, as it did when I first brought it up.

We'll see.
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  #32  
Old 07-27-2010, 01:53 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillian View Post
I knew that my post would get this kind of response, as it did when I first brought it up.

We'll see.
It's because it's a bad idea. And we really won't see anything - De Aza will probably get a September callup to serve as a 5th OF; maybe not.

If the Sox had any desire to upgrade from Pierre, and I do not believe they do at all, it won't be with someone in AAA.
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  #33  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:02 PM
Lillian Lillian is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
It's because it's a bad idea. And we really won't see anything - De Aza will probably get a September callup to serve as a 5th OF; maybe not.

If the Sox had any desire to upgrade from Pierre, and I do not believe they do at all, it won't be with someone in AAA.
I'm curious, how much have you seen De Aza play?
I was very impressed when I saw him play almost every Spring Training game. I understand that it's only Spring Training, and that his last couple of years of very good production were at AAA. However, he can do a lot of things, and has always been regarded very highly as a potentially good prototypical lead off hitter.

Yes, I would be happy if the Sox could move Pierre, and give De Aza a shot. Pierre's production in almost 400 at bats in the A.L. this season has been very "under whelming". I can't imagine De Aza would do any worse.
Dumping Pierre's salary, and getting back something useful would be just fine with me.

But, I can see that you guys think Pierre is the answer. O.K.
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  #34  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:07 PM
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doublem23 doublem23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillian View Post
I knew that my post would get this kind of response, as it did when I first brought it up.

We'll see.
Will you stop feeling so bad for yourself? If anybody had suggested we replace Pierre with De Aza, it'd get that kind of reaction.

De Aza is a career minor leaguer for a reason.

Since May, Juan's OBP is over .340. OK, he doesn't do a lot of things well, but he's been able to get on base fairly often and he is more the prototypical lead-off hitter that Ozzie loves. Maybe De Aza would put up nicer numbers, but I don't know if he's a better fit for this team.

I wouldn't mind him coming up and replacing Andruw Jones. Would be nice to have a backup OF that could play all 3 positions well.
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  #35  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:10 PM
soltrain21 soltrain21 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillian View Post
I'm curious, how much have you seen De Aza play?
I was very impressed when I saw him play almost every Spring Training game. I understand that it's only Spring Training, and that his last couple of years of very good production were at AAA. However, he can do a lot of things, and has always been regarded very highly as a potentially good prototypical lead off hitter.

Yes, I would be happy if the Sox could move Pierre, and give De Aza a shot. Pierre's production in almost 400 at bats in the A.L. this season has been very "under whelming". I can't imagine De Aza would do any worse.
Dumping Pierre's salary, and getting back something useful would be just fine with me.

But, I can see that you guys think Pierre is the answer. O.K.
At his absolute BEST with EVERYTHING going right De Aza would be Juan Pierre. But what would happen when (not if, but when) he fails miserably do we do? And what are you expecting to get out of Juan Pierre in a trade?

It's a terrible idea all around.
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  #36  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:27 PM
kittle42 kittle42 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillian View Post
I'm curious, how much have you seen De Aza play?
I was very impressed when I saw him play almost every Spring Training game. I understand that it's only Spring Training, and that his last couple of years of very good production were at AAA. However, he can do a lot of things, and has always been regarded very highly as a potentially good prototypical lead off hitter.
Come on, Lillian. Step back for a second and you *have* to realize how ridiculous your position is here. You post here a good deal and obviously have a good knowledge of baseball.
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  #37  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:30 PM
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voodoochile voodoochile is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
Come on, Lillian. Step back for a second and you *have* to realize how ridiculous your position is here. You post here a good deal and obviously have a good knowledge of baseball.
It constantly amazes me when people throw out a troll, knowing they are throwing out a troll, get the response to said troll they are expecting and then get defensive about it.

It's kind of unusual for someone to admit they were throwing out a troll though, so that's kind of new...
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  #38  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:34 PM
Lillian Lillian is offline
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Originally Posted by kittle42 View Post
Come on, Lillian. Step back for a second and you *have* to realize how ridiculous your position is here. You post here a good deal and obviously have a good knowledge of baseball.
OK, ok. So it's a bad idea.
I just don't like Pierre's game, and I really do like De Aza.
It is worth noting that Ozzie loves De Aza's game, as well. So I'm not completely "out to lunch" here.
Honestly, you can't really tell me that you like Pierre's first 400 at bats in the A.L., can you?

Don't worry, I don't take it personally. It's just a difference of opinion, and I guess no one agrees with me.

Go Sox
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  #39  
Old 07-27-2010, 02:35 PM
Lillian Lillian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoochile View Post
It constantly amazes me when people throw out a troll, knowing they are throwing out a troll, get the response to said troll they are expecting and then get defensive about it.

It's kind of unusual for someone to admit they were throwing out a troll though, so that's kind of new...
Guilty, as charged.
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  #40  
Old 07-27-2010, 11:38 PM
A. Cavatica A. Cavatica is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lillian View Post
OK, ok. So it's a bad idea.
I just don't like Pierre's game, and I really do like De Aza.
It is worth noting that Ozzie loves De Aza's game, as well. So I'm not completely "out to lunch" here.
Honestly, you can't really tell me that you like Pierre's first 400 at bats in the A.L., can you?

Don't worry, I don't take it personally. It's just a difference of opinion, and I guess no one agrees with me.

Go Sox
Ozzie also loves Pierre's game. And Wise's game. And Erstad's game. And Ozuna's game. And Timo's game.

Ozuna is the only one of those players who was worth what they paid him, IMO.

Ozzie is a horrible judge of talent.
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  #41  
Old 07-28-2010, 12:29 AM
rdivaldi rdivaldi is offline
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Originally Posted by A. Cavatica View Post
And Wise's game. And Erstad's game. And Ozuna's game. And Timo's game.
I don't think I've ever heard Ozzie say that about any of those players.

Pierre is notoriously better in the second half of the season than the first, this thread was silly from the get go.
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  #42  
Old 07-28-2010, 12:33 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by rdivaldi View Post
I don't think I've ever heard Ozzie say that about any of those players.

Pierre is notoriously better in the second half of the season than the first, this thread was silly from the get go.
Erstad his .400 hitter; or Wise's tremendous spring (.301 obp)?
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  #43  
Old 07-28-2010, 09:48 AM
russ99 russ99 is offline
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Were any of those players brought in to start like Pierre was, or had the track record at leadoff of Pierre?

No. Juan is a completely different case. The rest of your supposed bad players "who Ozzie liked" were forced into a larger role because Anderson couldn't cut it.

You can wail about this until you're blue in the face, but the fact is that Wise, Erstad, Mackowiak, Owens, etc. all were backups and bench players and since the club foolishly put their trust in the development of Brian Anderson, they had to take a bigger role when it turned out he couldn't hit big league pitching.
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  #44  
Old 07-28-2010, 10:07 AM
Tragg Tragg is offline
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Originally Posted by russ99 View Post
You can wail about this until you're blue in the face, but the fact is that Wise, Erstad, Mackowiak, Owens, etc. all were backups and bench players and since the club foolishly put their trust in the development of Brian Anderson, they had to take a bigger role when it turned out he couldn't hit big league pitching.
Complete and utter spin.
They were backups that awed Guillen with their talent, so he elevated them and refused to take them out of the lineup.
And what's the Kotsay excuse? There's no Anderson.
There was no Anderson for Owens in, Quentin in AAA.
And there was no Anderson at LEADOFF to uplift Wise there (nothing excuses Wise).
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  #45  
Old 07-28-2010, 01:23 PM
Taliesinrk Taliesinrk is offline
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Originally Posted by Tragg View Post
Complete and utter spin.
They were backups that awed Guillen with their talent, so he elevated them and refused to take them out of the lineup.
And what's the Kotsay excuse? There's no Anderson.
There was no Anderson for Owens in, Quentin in AAA.
And there was no Anderson at LEADOFF to uplift Wise there (nothing excuses Wise).
- (I still like Ozzie though).
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