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View Full Version : The best example ever as to why MLB has to have instant replay


Viva Medias B's
04-13-2008, 10:41 PM
Major League Baseball must have instant replay. There is absolutely no doubt about it now. Today, the Cubs got a home run that wasn't when the batted ball went past the pole on the foul side. The wrong call got the Phillies' manager, Charlie Manuel, ejected. It also helped the Cubs win the game in the end, proving that the only way they can really win ballgames is when they have the golden horseshoe stuck up their collective rear end.

And for those of you who oppose MLB instant replay, don't throw that "human element" stuff at me. That is just a phrase concocted by Bud Selig to confuse the feeble-minded.

CubKilla
04-13-2008, 10:47 PM
Major League Baseball must have instant replay. There is absolutely no doubt about it now. Today, the Cubs got a home run that wasn't when the batted ball went past the pole on the foul side. The wrong call got the Phillies' manager, Charlie Manuel, ejected. It also helped the Cubs win the game in the end, proving that the only way they can really win ballgames is when they have the golden horseshoe stuck up their collective rear end.

And for those of you who oppose MLB instant replay, don't throw that "human element" stuff at me. That is just a phrase concocted by Bud Selig to confuse the feeble-minded.

I thought I heard the MLB owners voted in favor of instant replay during this past offseason for, specifically, this purpose. Did I hear wrong or does anyone know what came of the vote?????

sox1970
04-13-2008, 10:52 PM
Fair or foul on a homerun is the only play I'd like to see instant replay. It's a quick review and 100% correct.

BadBobbyJenks
04-13-2008, 10:58 PM
CUBSESSED!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously though, yea I think home run calls and fair foul calls should be reviewed.
Do it like hockey does and send it up to the booth and have a guy up there make the call.

doublem23
04-13-2008, 11:02 PM
Fair or foul on a homerun is the only play I'd like to see instant replay. It's a quick review and 100% correct.

There are some other calls that can be judged quickly... 1B foot off the bag, trapped vs. caught balls in OF, whether or not someone left their base early while tagging up, etc.

Really, I think the only thing you can't realistically have reviewed by instant replay are balls and strikes.

voodoochile
04-13-2008, 11:07 PM
There are some other calls that can be judged quickly... 1B foot off the bag, trapped vs. caught balls in OF, whether or not someone left their base early while tagging up, etc.

Really, I think the only thing you can't realistically have reviewed by instant replay are balls and strikes.

The problem is what happens next? Ball is called caught by the ump and all the runners return to base safely. Replay shows the ball was trapped. Now what do you do? Where do the runners go? Does it matter if the ball was trapped in the outfield grass as the outfielder ran toward the infield or if he was running out toward the track and trapped it against the wall?

What if it got trapped on the infield dirt but it was the third out of the inning? Do you assume no error and that the play would have led to an out anyway?

Edit: I used to feel like you, doub. I wanted replay and lots of it, but became convinced that it's too difficult and subjective to implement in baseball because unlike in every other sport, the ball isn't in the hands of the offensive team. Things happen away from the ball all the time in baseball that have major scoring implications. In fact, if you want to score, you want the ball as far away from you as possible when attempting it. This is the exact opposite of all the other major sports.

doublem23
04-13-2008, 11:17 PM
Fair enough, but in your scenario, even if the runners get to move an arbitrary extra base or give the batter a double, I'd still take that over losing a phantom out. Maybe you can't exactly duplicate the scenario that would have occurred, but I'd like to at least try and get things as right as possible, rather than just throw my hands in the air and say "it's too difficult."

Bruizer
04-13-2008, 11:33 PM
Instant replay wouldn't have helped the Phillies tonight. The ball went over the foul pole, and every angle they showed afterwards was inconclusive. They should just extend the foul poles higher. :cool:

TDog
04-13-2008, 11:48 PM
I don't like the idea of instant replay and don't really respect a sport that gives lip service to allowing it while limiting its use.

Judging whether ruled home runs or ruled foul balls with home run distance are in fact fair and foul would be unobtrusive enough, though. You're talking about a dead ball situation. An instant replay would be no different than umpires conferring as they sometimes do after such plays.

It doesn't really upset me that such a play contributed to the Cubs winning today, but there was a Joe Crede non-home run a few years ago that seemed to more justifiably rile people here.

Nellie_Fox
04-14-2008, 12:00 AM
Major League Baseball must have instant replay. There is absolutely no doubt about it now. Today, the Cubs got a home run that wasn't when the batted ball went past the pole on the foul side. The wrong call got the Phillies' manager, Charlie Manuel, ejected. It also helped the Cubs win the game in the end, proving that the only way they can really win ballgames is when they have the golden horseshoe stuck up their collective rear end.

And for those of you who oppose MLB instant replay, don't throw that "human element" stuff at me. That is just a phrase concocted by Bud Selig to confuse the feeble-minded.

Fair or foul on a homerun is the only play I'd like to see instant replay. It's a quick review and 100% correct.TV is two-dimensional. Unless they can figure out some way to suspend a camera up in space directly above the foul pole, the replay is a less reliable way to determine fair or foul than the three-dimensional binocular vision of a human being. I've seen many replays where it is not at all clear exactly when the ball went past the pole because of the two-dimensionality.

There are some other calls that can be judged quickly... 1B foot off the bag, trapped vs. caught balls in OF, whether or not someone left their base early while tagging up, etc.And those CAN be determined in two dimensions, more often than not.

Really, I think the only thing you can't realistically have reviewed by instant replay are balls and strikes.Again, because of the three-dimensional aspect of where the ball was when it crossed the plate.

eastchicagosoxfan
04-14-2008, 06:02 AM
Baseball is a human game, and we make errors, umpires included. It's part of the game. It doesn't need to be "perfect." On a different level, the game is televised with instant replay to facilitate the announcer. It's a tool of his trade in a sense. It's not part of the game anymore than the observations of print journalists are part of the game.

Railsplitter
04-14-2008, 06:53 AM
Instant replay wouldn't have helped the Phillies tonight. The ball went over the foul pole, and every angle they showed afterwards was inconclusive. They should just extend the foul poles higher. :cool:
The foul poles my well be as tall as they can get without needing support wires. Anybody who had driven past a radio antenna or seen the high dive show at the Illinois State Fair knows what I'm talking about.

It's Time
04-14-2008, 08:55 AM
proving that the only way they can really win ballgames is when they have the golden horseshoe stuck up their collective rear end.

I really do hope you are not THAT crazy to suggest the only way they can win a game is when umps miss a call. Seriously, that's embarrassing.

rdwj
04-14-2008, 08:57 AM
I hate instant replay. I hate it in football and I'd hate it even more in baseball.

BringBackBlkJack
04-14-2008, 09:03 AM
The foul poles my well be as tall as they can get without needing support wires. Anybody who had driven past a radio antenna or seen the high dive show at the Illinois State Fair knows what I'm talking about.

Well, from the video I saw of the Cubs "home run" the ball didn't even go above the top of the pole, it was simply a blown call. Now, a shot like Thome's near-homer yesterday may justify an extended foul pole. The support wires shouldn't really be a huge issue. If they can put up that protective netting behind the plate I'm sure some foul pole support would be a piece of cake.

Hokiesox
04-14-2008, 09:03 AM
A trapped/caught ball in the infield ALWAYS gets a throw to first, for infielders who know anything about fundamentals. So, yes, it should be the third out, inning over.

Hokiesox
04-14-2008, 09:06 AM
A TV camera sure can tell which side of the foul pole the ball crossed on. The camera would have to be place at a 90 degree angle to the pole. If the ball goes OVER the pole, well, not much to be done there. But if it crosses the pole, a camera at a right angle would be easily able to tell which side of the pole the ball crossed on.

Sox It To Em
04-14-2008, 09:13 AM
I don't want instant replay either. The "human element" is an inherent part of the game (cliche, sorry, but true), and that includes the occasional blown call. Besides, umpires have undergone rigorous training and have accrued many years of experience before making it to the big leagues. They get the vast majority of calls right. It's part of what makes baseball unique. Leave instant replay to the NFL.

zach23
04-14-2008, 09:52 AM
The foul poles my well be as tall as they can get without needing support wires. Anybody who had driven past a radio antenna or seen the high dive show at the Illinois State Fair knows what I'm talking about.

Strap a laser to the top of the pole and have it pointing upward. It would then be easy for the umps to see if the ball crosses the beam or not.

UofCSoxFan
04-14-2008, 10:06 AM
Does anyone remember that Marlins game a couple years ago or so where they actually used replay to determine if a ball was a homerun or hit off the top of the wall. I could be "misremembering" this (to quote Roger Clemens) but I believe they actually reversed the call I remember this being controverseal and I would imagine a protest was filed but it was denied.

I don't mind replay for home runs: it is a dead ball situation and a very difficult call.

But as far as safe/out, foot on off bag, phanton tag, etc....I think I'm against it...like it or not, part of the game is at times deceiving the umpire: swiping at a runner and showing the ball confidently to the ump like you tagged him, making a trap and coming up like you caught the ball, etc...some players do this better than others and when I played I prided myself on selling the hard calls to the umps and I think replay would take away this competitive advantage.

Not to mention I'm not sure any game that Jose Contreras starts needs to be lengthened in any shape or form.

cws05champ
04-14-2008, 10:58 AM
Strap a laser to the top of the pole and have it pointing upward. It would then be easy for the umps to see if the ball crosses the beam or not.

We can name it after the inventor of the project...we'l call it "The Allen Parsons project". :D:

PatK
04-14-2008, 11:44 AM
Instant replay wouldn't have helped the Phillies tonight. The ball went over the foul pole, and every angle they showed afterwards was inconclusive. They should just extend the foul poles higher. :cool:

I don't know- I was watching the game with Cubs fans, and they didn't think it should have been called a home run.

Hokiesox
04-14-2008, 01:36 PM
Strap a laser to the top of the pole and have it pointing upward. It would then be easy for the umps to see if the ball crosses the beam or not.

I don't think MLB wants FAA approval for a foul pole.

PKalltheway
04-14-2008, 02:04 PM
Does anyone remember that Marlins game a couple years ago or so where they actually used replay to determine if a ball was a homerun or hit off the top of the wall. I could be "misremembering" this (to quote Roger Clemens) but I believe they actually reversed the call I remember this being controverseal and I would imagine a protest was filed but it was denied.
I remember that game, actually. Also, IIRC, the umpire who did it (I think it was Frank Pulli) got into trouble with MLB because of it.

Bruizer
04-14-2008, 03:22 PM
I don't know- I was watching the game with Cubs fans, and they didn't think it should have been called a home run.

I watched the game too with my Cubfan daughters. They showed three or four different angles, but you couldn't tell from any of the angles which side the ball was on. One angle appeared to zoom in on the ball and the foul pole, and the ball was on the foul side of the pole - but you still couldn't tell whether it was foul or not because the shot was taken after the ball had passd over the top of the pole and was on its way down. The way it was hooking, the second base ump probably had a better angle than any other ump.

Bru

TDog
04-14-2008, 03:58 PM
Strap a laser to the top of the pole and have it pointing upward. It would then be easy for the umps to see if the ball crosses the beam or not.

Joe Crede might argue with you about what is easy to see for an umpire after what happened to him in Baltimore a few years ago, but maybe you're on to something.

Set up lasers pointing from the foul pole toward centerfield to another pole in centerfield, spaced at three quarters of the length of a baseball. From the foul side of the pole, do something similar. Set up different alarms for balls that break the laser plane in fair and foul territory.

Sometimes teal isn't necessary.

jdm2662
04-14-2008, 04:18 PM
I would be in favor of instant replay for home runs and home runs only. Since the play is dead/foul if it's not a homerun, I don't see the harm in it.

Steelrod
04-14-2008, 04:22 PM
Joe Crede might argue with you about what is easy to see for an umpire after what happened to him in Baltimore a few years ago, but maybe you're on to something.

Set up lasers pointing from the foul pole toward centerfield to another pole in centerfield, spaced at three quarters of the length of a baseball. From the foul side of the pole, do something similar. Set up different alarms for balls that break the laser plane in fair and foul territory.

Sometimes teal isn't necessary.
Lasers are a little too modern for this game. Otherwise, you could also use them to frame out the strike zone!
Of course the next step would be light sabres replacing bats!:smile:

Lip Man 1
04-14-2008, 04:30 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=20190&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab4pos1

Lip

Mendoza Line
04-14-2008, 04:32 PM
This reminds me of a few years ago when Ross Gload's Grand Slam got called back because Sammy Sosa said it went foul. Why don't the umpires just call him whenever they need to make a decision?

Ziggy S
04-14-2008, 06:43 PM
This reminds me of a homerun by Lamb for Houston in Game 3 of the '05 Series (2005!!!!1!!) that clearly looked from replay as a fly off that wall and NOT a homer. IIRC, that made the score 4-0 at the time.

santo=dorf
04-14-2008, 10:33 PM
This reminds me of a few years ago when Ross Gload's Grand Slam got called back because Sammy Sosa said it went foul. Why don't the umpires just call him whenever they need to make a decision?
Ross's ball was cleary foul, and he doubled in 2 runs in the same at-bat.

Hokiesox
04-15-2008, 10:08 AM
Joe Crede might argue with you about what is easy to see for an umpire after what happened to him in Baltimore a few years ago, but maybe you're on to something.

I was right below the foul pole for that game. I still can't believe they ****ed that one up. STILL