PDA

View Full Version : Ozzie: Swisher to stay at leadoff for foreseeable future


Craig Grebeck
04-08-2008, 08:14 AM
Mod Edit: No quotes please http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cubicle/cs-080407-nick-swisher-leadoff-chicago-white-sox,1,2858616.story

Great, great, great decision. That robust .469 OBP is looking mighty nice right now. Let's just hope that he doesn't move CQ out of his spot either.

This offense is rolling with Swisher at the top.

fquaye149
04-08-2008, 08:15 AM
:bandance::bandance::bandance::bandance::bandance: :bandance::bandance::bandance::bandance::bandance:

soxfan21
04-08-2008, 08:58 AM
Nice :D:.

PopsBrechtel
04-08-2008, 09:04 AM
Happy days are here again :bandance:

The Immigrant
04-08-2008, 09:05 AM
But how will we ever get by without a "proven leadoff hitter"?

MsSoxVixen22
04-08-2008, 09:06 AM
Good to hear! :smile: It seems like Swisher is becoming the "sparkplug" much like Pods was when he was here. If Swisher gets on base, good things seem to happen.

ChiTownTrojan
04-08-2008, 09:21 AM
Good to hear! :smile: It seems like Swisher is becoming the "sparkplug" much like Pods was when he was here. If Swisher gets on base, good things seem to happen.
Well, the guys behind him (Cabrera/Thome/Konerko) aren't really hitting yet, but once they do there should be this kind of effect. We knew he was going to get on base, I'm more impressed with the way he's held his own in centerfield thus far. BA is making for a nice defensive upgrade late in games, too.

voodoochile
04-08-2008, 09:48 AM
Good to hear! :smile: It seems like Swisher is becoming the "sparkplug" much like Pods was when he was here. If Swisher gets on base, good things seem to happen.

That home run to open the game on Sunday certainly sent a message to the rest of the team. Yesterday's leadoff double when he jumped up screaming "Let's Go!" was pretty decent also...

JorgeFabregas
04-08-2008, 10:00 AM
The M-word reportedly passed AJP's lips in the locker room the other day.

Taliesinrk
04-08-2008, 10:09 AM
Ah yes. As I was reading the title of this thread, the first thought that popped into my head was how long it would take Craig Grebeck to post in the thread... I should have know he started it.

However, I must say that a week into the season, I was wrong. Mr. Grebeck, you were right. I still worry about our defense with Swisher in CF, but thus far, he's been everything we could ask of him, and more. I mean seriously, he had something like 6 straight BBs in 6 consecutive PAs?? That's insane. What I REALLY underestimated was the energy that he and Cabrera bring to the top of the line-up. That's some serious fire that has to resonate throughout the rest of the line-up... So far, so good... :D:

Taliesinrk
04-08-2008, 10:10 AM
The M-word reportedly passed AJP's lips in the locker room the other day.

What's the "M-word"?

Droso5
04-08-2008, 10:13 AM
What's the "M-word"?

I am also intrigued...

JorgeFabregas
04-08-2008, 10:37 AM
Moneyball. Ironic, because AJ had one of the highest out rates in the league last year.

peeonwrigley
04-08-2008, 10:45 AM
I love Swish at leadoff, and Quentin in the 7-spot.

Don't mess with success.

Droso5
04-08-2008, 10:46 AM
Moneyball. Ironic, because AJ had one of the highest out rates in the league last year.

Strange, how did 'Moneyball' make it past the language filters here?:scratch:

TomBradley72
04-08-2008, 10:52 AM
I'm pretty sure Jerry Owens is now looking at apartments for the summer in Charlotte.

Sockinchisox
04-08-2008, 11:04 AM
Awesome.

Don't fix what isn't broke.

Zook 'Em
04-09-2008, 01:48 PM
I telling anyone who would listen before the year that I wanted Swisher to lead off. He doesn't steal bases and he strikes out a lot- then again, so do Granderson and Sizemore- but he just keeps getting on base, which made him more qualified than anyone else on this team coming into the year.

I was far more worried about him playing CF, but he's looked pretty legit out there so far.

Speaking of Grady Sizemore...aside from the steals- really, the least of my concerns- Swisher's 2007 numbers are almost identical to Sizemore's.

Billy Ashley
04-09-2008, 01:49 PM
This is the right (and really only) move to be done. The White Sox have some big bats in the middle of the line up. Swisher has the ability to get on base often... that's a good combo.

spiffie
04-09-2008, 01:59 PM
But I was told that only stat geeks and people who never actually watch baseball would worry about having a high OBP guy in the leadoff spot. I guess Ozzie must be a closet SABR geek who doesn't understand baseball.

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 02:18 PM
This is absolute malarkey. How in the world can anyone believe that this Nick Swisher kid is any good in the lead-off spot?

I want someone with the Passion and the Fire. Someone who, when he inevitably grounds out, he grounds out HARD; in an essence, he GRINDS OUT. I want someone with abilities that people SAY are there but yet remain invisible and unquantifiable; I want INTANGIBLES.

And on the topic of his "actually getting on base" thingy, let us all be reminded of a quote from the great Dusty Faker..err..Baker "Dude, I don't like walks dude, cause they, you know dude, clog up the basepaths."

RockJock07
04-09-2008, 02:23 PM
I love Swisher on this team period, but with him at lead-off is even better. I've been a big fan of Swisher since he came up with Oakland and the Sox hit a home run when trading for him. He's just what our clubhouse needed.

spawn
04-09-2008, 02:33 PM
Swisher staying in the leadoff spot? Yet another in a long line of stupid decisions by our worthless idiot of a manager!

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 02:39 PM
Swisher staying in the leadoff spot? Yet another in a long line of stupid decisions by our worthless idiot of a manager!

I really hope you were joking like I was. If anything this move can at least somewhat make up for the blunders Ozzie has already made this season.

rdwj
04-09-2008, 02:47 PM
I really hope you were joking like I was. If anything this move can at least somewhat make up for the blunders Ozzie has already made this season.

Like what?

twsoxfan5
04-09-2008, 02:49 PM
I really hope you were joking like I was. If anything this move can at least somewhat make up for the blunders Ozzie has already made this season.

Yeah that is what the teal is for. Something that I am sure people feel is missing in your thread. Teal is code for sarcasm here.

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 02:50 PM
Sorry, I misspoke somewhat. What I meant to say is that this decision (Swish-Money in the lead-off spot) will make up for the lack of defense we have in CF with said Swish-Money and Ramirez on patrol.

BA not in CF appears to be a a defensive "blunder" only to me and me alone on this message board.

spawn
04-09-2008, 02:51 PM
I really hope you were joking like I was.
Well, unlike you I put that part of my post in teal which, as most people on this board know, denotes sarcasm.

EDIT: twsoxfan5 beat me to it.

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 02:53 PM
Yeah that is what the teal is for. Something that I am sure people feel is missing in your thread. Teal is code for sarcasm here.

OOOOOOOH! Now I just feel like a moron because I was going from thread to thread thinking "*** is this TEAL about!?" I'm an idiot. Thanks for the heads-up, but now that I think about it that post you are referring to is so dripping with sarcasm that it doesn't really need it, but now I know, and knowing is half the battle.

OK OK! I get it. I'm sorry that the post was not in teal! I think I can be allowed at least one NOOB moment right?

KenBerryGrab
04-09-2008, 02:53 PM
I've been impressed with Swisher in the field. He gets good reads on balls and breaks back well. His work in that huge Detroit outfield bodes well.

spawn
04-09-2008, 03:13 PM
Sorry, I misspoke somewhat. What I meant to say is that this decision (Swish-Money in the lead-off spot) will make up for the lack of defense we have in CF with said Swish-Money and Ramirez on patrol.

Please tell me you're not giving him the nickname "Swish-Money"...:puking:

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 03:44 PM
Please tell me you're not giving him the nickname "Swish-Money"...:puking:

Oh you bet your bottom dollar I am.

EDIT: I have always called him Swish-Money, seeing as how is "coming out party" was partly due to Moneyball. Get it? Cheesy I know but, come on, he's gotta have something.

swish
04-09-2008, 03:55 PM
Don't change it if it ain't broke!

voodoochile
04-09-2008, 03:55 PM
Oh you bet your bottom dollar I am.

EDIT: I have always called him Swish-Money, seeing as how is "coming out party" was partly due to Moneyball. Get it? Cheesy I know but, come on, he's gotta have something.

Why not go with the nickname he gave himself, Dirty30?

oeo
04-09-2008, 03:59 PM
Like what?

Yeah, what has he ****ed up? Maybe Ramirez in CF, but that only lasted for two games. Our 'A' lineup is exactly the way it should be right now; there should be no complaints.

Ozzie's done a good job so far (including in the bullpen)...hopefully that continues.

Bigfoot38
04-09-2008, 04:33 PM
Call me a pessimist, but is anyone esle frustrated that cabrera thome and konerko couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat???

What's going to happen when dye, AJ, and captain clutch(crede) cool off?

spawn
04-09-2008, 04:38 PM
Call me a pessimist, but is anyone esle frustrated that cabrera thome and konerko couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat???

What's going to happen when dye, AJ, and captain clutch(crede) cool off?
Instead of being pessimistic ask yourself this: What's going to happen when Cabrerra, Thome, and Konerko get hot? This team isn't having a problem scoring runs with the aforemetioned players not hitting well. That says a lot about the all around offensive capabilities this team possesses.

Bigfoot38
04-09-2008, 04:43 PM
Instead of being pessimistic ask yourself this: What's going to happen when Cabrerra, Thome, and Konerko get hot? This team isn't having a problem scoring runs with the aforemetioned players not hitting well. That says a lot about the all around offensive capabilities this team possesses.


Thats what I said all last year... :whiner:

spawn
04-09-2008, 04:48 PM
Thats what I said all last year... :whiner:
The big difference between this an last year is no one hit last year. That's not the case so far this year.

MCHSoxFan
04-09-2008, 04:50 PM
Good to hear! :smile: It seems like Swisher is becoming the "sparkplug" much like Pods was when he was here. If Swisher gets on base, good things seem to happen.


Yep! Except for a FEW days in the month, keep the OD line-up the SAME and put it out there EVERY day Ozzie!

Soxman219
04-09-2008, 05:15 PM
Why not go with the nickname he gave himself, Dirty30?

I nicknamed him Swishahouse.:tongue:

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 05:26 PM
Why not go with the nickname he gave himself, Dirty30?

Although I respect Swish-Money's abilities at the dish and also respect his abilities with the glove (though BA is still better by comparison), I do not appreciate his ability to give himself a nickname.

Dirty30 is nice, though somewhat simplistic. If he wanted something simple like that I could suggest SwisherSkoal (have you seen those chaws he puts in? Puts me to shame) or something like that.

I think Swish-Money is a little more artful and witty, though of course I have been wrong before, just not at WSI (lol).

fquaye149
04-09-2008, 05:29 PM
I nicknamed him Swishahouse.:tongue:

swishablast?

spiffie
04-09-2008, 05:32 PM
Although I respect Swish-Money's abilities at the dish and also respect his abilities with the glove (though BA is still better by comparison), I do not appreciate his ability to give himself a nickname.

Dirty30 is nice, though somewhat simplistic. If he wanted something simple like that I could suggest SwisherSkoal (have you seen those chaws he puts in? Puts me to shame) or something like that.

I think Swish-Money is a little more artful and witty, though of course I have been wrong before, just not at WSI (lol).
http://www.azstarnet.com/ss/2006/03/24/121411-1.jpg
This is horrible, this idea.

SoxGirl4Life
04-09-2008, 05:34 PM
Call me a pessimist, but is anyone esle frustrated that cabrera thome and konerko couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat???

What's going to happen when dye, AJ, and captain clutch(crede) cool off?

You're a pessimist.

Lefty34
04-09-2008, 06:56 PM
Why is everyone hating on Swish-Money as a nickname? Is everyone so righteous and all-knowing that anyone who thinks differently than the aggregate is showcasing their stupidity and is automatically wrong or unfounded?

Fine, I will be willing to conceded on the Swish-Money point, as long as SwishaSkoal will be taken into consideration.

And whatever the nickname, I like him at the lead-off spot. He most definitely isn't what you would picture as a "lead-off guy" but he sure is getting the job done.

No screw that, I will continue to call him Swish-Money, it isn't my fault that the cleverness of this nickname is lost amongst you mongrels

sox1970
04-09-2008, 07:07 PM
My eyes!

FedEx227
04-09-2008, 07:22 PM
Haha, that's not teal.


NOT TEAL


TEAL

:tealtutor:

TDog
04-09-2008, 07:24 PM
I don't know nearly as much about baseball or the individuals that make up this year's White Sox team as Ozzie Guillen. Even if my opinion mattered, I would have to defer to his judgment.

If my opinion were sought, I would question Swisher leading off, not because he doesn't have blazing speed, but because he strikes out so much. It seems most of the division is going with high strike-out guys to lead off. Granderson, Sizemore and Swisher are three you would battle for the American League most strike outs in the American League.

On the other hand, Swisher does get on base a lot and does see a lot of pitches, things you want to see from a leadoff man. The ability to get on base is far more important than the ability to steal bases.

I hope it works out.

mzh
04-09-2008, 07:32 PM
If my opinion were sought, I would question Swisher leading off, not because he doesn't have blazing speed, but because he strikes out so much. It seems most of the division is going with high strike-out guys to lead off. Granderson, Sizemore and Swisher are three you would battle for the American League most strike outs in the American League.

On the other hand, Swisher does get on base a lot and does see a lot of pitches, things you want to see from a leadoff man. The ability to get on base is far more important than the ability to steal bases.


Amen. Nick Swisher would fare well in the number two spot because of his ability to get on base, which is something you want to see when you've got Thome, Konerko and Dye following him.

mccoydp
04-09-2008, 07:37 PM
The big difference between this an last year is no one hit last year. That's not the case so far this year.

Agreed. A-Rod would have hit .230 on this team last year.

Frater Perdurabo
04-09-2008, 08:08 PM
If my opinion were sought, I would question Swisher leading off, not because he doesn't have blazing speed, but because he strikes out so much. It seems most of the division is going with high strike-out guys to lead off. Granderson, Sizemore and Swisher are three you would battle for the American League most strike outs in the American League.

Amen. Nick Swisher would fare well in the number two spot because of his ability to get on base, which is something you want to see when you've got Thome, Konerko and Dye following him.

I agree that Swisher would be great as a #2 hitter as well. But who on this team would lead off, then?

Keep Swisher leading off. The offense really has been productive with him at the top, and as soon as Cabrera (.174 BA), Konerko (.208) and Thome (.179) start approaching their career norms, it's going to be even more productive.

jabrch
04-09-2008, 08:21 PM
I agree that Swisher would be great as a #2 hitter as well. But who on this team would lead off, then?

Keep Swisher leading off. The offense really has been productive with him at the top, and as soon as Cabrera (.174 BA), Konerko (.208) and Thome (.179) start approaching their career norms, it's going to be even more productive.


Frater - what's the difference? Really? End of the day...

If Swish hits #2 and OC hits #1, what's the difference? Over the course of the season, how many runs will that REALLY matter?

Frater Perdurabo
04-09-2008, 08:44 PM
Frater - what's the difference? Really? End of the day...

If Swish hits #2 and OC hits #1, what's the difference? Over the course of the season, how many runs will that REALLY matter?

Because Cabrera's ability to hit the other way, etc. is more useful when someone is one base in front of him. He's more likely to be in that situation, and therefore more often will get a runner into scoring position, if he's hitting behind Swisher and his .400+ OBP than #9 hitter Juan Uribe and his .250 OBP.

It's a cliché, but Swisher is doing a great job leading off and Cabrera historically is a great #2 hitter. Why mess with success?

jabrch
04-09-2008, 08:48 PM
Why mess with success?


I wouldn't...I'm not proposing that we do. But I don't believe we'd be any worse if we did.

mzh
04-09-2008, 08:54 PM
It's a cliché, but Swisher is doing a great job leading off and Cabrera historically is a great #2 hitter. Why mess with success?

Because it's the exact same thing you saw in Scott Podsednik minus the speed. And Podsednik couldn't hit, but Swisher can, but we cannot have a guy who strikes out as much as ScoPo in the leadoff spot again.

FedEx227
04-09-2008, 11:17 PM
Frater - what's the difference? Really? End of the day...

If Swish hits #2 and OC hits #1, what's the difference? Over the course of the season, how many runs will that REALLY matter?

It's really a frame of mind debate.

But statistics do show that teams that jump out to first inning leads have a much great chance at winning the ball game.

balke
04-13-2008, 01:44 PM
UPDATE:

Not surprising to me, but on WGN they just showed an Ozzie interview about Jerry. The phrase "I feel like he should be playing everday", was uttered.

So, sounds like Jerry is to stay down in Charlotte til the Sox need him. Hopefully that's a long time. Not so much because Jerry sucks that bad, but because he could use the development, and I'd like to see Swisher and Quentin continue to succeed in the leadoff role. No sense in sending Anderson down for Owens to me, since Anderson has the D to come off the bench late.

ChiTownTrojan
04-13-2008, 07:27 PM
Because it's the exact same thing you saw in Scott Podsednik minus the speed. And Podsednik couldn't hit, but Swisher can, but we cannot have a guy who strikes out as much as ScoPo in the leadoff spot again.
I'll argue that if a guy strikes out a lot, leadoff is exactly where you want him to bat. Who cares if a guy strikes out, lines out, grounds out, or whatever, if there's nobody on base it's all the same. Strikeouts with guys on base hurt the team, because it doesn't let the runners advance. Swisher's strikeouts don't matter, all that matters is his OBP. The power is an added bonus, since it's nice to start off a game or inning with a double or HR, both of which have happened this year.

ChiTownTrojan
04-13-2008, 07:32 PM
UPDATE:

Not surprising to me, but on WGN they just showed an Ozzie interview about Jerry. The phrase "I feel like he should be playing everday", was uttered.

So, sounds like Jerry is to stay down in Charlotte til the Sox need him. Hopefully that's a long time. Not so much because Jerry sucks that bad, but because he could use the development, and I'd like to see Swisher and Quentin continue to succeed in the leadoff role. No sense in sending Anderson down for Owens to me, since Anderson has the D to come off the bench late.
I think JO has more value with the team than Alexei. I'd take his speed as a pinch runner and ability to do some damage on the basepaths over Ramirez's.... wait as second, what exactly is he contributing to this team? Alexei is a very high-ceilinged project, and he should be playing every day to get used to American pitching.

IlliniSox4Life
04-13-2008, 08:59 PM
I think JO has more value with the team than Alexei. I'd take his speed as a pinch runner and ability to do some damage on the basepaths over Ramirez's.... wait as second, what exactly is he contributing to this team? Alexei is a very high-ceilinged project, and he should be playing every day to get used to American pitching.

I agree with Alexei needing more playing time, but I don't know if JO would do a lot of good here too. His injury is such that I wouldn't want him stealing bases as a PR until he proves he is fast enough in AAA. I'd rather have Pablo as our go-to PR until Jerry is 100% (and if you remember Pods, he never really came back from a similar injury).

balke
04-13-2008, 09:10 PM
I think JO has more value with the team than Alexei. I'd take his speed as a pinch runner and ability to do some damage on the basepaths over Ramirez's.... wait as second, what exactly is he contributing to this team? Alexei is a very high-ceilinged project, and he should be playing every day to get used to American pitching.

If you bring JO up and send Alexei down, then you don't have anybody to replace infield players when the Sox get the lead or someone needs a day off.

Daver
04-13-2008, 09:13 PM
If you bring JO up and send Alexei down, then you don't have anybody to replace infield players when the Sox get the lead or someone needs a day off.

Did someone kidnap Pablo Ozuna?

btrain929
04-13-2008, 09:23 PM
Did someone kidnap Pablo Ozuna?

Not that it's indicative of his defense for the whole year, but he did look smooth in his 2 defensive chances at the end of the game today.

balke
04-13-2008, 09:26 PM
Did someone kidnap Pablo Ozuna?

And Pablo. But that leaves one infield replacement, and 3 OFers on the bench if you send Alexei down. If they want to send up Richar instead maybe. But JO for Alexei doesn't really work.

ChiTownTrojan
04-13-2008, 11:52 PM
And Pablo. But that leaves one infield replacement, and 3 OFers on the bench if you send Alexei down. If they want to send up Richar instead maybe. But JO for Alexei doesn't really work.
Ozzie is puting the same starting lineup out there just about every night (as he should with the way they're clicking), and barring any injuries or major slumps, i expect that to continue. That means that the guys on the bench are going to be used mostly as in-game replacements (pinch hitters, pinch runners, and defensive replacements). In that role I think Owens is better suited to be on the big-league team than Ramirez. Alexei isn't a defensive upgrade over any of the starters, he isn't as fast as Owens, and he isn't hitting at all right now. It's hard to justify a reason to even bring him into a game, except to get him "experience." And if that's the only reason, he's better off getting more consistent experience in Charlotte. As more of a slap-hitter/base-stealer, I don't think Jerry needs the consistent starts in order to stay effective.

Also, a bunch of the regulars are versatile enough that they can back each other up. Uribe backs up SS, and maybe even 3B. Ozuna can play 3B or 2B. Swisher and Thome can back up 1B. No, it's not ideal to have only one guy on the bench who plays on the IF, but this team could make it work. Later on in the year, I expect either Richar gets called up (as the starting 2B, with Uribe moving to a utility role) or Ramirez gets his act together and he gets re-called.

ChiTownTrojan
04-13-2008, 11:56 PM
And Pablo. But that leaves one infield replacement, and 3 OFers on the bench if you send Alexei down. If they want to send up Richar instead maybe. But JO for Alexei doesn't really work.
I still think that Josh Fields would be an even better candidate than Owens to take Ramirez's spot. He would get plenty of AB's between 3B and DH, while helping to keep Crede and Thome healthy. And when he's not in the starting lineup, he's a major power threat as a pinch hitter (which we don't have right now). I'm pretty sure nobody else on this board agrees with me though.

Jurr
04-14-2008, 12:08 PM
I still think that Josh Fields would be an even better candidate than Owens to take Ramirez's spot. He would get plenty of AB's between 3B and DH, while helping to keep Crede and Thome healthy. And when he's not in the starting lineup, he's a major power threat as a pinch hitter (which we don't have right now). I'm pretty sure nobody else on this board agrees with me though.
The one problem you have there is that he's not seeing enough pitches. Even at AAA, you're getting better at pitch recognition and honing your swing, despite the fact that the quality of the opposition isn't quite there.

Your front line talent needs to play. You can have a little fall-off on your bench, because you're not calling on the guy to contribute every day. Fields needs to get a little better at plate patience and he's not going to get that by sitting and watching 4 games a week.