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View Full Version : Has Anyone Ever Developed an Objective PTC Scoring Method?


TomBradley72
04-07-2008, 08:55 PM
A group of my friends (scattered across the country) are starting a season long "Pick to Click" tournament....I've looked everywhere and I can't find an "objective" scoring method for selecting the winning PTC for an individual game (ie. certain amount of pooints awarded for hits, runs, rbi's, etc.).

Most of the time the winner is pretty clear..but based on the size of the group and the fact that we're doing it over the entire season...an objective system would help. Has anyone seen one?

PicktoCLick72
04-08-2008, 12:22 AM
Elephant gun decides pretty much anything.

whtsx1959
04-08-2008, 12:36 AM
I see the Pick To Click winner as a gut feeling. Whoever helped out the team more than that player usually does.

ksimpson14
04-08-2008, 01:14 AM
I've never really tracked it, but I've never gotten how Hawk & DJ do it. It seems like multiple times I see one of their numbers lower than the previous times. Do they wager points? Or reset the totals after a certain time (I could have sworn I've seen one of them go down to 0 or close to it in the middle of the year)

Might be a good question if they're doing that thing where they give out their email address.

And no, in terms of picking the winner, I haven't seen a scoring system like that. Seems like it'd be hard. Weighing how valuable great pitching is vs great hitting. Some guys may have a solid day (better overall than another guy), but that other guy's one HR may have been a game winner or something like that (but I guess you could weigh that more). I guess scoring the pitching aspect would be the hardest, unless you just eliminated pitchers from it. That, or just have some independent party pick the winner every night.

Nellie_Fox
04-08-2008, 01:40 AM
I've never really tracked it, but I've never gotten how Hawk & DJ do it. It seems like multiple times I see one of their numbers lower than the previous times.I think they keep a different score for their PTC choices on WGN, CSN, and WCIU; thus the changing numbers.

TomBradley72
04-12-2008, 05:40 PM
For what it's worth, here's what we came up with. We needed a 100% objective scoring system because the four of us that are doing this every game live in different states, and with DirecTV, and conflicts (travel,work, etc.) we all can't see/watch every game so we can't have "subjective" stuff like defensive plays, etc.

We wanted something that can more or less be calculated from a box score. We're playing every game, we chip in $50 apiece, winner gets a shopping spree at Grandstand at the end of the season.

It's not perfect...would like to hear what you guys think.

1.BB/Sac/HBP/Catcher’s Interference = .5 Pt.
2.Stolen Base = .5 Pt.
3.Single = 1 pt.
4.Run scored= 1 pt.
5.Double = 2 points
6.RBI = 2 points
7.Triple = 3 points
8.Home Run = 4 points

HomeFish
04-12-2008, 06:09 PM
It's not perfect...would like to hear what you guys think.

1.BB/Sac/HBP/Catcher’s Interference = .5 Pt.
2.Stolen Base = .5 Pt.
3.Single = 1 pt.
4.Run scored= 1 pt.
5.Double = 2 points
6.RBI = 2 points
7.Triple = 3 points
8.Home Run = 4 points

Scenario:
The Sox play a 12-inning game. Buehrle pitches 9 shutout innings. Masset, Thornton, and Linebrink each pitch one shut-out inning. In the bottom of the 12th, Swisher walks, reaches second on an errant pickoff throw, reaches third on a ground-out. Thome hits a walk-off sacrifice fly.

The Sox only other hit was a Pablo Ozuna triple in the 3rd inning. He was stranded.

PTC Standings:
Ozuna (winner): 3 points
Thome: 2.5 points
Swisher: 1 point
Buehrle: 0 points
Bullpen: 0 points

Is that a fair outcome?

Daver
04-12-2008, 06:21 PM
Why not just use the WSI umpires results?


I haven't been wrong in years.

IlliniSox4Life
04-12-2008, 07:33 PM
Scenario:
The Sox play a 12-inning game. Buehrle pitches 9 shutout innings. Masset, Thornton, and Linebrink each pitch one shut-out inning. In the bottom of the 12th, Swisher walks, reaches second on an errant pickoff throw, reaches third on a ground-out. Thome hits a walk-off sacrifice fly.

The Sox only other hit was a Pablo Ozuna triple in the 3rd inning. He was stranded.

PTC Standings:
Ozuna (winner): 3 points
Thome: 2.5 points
Swisher: 1 point
Buehrle: 0 points
Bullpen: 0 points

Is that a fair outcome?

It seems pretty obvious to me that they were only including hitters (I believe Hawk and DJ don't count pitchers). Not only that, but since no scoring system would be perfect, you could devise a scenario for almost any system that would seem flawed. You just have to live with it for the sake of his bet.




However, I would suggest adding in points potentially for walk off home runs, walk off hits, go-ahead/tie runs scored/RBIs in the 8th inning and later (could change it to the 7th or 9th, or whatever). You could also subtract points for errors.

TomBradley72
04-12-2008, 07:33 PM
Scenario:
The Sox play a 12-inning game. Buehrle pitches 9 shutout innings. Masset, Thornton, and Linebrink each pitch one shut-out inning. In the bottom of the 12th, Swisher walks, reaches second on an errant pickoff throw, reaches third on a ground-out. Thome hits a walk-off sacrifice fly.

The Sox only other hit was a Pablo Ozuna triple in the 3rd inning. He was stranded.

PTC Standings:
Ozuna (winner): 3 points
Thome: 2.5 points
Swisher: 1 point
Buehrle: 0 points
Bullpen: 0 points

Is that a fair outcome?

In this case...probably not. For the purpose of what my friends and I are doing...we only pick hitters...pitchers aren't part of it. What do you suggest as an alternative?

HomeFish
04-13-2008, 01:10 AM
Sorry, I thought that you were proposing an objective PTC system to replace the one we have at WSI right now, where pitchers and "the bullpen" can win. My apologies.

Yeah, I would add some sort of addition for late-inning heroics. It seems to me that it could be done. That, or make Total Bases less valuable and RBI/Runs Scored more valuable. A triple that gets stranded shouldn't be worth more than an RBI single.

Railsplitter
04-13-2008, 07:09 AM
I think they keep a different score for their PTC choices on WGN, CSN, and WCIU; thus the changing numbers.
They do indeed have seperate scores for each channel.

BringBackBlkJack
04-13-2008, 11:26 AM
The PTC will always be subjective due to the nature of the game of baseball. Like a poster previously referenced, a triple with no one on doesn't win games but a sac fly might. The games aren't played on paper, thus, the PTC cannot be determined on paper.

It's like thinking all of those ESPN and BP "projected" stats and standings are a likely determinant of how a player or team will perform. If that's the case, the Sox better give back their rings because a 4th place team doesn't make the playoffs. No mathematical model is ever going to be able to handle a game full of so many intangibles.

TomBradley72
04-13-2008, 12:00 PM
The PTC will always be subjective due to the nature of the game of baseball. Like a poster previously referenced, a triple with no one on doesn't win games but a sac fly might. The games aren't played on paper, thus, the PTC cannot be determined on paper.

It's like thinking all of those ESPN and BP "projected" stats and standings are a likely determinant of how a player or team will perform. If that's the case, the Sox better give back their rings because a 4th place team doesn't make the playoffs. No mathematical model is ever going to be able to handle a game full of so many intangibles.

I agree...we still take the "subjective" approach when we all go to games together...we just want an objeective approach for this season long game we're playing.

I want Mags back
04-13-2008, 12:48 PM
i'm not gonna lie
:threadsucks

it's just not possible to have an actual system to score with, it has to come off
your gut feeling of who contributed most