PDA

View Full Version : 2B Battle


soxfandy
03-02-2008, 11:04 AM
I was just curious to see what everybody thinks about who should be our everyday second baseman? I really want to see alexei get it because I feel like he will be an exciting player. However, I don't think he will be ready that quickly. Then I believe pablo is suited best for our super sub role and not as an everyday player. So that leaves it to uribe and richar. Please danny richar have a good spring. Anybody but juan uribe!!! What does everybody else think?

PalehosePlanet
03-02-2008, 11:12 AM
May the best man win between Richar and Alexi (loser goes to AAA.) Pablo I'd keep in a reserve role and I have no problem with Uribe sticking around in a reserve role also. At least with Juan I'd know that we have a legit backup who can handle 3B, SS and 2B defensively --- positions that Pablo can no longer play adequately.

Taliesinrk
03-02-2008, 11:20 AM
Honestly, I think we co uld see any of the 4 playing 2B.

California Sox
03-02-2008, 11:24 AM
I want Richar. We need the left-handed bat. Also, Alexei hasn't had a professional at bat or really played that much 2b. Add to that the fact that SS is a tougher position to fill and the Sox don't anyone have in the minors with their two current SS both FAs at the end of the year, Alexei should go to the minors and get ready to play short.

soxfandy
03-02-2008, 11:25 AM
May the best man win between Richar and Alexi (loser goes to AAA.) Pablo I'd keep in a reserve role and I have no problem with Uribe sticking around in a reserve role also. At least with Juan I'd know that we have a legit backup who can handle 3B, SS and 2B defensively --- positions that Pablo can no longer play adequately.



I agree with this 100 percent.....i believe the battle is a good thing. I've seen uribe this year and I am still waiting for the offseason when he losses weight....not gains it. I just hate having 5 million wrapped up in a backup....maybe with a good spring we can look to package him with somebody and actually get something out of it!

sox1970
03-02-2008, 11:25 AM
I think Uribe will get moved--either Cincinnati or Baltimore.

The jury is still out on Ramirez. If he beats out Richar, then yeah, he should be in there. If Richar wins, then I think Ramirez will go to Charlotte to play everyday.

Ozuna needs to stay on the bench and start once a week against a lefty.

34rancher
03-02-2008, 11:39 AM
I want to see if Alexi is a versatile as he was originally advertised. Can he play some CF or not?

Craig Grebeck
03-02-2008, 11:48 AM
I just don't see how it's not Richar. He improved as he stayed up last season and has nothing left to prove in AAA. Ramirez was an investment, let's give him some time in AA or AAA before we challenge him too much.

I just don't think trial by fire is the right approach with a guy like him. He is raw.

jabrch
03-02-2008, 12:45 PM
Whomever looks best/ready in ST...it is way to early to judge - certainly given how little anyone here has actually SEEN of what went on. I'm fine whichever route the coaching staff goes here. You can make a reasonable arguement for any of those guys starting except Pablo.

oeo
03-02-2008, 12:50 PM
I just don't see how it's not Richar. He improved as he stayed up last season and has nothing left to prove in AAA. Ramirez was an investment, let's give him some time in AA or AAA before we challenge him too much.

I just don't think trial by fire is the right approach with a guy like him. He is raw.

I think most people are still riding high on his 4-5 game. Once Richar gets in the mix, and Alexei struggles a little bit, then there will be some changes of heart.

Also, remember that Ozzie said Alexei's defense at second was "rough." We also haven't seen him playing any 2B. It's early, but that could be an indicator that they're looking at him as our future SS.

Another thing I'd like to see from Alexei (and maybe this should go in the 'Alexei' thread) is the ability to steal bases. It appears he can really fly when he turns it on, but that doesn't necessarily mean he can steal bases. We already know that's a problem spot for Richar, even though he can fly as well.

MCHSoxFan
03-02-2008, 01:28 PM
I was just curious to see what everybody thinks about who should be our everyday second baseman? I really want to see alexei get it because I feel like he will be an exciting player. However, I don't think he will be ready that quickly. Then I believe pablo is suited best for our super sub role and not as an everyday player. So that leaves it to uribe and richar. Please danny richar have a good spring. Anybody but juan uribe!!! What does everybody else think?

I really want Alexi to be our starting 2nd baseman. However, if he does not make it, I want Richar. I would prefer Juan to be 2B/SS/3B back-up. I actually love Uribe. I just think he is a better player when he plays less and has to make the MOST of his playing time. I remember back in 2004, I could not wait to go to a game just to see him play. As for Pablo. I like him, but would prefer for him to be what he should be/is... A utility infielder.

Cuck the Fubs
03-02-2008, 02:09 PM
My own personal feeling is this..........

Ozuna is a bench guy...period.

Ramirez & Richar are unproven & in need of more seasoning.

Uribe, love him or hate him is a MLB ready guy who can play 2b,ss & 3b.

Uribe has to go in as the favorite unless the other 2 guys have an amazing spring.

Metalthrasher442
03-02-2008, 02:34 PM
I actually thought Uribe has the best shot starting at 2B this season.

Uribe is the most proven.. I think Alexei needs more time in AAA to really develop and Richar wasn't all the impressive last season.

Maybe one will destroy in AAA and be called up later on in the year, but right now I think Uribe has the best shot.

Tragg
03-02-2008, 02:41 PM
Richar should be the starter. He handled the position fine defensively; showed some power in his bat. He needs to get the OBP up but looks to have the skill to do it.
Alexi is inexperienced and Uribe is Uribe.
The GM is trying to get some OBP on this team (via his words and his trades) and reduce the swing at everything approach (although I'm not convinced the manager's on that page).

Richar.

The outfield looks like where the contention is.

BainesHOF
03-02-2008, 03:26 PM
I don't care what kind of spring training everyone has, Richar should be our second baseman. He's already demonstrated that he deserves a lengthy shot.

Uribe needs to be traded.

Milkman43
03-02-2008, 03:46 PM
Richar probably would be the starting second baseman only if he would have shown up to spring training on time. Ozzie is not happy about it and I believe that Richar still sits behind Juan and Alexei for the starting job. Coming into this season Richar was my pick to start at second base. I think though that Ramirez will end up winning the job.

LITTLE NELL
03-02-2008, 04:17 PM
I actually thought Uribe has the best shot starting at 2B this season.

Uribe is the most proven.. I think Alexei needs more time in AAA to really develop and Richar wasn't all the impressive last season.

Maybe one will destroy in AAA and be called up later on in the year, but right now I think Uribe has the best shot.
Uribe has proven that he does'nt miss many meals and can be lazy. I dont understand all the love for this guy when 99% of this board bashed him after the 07 season.

TomBradley72
03-02-2008, 04:19 PM
I see Richar and either Uribe or Ramirez "sharing" 2B in a platoon type situation. Richar would be our only LH hitting infielder...along with his speed...I think that gives him an edge to make the 25 man roster.

If we can't trade Uribe...Ramirez is headed to Charlotte.

Starting Rotation
1. Buehrle
2. Vazquez
3. Danks
4. Contreras
5. Floyd
Bullpen
6. Jenks
7. Linebrink
8. Dotal
9. Thornton
10. Logan
11. Wassermann
12. Massett
Starting Line Up
13. Owens
14. Cabrera
15. Thome
16. Konerko
17. Dye
18. Swisher
19. Fields
20. Pierzynski
21. Uribe
Bench
22. Quentin
23. Hall
24. Richar
25. Ozuna
On the Bubble
26. Crede
27. MacDougal
28. Anderson
29. Ramirez
30. Broadway
31. Haeger

sox1970
03-02-2008, 04:24 PM
^

I agree except I think Uribe gets traded, Richar will be at 2B, and Jeff Liefer makes the team as a pinch hitter/1B backup.

Taliesinrk
03-02-2008, 04:31 PM
^
Jeff Liefer makes the team as a pinch hitter/1B backup.

That should be in teal. We'll have 4 players capable of playing 1B. (6 if the nutties want to start throwing in Fields and Dye). I've got money that says Liefer doesn't make the team.

guillen4life13
03-02-2008, 04:32 PM
^

I agree except I think Uribe gets traded, Richar will be at 2B, and Jeff Liefer makes the team as a pinch hitter/1B backup.

Nooooooo!

Tragg
03-02-2008, 05:43 PM
Bench
22. Quentin
23. Hall
24. Richar
25. Ozuna



If promising young hitters like Quentin and Richar can't beat out Owens and Uribe, that does not portend well.
Quentin looks like he could be an impact bat. Owens' slap hitting was awful last year.

A. Cavatica
03-02-2008, 07:27 PM
I'm happy to see a competition between several young players with real talent! I'm hoping Chris Getz turns into Dustin Pedroia, but I'll be happy too if Richar or Ramirez seizes the opportunity.

RowanDye
03-02-2008, 07:28 PM
If promising young hitters like Quentin and Richar can't beat out Owens and Uribe, that does not portend well.
Quentin looks like he could be an impact bat. Owens' slap hitting was awful last year.

Owens playing well enough to be the leadoff man is the only reason he should be on the team. If he can't get on base enough to hit leadoff, then I would rather have a plus defensive CF (i.e. Anderson) than a pinch runner.

If Quentin plays well enough to demand a starting spot, then the leadoff and 5th OF spots become very interesting.

TomBradley72
03-02-2008, 09:01 PM
If promising young hitters like Quentin and Richar can't beat out Owens and Uribe, that does not portend well.
Quentin looks like he could be an impact bat. Owens' slap hitting was awful last year.

Assuming Uribe does not get traded...I would see Owens in CF against RHs, Swisher in LF, Swisher in CF against LHs with Quentin in LF.

I'm not the hugest Owens fan...but I think we need a real lead off hitter most of the time...we'll see if he's matured enough as a hitter. I'd like to see BA make the team so Swisher could DH against LHs.

btrain929
03-02-2008, 09:08 PM
I see Richar and either Uribe or Ramirez "sharing" 2B in a platoon type situation. Richar would be our only LH hitting infielder...along with his speed...I think that gives him an edge to make the 25 man roster.

If we can't trade Uribe...Ramirez is headed to Charlotte.

Starting Rotation
1. Buehrle
2. Vazquez
3. Danks
4. Contreras
5. Floyd
Bullpen
6. Jenks
7. Linebrink
8. Dotal
9. Thornton
10. Logan
11. Wassermann
12. Massett
Starting Line Up
13. Owens
14. Cabrera
15. Thome
16. Konerko
17. Dye
18. Swisher
19. Fields
20. Pierzynski
21. Uribe
Bench
22. Quentin
23. Hall
24. Richar
25. Ozuna
On the Bubble
26. Crede
27. MacDougal
28. Anderson
29. Ramirez
30. Broadway
31. Haeger



You can spell Pierzynski, but you can't spell Dotel?
C'mon, Church Elder.... :tongue:

BainesHOF
03-03-2008, 06:21 AM
It would be a darn shame if Uribe starts in order to cover up the mistake of giving him a $5 million dollar contract right before we signed Cabrerra.

Richar is our future and is ready now. To put his progress on hold for Uribe after his sad season of 2007 would be a huge mistake. I'm hoping the Sox have been talking up Uribe in order to trade him.

ArkanSox
03-03-2008, 07:23 AM
if he can adjust well to MLB pitching and even approach what he's done as the Cuban League's best hitter, and his fielding is as slick as advertised, he wins the second base job hands down. Being on the major league roster, he also gives the Sox an able emergency reserve man for the other side of the infield or an outfield position.

Speculating further, I imagine Pablo as the backup 2nd Baseman, Richar playing in the minors to try to improve on his anemic batting average/ on base percentage, and Uribe being traded (in a package with Crede or Fields) for starting pitching.

It will be interesting to see how it all plays out this spring.

Lillian
03-03-2008, 08:26 AM
There is one more candidate, about whom none of you have mentioned.
Jason Bourgoise just turned 26, and had a very solid season at both AA and AAA last year. His OBP is pretty good, and he can steal bases. I'm out here in Tucson for my fifth consecutive Spring Training, and he looks very good.

I would love to see us fill the opening at 2nd with someone like Jason, who could also solve the problem of the missing lead off hitter. Jason is the only one of the current candidates who could do that.

That would in turn open up the important Centerfield competition for a player who could provide good defense. Swisher is not the answer in Center, and Owens is just barely adequate. Owens is probably better suited as a fourth outfielder, and pinch runner. As disappointed as I've been about Brian Anderson, he is still the best defensive outfielder in our organization, and would look awfully good out there, if he could just put up respectable offensive numbers. Maybe he really has grown up, and is now finally ready to realize his vast potential.
Swisher could play Left, and not be a defensive liability there.

The only problem with this scenario is that there is no room for Quentin.
We sure could have a great club at Charlotte if it included Ramirez, Quentin, and Richar. There could be a big advantage to having Ramirez at AAA. He could spend the whole season playing short, which would give the organization a better idea of whether they could count on him to replace Cabrera. They will have to decide that this year, or shell out big money for a then pretty old player. Do any of you really want to see the Sox committ big bucks to a multi year contract for a 35 year old short stop?

A. Cavatica
03-03-2008, 08:42 AM
Jason is the only one of the current candidates who could do that.

(cough) Chris Getz (cough)

His upside is higher than Bourgeois'.

Lillian
03-03-2008, 09:15 AM
(cough) Chris Getz (cough)

His upside is higher than Bourgeois'.

Yes, I like Getz a lot too. However, isn't he much better suited hitting in the two hole? That is Cabrera's best spot. If Getz makes the Sox in the future, I'm pretty sure it would be as a number two hitter in the lineup, not as a lead off hitter.

btrain929
03-03-2008, 10:44 AM
There is one more candidate, about whom none of you have mentioned.
Jason Bourgoise just turned 26, and had a very solid season at both AA and AAA last year. His OBP is pretty good, and he can steal bases. I'm out here in Tucson for my fifth consecutive Spring Training, and he looks very good.

I would love to see us fill the opening at 2nd with someone like Jason, who could also solve the problem of the missing lead off hitter. Jason is the only one of the current candidates who could do that.

That would in turn open up the important Centerfield competition for a player who could provide good defense. Swisher is not the answer in Center, and Owens is just barely adequate. Owens is probably better suited as a fourth outfielder, and pinch runner. As disappointed as I've been about Brian Anderson, he is still the best defensive outfielder in our organization, and would look awfully good out there, if he could just put up respectable offensive numbers. Maybe he really has grown up, and is now finally ready to realize his vast potential.
Swisher could play Left, and not be a defensive liability there.

The only problem with this scenario is that there is no room for Quentin.
We sure could have a great club at Charlotte if it included Ramirez, Quentin, and Richar. There could be a big advantage to having Ramirez at AAA. He could spend the whole season playing short, which would give the organization a better idea of whether they could count on him to replace Cabrera. They will have to decide that this year, or shell out big money for a then pretty old player. Do any of you really want to see the Sox committ big bucks to a multi year contract for a 35 year old short stop?

I, too, am on the Jason Bourgeois bandwagon. We have a surprising amount of depth at the 2b position with younger players like Jason, Richar, Getz, Alexei, John Shelby (somewhat).

Lillian, I believe Bourgeois has only been playing CF while with the big club (he also started playing CF last year, too). How does he look defensively? How's his arm? Would he be a possible CF/leadoff candidate if he continues his strong ST play?

oeo
03-03-2008, 11:52 AM
Richar mentions a back injury over the winter:
Richar revealed that he had a back injury this winter that limited him to 78 at-bats with Azucareros of Dominican Winter League.

"I think everything is going to be OK," Richar said. "I trust myself and I'm ready to play hard and show them I'm readyhttp://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-03-white-sox-bits-chicagomar03,1,6624082.story

He's also going to be playing in his first game today. Also, Alexei will be in at SS.

A. Cavatica
03-03-2008, 09:33 PM
Yes, I like Getz a lot too. However, isn't he much better suited hitting in the two hole? That is Cabrera's best spot. If Getz makes the Sox in the future, I'm pretty sure it would be as a number two hitter in the lineup, not as a lead off hitter.

Depends on how much he improves. His greatest skill seems to be getting on base (.351 over two seasons, 88 walks vs 59 strikeouts), and his SB/CS ratio is decent (32-11). If he can keep that up at higher levels, he's leadoff material. I like a little more power from the two spot than he has.

chisoxmike
03-03-2008, 11:16 PM
I want Richar has our starting second basemen and our leadoff man to start the season.

Lillian
03-03-2008, 11:28 PM
I, too, am on the Jason Bourgeois bandwagon. We have a surprising amount of depth at the 2b position with younger players like Jason, Richar, Getz, Alexei, John Shelby (somewhat).

Lillian, I believe Bourgeois has only been playing CF while with the big club (he also started playing CF last year, too). How does he look defensively? How's his arm? Would he be a possible CF/leadoff candidate if he continues his strong ST play?

I haven't seen enough of him in CF to give an educated opinion. He did misplay a wind blown double on Sunday, but that was understandable, as it was very gusty. I think that Owens is probably at least as good defensively as Bourgeois, and playing either of them in center defeats my personal preference for a true, outstanding centerfielder. It isn't that I think Jason is a better leadoff hitter than Owens, but rather that his best position is Second, leaving CF open for a better defensive player, like B.A.
I don't know how good his arm is either, but I'd be surprised if it is rated a plus. Does anyone know?

I did notice that MLB.com posted an article about him today, after we started this discussion. It doesn't really offer much information about his tools, but interesting to see how people in the Sox organization are taking notice of his play.

BUMMER
03-13-2008, 01:00 PM
I was just curious to see what everybody thinks about who should be our everyday second baseman? I really want to see alexei get it because I feel like he will be an exciting player. However, I don't think he will be ready that quickly. Then I believe pablo is suited best for our super sub role and not as an everyday player. So that leaves it to uribe and richar. Please danny richar have a good spring. Anybody but juan uribe!!! What does everybody else think?

With the daily Cubtalk of obtaining Brian Roberts, wouldn't he also be a good "fit" on the Sox? With Owens inheriting Pod's groins, Richar with a bad back, Ramieriz not a 2B-man, and Uribe desired by the O's for SS - Roberts looks good at 2B and leading-off for Sox. Up-the-middle defense would be strong w/ Cabrera at SS, Roberts at 2B, and BA in CF. Everyday lineup would be stronger with Roerts/Cabrera 1-2. Ozuna & Richar or Ramieriz would be util IF. Plus KW would pull a "coup" grabbing a player the Cub's are also after. Do the Sox have a good enough package to get Roberts? (Uribe, Richar, Broadway, ...???)

ChiTownTrojan
03-13-2008, 01:29 PM
With the daily Cubtalk of obtaining Brian Roberts, wouldn't he also be a good "fit" on the Sox? With Owens inheriting Pod's groins, Richar with a bad back, Ramieriz not a 2B-man, and Uribe desired by the O's for SS - Roberts looks good at 2B and leading-off for Sox. Up-the-middle defense would be strong w/ Cabrera at SS, Roberts at 2B, and BA in CF. Everyday lineup would be stronger with Roerts/Cabrera 1-2. Ozuna & Richar or Ramieriz would be util IF. Plus KW would pull a "coup" grabbing a player the Cub's are also after. Do the Sox have a good enough package to get Roberts? (Uribe, Richar, Broadway, ...???)
Didn't you hear? The Orioles are giving away Roberts for a bag of balls! First one to call in wins!

Seriously, in case you hadn't noticed, we don't have much of trade value to get some one like Roberts. They're looking for a 5-for-1 deal (like they got with Bedard and Tejada), and we don't have much of value in our farm system right now.

Carolina Kenny
03-13-2008, 01:35 PM
Ozuma-sub only, pitch run, hit- "no one realizes how much we missed this guy" (Hawk)

Richtor- if healthly will win starting job. Best available blend of speed, defense and (hopefully) productive bat

Uribeton- may start season but should be sub at all IF positions or traded if right deal comes along

Alexi-needs to go to minors to work on defense and how to live in USA

Getz-trade bait

Taliesinrk
03-13-2008, 01:35 PM
With the daily Cubtalk of obtaining Brian Roberts, wouldn't he also be a good "fit" on the Sox? With Owens inheriting Pod's groins, Richar with a bad back, Ramieriz not a 2B-man, and Uribe desired by the O's for SS - Roberts looks good at 2B and leading-off for Sox. Up-the-middle defense would be strong w/ Cabrera at SS, Roberts at 2B, and BA in CF. Everyday lineup would be stronger with Roerts/Cabrera 1-2. Ozuna & Richar or Ramieriz would be util IF. Plus KW would pull a "coup" grabbing a player the Cub's are also after. Do the Sox have a good enough package to get Roberts? (Uribe, Richar, Broadway, ...???)

I think w/ BA's emergence, this becomes an even more enticing deal. The problem lies with what the O's would demand back. I think we'd be very formidable with that line-up (and especially defense), but at what cost?

Plus we'd have the steriods thing all season too..

kittle42
03-13-2008, 01:40 PM
Ozuma-sub only, pitch run, hit- "no one realizes how much we missed this guy" (Hawk)

Richtor- if healthly will win starting job. Best available blend of speed, defense and (hopefully) productive bat

Uribeton- may start season but should be sub at all IF positions or traded if right deal comes along

Alexi-needs to go to minors to work on defense and how to live in USA

Getz-trade bait

I don't get it.

Taliesinrk
03-13-2008, 02:00 PM
I don't get it.

Yeah.. does this mean you favor the trade?

Carolina Kenny
03-13-2008, 02:44 PM
Yeah.. does this mean you favor the trade?

What trade, there is no trade. Maybe Otis knows.

kittle42
03-13-2008, 03:08 PM
What trade, there is no trade. Maybe Otis knows.

I was just baffled by your names for the players, except for the completely non-trade-worthy Getz.

Tragg
03-13-2008, 06:58 PM
Get up to spiff soon, Richar.
Uribe's O at 2nd will clog this offense

thomas35forever
03-13-2008, 10:24 PM
I don't care what kind of spring training everyone has, Richar should be our second baseman. He's already demonstrated that he deserves a lengthy shot.

Uribe needs to be traded.
Who's gonna want him? He's a bum. He'd probably be most beneficial to a AAA team.

gogosox16
03-13-2008, 10:33 PM
Who's gonna want him? He's a bum. He'd probably be most beneficial to a AAA team.
agreed