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LITTLE NELL
02-24-2008, 05:52 AM
Im pulling very hard for Owens to have a great spring and have him in CF and our leadoff man. I believe the Sox will be a better team with Swisher in left, Owens in center and Dye in right, with Qeuntin and Ozuna as 4th and 5th outfielders. Anyone agree?

Lillian
02-24-2008, 07:17 AM
The only way Pablo sees anytime, anywhere in the outfield is if there are either several injuries, or a trade. Swisher, Quentin, Dye, Owens, and even Anderson have to be ahead of Ozuna, on the outfield depth chart.

That said, I love Pablo, and could see him getting some time at second, and as a pinch runner, and even a pinch hitter, against tough lefties.
Although they wouldn't platoon positions, I like the idea of plantooning Ozuna and Owens in the lead off spot. Owens would sit against lefties, with Quentin taking the third outfield spot, albeit in Left rather than center. Ozuna would play second on those days.
It would look something like this:
versus righties: Swisher in Left, Owens in center and Dye in Right
versus lefties: Quentin in Left, Swisher in center, Dye in Right
When Owens sits, Pablo leads off and plays Second.

If Quentin hits the Lefties well enough, it would justify giving him a chance to play everyday, in which case you may have to move Swisher to First, and look to trade Paulie. But that is for another thread.

Lukin13
02-24-2008, 09:00 AM
versus righties: Swisher in Left, Owens in center and Dye in Right
versus lefties: Quentin in Left, Swisher in center, Dye in Right
When Owens sits, Pablo leads off and plays Second.

If Quentin hits the Lefties well enough, it would justify giving him a chance to play everyday, in which case you may have to move Swisher to First, and look to trade Paulie. But that is for another thread.

Carlos Quentin plays everyday if he is healthy.

To put this into perspective for you, just two short years ago Quentin was a bigger prospect than Josh Fields is today.

Again, I have trouble coming to terms with why he cost us so little if he is indeed ready to play... But I certaintly hope that the fact that without Owens in the lineup the Sox have no traditional leadoff hitter won't keep Ozzie from giving a guy with much higher ceiling a fair shot.

There are less and less players in the mold of Jerry Owens coming into the league these days. Strictly speed hitters are becoming a thing of the past. The worst part about Owens is that most slap hitters with speed are above average defensively. Owens is horrible in center and below average in the corners. People keep saying that they hope his bat improves; I believe that unless Owens can improve his routes and strengthen his arm that regardless of how he hits he shouldn't be an everyday outfielder.

I rank Anderson ahead of Owens because this team needs a centerfielder and Owens is a bad corner outfielder not a centerfielder.

gr8mexico
02-24-2008, 10:31 AM
Im pulling very hard for Owens to have a great spring and have him in CF and our leadoff man. I believe the Sox will be a better team with Swisher in left, Owens in center and Dye in right, with Qeuntin and Ozuna as 4th and 5th outfielders. Anyone agree?
"My Outfield" When did you become the coach:?:

LITTLE NELL
02-24-2008, 11:37 AM
"My Outfield" When did you become the coach:?:
1946(actually manager)

sullythered
02-24-2008, 02:22 PM
Carlos Quentin plays everyday if he is healthy.

To put this into perspective for you, just two short years ago Quentin was a bigger prospect than Josh Fields is today.

Again, I have trouble coming to terms with why he cost us so little if he is indeed ready to play... But I certaintly hope that the fact that without Owens in the lineup the Sox have no traditional leadoff hitter won't keep Ozzie from giving a guy with much higher ceiling a fair shot.

There are less and less players in the mold of Jerry Owens coming into the league these days. Strictly speed hitters are becoming a thing of the past. The worst part about Owens is that most slap hitters with speed are above average defensively. Owens is horrible in center and below average in the corners. People keep saying that they hope his bat improves; I believe that unless Owens can improve his routes and strengthen his arm that regardless of how he hits he shouldn't be an everyday outfielder.

I rank Anderson ahead of Owens because this team needs a centerfielder and Owens is a bad corner outfielder not a centerfielder.
I'm thinking he's gotta still be pretty hurt. Otherwise I just don't understand why the Dbacks would have moved him.

Daver
02-24-2008, 02:42 PM
If Owens is the starting center fielder on opening day, I'm guessing the Sox lose 80 games.

munchman33
02-24-2008, 03:59 PM
My money is on Crisp starting in center.

jabrch
02-24-2008, 04:00 PM
If Owens is the starting center fielder on opening day, I'm guessing the Sox lose 80 games.


How many wins fewer is that than you are guessing with Swisher or CQ starting in CF?

Daver
02-24-2008, 04:02 PM
How many wins fewer is that than you are guessing with Swisher or CQ starting in CF?

I haven't seen enough of Quentin to give an opinion, Swisher is not a liability in Center.

btrain929
02-24-2008, 04:06 PM
If Owens is the starting center fielder on opening day, I'm guessing the Sox lose 80 games.

....which means they'd win 82 games, a 12 game turnaround from '07. It's not a World Series winner, or an ideal situation at all, but it's an improvement.

With that said, I still think the OF for the majority of the year will be Quentin/Swisher/Dye. The Swisher in CF is very similar to the Rowand switch to CF. Both were pretty good defensively at their corner positions (Rowand obviously a little faster). But KW/Ozzie believe their grindyness will let them be decent options defensively in CF. So far it's worked alright for Rowand.....

munchman33
02-24-2008, 04:10 PM
Swisher is not a liability in Center.

I disagree.

jabrch
02-24-2008, 04:10 PM
I haven't seen enough of Quentin to give an opinion, Swisher is not a liability in Center.

I agree with you on that based on the 2 times I saw Swish play CF. But I'm curious as to why you think JO would lock us in at 80 wins. Owens 2nd half, (.278/.339) leads me to believe he could get better. He won't ever hit 25 HRs, but we don't need that. I see no reason to believe he can't do what Pods did in 2005 (.290/.350). That's only 10 pts more than Scotty in AVG and OBP. Frankly, I'm not sure he can't do even better than that in the OBP side.

I respect your opinions - but am very curious as to why you think that a lineup with JO in CF would be only an 80 win team.

I think the success of the back end of the rotation will have much more impact on this team's results than will the decision on who is the third OF.

Daver
02-24-2008, 04:22 PM
I disagree.

I'm happy for you.

Daver
02-24-2008, 04:26 PM
I agree with you on that based on the 2 times I saw Swish play CF. But I'm curious as to why you think JO would lock us in at 80 wins. Owens 2nd half, (.278/.339) leads me to believe he could get better. He won't ever hit 25 HRs, but we don't need that. I see no reason to believe he can't do what Pods did in 2005 (.290/.350). That's only 10 pts more than Scotty in AVG and OBP. Frankly, I'm not sure he can't do even better than that in the OBP side.

I respect your opinions - but am very curious as to why you think that a lineup with JO in CF would be only an 80 win team.

I think the success of the back end of the rotation will have much more impact on this team's results than will the decision on who is the third OF.

When you have a shaky rotation, and the Sox have this as best as of this moment, defense becomes a premium, you can't give away outs. Jerry Owens can't play center field, he gets poor reads, has limited range because of it, and he can't throw to save his life.

hi im skot
02-24-2008, 04:56 PM
My money is on Crisp starting in center.


Yeah, just not on the White Sox.

jabrch
02-24-2008, 08:57 PM
When you have a shaky rotation, and the Sox have this as best as of this moment, defense becomes a premium, you can't give away outs. Jerry Owens can't play center field, he gets poor reads, has limited range because of it, and he can't throw to save his life.

His arm is undisputalbly unacceptable.

I'm not yet 100% sure he doesn't end up with decent range by using his legs to offset his skills.

That said, I don't agree that this team couldn't go over .500 with JO in center. But I also agree with you that it probably won't happen as we will see Swish in CF most of the year.

chisoxmike
02-24-2008, 09:06 PM
Quentin - LF
Swisher - CF
Dye - RF


Don't mess with that.

Jerry Owens in AAA.

Daver
02-24-2008, 09:13 PM
His arm is undisputalbly unacceptable.

I'm not yet 100% sure he doesn't end up with decent range by using his legs to offset his skills.

That said, I don't agree that this team couldn't go over .500 with JO in center. But I also agree with you that it probably won't happen as we will see Swish in CF most of the year.

Speed does not = range.

When you take the wrong angle, and commit to it, no speed in the world other than light can correct it.

kittle42
02-24-2008, 09:52 PM
"My Outfield" When did you become the coach:?:

Um, taking things a little literally, are we?

jabrch
02-24-2008, 10:09 PM
Speed does not = range.

When you take the wrong angle, and commit to it, no speed in the world other than light can correct it.

I understand the difference between speed and range - but there is a correlation between the two. Sure - there are many other factors in range, but a fast guy will have more range than a slow guy if all else were equal.

I understand your concern - but I think it is a bit early to conclude that .500 is a best case of JO was in CF.

sullythered
02-24-2008, 10:29 PM
Quentin - LF
Swisher - CF
Dye - RF


Don't mess with that.

Jerry Owens in AAA.
That would be nice, but isn't Quentin supposed to miss the first part of the year?

PalehosePlanet
02-24-2008, 10:37 PM
Quentin - LF
Swisher - CF
Dye - RF


Don't mess with that.

Jerry Owens in AAA.

I agree with the exception of Owens going down to AAA. It would be nice to have his speed on the bench.

Metalthrasher442
02-24-2008, 10:37 PM
That would be nice, but isn't Quentin supposed to miss the first part of the year?

Yeah he still has soreness in his shoulder. I wouldn't want to mess with that. Keep him healthy man.

PalehosePlanet
02-24-2008, 10:42 PM
That would be nice, but isn't Quentin supposed to miss the first part of the year?

I've read (sorry, don't remember where) that he should be ready to go for ST and that he'll be a 100% for the start of the season.

But I agree that if he isn't at 100%, put him on the DL, then keep him in the minor league complex for a while longer while the team comes north.

Brian26
02-24-2008, 11:40 PM
When you have a shaky rotation, and the Sox have this as best as of this moment, defense becomes a premium, you can't give away outs. Jerry Owens can't play center field, he gets poor reads, has limited range because of it, and he can't throw to save his life.

Not to mention he's got the slowest swing I've seen since Harold Baines and Singleton were on the team in 2001.

pearso66
02-24-2008, 11:48 PM
I would love to see, if Quentin can't go to start the season, Brian Anderson given another shot at CF. With Swisher in LF and possibly Uribe out of the lineup, the Sox can live with one guy being in there solely for D. Plus if his bat comes around, he is a heck of a defensive CFer, and we would have a surplus of major league OFers instead of a shortage.

kraut83
02-25-2008, 09:51 AM
I've read (sorry, don't remember where) that he should be ready to go for ST and that he'll be a 100% for the start of the season.

But I agree that if he isn't at 100%, put him on the DL, then keep him in the minor league complex for a while longer while the team comes north.

Exactly. There's no need to rush him back at this point.

I haven't read anything recently regarding his health, but IIRC when the trade went down, we were hearing that he wouldn't be ready for spring training.