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View Full Version : Thomas Was Victim of 'Roids


mealfred13
12-17-2007, 06:48 PM
Here's an interesting read I found on Google: http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2007/dec/17/keegan_thomas_victim_roids/

I particularly like this part:
It would be a nice gesture if Giambi forfeited his MVP trophy and asked that it be presented to Thomas.

Nice to see that other people are saying what's been said here for years: That Thomas was one of the most talented players among a large number of tainted ones who overshadow his achievements.

Big Hurt #35=HOF
12-17-2007, 07:04 PM
Mannnn Frank was a solid, pure hitter. If he took roids he would have hit 100 HR's in a year-Ha Ha

He sure was robbed that extra MVP award! Glad he got his 500th home run!!!!!

Great job to Frank Thomas #35!!!!!

Martinigirl
12-17-2007, 07:17 PM
Here's an interesting read I found on Google: http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2007/dec/17/keegan_thomas_victim_roids/

I particularly like this part:


Nice to see that other people are saying what's been said here for years: That Thomas was one of the most talented players among a large number of tainted ones who overshadow his achievements.


Yeah, like Giambi is that classy.

Hokiesox
12-17-2007, 07:30 PM
The Sox would be out of a lot of money if that happened.

Not saying it shouldn't... but that's the reality

angiew
12-17-2007, 08:28 PM
Using the words "classy" and "Giambi" in the same sentence should be a crime. That is one greasy man.:?:

WizardsofOzzie
12-17-2007, 08:37 PM
Won't ever happen but it would be nice if it did

TheOldRoman
12-17-2007, 08:53 PM
The biggest crime was that, steroids aside, Frank STILL had a better season than Giambi in 2000. He put up better numbers, and led a less talented team to more wins. Giambi won a popularity contest because the media thought he was "cool" and "a rebel".

areilly
12-17-2007, 09:12 PM
Slippery slope if I ever heard of one. I'm all in favor of revisionist history working in the Sox' favor, but this is just ridiculous:

1986 AL RoY: Mark Eichhorn
1986 AL CYA: Teddy Higuera
1986 AL MVP: Don Mattingly
1987 AL RoY: Kevin Seitzer
1987 NL RoY: Mike Dunne
1987 AL CYA: Jimmy Key
1988 AL MVP: Mike Greenwell
1990 NL MVP: Bobby Bonilla
1990 NL RoY: Delino DeShields [if you don't believe Justice's denial]
1991 AL CYA: Scott Erickson
1991 AL RoY: Juan Guzman
1992 NL MVP: Terry Pendleton
1993 NL MVP: David Justice [or Fred McGriff, again depending what you think of Justice's denial]
1995 AL MVP: Albert Belle
1996 AL MVP: Alex Rodriguez
1996 NL MVP: Mike Piazza
1997 AL CYA: Randy Johnson
1998 NL MVP: Moises Alou
1998 AL CYA: Pedro Martinez
1998 AL MVP: Nomar Garciaparra
2000 AL MVP: Frank Thomas
2001 NL MVP: Luis Gonzalez
2002 NL MVP: Albert Pujols
2002 AL MVP: Alex Rodriguez
2003 NL CYA: Jason Schmidt
2003 NL MVP: Albert Pujols
2004 NL MVP: Adrian Beltre


Not only would Frank be a 3-time MVP, but Alex Rodriguez would be a 5-time MVP. Unreal.

TDog
12-17-2007, 09:43 PM
If someone renounced an MVP award, years after the fact, the league would not re-award that award to another player. Officially there would be no MVP that year.

I don't think Giambi deserved the award. Not that Thomas played like an MVP in the ALDS (which, of course, was played after the writers voted), but he led the Sox to a great regular season.

FarWestChicago
12-17-2007, 10:12 PM
Not only would Frank be a 3-time MVP, but Alex Rodriguez would be a 5-time MVP. Unreal.I thought you were taking the 'roiders off the list? :wink:

PalehosePlanet
12-18-2007, 12:30 AM
Nice to see Frank getting his share of positive support from the press, including two notable mentions in one day (including the earlier article posted from the Calgary free press.)

CRAW
12-18-2007, 09:38 AM
I'm sure someone on here knows of a way to get in touch with Frank - doesn't he have a fan club address or fan club email address? I'd like to personally thank him for following the right path.

Thanks.

skottyj242
12-18-2007, 03:00 PM
I wonder if on his plaque it will say he narrowly missed his third MVP award.

chaerulez
12-18-2007, 03:02 PM
Slippery slope if I ever heard of one. I'm all in favor of revisionist history working in the Sox' favor, but this is just ridiculous:

1986 AL RoY: Mark Eichhorn
1986 AL CYA: Teddy Higuera
1986 AL MVP: Don Mattingly
1987 AL RoY: Kevin Seitzer
1987 NL RoY: Mike Dunne
1987 AL CYA: Jimmy Key
1988 AL MVP: Mike Greenwell
1990 NL MVP: Bobby Bonilla
1990 NL RoY: Delino DeShields [if you don't believe Justice's denial]
1991 AL CYA: Scott Erickson
1991 AL RoY: Juan Guzman
1992 NL MVP: Terry Pendleton
1993 NL MVP: David Justice [or Fred McGriff, again depending what you think of Justice's denial]
1995 AL MVP: Albert Belle
1996 AL MVP: Alex Rodriguez
1996 NL MVP: Mike Piazza
1997 AL CYA: Randy Johnson
1998 NL MVP: Moises Alou
1998 AL CYA: Pedro Martinez
1998 AL MVP: Nomar Garciaparra
2000 AL MVP: Frank Thomas
2001 NL MVP: Luis Gonzalez
2002 NL MVP: Albert Pujols
2002 AL MVP: Alex Rodriguez
2003 NL CYA: Jason Schmidt
2003 NL MVP: Albert Pujols
2004 NL MVP: Adrian Beltre


Not only would Frank be a 3-time MVP, but Alex Rodriguez would be a 5-time MVP. Unreal.

If Luis Gonzalez didn't roid, neither did Sammy Sosa.

Hitmenof77
12-19-2007, 10:46 AM
I'm sure someone on here knows of a way to get in touch with Frank - doesn't he have a fan club address or fan club email address? I'd like to personally thank him for following the right path.

Thanks.

Personally I would wait before doing anything like that. While I would like to believe that Frank and the rest of the players who weren't in the report are clean, I really believe those players listed on the Mitchell report are just the tip of the iceberg. They were listed because their steroid, HGH, PED, etc pusher/trainer got busted and spilled the beans. If a Balco like lab in the Midwest was busted, I'm sure you would see members of the Sox, Cubs, etc listed.

Personally I don't believe Frank, did steroids, HGH, PED of any kind. But I wouldn't say I'm 100% sure he did not take. I'm 95% sure Frank didn't use any PED's.

SoxSpeed22
12-19-2007, 02:13 PM
If anything, this whole thing legitimizes Frank's chances at the HoF. Before this, he was a fringe hall-of-famer, now that he was the only clean slugger of the steroid era, this makes it easier for him to get in.

Lip Man 1
12-19-2007, 02:30 PM
Sox:

Me thinks you are forgetting about a guy named Ken Griffey Jr. in your comment about the only 'clean' sluggar of the era.

Lip

Heffalump
12-19-2007, 02:58 PM
If anything, this whole thing legitimizes Frank's chances at the HoF. Before this, he was a fringe hall-of-famer, now that he was the only clean slugger of the steroid era, this makes it easier for him to get in.


Fringe?

That is crazy. The guy has stats up the wazoo! He probably isn't a first ballot inductee, but there is no way he is a fringe hall of famer.

Jim Rice, Andre Dawson, Bruce Sutter...those are fringe hall of famers.

SoxSpeed22
12-19-2007, 03:30 PM
Griffey was on his way, then he kept getting hurt and now he's fine. He could've taken HGH anytime he wanted, but didn't, so he has to be in. After Thomas' 500th home run, there were still people that didn't think that was enough to get in, now it should be with another year.

Heffalump
12-19-2007, 04:29 PM
Griffey was on his way, then he kept getting hurt and now he's fine. He could've taken HGH anytime he wanted, but didn't, so he has to be in. After Thomas' 500th home run, there were still people that didn't think that was enough to get in, now it should be with another year.

How do you know Griffey didn't take HGH? Just because his name wasn't in the Mitchell report? I'm not saying that he did, but you make it sound like it is a stone cold fact.

SoxSpeed22
12-19-2007, 05:43 PM
How do you know Griffey didn't take HGH? Just because his name wasn't in the Mitchell report? I'm not saying that he did, but you make it sound like it is a stone cold fact.You're making it sound like anyone could've done anything, saying he did is just speculation at this point. What makes you so sure he did anything? If he did, we would've already know about it by now, probably from him.

Nellie_Fox
12-20-2007, 12:49 AM
What makes you so sure he did anything?He said quite the opposite.
If he did, we would've already know about it by now, probably from him.What? This makes absolutely no sense.

SoxSpeed22
12-20-2007, 01:17 AM
Basically, I am getting words put in my mouth and the thing Nellie didn't get was that Griffey probably would have admitted if he used HGH. I'm done with this.

Nellie_Fox
12-20-2007, 02:10 AM
Basically, I am getting words put in my mouth and the thing Nellie didn't get was that Griffey probably would have admitted if he used HGH. I'm done with this.Oh, I got it, I just don't understand why you think he would just come out and make a statement about it. "As a result of the Mitchell report, in which I was not implicated, I'd like to admit to my use of illegal performance-enhancing drugs." Please.

By the way, it is you who put words in Heffalump's mouth.

Heffalump
12-20-2007, 08:37 AM
Basically, I am getting words put in my mouth and the thing Nellie didn't get was that Griffey probably would have admitted if he used HGH. I'm done with this.


Come on SoxSpeed22, are you really Ken Griffey Sr.?

Just kidding.

Your arguement simply does not make any sense. How do you know that Griffey didn't use? How do you know that if he did, he would admit it? Come on, you don't know anything about this guy, his personality, or his lifestyle choices.

I know that a lot of these guys are/were our heroes growing up, but we can't look at them as a kind of saint/superhero. We need to address is simply from a more adult perspective, based on the factual information available, the current state of MLB and the effect of how much money is involved.

IMO, I agree that Griffey and Frank are most likely completely natural baseball stars. However, WE have no way to truly confirm that. To think that these guys would just come clean with the money that is involved is simply absurd. Especially since their reputations have not been tarnished by news such as the Mitchell Report. The only guys that are gonna "come clean" are those that are doing damage control for their reputations after already being outed

Heffalump
12-20-2007, 08:39 AM
Oh, I got it, I just don't understand why you think he would just come out and make a statement about it. "As a result of the Mitchell report, in which I was not implicated, I'd like to admit to my use of illegal performance-enhancing drugs." Please.

By the way, it is you who put words in Heffalump's mouth.


Thanks for getting my back, Nellie!!

PennStater98r
12-20-2007, 09:44 AM
Needed to make a comment on the Frank being a fringe HoF player

Have you been talking to only Cub fans Soxspeed22?

Thomas is a legit first ballot HoF. He had one of the top 5 eight year runs of any player in any era of baseball - clean or not - and even some of those 'roiders didn't do the things that Frank did in the early to late '90s.

raven1
12-20-2007, 05:27 PM
Needed to make a comment on the Frank being a fringe HoF player

Have you been talking to only Cub fans Soxspeed22?

Thomas is a legit first ballot HoF. He had one of the top 5 eight year runs of any player in any era of baseball - clean or not - and even some of those 'roiders didn't do the things that Frank did in the early to late '90s.

I agree Frank deserves to make the HOF on the first ballot, but if he has to compete for votes against other players from that era with inflated numbers he might fall short. Hopefully a few years from now HoF voters will snub not only names users but those with even circumstantial steroid evidence as well (like Sosa - before & after pictures only a season apart that coincide with a huge power surge) and give Frank his due.