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the1tab
12-13-2007, 08:13 AM
Greenie on Mike & Mike (an appropriate nickname for someone reporting on this story) just read a few tidbits from various papers all over the country on info that's been leaked or is known about the Mitchell report. Interesting. A few nuggets:

- one informant said there were "a number of prominant Yankees" and that it's "going to be a rough day in the Bronx"

- No Mets

- Boras is already working spin control in California, saying that there was no due process and it wasn't a collaborative effort

- Bud Selig started the report to save his legacy, and this might tarnish it beyond repair.

Anyone else know anything or has anyone read anything?

NO MARIOTTI REFERENCES ARE CONSIDERED VALID IN THIS THREAD.

itsnotrequired
12-13-2007, 08:17 AM
Well, it should be out soon enough...

SoxGirl4Life
12-13-2007, 08:17 AM
NO MARIOTTI REFERENCES ARE CONSIDERED VALID IN THIS THREAD.

Why isn't that word in the cuss word filter?

Scottiehaswheels
12-13-2007, 08:19 AM
- one informant said there were "a number of prominant Yankees" and that it's "going to be a rough day in the Bronx"



Why does this not surprise me when the guy in charge is on the Red Sox payroll?

hi im skot
12-13-2007, 08:20 AM
Omigodomigodomigod I'm sooooooo excited!

rowand33
12-13-2007, 08:24 AM
2 PM, right?

mrfourni
12-13-2007, 08:28 AM
2 PM, right?

2 p.m. eastern. 1 p.m. central

RedHeadPaleHoser
12-13-2007, 08:33 AM
Why isn't that word in the cuss word filter?

Because ****tard is the cross reference off jaythejoke.com. As it should be. :D:

Crede_Fan
12-13-2007, 08:46 AM
Mike & Mike just announced that Roger Clemens is in the report.

the1tab
12-13-2007, 08:47 AM
Mike & Mike just reported that a trainer for the Yankees told a reporter for ESPN the Magazine that he told George Mitchell that, on a number of occassions, Roger Clemens was in possession of and was using steroids.

Wow. Good stuff.

SoxGirl4Life
12-13-2007, 08:47 AM
Mike & Mike just announced that Roger Clemens is in the report.

And you're surprised?

What, they couldn't wait until the official release because its out of their time slot?

Madvora
12-13-2007, 08:49 AM
I love this stuff. I can't wait for this whole report to come out.

balke
12-13-2007, 08:51 AM
This was hinted at from the VERY BEGINNING of all steroid talk. I remember Gammons and others would say we'd be very surprised what PITCHERS did steroids, and they always said it in such a somber tone that it would be the biggest of the big.

the1tab
12-13-2007, 08:51 AM
We're going to watch and listen to a full day of preemptive spin control and people getting thrown under the bus as various informants either try to get paid or players/agent/owners try to cover their tails.

It would be great if Clemens isn't in the report, and this jamoke just threw the Rocket under the bus. However, if you look at the circumstances surrounding Clemens' departure from Boston and how his career was going, and then to see such a remarkable turnaround in Toronto just a year later in the midst of a decade filled with apparently superficial accomplishments, I wouldn't be shocked if there are 6 Cy Youngs Awards and 8 MVP Awards (Giambi's one, Bonds 7) that all carry a * by the end of the day

Jose.Contreras
12-13-2007, 08:53 AM
Roger Clemens was one of the most obvious steroid abusers out there. I didn't need the Mitchell report to tell me that he was juicing. I mean his career was winding down like 14 years ago! Then he suddenly gets himself to the point where he is posting mind boggling numbers till the age of like, 48. Plus look at Roger. He's a horse and a half!

Roger Clemens...juicing?!?! COME ON. Give me someoen I didn't already suspect for years and years.

Jjav829
12-13-2007, 08:55 AM
:o::o::o::o: <----Pure sarcasm (we need a teal colored smilie like that)

the1tab
12-13-2007, 08:56 AM
Just wanted to gauge people's thoughts about the report

Jurr
12-13-2007, 08:56 AM
Well, duh. I've been saying that for years. I work with the head and neck every day, and I know a thing or two about growth and development of the bone structure of the face. The mandible shouldn't add to its overall dimension after the age of 21 or 22. Once the wisdom teeth have secured their location and support, things taper off in the growth department. His jaw (especially the angle of the mandible) has grown significantly in the last 20 years. And no...it's not because the face has "filled out". Growth around the angle (or the bending part of the jaw bone) should not be changed THAT much. Nobody wanted to hear about old Roger. It was all about Bonds.

veeter
12-13-2007, 08:57 AM
Does Ron Schuler look smart now?

SBSoxFan
12-13-2007, 08:57 AM
Mike & Mike just reported that a trainer for the Yankees told a reporter for ESPN the Magazine that he told George Mitchell that, on a number of occassions, Roger Clemens was in possession of and was using steroids.

Wow. Good stuff.

Wow. Was he in an airport on his cell phone at the time?

Roger Clemens was one of the most obvious steroid abusers out there. I didn't need the Mitchell report to tell me that he was juicing. I mean his career was winding down like 14 years ago! Then he suddenly gets himself to the point where he is posting mind boggling numbers till the age of like, 48. Plus look at Roger. He's a horse and a half!

Roger Clemens...juicing?!?! COME ON. Give me someoen I didn't already suspect for years and years.

Great. Now to go along with all PPDC threads we'll have the "I've known for years that so-and-so was juicing."

colles9
12-13-2007, 08:59 AM
I hate to say it but wasnt this what Conseco was saying though out his entire book... pointing blame on the Rocket for taking them? I can't say that him being on the list is any surprise... however I do like his new commercial where he asked his wife permission to return to baseball.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 08:59 AM
Clemens did steroids? Jesus!:o::o::o:

Next we're going to find out Sammy Sosa or Bret Boone used steroids!

Who next of our pure and vestal heroes shall fall to these witch hunts!!!!

Jurr
12-13-2007, 09:00 AM
Wow. Was he in an airport on his cell phone at the time?



Great. Now to go along with all PPDC threads we'll have the "I've known for years that so-and-so was juicing."
Um....this one was a no brainer, and there have been MANY people on WSI who would throw Clemens' name out there.

Jurr
12-13-2007, 09:00 AM
Clemens did steroids? Jesus!:o::o::o:

Next we're going to find out Sammy Sosa or Bret Boone used steroids!

Who next of our pure and vestal heroes shall fall to these witch hunts!!!!
Brady Anderson, anyone?:smile:

SBSoxFan
12-13-2007, 09:01 AM
Um....this one was a no brainer, and there have been MANY people on WSI who would throw Clemens' name out there.

And many who have thrown Rowand's name, just to pick one, out there.

TommyJohn
12-13-2007, 09:02 AM
Greenie on Mike & Mike (an appropriate nickname for someone reporting on this story) just read a few tidbits from various papers all over the country on info that's been leaked or is known about the Mitchell report. Interesting. A few nuggets:

- one informant said there were "a number of prominant Yankees" and that it's "going to be a rough day in the Bronx"



Why does this not surprise me when the guy in charge is on the Red Sox payroll?

And why do I get the feeling that the Red Sox will come out smelling like
a rose? Will any prominent Red Sox be named, or just a couple of token
utility infielders?

Oblong
12-13-2007, 09:03 AM
from another source:

Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera are not in the report. I was hoping Jeter would be.

misty60481
12-13-2007, 09:11 AM
Does anyone think the owners are taking this seriously or just as more of an inconvienence because of 15 day suspensions.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:31 AM
Brady Anderson, anyone?:smile:

Luis Gonzalez never did!

Ken Cami-who?

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:32 AM
And many who have thrown Rowand's name, just to pick one, out there.

Oh GMAB. Yeah, that's the same thing:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Fenway
12-13-2007, 09:34 AM
somewhere in heaven this man is laughing his ass off :bandance:

http://assets.espn.go.com/i/magazine/new/will_mcdonough_a.jpg

Fenway
12-13-2007, 09:37 AM
Report: Clemens to be named (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/)

ESPN reported this morning that Roger Clemens will be among the names revealed today in George Mitchell's report on performance-enhancing drugs in baseball. A source close to a former Yankees trainer told ESPN that the trainer told Mitchell investigators he supplied Clemens with steroids

Fenway
12-13-2007, 09:41 AM
Report: Clemens to be named (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/)

ESPN reported this morning that Roger Clemens will be among the names revealed today in George Mitchell's report on performance-enhancing drugs in baseball. A source close to a former Yankees trainer told ESPN that the trainer told Mitchell investigators he supplied Clemens with steroids

Klapisch: Baseball holds its breath (http://www.bergenrecord.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkyNjgmZmdi ZWw3Zjd2cWVlRUV5eTcyMzMwNDEmeXJpcnk3ZjcxN2Y3dnFlZU VFeXk2) According to one industry official, "several" prominent Yankees will be named by former Sen. George Mitchell in his 2 p.m. news conference.

chisoxmike
12-13-2007, 09:43 AM
You know, it will be interesting to see how people will react on here if a Sox player gets named today. All this laughing and dancing bananas will just go away and there will be hundreds of posts that go "I'll wait to see his responce/there's got to be an explanation for this."

skottyj242
12-13-2007, 09:45 AM
I can't wait.

SBSoxFan
12-13-2007, 09:47 AM
Oh GMAB. Yeah, that's the same thing:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I see your rolling eyes, and raise you one :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

The point is, there have been plenty of player's names thrown out here based on nothing more than idle speculation. There's bound to be a lot of "I knew its" around here after 2pm today. I'm willing to bet most are of the same ilk as the "kill KW"/"KW is god" crowds.

assrevolution
12-13-2007, 09:48 AM
You know, it will be interesting to see how people will react on here if a Sox player gets named today. All this laughing and dancing bananas will just go away and there will be hundreds of posts that go "I'll wait to see his responce/there's got to be an explanation for this."

This could be very damaging to Sox fans. I dread hearing Frank Thomas or any other Sox star brought up on that list. I can't say I'd give the player the benefit of the doubt. Ignorance may be bliss, but the truth needs to come out for the good of the sport.

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 09:51 AM
I have a final exam at noon and then I'll be running home to catch this thing. It's completely pointless/stupid/McCarthyism but I can't wait.

WhiteSox5187
12-13-2007, 09:52 AM
No Mets??? I find that a bit shocking, especially since one of the informants was a former Mets locker room attendant.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:52 AM
You know, it will be interesting to see how people will react on here if a Sox player gets named today. All this laughing and dancing bananas will just go away and there will be hundreds of posts that go "I'll wait to see his responce/there's got to be an explanation for this."

If it's one who's completely obvious about it, I doubt it.

Except that we dont' have any ballplayers who are completely obvious--they would all be a shock, and we would react accordingly

The only person surprised by Clemens taking roids is apparently SBSoxFan

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:54 AM
I see your rolling eyes, and raise you one :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

The point is, there have been plenty of player's names thrown out here based on nothing more than idle speculation. There's bound to be a lot of "I knew its" around here after 2pm today. I'm willing to bet most are of the same ilk as the "kill KW"/"KW is god" crowds.

The biggest suspects have been:

McGwire
Sosa
Giambi
Bonds
Anderson
Boone
Gonzalez
and
Clemens

in mine and most people's books. Just because a few people on this board go overboard with roids speculation every time a player works out or gets injured (Prior's on Roids! Rowand's on Roids!) doesn't mean that Clemens wasn't a smart bet to be juicing :rolleyes:

VenturaFan23
12-13-2007, 09:55 AM
"OH MY GAAAAAWD!!!! ROGER CLEMENS IS BUSTED!!!!"

Had to do it :smile:

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:55 AM
This could be very damaging to Sox fans. I dread hearing Frank Thomas or any other Sox star brought up on that list. I can't say I'd give the player the benefit of the doubt. Ignorance may be bliss, but the truth needs to come out for the good of the sport.

Frank Thomas will not be on that list. I can pretty much guarantee you that.

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 09:55 AM
Does Ron Schuler look smart now?

In a word: No!

SBSoxFan
12-13-2007, 09:56 AM
The biggest suspects have been:

McGwire
Sosa
Giambi
Bonds
Anderson
Boone
Gonzalez
and
Clemens

in mine and most people's books. Just because a few people on this board go overboard with roids speculation every time a player works out or gets injured (Prior's on Roids! Rowand's on Roids!) doesn't mean that Clemens wasn't a smart bet to be juicing :rolleyes:

I have no argument with that. My point is that I fear the people who will go overboard!

AJ Hellraiser
12-13-2007, 09:56 AM
No Mets??? I find that a bit shocking, especially since one of the informants was a former Mets locker room attendant.

That does not mean that there won't be players that were on the Mets when he was the locker room attendant there... he hasn't been there for a while and they have had a major roster overhaul since his days with them...

Also, keep in mind that the 80 names are supposed to be a mixture of current and former players...

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 09:57 AM
In a word: No!

POTY

Maybe Navarro SHOULD have roided

(just kidding)

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 09:57 AM
No Mets??? I find that a bit shocking, especially since one of the informants was a former Mets locker room attendant.

He was only with the team until 1995. There will probably a lot of former Mets on there.

munchman33
12-13-2007, 09:57 AM
Clemens, Pettite, Tejada, Brian Roberts, Jay Gibbons, David Segui all named according to MLBtraderumors. Report coming from espn.

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 09:59 AM
Clemens, Pettite, Tejada, Brian Roberts, Jay Gibbons, David Segui all named according to MLBtraderumors. Report coming from espn.


Segui and Gibbons already admitted to it. The rest aren't big shockers.

ComiskeyBrewer
12-13-2007, 10:00 AM
ROGER CLEMENS DID ROIDS????????


http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7106/blackguysbj3.gif

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/6519/stunnedev2.jpg

ESPN reports Americans everywhere are stunned!

Latest name: Andy Pettite.

doublem23
12-13-2007, 10:01 AM
Sorry, I can't view this report too credibly since it was spearheaed by an executive of a MLB team. Talk about the all-time conflict of interest. Did Mitchell blow the horn on any Red Sox?

The day MLB actually gets an outside investigator to report on it's drug problem is the day I'll start really taking interest in this ****.

doublem23
12-13-2007, 10:04 AM
This could be very damaging to Sox fans. I dread hearing Frank Thomas or any other Sox star brought up on that list. I can't say I'd give the player the benefit of the doubt. Ignorance may be bliss, but the truth needs to come out for the good of the sport.

I would be completely shocked if Frank's name was on that report.

ComiskeyBrewer
12-13-2007, 10:06 AM
I would be completely shocked if Frank's name was on that report.

Yea, i would be too. he just didn't seem like the kind of guy who needed steroids, or is the type of guy to use em.

chisoxmike
12-13-2007, 10:09 AM
Sorry, I can't view this report too credibly since it was spearheaed by an executive of a MLB team. Talk about the all-time conflict of interest. Did Mitchell blow the horn on any Red Sox?

The day MLB actually gets an outside investigator to report on it's drug problem is the day I'll start really taking interest in this ****.

My thoughts as well.

doublem23
12-13-2007, 10:11 AM
http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/11/commentary/column_sportsbiz/sportsbiz/george_mitchell_disney.03.jpg
Big Papi? You're on steroids? Mike Lowell? I thought you just got better because you wanted to preform for Red Sox Nation. Papelbon? OK, boys, we'll keep this our little secret. Now come on and help me get some more dirt on the Yankees!

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 10:12 AM
I would pretty much bet my entire bank account that Frank never used steroids.

Will he be on this report? Probably not.

russ99
12-13-2007, 10:15 AM
Does anyone think the owners are taking this seriously or just as more of an inconvienence because of 15 day suspensions.

Honestly, I think they're afraid of taking on the union which is the only real reason something more strict hasn't been put in place.

Also, this is a little too convenient a scapegoat for Uncle Bud. He can say "he tried" to stem the juicing flow, when in reality he's doing little to prevent it.

The timing really sucks too. They should have done this just before Spring Training. Right before Xmas is certainly a Bud ploy, since we'll be dutifully shocked, then enjoy the holidays and forget all about it when baseball starts up again.

DoubleO
12-13-2007, 10:18 AM
Since this thread is growing with speculation until the actual report does come out, I will share a list of players that where e-mailed to me from a close friend. I DO NOT a have creditable source, so take it for what it is worth...

Brady Anderson, Manny Alexander, Rick Ankiel, Jeff Bagwell, Barry Bonds, Aaron Boone, Rafaeil Bettancourt, Bret Boone, Milton Bradley, David Bell, Dante Bichette, Albert Belle, Paul Byrd, Wil Cordero, Ken Caminiti, Mike Cameron, Ramon Castro, Jose and Ozzie Canseco, Roger Clemens, Paxton Crawford, Wilson Delgado, Lenny Dykstra, Johnny Damon, Carl Everett, Kyle Farnsoworth, Ryan Franklin, Troy Glaus, Rich Garces, Jason Grimsley, Troy Glaus, Juan Gonzalez, Eric Gagne, Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Giambi, Jeremy Giambi, Jose Guillen, Jay Gibbons, Juan Gonzalez, Clay Hensley, Jerry Hairston, Felix Heredia, Jr., Darren Holmes, Wally Joyner, Darryl Kile, Matt Lawton, Raul Mondesi, Mark McGwire, Guillermo Mota, Robert Machado, Damian Moss, Abraham Nunez, Trot Nixon, Jose Offerman, Andy Pettitte, Mark Prior, Neifi Perez, Rafael Palmiero, Albert Pujols, Brian Roberts, Juan Rincon, John Rocker, Pudge Rodriguez, Sammy Sosa, Scott SChoenweiis, David Segui, Alex Sanchez, Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, Julian Tavarez,Fernando Tatis, Maurice Vaughn, Jason Varitek, Ismael Valdez, Matt Williams and Kerry Wood.

ComiskeyBrewer
12-13-2007, 10:22 AM
Since this thread is growing with speculation until the actual report does come out, I will share a list of players that where e-mailed to me from a close friend. I DO NOT a have creditable source, so take it for what it is worth...

Brady Anderson, Manny Alexander, Rick Ankiel, Jeff Bagwell, Barry Bonds, Aaron Boone, Rafaeil Bettancourt, Bret Boone, Milton Bradley, David Bell, Dante Bichette, Albert Belle, Paul Byrd, Wil Cordero, Ken Caminiti, Mike Cameron, Ramon Castro, Jose and Ozzie Canseco, Roger Clemens, Paxton Crawford, Wilson Delgado, Lenny Dykstra, Johnny Damon, Carl Everett, Kyle Farnsoworth, Ryan Franklin, Troy Glaus, Rich Garces, Jason Grimsley, Troy Glaus, Juan Gonzalez, Eric Gagne, Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Giambi, Jeremy Giambi, Jose Guillen, Jay Gibbons, Juan Gonzalez, Clay Hensley, Jerry Hairston, Felix Heredia, Jr., Darren Holmes, Wally Joyner, Darryl Kile, Matt Lawton, Raul Mondesi, Mark McGwire, Guillermo Mota, Robert Machado, Damian Moss, Abraham Nunez, Trot Nixon, Jose Offerman, Andy Pettitte, Mark Prior, Neifi Perez, Rafael Palmiero, Albert Pujols, Brian Roberts, Juan Rincon, John Rocker, Pudge Rodriguez, Sammy Sosa, Scott SChoenweiis, David Segui, Alex Sanchez, Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, Julian Tavarez,Fernando Tatis, Maurice Vaughn, Jason Varitek, Ismael Valdez, Matt Williams and Kerry Wood.

Any idea where he got that list?

DoubleO
12-13-2007, 10:24 AM
Any idea where he got that list?

I have sent an e-mail to find out, nothing yet, that is why it is pure speculation. If I do find something out, I will share...

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 10:25 AM
Rich Garces

http://www.cnnsi.com/2007/images/05/10/p1_garces.jpg

Not so sure that's steroids...

Tekijawa
12-13-2007, 10:26 AM
Any idea where he got that list?

I think from the 2nd checklist card in my 1997 Topps set...

assrevolution
12-13-2007, 10:26 AM
I have sent an e-mail to find out, nothing yet, that is why it is pure speculation. If I do find something out, I will share...

Validation should occur before posting this type of information. Otherwise, why post it?

soltrain21
12-13-2007, 10:27 AM
Validation should occur before posting this type of information. Otherwise, why post it?


Because it's all wild and unfounded speculation to begin with?

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 10:29 AM
Brady Anderson
Rick Ankiel,
Jeff Bagwell(never mention this fraud with Frank again)
Barry Bonds
Rafaeil Bettancourt
Albert Belle
Mike Cameron
Roger Clemens
Johnny Damon
Eric Gagne
Nomar Garciaparra
Mark McGwire
Andy Pettitte
Mark Prior
Albert Pujols
Brian Roberts
Pudge Rodriguez
Sammy Sosa
Gary Sheffield
Miguel Tejada
Maurice Vaughn
Jason Varitek
Kerry Wood

Wow...respect to the Big Hurt and Ken Griffey Jr...still don't trust A-Rod

chisoxmike
12-13-2007, 10:30 AM
Brady Anderson
Rick Ankiel,
Jeff Bagwell(never mention this fraud with Frank again)
Barry Bonds
Rafaeil Bettancourt
Albert Belle
Mike Cameron
Roger Clemens
Johnny Damon
Eric Gagne
Nomar Garciaparra
Mark McGwire
Andy Pettitte
Mark Prior
Albert Pujols
Brian Roberts
Pudge Rodriguez
Sammy Sosa
Gary Sheffield
Miguel Tejada
Maurice Vaughn
Jason Varitek
Kerry Wood

Wow...respect to the Big Hurt and Ken Griffey Jr...still don't trust A-Rod

And where the hell did this come from?

ComiskeyBrewer
12-13-2007, 10:31 AM
I have sent an e-mail to find out, nothing yet, that is why it is pure speculation. If I do find something out, I will share...


I just answered my own question. Deadspin has what they say is "the list"

http://deadspin.com/sports/is-this-the-list%3F/is-this-the-list-of-players-mentioned-333479.php

assrevolution
12-13-2007, 10:31 AM
Because it's all wild and unfounded speculation to begin with?

Possibly, but when the report comes out this afternoon there will be people that are accountable for publishing the information instead of it just 'appearing' on the Internet.

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 10:32 AM
These lists have been floating around in forwarded emails. Most likely just a hoax.

In other news, the NY Daily News is reporting Pettitte is also officially on the list.

DoubleO
12-13-2007, 10:33 AM
Validation should occur before posting this type of information. Otherwise, why post it?

Why was this thread even started? Unless Mitchell himself is actually telling us the name of the players a few hours before it is released, everything on here is speculation? That is why I said to "take it for what it is worth"

Fenway
12-13-2007, 10:34 AM
NY Daily News has a second name

Andy Pettitte



Among the names expected to appear in the Mitchell Report today are two of the most revered pitchers in Yankee history - Roger Clemens and Andy Pettitte.
According to a source familiar with information provided to Mitchell, Brian McNamee, the longtime personal trainer for the players, gave the former Senate majority leader conducting a steroids investigation for Major League Baseball information linking Clemens to the use of steroids and human growth hormone and Pettitte to human growth hormone.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/2007/12/13/2007-12-13_source_yankees_clemens_pettitte_named_in.html

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 10:35 AM
Any idea where he got that list?

Matter of time before this happened.... some guy lists the 80 players he thinks are on steriods or wants to see on steroids, and that list gets copied and pasted as "evidence." I'm holding out even surfing the web until 1:00!

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 10:36 AM
And where the hell did this come from?

Who knows? I've found this list on 20 other sites I've been checking over the past hour.

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 10:37 AM
Just for kicks and giggles, that list has 5 former White Sox by my counts (Belle, Cameron, Everett, Sosa, Canseco)

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 10:37 AM
Pujols!:o::o::o:

edit: And Dante???? :(

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 10:38 AM
The owners? Don't worry about the owners...they are orchestrating the whole thing...obviously they don't give a **** with Tejada being traded for...

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 10:40 AM
Pujols!:o::o::o:

edit: And Dante???? :(

I'd be crushed.

ComiskeyBrewer
12-13-2007, 10:40 AM
Pujols!:o::o::o:

edit: And Dante???? :(

Pujols really doesn't shock me. I have heard rumors about him for a few years now.

Chez
12-13-2007, 10:40 AM
I'm looking forward to the List being released to end the irresponsible speculation running rampant on this board and in the media.

Tekijawa
12-13-2007, 10:41 AM
Just for kicks and giggles, that list has 5 former White Sox by my counts (Belle, Cameron, Everett, Sosa, Canseco)

Schoenweis?

Tekijawa
12-13-2007, 10:41 AM
I'd be crushed.

Nefi Perez?!?!?!?!:o:

DoubleO
12-13-2007, 10:41 AM
I'm looking forward to the List being released to end the irresponsible speculation running rampant on this board and in the media.

What else are we suppose to do for the next couple of hours?

GoSox2K3
12-13-2007, 10:42 AM
Nomar Garciaparra
Mark Prior
Sammy Sosa
Kerry Wood



Possibly the top 4 jerseys sold to Cub fans in the last 10 years.

Jjav829
12-13-2007, 10:42 AM
"OH MY GAAAAAWD!!!! ROGER CLEMENS IS BUSTED!!!!"

Had to do it :smile:

I think you were one-uped by a Deadspin commenter. This was even better:

"ROGER CLEMENS IS IN GEORGE'S REPORT AND ROGER CLEMENS IS GOIN' DOWN. OH MY GOOD--GOODNESS GRACIOUS! OF ALL THE DRAMATIC THI--OF ALL THE DRAMATIC THINGS I'VE EVER SEEN, ROGER CLEMENS' NAME STANDING RIGHT IN GEORGE MITCHELL'S REPORT MEANING HIS ASS IS NAILED TO THE WALL! ROGER CLEMENS IS A JUICER! AND THERE WE GO JOHN, NOW HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT WHO'S GOING TO TAKE THAT SPOT IN THE ROTATION.":roflmao: :roflmao:

HawkDJ
12-13-2007, 10:43 AM
Schoenweis?

Good call.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 10:44 AM
I'd be crushed.

Me too! Bichette was one of my favorite players growing up

Sockinchisox
12-13-2007, 10:45 AM
Nefi Perez?!?!?!?!:o:

He was busted last year and suspended 50 games already.

AZChiSoxFan
12-13-2007, 10:45 AM
And where the hell did this come from?

I'm pretty sure than "EndemicSox" posted it. :redneck

AZChiSoxFan
12-13-2007, 10:48 AM
Just for kicks and giggles, that list has 5 former White Sox by my counts (Belle, Cameron, Everett, Sosa, Canseco)

I can already see tomorrow's headline in the Trib:

"Former Sox player Sosa listed in Mitchell report!!"

soxfan13
12-13-2007, 10:48 AM
I can already see tomorrow's headline in the Trib:

"Former Sox player Sosa listed in Mitchell report!!"

Stop already!!

Jjav829
12-13-2007, 10:49 AM
I was going to post this before even seeing that list, but I figure it still remains valid.

All of the names revealed are basically going to fall into one of 3 categories.

1.) The "No ****" category. Players who were obviously juicing for some period of time (e.g. Sosa).

2.) The "Really? Him?" category. Players who no one ever really suspected of using steroids (e.g. Rich Garces).

3.) The "Yeah, we kinda figured, but didn't really want to know" category. Players who are/were so good that we figured they may be using, but wanted to believe they were naturally that good (e.g. Albert Pujols).

doublem23
12-13-2007, 10:50 AM
Me too! Bichette was one of my favorite players growing up

It would also ruin one of the greatest MLB commercials ever, where Dante Bichette and Larry Walker took offense to someone hinting that their power numbers were caused by the light air in Denver.

I think Dante said something like, "I am so sick of that!" and slams a ball down on a table and it starts floating in mid-air.

Bucky F. Dent
12-13-2007, 10:50 AM
Sorry, I can't view this report too credibly since it was spearheaed by an executive of a MLB team. Talk about the all-time conflict of interest. Did Mitchell blow the horn on any Red Sox?

The day MLB actually gets an outside investigator to report on it's drug problem is the day I'll start really taking interest in this ****.


Yep. I can't believe that Selig would be so foolish as to put a person w/ ties to a major league franchise in charge of this investigation.

veeter
12-13-2007, 10:51 AM
I just answered my own question. Deadspin has what they say is "the list"

http://deadspin.com/sports/is-this-the-list%3F/is-this-the-list-of-players-mentioned-333479.php (http://deadspin.com/sports/is-this-the-list%3F/is-this-the-list-of-players-mentioned-333479.php[/quote) Man, Troy Glaus is on there twice.

doublem23
12-13-2007, 10:52 AM
Yep. I can't believe that Selig would be so foolish as to put a person w/ ties to a major league franchise in charge of this investigation.

Really?

http://msnbcmedia3.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/060330/060330_selig_hsml_4p.widec.jpg

I can.

mcfish
12-13-2007, 10:54 AM
I'm looking forward to the List being released to end the irresponsible speculation running rampant on this board and in the media.I've always suspected Lance Johnson. 10 home runs in 1995? That's unpossible! Look at the change over the years...

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/pics/lance_johnson_autograph.jpg

http://www.checkoutmycards.com/CardImages/Cards/002/017/06F.jpg

slavko
12-13-2007, 10:54 AM
This was hinted at from the VERY BEGINNING of all steroid talk. I remember Gammons and others would say we'd be very surprised what PITCHERS did steroids, and they always said it in such a somber tone that it would be the biggest of the big.

This is referring to RC's head? My big surprise:No Magglio.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 10:55 AM
I've always suspected Lance Johnson. I mean look at the change over the years...

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/pics/lance_johnson_autograph.jpg

http://www.checkoutmycards.com/CardImages/Cards/002/017/06F.jpg

:rolling: Those are some popeye-esque forearms! He really fills out those sleeves :)

Fenway
12-13-2007, 10:58 AM
These 2 better be on the list. Look at the size of their heads

http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/Third_Party_Photo/2006/06/29/1151556986_3727.jpg

mcfish
12-13-2007, 10:58 AM
[/url] Man, Troy Glaus is on there twice.He must have really hit the juice hard; like Canseco style.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 11:03 AM
He must have really hit the juice hard; like Canseco style.

Once for the cream, once for the clear

cbotnyse
12-13-2007, 11:05 AM
I really hope Albert Pujols is clean.

Juice16
12-13-2007, 11:05 AM
Drudge Report has a list.

Tekijawa
12-13-2007, 11:06 AM
I really hope Albert Pujols is clean.
and clear!

FJA
12-13-2007, 11:07 AM
Since this thread is growing with speculation until the actual report does come out, I will share a list of players that where e-mailed to me from a close friend. I DO NOT a have creditable source, so take it for what it is worth...

Brady Anderson, Manny Alexander, Rick Ankiel, Jeff Bagwell, Barry Bonds, Aaron Boone, Rafaeil Bettancourt, Bret Boone, Milton Bradley, David Bell, Dante Bichette, Albert Belle, Paul Byrd, Wil Cordero, Ken Caminiti, Mike Cameron, Ramon Castro, Jose and Ozzie Canseco, Roger Clemens, Paxton Crawford, Wilson Delgado, Lenny Dykstra, Johnny Damon, Carl Everett, Kyle Farnsoworth, Ryan Franklin, Troy Glaus, Rich Garces, Jason Grimsley, Troy Glaus, Juan Gonzalez, Eric Gagne, Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Giambi, Jeremy Giambi, Jose Guillen, Jay Gibbons, Juan Gonzalez, Clay Hensley, Jerry Hairston, Felix Heredia, Jr., Darren Holmes, Wally Joyner, Darryl Kile, Matt Lawton, Raul Mondesi, Mark McGwire, Guillermo Mota, Robert Machado, Damian Moss, Abraham Nunez, Trot Nixon, Jose Offerman, Andy Pettitte, Mark Prior, Neifi Perez, Rafael Palmiero, Albert Pujols, Brian Roberts, Juan Rincon, John Rocker, Pudge Rodriguez, Sammy Sosa, Scott SChoenweiis, David Segui, Alex Sanchez, Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, Julian Tavarez,Fernando Tatis, Maurice Vaughn, Jason Varitek, Ismael Valdez, Matt Williams and Kerry Wood.

I'm not so sure this is the list. Where is Gary Matthews Jr.?

Other than Pujols, the other name that really jumped out at me was Darryl Kile ...

mjmcend
12-13-2007, 11:07 AM
Those leaked lists have an overabundance of Latin players. How long until we hear the cries of racism?

rowand33
12-13-2007, 11:08 AM
A high-ranking MLB official said there are several errors in the list provided to WNBC.com by two sources. Original sources are standing by the preliminary list provided to WNBC.com

http://www.wnbc.com/sports/14845845/detail.html

soxfan13
12-13-2007, 11:09 AM
http://www.wnbc.com/sports/14845845/detail.html

List was taken down due to errors and unproven sources.

Madvora
12-13-2007, 11:10 AM
Wow, Wood and Prior both on that last. I wonder if that's correct.
I can't wait.

rowand33
12-13-2007, 11:10 AM
Wow, Wood and Prior both on that last. I wonder if that's correct.
I can't wait.

I'm far too excited for this list to come out. My productivity has taken a serious hit today because of the Mitchell report.

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:12 AM
List was taken down due to errors and unproven sources.

Was it the same as the deadspin list?

salty99
12-13-2007, 11:13 AM
Schoenweis?

Wil Cordero as well

mcfish
12-13-2007, 11:13 AM
Other than Pujols, the other name that really jumped out at me was Darryl Kile ...That does seem kinda unnecessary at this point, doesn't it.

soxfan13
12-13-2007, 11:13 AM
Was it the same as the deadspin list?

Im not sure.

Paulwny
12-13-2007, 11:14 AM
Since this thread is growing with speculation until the actual report does come out, I will share a list of players that where e-mailed to me from a close friend. I DO NOT a have creditable source, so take it for what it is worth...

Brady Anderson, Manny Alexander, Rick Ankiel, Jeff Bagwell, Barry Bonds, Aaron Boone, Rafaeil Bettancourt, Bret Boone, Milton Bradley, David Bell, Dante Bichette, Albert Belle, Paul Byrd, Wil Cordero, Ken Caminiti, Mike Cameron, Ramon Castro, Jose and Ozzie Canseco, Roger Clemens, Paxton Crawford, Wilson Delgado, Lenny Dykstra, Johnny Damon, Carl Everett, Kyle Farnsoworth, Ryan Franklin, Troy Glaus, Rich Garces, Jason Grimsley, Troy Glaus, Juan Gonzalez, Eric Gagne, Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Giambi, Jeremy Giambi, Jose Guillen, Jay Gibbons, Juan Gonzalez, Clay Hensley, Jerry Hairston, Felix Heredia, Jr., Darren Holmes, Wally Joyner, Darryl Kile, Matt Lawton, Raul Mondesi, Mark McGwire, Guillermo Mota, Robert Machado, Damian Moss, Abraham Nunez, Trot Nixon, Jose Offerman, Andy Pettitte, Mark Prior, Neifi Perez, Rafael Palmiero, Albert Pujols, Brian Roberts, Juan Rincon, John Rocker, Pudge Rodriguez, Sammy Sosa, Scott SChoenweiis, David Segui, Alex Sanchez, Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, Julian Tavarez,Fernando Tatis, Maurice Vaughn, Jason Varitek, Ismael Valdez, Matt Williams and Kerry Wood.

This list looks like the list reported by WNBC and now being reported on CNBC.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/22243678/site/14081545

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:16 AM
That does seem kinda unnecessary at this point, doesn't it.

I think he was merely hiniting that the 'roids could be a possible cause of the heart problems that caused his death. I didn't take it as anything disrespectful towards Kile.

skottyj242
12-13-2007, 11:16 AM
I just got this emailed to me, don't know if there is any basis in it but I will share:

itsnotrequired
pdimas
cwsfannick
jenn2080
chips
thedude
dumpjerry
whitesoxwilkes
whitesoxwilkes jr.
hangar18
chisoxmike


Will report when it becomes official that all these people are cheating bastards. I don't know where my buddy got this list but he's a close friend and it's credible.

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 11:17 AM
Here comes the MLB PR team...err lawyers...get ready for a deluge of MLB PR on ESPN over the next 30 days...

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 11:18 AM
I just got this emailed to me, don't know if there is any basis in it but I will share:

itsnotrequired
pdimas
cwsfannick
jenn2080
chips
thedude
dumpjerry
whitesoxwilkes
whitesoxwilkes jr.
hangar18
chisoxmike


Will report when it becomes official that all these people are cheating bastards. I don't know where my buddy got this list but he's a close friend and it's credible.

I'm shocked that I'm not on that list. I mean my post count screams steroids...

FJA
12-13-2007, 11:19 AM
This list looks like the list reported by WNBC and now being reported on CNBC.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/22243678/site/14081545

Both have now taken it down. I don't know - I remain skeptical of its authenticity. In addition to the Matthews Jr. exclusion, there are a ton of misspellings and the use of "Pudge" instead of "Ivan" Rodriguez.

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:20 AM
I just got this emailed to me, don't know if there is any basis in it but I will share:

itsnotrequired
pdimas
cwsfannick
jenn2080
chips
thedude
dumpjerry
whitesoxwilkes
whitesoxwilkes jr.
hangar18
chisoxmike


Will report when it becomes official that all these people are cheating bastards. I don't know where my buddy got this list but he's a close friend and it's credible.

Hah!! I knew Dump would be on there! The last time I saw him he picked me up with one hand and twirled me over his head just for kicks. I found it a little odd since I'm 6'5" and 265.

soxfan13
12-13-2007, 11:20 AM
I just got this emailed to me, don't know if there is any basis in it but I will share:

itsnotrequired
pdimas
cwsfannick
jenn2080
chips
thedude
dumpjerry
whitesoxwilkes
whitesoxwilkes jr.
hangar18
chisoxmike


Will report when it becomes official that all these people are cheating bastards. I don't know where my buddy got this list but he's a close friend and it's credible.

I wanna be on the list WAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

munchman33
12-13-2007, 11:21 AM
I'm shocked that I'm not on that list. I mean my post count screams steroids...

I always thought you were clean Voodoo.

But honestly, where is Lip? I'm not taking any report seriously that doesn't include his name.

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:22 AM
Both have now taken it down. I don't know - I remain skeptical of its authenticity. In addition to the Matthews Jr. exclusion, there are a ton of misspellings and the use of "Pudge" instead of "Ivan" Rodriguez.

I'm leaning the other way, it looks to probably true IMO. The reason I say that is the inslusion of lots of lesser known types like Wilson Delgado and Clay Hensley.

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 11:22 AM
I always thought you were clean Voodoo.

But honestly, where is Lip? I'm not taking any report seriously that doesn't include his name.

Brown noser...:tongue:

Skotty, I'd be shocked if Chips was on steroids. I mean honestly my left leg weighs more than he does soaking wet...

FJA
12-13-2007, 11:24 AM
I'm leaning the other way, it looks to probably true IMO. The reason I say that is the inslusion of lots of lesser known types like Wilson Delgado and Clay Hensley.

Good point. Of course, there's also the possibility that the list is partially accurate.

balke
12-13-2007, 11:26 AM
Thank God we aren't testing for HGH.

twentywontowin
12-13-2007, 11:26 AM
Other than Pujols, the other name that really jumped out at me was Darryl Kile ...

Not me. Healthy athletes don't have heart attacks at his age unless you have a condition. He probably chewed on them like candy.

FJA
12-13-2007, 11:31 AM
Not me. Healthy athletes don't have heart attacks at his age unless you have a condition. He probably chewed on them like candy.

I'm not necessarily surprised; I'm just wondering if he's mentioned in passing or if there is some additional light shed on his death.

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 11:31 AM
Not me. Healthy athletes don't have heart attacks at his age unless you have a condition. He probably chewed on them like candy.

You might be right. As a big Cards fan, I was crushed when DK died suddenly. Knowing what we do now, I wonder what the connection is.

And I don't think "crushed" is the right word for Pujols. Disappointed may be. This man didn't go on a Sosa/McGwire/Bonds binge. He was just good... every day, for 7 years. And from his rookie year, too. I find it suprising not because of his power numbers, but becaue of his consistency and great aveage. Personally, I'm bummed.

What a great lesson this may turn out to be, though. Players on this list have suffered career ending injuries, dramatic weight loss, horrible diseases, and possibly death. Is that too much to be a coincidence? In the midst of suprise and the confirmation of these rumors, this should really be a great cautionary tale for lots of people considering "whatever it takes."

Now, when does George Mitchell head to the NFL?

daveeym
12-13-2007, 11:33 AM
Good point. Of course, there's also the possibility that the list is partially accurate.It's almost a certainty that its only partially accurate. I'm pretty sure this is a list from Grimsley and the Mets clubhouse supplier. I'm sure plenty of unnamed players used other sources that won't be in this report. It'll be interesting to see if the report gives the sources along with the players.

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 11:35 AM
It's almost a certainty that its only partially accurate. I'm pretty sure this is a list from Grimsley and the Mets clubhouse supplier. I'm sure plenty of unnamed players used other sources that won't be in this report. It'll be interesting to see if the report gives the sources along with the players.

That's what I'm saying... this just seems like a list some guy has put together of all the assumed or rumored names. That may explain the lack of "shockers" on the list.

soxinem1
12-13-2007, 11:36 AM
All I am glad to say is that no Big Frank, Magglio, Paulie, Thome names were on it.

On CBS forum yesterday, there were some beligerent ******* 'fans' ripping into Big Frank and Thome, saying they were cheaters, bums, etc.

Big Frank may have his 1st year voted in HOF credentials solidified even more now.

thomas35forever
12-13-2007, 11:39 AM
I'm not necessarily surprised; I'm just wondering if he's mentioned in passing or if there is some additional light shed on his death.
I kind of suspect that Kile will be on that list. If he is, it will make the cause of his death a little more clear.

daveeym
12-13-2007, 11:42 AM
That's what I'm saying... this just seems like a list some guy has put together of all the assumed or rumored names. That may explain the lack of "shockers" on the list. Who's some guy? My understanding is that, basically these are names from the feds that have been passed on to Mitchell and info Mitchell got from the guys the feds busted. Now this might not end up being the case but that's been the trail the leaks have shown up until now.

Chez
12-13-2007, 11:45 AM
Wil Cordero as well

And Robert Machado.

Fenway
12-13-2007, 11:46 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3142651

Clarke and Lucchino both said Mitchell's return to the Red Sox following the investigation includes a return to the payroll. One general manager said that he did not believe Mitchell would implicate a high-profile Red Sox player in his report.

While Mitchell is on the record that he does not and did not own an interest in the Red Sox, he did not readily disclose that the Red Sox paid him for four years. Nor does a role as a paid advisor seem to fit Lucchino's description of Mitchell's directorship as "honorary," which might suggest the position is unpaid.


Some members of the baseball establishment indicated to ESPN.com that neither Mitchell nor Selig have seemed willing to acknowledge the legitimacy of their concerns about Mitchell as the investigation unfolded.
"Did he get a ring?" asked one team executive about Mitchell following Boston's World Series sweep of Colorado. "The kids who park cars at Fenway Park got rings, so you have to think he'll get one."

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:47 AM
Who's some guy? My understanding is that, basically these are names from the feds that have been passed on to Mitchell and info Mitchell got from the guys the feds busted. Now this might not end up being the case but that's been the trail the leaks have shown up until now.

He's probably referring to the Mets clubhouse/trainer guy (Radinski?? not sure of the name), a former steroids dealer who was, it seems, the biggest souce for the Mitchell report.

manders_01
12-13-2007, 11:48 AM
This could be very damaging to Sox fans. I dread hearing Frank Thomas or any other Sox star brought up on that list. I can't say I'd give the player the benefit of the doubt. Ignorance may be bliss, but the truth needs to come out for the good of the sport.

My co-worker thinks Frank's gonna be on it. :(:

thomas35forever
12-13-2007, 11:49 AM
My co-worker thinks Frank's gonna be on it. :(:
What team does he like? The Rox?

PalehosePlanet
12-13-2007, 11:50 AM
My co-worker thinks Frank's gonna be on it. :(:

Your co-worker is a cubs fan; Frank won't be on the list.

soxfanatlanta
12-13-2007, 11:50 AM
I'll be in a meeting with my client when it gets released; I have to wait until late this afternoon.
:mad:

soxfan21
12-13-2007, 11:53 AM
I'll hopefully see it right when it comes out, looks like from all of the lists that have been circulating, there could be a lot of recent cubs players on it. Nice.:D:

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 11:54 AM
He's probably referring to the Mets clubhouse/trainer guy (Radinski?? not sure of the name), a former steroids dealer who was, it seems, the biggest souce for the Mitchell report.

The actual George Mitchell list will be credible, I believe. It's the list floating on the web that I don't trust. If it turns out to be true, than fine... but until then, I just don't believe it. Anyone can say "I got it from a good source," but that kind of line is bunk when it comes to internet rumors! :D:

pdimas
12-13-2007, 11:55 AM
I just got this emailed to me, don't know if there is any basis in it but I will share:

itsnotrequired
pdimas
cwsfannick
jenn2080
chips
thedude
dumpjerry
whitesoxwilkes
whitesoxwilkes jr.
hangar18
chisoxmike


Will report when it becomes official that all these people are cheating bastards. I don't know where my buddy got this list but he's a close friend and it's credible.


Mentiras!!!!

Trav
12-13-2007, 11:55 AM
Your co-worker is a cubs fan; Frank won't be on the list.

The only reason I'm excited about this list coming out is having Frank NOT be on it. If he didn't play in the steroid era, people would realize just how good he was.

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 11:56 AM
Your co-worker is a cubs fan; Frank won't be on the list.

Frank Thomas and Ken Griffey Jr. will come out of this debacle looking like the true 1st ballot HOF'ers that they are...

thomas35forever
12-13-2007, 11:57 AM
Frank Thomas and Ken Griffey Jr. will come out of this debacle looking like the true 1st ballot HOF'ers that they are...
Feels just like the mid-90s again.

manders_01
12-13-2007, 11:59 AM
What team does he like? The Rox?

Your co-worker is a cubs fan; Frank won't be on the list.

The only reason I'm excited about this list coming out is having Frank NOT be on it. If he didn't play in the steroid era, people would realize just how good he was.

He doesn't really have a team. Just a general sports enthusiast.

Personally, I don't think he will be on the list and I really hope he's not.

RedHeadPaleHoser
12-13-2007, 11:59 AM
It truly doesn't matter who is on this list other than give some people more fodder for disliking a player who they thought was already using 'roids. Players will spin control, teams will spin control, MLB will spin control, so the truth as to who and why gets lost in speculation.

This is gonna be bad for baseball, regardless of who is named.

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 12:01 PM
It truly doesn't matter who is on this list other than give some people more fodder for disliking a player who they thought was already using 'roids. Players will spin control, teams will spin control, MLB will spin control, so the truth as to who and why gets lost in speculation.

This is gonna be bad for baseball, regardless of who is named.
:gulp:

CHISOXFAN13
12-13-2007, 12:01 PM
My co-worker thinks Frank's gonna be on it. :(:

I just talked to my dog, and she said Frank won't be on the list.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:01 PM
It truly doesn't matter who is on this list other than give some people more fodder for disliking a player who they thought was already using 'roids. Players will spin control, teams will spin control, MLB will spin control, so the truth as to who and why gets lost in speculation.

This is gonna be bad for baseball, regardless of who is named.

Good for baseball. Embarrassing for the MLB. Bad for the fans who care.

RedHeadPaleHoser
12-13-2007, 12:02 PM
Good for baseball. Embarrassing for the MLB. Bad for the fans who care.

So bad for two of three = bad for baseball.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:08 PM
So bad for two of three = bad for baseball.

Well I don't think Bud Selig and his cronies are actually going to be affected by it other than having to blush and say Oops! He may even talk about how this is the time to look forward and not back. I doubt attendance will drop off and they will continue to make money. So it isn't really bad, just embarrassing.

soxfan13
12-13-2007, 12:13 PM
And Robert Machado.

IIRC he actually got busted or admitted to steroids.

thepaulbowski
12-13-2007, 12:13 PM
- Boras is already working spin control in California, saying that there was no due process and it wasn't a collaborative effort

As much as it pains me to say it, I do agree with Boras on this.

RedHeadPaleHoser
12-13-2007, 12:14 PM
Well I don't think Bud Selig and his cronies are actually going to be affected by it other than having to blush and say Oops! He may even talk about how this is the time to look forward and not back. I doubt attendance will drop off and they will continue to make money. So it isn't really bad, just embarrassing.

That's what I mean by spin. They'll throw their hands up, give the shoulder shrug...and dump this on the players/teams. The players/teams will give the "I didn't know what it was" or "We were not aware" comments...so as I said originally...this is bad because NOTHING of fact will ever be determined. Misdirection in the form of indifference will be the end result here...and that's why it is bad for baseball, because it will end up smearing SOME innocent players (Paul Byrd, who had to go public about a doctor's prescription) but end up proving nothing.

doublem23
12-13-2007, 12:16 PM
How utterly hypocritical is it that an ESPN poll asking "Knowing what we know now, should Roger Clemens be a Hall of Famer?"

64% yes.

:o:

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:16 PM
I was just thinking about how this will affect the cheaters who went on to work on TV..... Do they get canned immediately or is it going to be a gradual thing? I have to imagine that there will be at least a few who will fall into this category.

russ99
12-13-2007, 12:18 PM
As much as it pains me to say it, I do agree with Boras on this.

My only issue is that Boras and in turn the players association is doing absolutely nothing in regard to this, as god forbid some of their clients may lose a few dollars of salary. At least Bud/Mitchell is doing something.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:19 PM
That's what I mean by spin. They'll throw their hands up, give the shoulder shrug...and dump this on the players/teams. The players/teams will give the "I didn't know what it was" or "We were not aware" comments...so as I said originally...this is bad because NOTHING of fact will ever be determined. Misdirection in the form of indifference will be the end result here...and that's why it is bad for baseball, because it will end up smearing SOME innocent players (Paul Byrd, who had to go public about a doctor's prescription) but end up proving nothing.

Ah, good point.

Sockinchisox
12-13-2007, 12:19 PM
SI is saying Tejada is definitely on the list.

ode to veeck
12-13-2007, 12:20 PM
Why isn't that word in the cuss word filter?

there should be an automatic script that moves all posts with it's mention to the outhouse

ode to veeck
12-13-2007, 12:21 PM
until the report is out this is just baseless rumor mongering

thomas35forever
12-13-2007, 12:22 PM
How utterly hypocritical is it that an ESPN poll asking "Knowing what we know now, should Roger Clemens be a Hall of Famer?"

64% yes.

:o:
This report lists players who received steroids, not those who necessarily took them. Until we know more about what Clemens did, nearly two-thirds of fans will think he's a Hall of Famer.

daveeym
12-13-2007, 12:23 PM
The actual George Mitchell list will be credible, I believe. It's the list floating on the web that I don't trust. If it turns out to be true, than fine... but until then, I just don't believe it. Anyone can say "I got it from a good source," but that kind of line is bunk when it comes to internet rumors! :D:Agreed. I'm betting the list out there is the Mitchell list though. No way all these mainstream media outlets are releasing these names without knowing it's the Mitchell report. MLBtraderumours.com is another story but the nbc's etc. are releasing it now.

I sum it up like this. The names will be accurate. Mitchell's Red Sox role is just talk show fodder. This report is based on limited information from work the Fed's already did. If the report implies that this is a thorough investigation and the list is exhaustive then we'll know it's a sham.

I think the report just goes to show that the worst case scenario actually occurred and that the previous "studies" and "reports" of upwards of 50% of baseball was on PED's has always been more spot on than what MLB and others would like you to believe.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:24 PM
This report lists players who received steroids, not those who necessarily took them. Until we know more about what Clemens did, nearly two-thirds of fans will think he's a Hall of Famer.

That's true, I hear steroids are great for getting stains out of clothes.

fquaye149
12-13-2007, 12:24 PM
This report lists players who received steroids, not those who necessarily took them. Until we know more about what Clemens did, nearly two-thirds of fans will think he's a Hall of Famer.

Just holding it for a friend huh?

And maybe he just got unnaturally large and fast to recover from injuries on his own.

But yeah, who knows...

I'm sure you're extending this same benefit of the doubt to Sosa and McGwire, right?

daveeym
12-13-2007, 12:25 PM
He doesn't really have a team. Just a general sports enthusiast.

Personally, I don't think he will be on the list and I really hope he's not.
I doubt he's on the official list but this morning on the Score Pappy was basically saying he would be on the list. Moron part 2.

soxfan21
12-13-2007, 12:32 PM
30 min. left:gulp:.

D. TODD
12-13-2007, 12:34 PM
I will take this report with a grain of salt. It will just scratch the surface of those who may have used, and plenty of guys that did will be no where near the report. Others may be implicated that had minimal or no direct use. In the long run I'm more concerned on how this report will be used for the here and now and into the future. I firmly believe most players used now illegal performance enhancing drugs, more then just steroids, and it was part of the game for that era. Let's see how they police it from here on out.


I heard James Carville on XM give a interesting possability. He said congress can and might use this to make a law that any sporting event ( baseball, football, hockey, etc.) would have to adopt Olympic standards of testing in order to continue to practice inter-state commerce in the selling of tickets. That would have a far reaching effect on all professional sports in America.

chisoxmike
12-13-2007, 12:36 PM
All I am glad to say is that no Big Frank, Magglio, Paulie, Thome names were on it.



:?:
The list isn't out yet.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:36 PM
I will take this report with a grain of salt. It will just scratch the surface of those who may have used, and plenty of guys that did will be no where near the report. Others may be implicated that had minimal or no direct use. In the long run I'm more concerned on how this report will be used for the here and now and into the future. I firmly believe most players used now illegal performance enhancing drugs, more then just steroids, and it was part of the game for that era. Let's see how they police it from here on out.


I heard James Carville on XM give a interesting possability. He said congress can and might use this to make a law that any sporting event ( baseball, football, hockey, etc.) would have to adopt Olympic standards of testing in order to continue to practice inter-state business in the selling of tickets. That would have a far reaching effect on all professional sports in America.

That is interesting. I think that's a pretty good idea actually.

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 12:37 PM
I will take this report with a grain of salt. It will just scratch the surface of those who may have used, and plenty of guys that did will be no where near the report. Others may be implicated that had minimal or no direct use. In the long run I'm more concerned on how this report will be used for the here and now and into the future. I firmly believe most players used now illegal performance enhancing drugs, more then just steroids, and it was part of the game for that era. Let's see how they police it from here on out.


I heard James Carville on XM give a interesting possability. He said congress can and might use this to make a law that any sporting event ( baseball, football, hockey, etc.) would have to adopt Olympic standards of testing in order to continue to practice inter-state commerce in the selling of tickets. That would have a far reaching effect on all professional sports in America.


I hope Carville is right! This would be good for the game...but nonetheless, the players will always be one step ahead of the testing, and I'm not sure it accomplishes anything(other than influencing the youth, which is a good thing)...

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:41 PM
Anyone wanting a laugh should tune into ESPN's special report. They are in full COA and mourning mode. Gammons says it would be a shame if Clemens and Pettite go down because of this. Tim Kurgen or whatever his name is, just went on about how it isn't the media's fault for not seeing this problem. Steve Phillips is saying he suspected players were on PEDs but he had nowhere to go. Poor Steve.

RedHeadPaleHoser
12-13-2007, 12:43 PM
Anyone wanting a laugh should tune into ESPN's special report. They are in full COA and mourning mode. Gammons says it would be a shame if Clemens and Pettite go down because of this. Tim Kurgen or whatever his name is, just went on about how it isn't the medias fault for not seeing this problem. Steve Phillips is saying he suspected players were on PEDs but he had nowhere to go. Poor Steve.

And so it begins.

mjmcend
12-13-2007, 12:44 PM
As much as it pains me to say it, I do agree with Boras on this.

Why? They are not going to jail or being tried in court. If they feel this reports impugns their character, they can sue for libel. I won't hold my breath for any of them to actually do that (although, more than a few will cry and say they will at first).

Thomes Forearm
12-13-2007, 12:45 PM
Anyone wanting a laugh should tune into ESPN's special report. They are in full COA and mourning mode. Gammons says it would be a shame if Clemens and Pettite go down because of this. Tim Kurgen or whatever his name is, just went on about how it isn't the media's fault for not seeing this problem. Steve Phillips is saying he suspected players were on PEDs but he had nowhere to go. Poor Steve.

Not to hijack, but Tim Kirjan is one of the most ridiculous people I have ever heard speak. He and Lou Holtz need linguistic classes.

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 12:47 PM
MLB, Players, Agents, ESPN, etc...will be spinning this in the players favor in any way they can, of course, there will be exceptions, but get ready for the deluge...

102605
12-13-2007, 12:48 PM
I wonder if Kruk is nervous!? :D:

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:48 PM
Not to hijack, but Tim Kirjan is one of the most ridiculous people I have ever heard speak. He and Lou Holtz need linguistic classes.
Clearly they are on there for their beauty.


For the record, Cansaco is at the press conference. haha

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 12:49 PM
Anyone wanting a laugh should tune into ESPN's special report. They are in full COA and mourning mode. Gammons says it would be a shame if Clemens and Pettite go down because of this. Tim Kurgen or whatever his name is, just went on about how it isn't the medias fault for not seeing this problem. Steve Phillips is saying he suspected players were on PEDs but he had nowhere to go. Poor Steve.

Oh he suspected did he? Poor Steve... :rolleyes:

Denial, it's not just a river in Egypt...

These guys have been getting fat off of reporting on records being broken and being able to interview the players breaking them. They didn't not report this because they didn't have anywhere to go, they chose not to investigate it because they made more money and gained more acclaim by rubbing up to these false idols.

It would be hilarious if it weren't so sad...

daveeym
12-13-2007, 12:49 PM
I heard James Carville on XM give a interesting possability. He said congress can and might use this to make a law that any sporting event ( baseball, football, hockey, etc.) would have to adopt Olympic standards of testing in order to continue to practice inter-state business in the selling of tickets. That would have a far reaching effect on all professional sports in America.
This aspect will be so interesting to watch over the next few months. Congress has been doing the work for MLB and throwing them bones over and over again to give MLB a chance to self-clean. Every step of the way MLB glosses it over and says there's no major problem. If MLB doesn't come out and say something to the effect of, "This report is limited in scope but shows there was a widespread abuse of PED's....." the feds are gonna hammer them.

skottyj242
12-13-2007, 12:51 PM
When I went to lunch, I went to the airport and saw Kenny talking on his cell phone, and over heard him say that the Ed Farmer and that quiet Asian hot dog lady are on the list.

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:54 PM
Get ready, they just handed the report out.

thomas35forever
12-13-2007, 12:54 PM
ESPN calls Bonds the greatest slugger in baseball history?!:puking:

EndemicSox
12-13-2007, 12:55 PM
Roger Cossack shilling for the players...

Madvora
12-13-2007, 12:56 PM
It has been distributed and they're going over it now on ESPN... specifically on Clemens

Trav
12-13-2007, 12:56 PM
Roger Cossack shilling for the players...
And a Canadian actor apparently, haha.


Reading the report live on the air.... haha this is so rediculous.

hi im skot
12-13-2007, 12:56 PM
I'm sorry that I'm not near a TV right now...

rocky biddle
12-13-2007, 12:57 PM
Ouch. They have photocopies of checks from players in the back of the report.

Sockinchisox
12-13-2007, 12:57 PM
Wow, Lo Duca.

Photographed checks paying for roids...

koch44
12-13-2007, 12:57 PM
http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf

Fenway
12-13-2007, 12:57 PM
409 pages

http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf

downstairs
12-13-2007, 12:58 PM
http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf
You rock, thanks.

I'll post "the list" in a second after downloaded.

Madvora
12-13-2007, 12:58 PM
http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf
Wow, great post. 409 pages!!!

Tekijawa
12-13-2007, 12:58 PM
http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf

Good only 409 pages... this should be a quick read!

soxfan21
12-13-2007, 12:59 PM
http://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt.pdf
Thanks for this, really interesting.

na-na-na-na
12-13-2007, 01:00 PM
Frank Thomas was the other unnamed active player who cooperated :o:

102605
12-13-2007, 01:01 PM
Jim Parque??? NO!!!!!!!

p.391

hsnterprize
12-13-2007, 01:02 PM
Some other names...David Segui, Fernando Vina, and a couple of others that have slipped my mind. No White Sox players mentioned...yet.

Chez
12-13-2007, 01:05 PM
Jim Parque??? NO!!!!!!!

p.391

Parque took something to enhance his performance? How bad would he have been without it! He should consider suing the manufacturer. They didn't work!

soxfan21
12-13-2007, 01:05 PM
I like how Karchner talks about how Cubs players offered him some roids (page 232).

Nellie_Fox
12-13-2007, 01:07 PM
:tomatoaward :tomatoaward

Madvora
12-13-2007, 01:07 PM
Greg Zaun "Somber Streak"

manders_01
12-13-2007, 01:07 PM
I haven't browsed the whole thing yet but jumped to the end based on an above post...

Matt Herges on an Express Mail slip.

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 01:07 PM
Kevin Brown
Brendan Donnelly
Tejada
Nook Logan
Hairston Jr.
Mo Vaughn
Danny Naegle
David Justice
Glenallen Hill
Gregg Zaun
Jason Grimsley
Chuck knoblauch
Clemens
Pettitte
Rondell White
Todd Hundley
Brian Roberts
David Segui
Lenny Dykstra
Gary Sheffield
Randy Velarde
Benito Santiago
Jason and Jeremy Giambi
Paul Byrd
Rick Ankiel
David Bell
Kevin Young
Jose Cansco
Barry Bonds
Jay Gibbons
Troy Glaus
Jason Grimsley
Jose Guillen
Gary Matthews Jr.
John Rocker
Scott Schoeneweis
Ishmael Valdez
Matt Williams

downstairs
12-13-2007, 01:08 PM
Hahaha... Jim Parque is on the list!

russ99
12-13-2007, 01:09 PM
Uh, guys... next time you buy performance enhancers, don't pay by check.

The photocopied checks in the Mitchell Report are pretty solid evidence.

DeadMoney
12-13-2007, 01:12 PM
Page 367 of the file. He thanks those who cooperated and helped a lot.

"Frank Thomas of the Toronto Blue Jays"

Edit: Also on page 11 of the file... "Among current players I asked to interview were five who have spoken publicly
about the issue. When I did so, I made clear that there was no suggestion that any of the five had
used performance enhancing substances, and I repeat here that clarifying statement. Four of the
five declined. One of them, Frank Thomas of the Toronto Blue Jays, agreed. His comments
were informative and helpful."

Big Frank, say hello to the Hall of Fame. :D:

jenn2080
12-13-2007, 01:12 PM
Frank Thomas was the other unnamed active player who cooperated :o:


What are you freaking about. The report says that there was no suggestion that him or the other four used.

JohnTucker0814
12-13-2007, 01:12 PM
Uh, guys... next time you buy performance enhancers, don't pay by check.

The photocopied checks in the Mitchell Report are pretty solid evidence.

It was pretty funny to see the checks... stupid people... but I guess this was before there was a big media problem with what they were doing... little did they know they were building a case against themselves!

102605
12-13-2007, 01:13 PM
Karchner said that during spring training in 1999, he observed two of his Chicago Cubs teammates inject themselves with steroids in an apartment that Karchner was sharing with them.

Later that season, Karchner was offered steroids by certain of his Cubs teammates.
:D:

russ99
12-13-2007, 01:13 PM
It was pretty funny to see the checks... stupid people... but I guess this was before there was a big media problem with what they were doing... little did they know they were building a case against themselves!

Oh say it isn't so, Exavier "Nook" Logan...

:D:

Scottiehaswheels
12-13-2007, 01:14 PM
Damn it... Hal Morris? he was like one of my childhood idols growing up because he grew up nearby..

CHISOXFAN13
12-13-2007, 01:14 PM
Frank Thomas was the other unnamed active player who cooperated :o:

That's a good thing, pal!

D. TODD
12-13-2007, 01:14 PM
Parque took something to enhance his performance? How bad would he have been without it! He should consider suing the manufacturer. They didn't work! I firmly believe that most users were of his caliber. Injuries or middle of the road to low level guys that had to "work" harder to get the job done.

goon
12-13-2007, 01:14 PM
It looks like a lot of the guys on some of the guys on the "leaked" list aren't in the report, but still some pretty big names have been exposed.

goon
12-13-2007, 01:15 PM
What are you freaking about. The report says that there was no suggestion that him or the other four used.

No, I think what he meant was Frank Thomas helped George Mitchell with his investigation.

soxwon
12-13-2007, 01:16 PM
someone print the list-i dont have time to read 409 pages!!!

Jjav829
12-13-2007, 01:18 PM
A lot of crappy players named in this. Adam Piatt. Jason Christiansen. Phil Hiatt. Mike Lansing. Cody McKay. Kent Mercker. Stephen Randolph.

And of note, Albert Pujols is not named at all in the report.

South Side Irish
12-13-2007, 01:18 PM
someone print the list-i dont have time to read 409 pages!!!

Relax, dude, they're all buried within the report. Takes forever to skim through it, though.

Yep, lots of big names are missing. Looks like everyone jumped the gun a bit... I for one sure am relived that Pujols is not that list!

soltrain21
12-13-2007, 01:18 PM
Damn it, Tim Laker. DAMN IT!

VenturaFan23
12-13-2007, 01:18 PM
Page 11, third paragraph......:thumbsup:

D. TODD
12-13-2007, 01:19 PM
Damn it... Hal Morris? he was like one of my childhood idols growing up because he grew up nearby.. Hal Morris the Munster, Indiana boy. No power, but a good stick for average guy with a solid glove.

Jjav829
12-13-2007, 01:20 PM
Good only 409 pages... this should be a quick read!

Done! Anyone else finish yet? Good read, but I wish the main character lived in the end. Oh well.


What? :?:

Scottiehaswheels
12-13-2007, 01:20 PM
Hal Morris the Munster, Indiana boy. No power, but a good stick for average guy with a solid glove.
larry bigbie from hobart is in there too....

na-na-na-na
12-13-2007, 01:20 PM
...yes, congrats to Frank for stepping up!

pmck003
12-13-2007, 01:23 PM
Anyone ever go to the Metrodome and hear

Chuck knnnnnnnooooooooblaaaah

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 01:23 PM
someone print the list-i dont have time to read 409 pages!!!

There is no summary list of names in the report. I've been scrolling it and picking out the ones I recognize. It's not complete, but every name in the two posts I put up are in the report as folks who got HGH or steroids in some manner at some time.

D. TODD
12-13-2007, 01:23 PM
larry bigbie from hobart is in there too.... A Ball State guy to. I doubt our own Kenny Lofton will be part of it, but the region guys are taking a hit. No La Troy Hawkins either I suppose.

nysox35
12-13-2007, 01:25 PM
Re: Jim Parque, for what it's worth, it looks like his involvement came in his post White Sox days.

soxwon
12-13-2007, 01:25 PM
no real harm done, most are out of baseball.
they cant suspend someone for hearsay.
there was more evidence on OJ and he got off.

Dolanski
12-13-2007, 01:25 PM
Not to be a jackass but I think everyone here wants to know this: Any White Sox players in the report? Or rather, anyone we would care to hear about? (Jim Parque does not count...)

russ99
12-13-2007, 01:26 PM
I guess the best part is that none of the 2005 Sox are mentioned as alleged users.

Sockinchisox
12-13-2007, 01:26 PM
Jack Cust, I kinda figured.

mcg
12-13-2007, 01:28 PM
Not to be a jackass but I think everyone here wants to know this: Any White Sox players in the report? Or rather, anyone we would care to hear about? (Jim Parque does not count...)
I did a find for Sox in the report and only came across some mentions of the Black Sox, a Frank Thomas quote supporting testing, Jim Parque, Matt Karchener, and Scott Schoenweis... and a whole lotta Red Sox stuff.

Myrtle72
12-13-2007, 01:28 PM
So far, I don't think I've seen/heard of any real surprises.

voodoochile
12-13-2007, 01:28 PM
There is no summary list of names in the report. I've been scrolling it and picking out the ones I recognize. It's not complete, but every name in the two posts I put up are in the report as folks who got HGH or steroids in some manner at some time.

I merged the posts and made it easier to read.

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1747935&postcount=209

It's Time
12-13-2007, 01:29 PM
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/photo/photogallery/sosa500/homer/01.jpg
"See, my name is not on the report".

rocky biddle
12-13-2007, 01:29 PM
I didn't see Wood or Prior. That "leaked" list was mainly bogus.

twentywontowin
12-13-2007, 01:29 PM
If I'm reading this right, Mitchell asked five players to sit down, four declined, and Big Frank stepped up and was the hero.

I love you Frank.

Bucky F. Dent
12-13-2007, 01:30 PM
I did a pdf search of the document the White Sox were only named six times:
Once to reference Frank Thomas.
Once to refer to the 1919 scandal.
Once with respect to Parque.
Twice with regard to Schoewenweis.
Once to identify Karchner, who from what little I have read was reporting on activity w/ the Cubs.

russ99
12-13-2007, 01:30 PM
So far, I don't think I've seen/heard of any real surprises.

I think the problem is that most of the named players were outed by that clubhouse attendant with the Mets.

There's very little else than the usual conjecture and players who've already admitted it.

Not really a thorough investigation, IMO.

It's Time
12-13-2007, 01:30 PM
http://www.deadspin.com/sports/raffyandsosabestbuds.jpg

The faces of innocence.:redneck

ode to veeck
12-13-2007, 01:31 PM
My co-worker thinks Frank's gonna be on it. :(:

Your co-worker is lost

Madvora
12-13-2007, 01:31 PM
I guess the best part is that none of the 2005 Sox are mentioned as alleged users.
Well Carl Everett was in that preliminary list, but I don't find his name in this report.

Juice16
12-13-2007, 01:32 PM
I did a pdf search of the document the White Sox were only named five times. Once to reference Frank Thomas. Once to refer to the 1919 scandal. Once with respect to Parque. Once with regard to Schoewenweis. Once to identify Karchner, who from what little I have read was reporting on activity w/ the Cubs.

I wonder why these players he saw shoot up are not mentioned.