PDA

View Full Version : Countdown until Options are Exercised/Declined....


upperdeckusc
10-29-2007, 08:02 PM
On our team, I know there are options on:
Uribe
Erstad
Myers
Anyone else I'm missing? I know teams have 10 days to exercise or decline the options. What's your guys' predictions on these options? If they're declined, who can/will be their replacements? Me personally, I'd reject all of the options. The only one I'd consider is myers because he IS a veteran for the bullpen that we need, his option is cheap, and he's been successful in the past. I was happy when we got him. But his stint with the Sox was terrible, and I think he'll get declined because of it.

SoxSpeed22
10-29-2007, 08:34 PM
Exercise Erstad's option, and make him first-base coach. Let the others walk.

JermaineDye05
10-29-2007, 09:18 PM
Exercise Erstad's option, and make him first-base coach. Let the others walk.

I wouldn't let Uribe walk until you have someone to take his place at SS. If the Sox let him walk with the hopes of trading for a Furcal or Tejada or possibly signing A-Rod or whoever else and those don't pan out then the Sox will be in a bad spot with no short stop. I'd like to keep Erstad for the bench, but not so much to start.

JB98
10-29-2007, 09:34 PM
Decline Myers, decline Erstad. Keep Uribe (gulp).

itsnotrequired
10-29-2007, 09:36 PM
Decline Myers, decline Erstad. Keep Uribe (gulp).

That is my vote.

Noneck
10-29-2007, 09:36 PM
Doesn't Pod have an option this year also?

itsnotrequired
10-29-2007, 09:37 PM
Doesn't Pod have an option this year also?

Still arbitration eligible.

chisoxmike
10-29-2007, 09:38 PM
Decline Myers.

Keep Erstad.

Maybe Uribe. :dunno: It depends on who you replace him with.

itsnotrequired
10-29-2007, 09:39 PM
Is Erstad really worth $3.5 million?

chisoxmike
10-29-2007, 09:40 PM
Is Erstad really worth $3.5 million?

Kenny Williams makes that when he passes "Go."

santo=dorf
10-29-2007, 09:46 PM
Is Erstad really worth $3.5 million?
Hell no.

...and before anyone brings up the oh so important back up first baseman gig, we could sign Travis Lee off the street for the minimum and he would hit more homers and play better defense than Erstad.

DickAllen72
10-29-2007, 09:59 PM
I wouldn't let Uribe walk until you have someone to take his place at SS. If the Sox let him walk with the hopes of trading for a Furcal or Tejada or possibly signing A-Rod or whoever else and those don't pan out then the Sox will be in a bad spot with no short stop. I'd like to keep Erstad for the bench, but not so much to start.
Agreed on all counts.

upperdeckusc
10-29-2007, 10:08 PM
I wouldn't let Uribe walk until you have someone to take his place at SS. If the Sox let him walk with the hopes of trading for a Furcal or Tejada or possibly signing A-Rod or whoever else and those don't pan out then the Sox will be in a bad spot with no short stop. I'd like to keep Erstad for the bench, but not so much to start.

only problem with that is that means we have 10 days to find a new SS to replace him. i think leverage wise, we're in a bad spot either way. trying to trade for a new SS in the next 10 days, teams will know we dont want uribe and will try to squeeze us for everything we have anyways. i say decline it, and WORST CASE SCENARIO resign him at a cheaper price. i highly doubt someone will throw a 3 yr / 15 mil deal at him. let him sign back for a 1-2 yr deal at 2 mil per. that way thats a good price for a starter with his production OR if we can trade for another SS, thats not TOO bad of a price for a sub/pinch hitter.

Brian26
10-29-2007, 10:25 PM
Decline Myers, decline Erstad. Keep Uribe (gulp).

That is my vote.

I hope this happens.

Myers should be gone. Just because its coming from the leftside, it doesn't make his 55mph no-movement slider difficult to hit.

JB98
10-29-2007, 10:58 PM
I hope this happens.

Myers should be gone. Just because its coming from the leftside, it doesn't make his 55mph no-movement slider difficult to hit.

And the other left-handed relief options (Thornton, Logan), while not great, are clearly superior as well. Hopefully, another year of experience will benefit Logan. Thornton is what he is at this point, but at least he isn't washed up like Myers.

jabrch
10-29-2007, 11:10 PM
I'd keep Uribe for sure - unless we have some other option.

Tragg
10-29-2007, 11:11 PM
Decline Myers, decline Erstad. Keep Uribe (gulp).
I would hold my nose and keep Uribe too the way things look. The usual suspects simply aren't big upgrades. But geeze, 5 mill for Uribe.

wassagstdu
10-30-2007, 07:05 AM
Did I hear correctly that Julio Lugo is making more than $10MM? I think Uribe should be kept regardless, but with a "comparable" like that it is a complete no-brainer. Exercise the option and trade him if there is a chance to upgrade. He is a bargain.

Edit:
Lugo:4-year deal worth $36MM thru 2010 season.

Bucky F. Dent
10-30-2007, 08:17 AM
Decline Myers, decline Erstad. Keep Uribe (gulp).


Unless you can make a deal to replace Uribe before the deadline, I agree.:(:

eastchicagosoxfan
10-30-2007, 08:46 AM
Uribe stays, for the reasons mentioned by previous posters. Myers is done. If he happens to pitch well for someone next year, so be it, but he did nothing in 2007 to indicate that he could. The Sox have to look at options other than Erstad in the outfield. Maybe it's Anderson, Sweeney or Owens, but Erstad hasn't demonstrated in the past two seasons that he's durable enough to play daily. In the last five seasons, he's been healthy in one. He might be healthy in 2008, but it should be for someone else. It's the risk the GM has to take.

spiffie
10-30-2007, 10:32 AM
Exercising the option on Juan Uribe sends a message to everyone that being out of shape, playing lazy, and doing nothing to improve your craft are things the team values, and will give you a raise for. If you're not going to replace Juan Uribe with someone, anyone who will put some effort into the game and actually get on base more than once a week, who the hell will you replace?

Keeping Uribe pretty much says to the fans that everything was fine last year, and that if everyone just relaxes that these guys will win 90 again next year. And I don't much buy that. This is a team that since July 1, 2006 has gone 110-135. And the response is to keep dicking around with which mediocre player to put in CF, or which crappy bullpen arm we'll see get lit up next.

It's not just Juan Uribe. Obviously any shortstop outside of A-Rod would like not have had any impact on the team last year. The problem is that if you don't make this change, where can you change? The starting rotation is pretty much locked in for next year. At least half the bullpen will almost surely be back next year (Jenks, Thornton, MacDougal, Logan all either should be back or are signed for next year). Your 1B, C, RF, and DH aren't going anywhere. 3B will be either Crede or Fields. LF will almost surely be someone in house. 2B will likely be Richar. A lot of the bench is set for next year (Ozuna, Hall, likely Erstad). There are very few places where changes can reasonably be made that might be able to shake this team up. SS is one of those places, and the thought that they would resign the poster child for what was wrong with the team the last season and a half makes me feel like as a Sox fan I'm simply going to have to hope the last 240 or so games were just a fluke.

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 10:44 AM
Exercising the option on Juan Uribe sends a message to everyone that being out of shape, playing lazy, and doing nothing to improve your craft are things the team values, and will give you a raise for. If you're not going to replace Juan Uribe with someone, anyone who will put some effort into the game and actually get on base more than once a week, who the hell will you replace?

Keeping Uribe pretty much says to the fans that everything was fine last year, and that if everyone just relaxes that these guys will win 90 again next year. And I don't much buy that. This is a team that since July 1, 2006 has gone 110-135. And the response is to keep dicking around with which mediocre player to put in CF, or which crappy bullpen arm we'll see get lit up next.

It's not just Juan Uribe. Obviously any shortstop outside of A-Rod would like not have had any impact on the team last year. The problem is that if you don't make this change, where can you change. The starting rotation is pretty much locked in for next year. At least half the bullpen will almost surely be back next year (Jenks, Thornton, MacDougal, Logan all either should be back or are signed for next year). Your 1B, C, RF, and DH aren't going anywhere. 3B will be either Crede or Fields. LF will almost surely be someone in house. 2B will likely be Richar. A lot of the bench is set for next year (Ozuna, Hall, likely Erstad). There are very few places where changes can reasonably be made that might be able to shake this team up. SS is one of those places, and the thought that they would resign the poster child for what was wrong with the team the last season and a half makes me feel like as a Sox fan I'm simply going to have to hope the last 240 or so games were just a fluke.

completely agree. if your the manager, you shouldnt have to formally make a statement to the press every winter that you "hope" your SS comes into camp in shape. *****. cut ties with him and when he realizes theres no market for him and he could be out of baseball, maybe he'll resign a 1 yr deal at 1.5/2mil and maybe he'll take things more seriously. best case scenario he has a contract yr type season, he leaves via free agency and we actually get draft picks for him!!!!

wilburaga
10-30-2007, 10:46 AM
Keep Uribe for sure, keep Erstad and lose Myers.

Non-tender Pods and Cintron. Release Hall. The Sox don't like to eat contracts, but we must get more than 4 extra base hits and 4 RBIs from catchers not named A.J.

We must upgrade our bench, which was absolutely (no pun) awful last year. Granted we had some injury issues, but the Halls, Cintrons, Sweeneys, Gonzalez, etc. contributed nothing. Hopefully Pablo comes back full strength, which will help, but we must bring in reserve help in the middle infield and at catcher.

W

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 10:50 AM
Keep Uribe for sure, keep Erstad and lose Myers.

Non-tender Pods and Cintron. Release Hall. The Sox don't like to eat contracts, but we must get more than 4 extra base hits and 4 RBIs from catchers not named A.J.

We must upgrade our bench, which was absolutely (no pun) awful last year. Granted we had some injury issues, but the Halls, Cintrons, Sweeneys, Gonzalez, etc. contributed nothing. Hopefully Pablo comes back full strength, which will help, but we must bring in reserve help in the middle infield and at catcher.

W

the 8.5 mil your wasting on those 2 bums can definitely come into handy to upgrade the bench.....

itsnotrequired
10-30-2007, 10:55 AM
the 8.5 mil your wasting on those 2 bums can definitely come into handy to upgrade the bench.....

Just because they pick up Uribe's option doesn't mean he is back on the team. The options out there for SS are limited so he serves as an insurance policy. By not picking it up, Uribe walks. He would declare himself a FA and the Sox would need to offer him arbitration for a Type B draft compensation.

spiffie
10-30-2007, 11:00 AM
Just because they pick up Uribe's option doesn't mean he is back on the team. The options out there for SS are limited so he serves as an insurance policy. By not picking it up, Uribe walks. He would declare himself a FA and the Sox would need to offer him arbitration for a Type B draft compensation.
Problem is will the Sox risk signing Uribe for $5 million, then going out and spending even more on a SS, then possibly not being able to trade Uribe, and thus getting stuck with a very high-priced backup SS? I don't see that as very likely. If Juan is resigned, Juan isn't going anywhere I suspect.

itsnotrequired
10-30-2007, 11:06 AM
Problem is will the Sox risk signing Uribe for $5 million, then going out and spending even more on a SS, then possibly not being able to trade Uribe, and thus getting stuck with a very high-priced backup SS? I don't see that as very likely. If Juan is resigned, Juan isn't going anywhere I suspect.

If Uribe cannot be traded (i.e. no other team wants him), the Sox will not pick up another SS. Uribe would not be a backup, he would be the starter.

Look at the FA shortstops out there. There is not a great selection. The Sox don't really have someone they could promote to the job either.

Another option would be to not pick it up and compete for his services on the FA market.

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 11:10 AM
Problem is will the Sox risk signing Uribe for $5 million, then going out and spending even more on a SS, then possibly not being able to trade Uribe, and thus getting stuck with a very high-priced backup SS? I don't see that as very likely. If Juan is resigned, Juan isn't going anywhere I suspect.

aaaaaaaaaaaaaand i don't know why anyone in the world would want that to happen. the angels have like 3 stud SS's, the dodgers have 2. the braves have lillibridge. the bosox have lowrie. go ahead and trade somebody to get one of them. aybar or hu can leadoff, they all play SS, and i'm pretty sure they come at league minimum. if you have to trade a konerko or garland or (preferably) contreras to get them (we should also get another 1-2 players in the deal if its garland/konerko) we'll also be shaving money off the books to put towards our bench/cf/bullpen.

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 11:11 AM
If Uribe cannot be traded (i.e. no other team wants him), the Sox will not pick up another SS. Uribe would not be a backup, he would be the starter.

Look at the FA shortstops out there. There is not a great selection. The Sox don't really have someone they could promote to the job either.

Another option would be to not pick it up and compete for his services on the FA market.

that should be the only option. i doubt there will be a lot of suitors out there for him, and we'll 100% get him for cheaper than 5 mil/yr.

Dont Stop Belivn
10-30-2007, 11:12 AM
another year with Uribe makes me sick. I can see everyones point though on both sides. I just think that Kenny should look at the trade market and then take it from there.

Keep Erstad in hopes that he will be a good bench player, and a last resort insurance policy.

Myers, well, they can do what they want with him. If that includes takin him out back and putting him out of his misery, so be it.

Dont Stop Belivn
10-30-2007, 11:13 AM
that should be the only option. i doubt there will be a lot of suitors out there for him, and we'll 100% get him for cheaper than 5 mil/yr.

for this fact, i am starting to lean towards this option. It just makes the most sense

wilburaga
10-30-2007, 11:18 AM
the 8.5 mil your wasting on those 2 bums can definitely come into handy to upgrade the bench.....

Uribe is on his walk year. I think he'll be highly motivated to come into camp in shape and stay in shape. I wouldn't sign him to a multi-year contract no matter what he does next year, but for a one year bridge to the next shortsop I think he'll do fine. Look, we've won one more championship with Uribe at short than we did during the tenures of L'il Looie, Ron Hansen, Bee Bee Richard, Luis Alvarado, Eddie Leon, Bucky Dent, Alan Bannister, Don Kessinger, Harry Chappas, Greg Pryor, Bill Almon, Scott Fletcher, Dybber, # 13, Mike Caruso, Jose, and The Choice combined.

As for Erstad, he's a pro. I grant he's unlikely to make it DL free through the season, but I think it's worth the risk, especially since it's not my money.

W

itsnotrequired
10-30-2007, 11:24 AM
that should be the only option. i doubt there will be a lot of suitors out there for him, and we'll 100% get him for cheaper than 5 mil/yr.

That will be KW's call. Does he pick him up for $5 million, hope to trade and if a trade doesn't work, fall back on him? Or does he let him go, hope for the best on the FA market (sucky) and if that doesn't work, crawl back to Uribe?

If they go the second route and try to get Uribe back after excercising all other options, I doubt it will be for a one year deal. I would have to imagine there is another team out there than would offer Uribe at least a 2 year deal. The fact that picking up the option now at worst puts the Sox on the hook for just one season makes picking up the option very attractive.

Uribe is on his walk year. I think he'll be highly motivated to come into camp in shape and stay in shape. I wouldn't sign him to a multi-year contract no matter what he does next year, but for a one year bridge to the next shortsop I think he'll do fine. Look, we've won one more championship with Uribe at short than we did during the tenures of L'il Looie, Ron Hansen, Bee Bee Richard, Luis Alvarado, Eddie Leon, Bucky Dent, Alan Bannister, Don Kessinger, Harry Chappas, Greg Pryor, Bill Almon, Scott Fletcher, Dybber, # 13, Mike Caruso, Jose, and The Choice combined.

As for Erstad, he's a pro. I grant he's unlikely to make it DL free through the season, but I think it's worth the risk, especially since it's not my money.

W

Uribe already has 6 years of MLB experience. If the Sox don't pick up the option, he will be a FA.

Huisj
10-30-2007, 11:34 AM
Non-tender Pods and Cintron. Release Hall. The Sox don't like to eat contracts, but we must get more than 4 extra base hits and 4 RBIs from catchers not named A.J.





In Hall's defense, he played the season with a torn labrum. I would expect him to play much better next year if he is at full strength. His career numbers say that he simply can't be as bad as he was last year.

veeter
10-30-2007, 12:45 PM
That is my vote.Mine too.

rdivaldi
10-30-2007, 12:54 PM
In Hall's defense, he played the season with a torn labrum. I would expect him to play much better next year if he is at full strength. His career numbers say that he simply can't be as bad as he was last year.

I could not agree more. I roll my eyes every time someone makes a ridiculous statement about Hall. The guy is a great hitter, just had bad luck with the injury last year.

jabrch
10-30-2007, 12:57 PM
Keeping Uribe pretty much says to the fans that everything was fine last year, and that if everyone just relaxes that these guys will win 90 again next year.

You have a vividy negative imagination.

Picking up Uribe's option really says nothing like what you claim that it says.

spiffie
10-30-2007, 01:07 PM
You have a vividy negative imagination.

Picking up Uribe's option really says nothing like what you claim that it says.
And what message would you take from a move that damn near seals up the roster as almost wholly unchanged from last year? Especially when combined with KW's comments about how much better this team was than their record, and how he didn't see the need for any significant changes? When the words and actions coincide, that tells me they believe what they're saying. So that tells me they're saying this group of guys is a group they believe is capable of winning this division (and that takes 90+ wins). Unless we're to believe an upgrade in CF is enough to take a team that is 105-131 (.445) since the 2006 All-Star game back to the elite teams in baseball.

chisox77
10-30-2007, 01:22 PM
Pick up Uribe's option - he is a bargain, and it is a contract year for him. Most of the time, MLB players (or for that matter), professional athletes in any sport tend to "step it up" in that kind of situation. He could have a solid year, which could benefit the White Sox.

:cool:

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 02:00 PM
Pick up Uribe's option - he is a bargain, and it is a contract year for him. Most of the time, MLB players (or for that matter), professional athletes in any sport tend to "step it up" in that kind of situation. He could have a solid year, which could benefit the White Sox.

:cool:

hahahaha, funny. wouldnt you think he'd bust his hump LAST yr to ensure we pick up his option THIS yr? if his option gets declined bcuz of his poor '07, then what for him? i dont think incentives will help him. he's just a lost cause and should not be brought back for more than 2-2.5 mil.

santo=dorf
10-30-2007, 05:10 PM
another year with Uribe makes me sick. I can see everyones point though on both sides. I just think that Kenny should look at the trade market and then take it from there.

Keep Erstad in hopes that he will be a good bench player, and a last resort insurance policy.

Myers, well, they can do what they want with him. If that includes takin him out back and putting him out of his misery, so be it.
You want to spend $3.5 million on an injury prone player just to HOPE he is a good bench player? That's silly.

Wouldn't it be a lot better to put that $3.5 million towards the bullpen or an everyday player?

santo=dorf
10-30-2007, 05:17 PM
I could not agree more. I roll my eyes every time someone makes a ridiculous statement about Hall. The guy is a great hitter, just had bad luck with the injury last year.
Oh irony.
.262/.297/.377/.674

Just for reference, here's Neifi Perez's career line, and he's considered to be the worst hitter in MLB history: .267/.297/.375/.672
:rolleyes:

spiffie
10-30-2007, 05:43 PM
Oh irony.
.262/.297/.377/.674

Just for reference, here's Neifi Perez's career line, and he's considered to be the worst hitter in MLB history: .267/.297/.375/.672
:rolleyes:
Obviously he's not a "great" hitter, but his numbers against LHP (which I assume would be who he would mostly start against assuming a healthy season) are 275/319/398/715. I can live with a backup catcher hitting 275 with a little pop against LHP in his 40-50 starts.

santo=dorf
10-30-2007, 05:48 PM
Obviously he's not a "great" hitter, but his numbers against LHP (which I assume would be who he would mostly start against assuming a healthy season) are 275/319/398/715. I can live with a backup catcher hitting 275 with a little pop against LHP in his 40-50 starts.
A SLG % below .400 is less than "a little" pop, and that .319 OBP sucks. He's not even good defensively or handles pitchers well, the thing that keeps most back up catchers in the league today.

He was overrated from the start, and he took the White Sox for a lot of cash last year.

spiffie
10-30-2007, 06:00 PM
A SLG % below .400 is less than "a little" pop, and that .319 OBP sucks. He's not even good defensively or handles pitchers well, the thing that keeps most back up catchers in the league today.

He was overrated from the start, and he took the White Sox for a lot of cash last year.
You do realize that assuming they platoon Hall against mostly LHP, and he puts up a line of about that 275/319/398/715 that he would rank the following among AL catchers with 150 or more AB's (thus encompassing many of the backups on other teams last year):

BA: 7/25
OBP: 11/25
SLG: 14/25
OPS: 12/25

If Toby Hall sucks, then 1/2 to 2/3 of the catchers in the AL suck. And to get a backup catcher better than him you're going to spend out the ass. If platooned properly, and kept in mostly LHP matchups he's going to give you average production for a catcher. I would love to find a backup catcher able to give us a 270/380/475 line too, but they are kind of tough to find. Suppose maybe we could steal Kelly Shoppach from CLE, since he's the only backup in the AL I see with an OPS over 750, but they might not let us have him.

santo=dorf
10-30-2007, 06:09 PM
You do realize that assuming they platoon Hall against mostly LHP, and he puts up a line of about that 275/319/398/715 that he would rank the following among AL catchers with 150 or more AB's (thus encompassing many of the backups on other teams last year):

BA: 7/25
OBP: 11/25
SLG: 14/25
OPS: 12/25

If Toby Hall sucks, then 1/2 to 2/3 of the catchers in the AL suck. And to get a backup catcher better than him you're going to spend out the ass. If platooned properly, and kept in mostly LHP matchups he's going to give you average production for a catcher. I would love to find a backup catcher able to give us a 270/380/475 line too, but they are kind of tough to find. Suppose maybe we could steal Kelly Shoppach from CLE, since he's the only backup in the AL I see with an OPS over 750, but they might not let us have him.

...and where does Toby Hall's salary ranked when compared to other back ups? I'm guessing 2nd (I know Blanco gets more.) So apparently it doesn't cost you that much more to find a better back up. You didn't even mention anything about his defense skills.

I wanted Jose Molina (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1429634&postcount=45), who was traded mid season, because his LHP stats are pretty similar to Hall's (His SLG% is 30 points higher) and he is a great defensive catcher. Oh yeah, his 2007 salary was less than Hall's as well.

Crede24Thome25
10-30-2007, 06:15 PM
The only players that should leave are podsednik, uribe, erstad, cintron, contreras. Players sox should aquire Kahlil greene, andruw jones or tori hunter, not sure what else we could get for the rest of them. Hopefully we wont let paulie get away and go to the angels that would be a true heartbreaker for me, but at least we would still have thome. ( only if we could trade kenny williams):D:

RCWHITESOX
10-30-2007, 06:27 PM
Uribe is on his walk year. I think he'll be highly motivated to come into camp in shape and stay in shape. I wouldn't sign him to a multi-year contract no matter what he does next year, but for a one year bridge to the next shortsop I think he'll do fine. Look, we've won one more championship with Uribe at short than we did during the tenures of L'il Looie, Ron Hansen, Bee Bee Richard, Luis Alvarado, Eddie Leon, Bucky Dent, Alan Bannister, Don Kessinger, Harry Chappas, Greg Pryor, Bill Almon, Scott Fletcher, Dybber, # 13, Mike Caruso, Jose, and The Choice combined.

As for Erstad, he's a pro. I grant he's unlikely to make it DL free through the season, but I think it's worth the risk, especially since it's not my money.

W
Show Uribe the door enough is enough. If anything he's become worse in the last two years. He's eratic in the field and is the same impatient hitter at the plate. He has a lousy oba and doesn't hit in the clutch. He pretty much is what he is a mediocre player at best. Please don't tell me that they can't find someone else to play SS because I'm not buying that. As for his being the last SS on a Sox championship team it just proves they won despite of him. As for his 20 hr season he has to have for the most part some of the most meaningless # ever.

jabrch
10-30-2007, 07:04 PM
And what message would you take

Simply put, that there may not be a proven better veteran SS out there who is available, and that they aren't going with a rookie.

soxinem1
10-30-2007, 07:10 PM
I have a feeling that the Sox will sign/trade for a SS within the next few days.

Unless of course Ozzie's 'Going back to small-ball' line was just bull****.

If it does not happen then, it probably will not happen at all.

itsnotrequired
10-30-2007, 07:29 PM
I have a feeling that the Sox will sign/trade for a SS within the next few days.

Unless of course Ozzie's 'Going back to small-ball' line was just bull****.

If it does not happen then, it probably will not happen at all.

The Sox won't be signing anyone for the next 13 days unless they were already out of work at season's end.

mjmcend
10-30-2007, 07:34 PM
How do you not pick up Uribe's option, and then expect to trade for another SS? Other teams will hold us for ransom if they know we don't have another option capable playing at the major league level.

veeter
10-30-2007, 08:54 PM
Erstad and Myers...they gone. Per mlb.com.

itsnotrequired
10-30-2007, 08:59 PM
Erstad and Myers...they gone. Per mlb.com.

No surprises here.

Brian26
10-30-2007, 09:06 PM
Myers should be gone. Just because its coming from the leftside, it doesn't make his 55mph no-movement slider difficult to hit.

Thank You Kenny! :worship:

Bucky F. Dent
10-30-2007, 10:03 PM
Exercising the option on Juan Uribe sends a message to everyone that being out of shape, playing lazy, and doing nothing to improve your craft are things the team values, and will give you a raise for. If you're not going to replace Juan Uribe with someone, anyone who will put some effort into the game and actually get on base more than once a week, who the hell will you replace?

Keeping Uribe pretty much says to the fans that everything was fine last year, and that if everyone just relaxes that these guys will win 90 again next year. And I don't much buy that. This is a team that since July 1, 2006 has gone 110-135. And the response is to keep dicking around with which mediocre player to put in CF, or which crappy bullpen arm we'll see get lit up next.

It's not just Juan Uribe. Obviously any shortstop outside of A-Rod would like not have had any impact on the team last year. The problem is that if you don't make this change, where can you change? The starting rotation is pretty much locked in for next year. At least half the bullpen will almost surely be back next year (Jenks, Thornton, MacDougal, Logan all either should be back or are signed for next year). Your 1B, C, RF, and DH aren't going anywhere. 3B will be either Crede or Fields. LF will almost surely be someone in house. 2B will likely be Richar. A lot of the bench is set for next year (Ozuna, Hall, likely Erstad). There are very few places where changes can reasonably be made that might be able to shake this team up. SS is one of those places, and the thought that they would resign the poster child for what was wrong with the team the last season and a half makes me feel like as a Sox fan I'm simply going to have to hope the last 240 or so games were just a fluke.

Well said. It's time to replace Uribe.

DickAllen72
10-30-2007, 10:10 PM
As for his being the last SS on a Sox championship team it just proves they won despite of him.
That statement is ridiculous.

Granted Uribe has been a disappointment over the past two seasons, but he was a key part of the 2005 World Series Champion team.

DickAllen72
10-30-2007, 10:11 PM
How do you not pick up Uribe's option, and then expect to trade for another SS? Other teams will hold us for ransom if they know we don't have another option capable playing at the major league level.
Yes.

JB98
10-30-2007, 10:12 PM
That statement is ridiculous.

Granted Uribe has been a disappointment over the past two seasons, but he was a key part of the 2005 World Series Champion team.

Uribe's performance the last two years has been maddening because he showed us in 2005 that he is capable of more.

DickAllen72
10-30-2007, 10:17 PM
Uribe's performance the last two years has been maddening because he showed us in 2005 that he is capable of more.
I agree with you 100% on that.

I want to see the Sox upgrade over Uribe. But they better have his replacement signed, sealed and delivered before they let him walk, or they're screwed big time.

Believe it or not, there are worse options than Uribe at SS. Think Cintron or Andy Gonzalez. I'd probably take Uribe over Eckstein at this point too.

santo=dorf
10-30-2007, 10:32 PM
Erstad and Myers...they gone. Per mlb.com.
http://www.liefalmont.com/images/applause.gif

Darin Erstad-OF- White SoxOct. 30 - 9:11 pm ethttp://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gif
White Sox declined outfielder Darin Erstad's $3.5 million club option for 2008.
Some upgrade over Brian Anderson that Erstad was. The 33-year-old hit .248/.310/.335 to finish with a sub-700 OPS for the third straight year and the fifth time in seven seasons. He gets a $250,000 buyout as he becomes a free agent.


Mike Myers-R- White SoxOct. 30 - 9:09 pm ethttp://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gifhttp://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gifhttp://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gifhttp://www.rotoworld.com/images/pixel.gif
White Sox declined LHP Mike Myers' $1.1 million club option for 2008.
The White Sox kept saying nice things about Myers even after some dreadful results in month and a half with the club, but they didn't want him back badly enough to guaranee him nearly three times the minimum. He'll likely be offered a minor league contract or maybe a lesser one-year deal by the club.

soxfanreggie
10-30-2007, 10:39 PM
While his option wasn't picked up, I could see him being invited to spring training...non-roster invitee? If he still has something to give, we can see it them. If not, maybe get him in the minors and use his baseball knowledge, or we could try to get him into coaching. Speaking of which, is Sandy Alomar, Jr. going to join our staff soon? Last I knew he was with the Mets.

JB98
10-30-2007, 10:54 PM
I agree with you 100% on that.

I want to see the Sox upgrade over Uribe. But they better have his replacement signed, sealed and delivered before they let him walk, or they're screwed big time.

Believe it or not, there are worse options than Uribe at SS. Think Cintron or Andy Gonzalez. I'd probably take Uribe over Eckstein at this point too.

No question. That's why I think the Sox might have to swallow hard and pick up Uribe's option. What is it? 15 days after the World Series ends they have to make a decision? That means they have 13 more days to explore adding someone via trade. If it doesn't happen, they have to keep Uribe.

Certainly, there are no viable in-house alternatives. If there were, I believe Guillen would have benched Uribe last season.

upperdeckusc
10-30-2007, 11:30 PM
I agree with you 100% on that.

I want to see the Sox upgrade over Uribe. But they better have his replacement signed, sealed and delivered before they let him walk, or they're screwed big time.

Believe it or not, there are worse options than Uribe at SS. Think Cintron or Andy Gonzalez. I'd probably take Uribe over Eckstein at this point too.

besides Uribe's right arm, why in the hell would you?

JB98
10-30-2007, 11:40 PM
besides Uribe's right arm, why in the hell would you?

That's not a small consideration. Defense is first and foremost when evaluating a shortstop. Uribe's range and arm are superior to Eckstein's. Uribe has also been healthier than Eckstein.

upperdeckusc
10-31-2007, 12:15 AM
That's not a small consideration. Defense is first and foremost when evaluating a shortstop. Uribe's range and arm are superior to Eckstein's. Uribe has also been healthier than Eckstein.

ill take eckstein playing 20 less games a yr and batting .290 and having a .360 obp over uribe's production (if you wanna call it that). and uribe's range? HA! he can barely bend over to scoop up a grounder. he can make backhand plays because of his arm. as far as balls up the middle or hard backhands, he's not above average. 2005, yes. the past 2 yrs, no way.
give me eckstein.

JB98
10-31-2007, 12:26 AM
ill take eckstein playing 20 less games a yr and batting .290 and having a .360 obp over uribe's production (if you wanna call it that). and uribe's range? HA! he can barely bend over to scoop up a grounder. he can make backhand plays because of his arm. as far as balls up the middle or hard backhands, he's not above average. 2005, yes. the past 2 yrs, no way.
give me eckstein.

You think Eckstein has great range?

I'm not defending Uribe. Like everyone else, I'd like an upgrade. But I'm not impressed with Eckstein's defense.

upperdeckusc
10-31-2007, 12:36 AM
You think Eckstein has great range?

I'm not defending Uribe. Like everyone else, I'd like an upgrade. But I'm not impressed with Eckstein's defense.

not exactly. i think uribe is better than eckstein defensively. if you go by fielding percentage, eckstein has had better #s 2 of the past 3 yrs, even tho it was with less chances. but i still think the difference between eckstein and uribe offensively is ALOT GREATER than the difference between them defensively. i agree the only thing eckstein doesnt have going for him is his age, but i'd still take him for 2-3 yrs to let us find/develop a long term answer for the position.

rdivaldi
10-31-2007, 01:44 AM
Oh irony.
.262/.297/.377/.674

Just for reference, here's Neifi Perez's career line, and he's considered to be the worst hitter in MLB history: .267/.297/.375/.672
:rolleyes:

Obviously he's not a great hitter, but much better than the pathetic performance he gave us last year. His skills against LHP are going to come in handy.

Who in the world considers Neifi Perez to be the "worst hitter in MLB history"?

MetroPD
10-31-2007, 05:10 AM
$5mil for Uribe? No thanks, I'd rather be frustrated and angry with a nobody playing SS. At least I know the kid is only getting paid league minimum instead of watching the bumbling, stumbling, swinging out his shoes Uribe again.

santo=dorf
10-31-2007, 06:41 AM
Obviously he's not a great hitter, but much better than the pathetic performance he gave us last year. His skills against LHP are going to come in handy.

Who in the world considers Neifi Perez to be the "worst hitter in MLB history"?
Jim Thome, a whipping boy when he plays against LHP, has better career numbers against LHP than Toby Hall. So if Thome is so bad against lefties to the point where people are suggesting to platoon him, what does that make Hall? :?:

Kaufman, an admirer of sabermetrician (http://www.answers.com/topic/sabermetrics) Bill James (http://www.answers.com/topic/bill-james-1), made his own contribution to baseball statistics (http://www.answers.com/topic/baseball-statistics) by creating the Neifi Index[1] (http://www.salon.com/news/sports/col/kaufman/2003/06/26/thursday/). Named for infielder Neifi Pérez (http://www.answers.com/topic/neifi-p-rez-1), this statistic measures a player's ability to contribute to his team's success by not playing. Introduced as an award that "we, the great whiffing, grounder-booting, sedentary lifestyle-leading masses, wouldn't just have a chance of winning if we were allowed to play. We'd be a lock", the Neifi Index is the difference between a player's team's winning percentage when he does not playing and when he does play. It is called the Neifi Index because when Kaufman first computed it, the San Francisco Giants (http://www.answers.com/topic/san-francisco-giants) winning percentage when Pérez did not play was .929, but was only .542 when he did play, thus giving him a Neifi Index of .387.

wilburaga
10-31-2007, 10:24 AM
Obviously he's not a great hitter, but much better than the pathetic performance he gave us last year. His skills against LHP are going to come in handy.


If Hall had shown some improvement in any phase of his game over the course of the season, I'd have more hope for him in 2008. He was flat out awful all year. I don't recall him making one positive play, and I remember more than a few negatives. 3 baserunners thrown out out of 29. 4 lousy extra base hits, all doubles. 3 RBIs all year. Yes, he was compromised by the shoulder injury, but what makes you think he'll heal over the offseason in the absence of surgical intervention?

W

Nellie_Fox
10-31-2007, 03:39 PM
Jim Thome, a whipping boy when he plays against LHP, has better career numbers against LHP than Toby Hall. So if Thome is so bad against lefties to the point where people are suggesting to platoon him, what does that make Hall? :?:You don't hold your designated hitter to a little higher standard than your backup catcher????