PDA

View Full Version : *Official* "C'mon Timo! Don't do that to us!" 9/5/07 Postgame Thread


Viva Medias B's
09-05-2007, 09:53 PM
We didn't hit; we didn't win.

Brian26
09-05-2007, 09:53 PM
Tigers win.

JB98
09-05-2007, 09:54 PM
This club really cannot hit. There's nothing more to say.

Floyd was impressive tonight. Like most of our pitchers, he seems to enjoy Detroit.

WhiteSox5187
09-05-2007, 09:55 PM
Great outting by Floyd. Offense, well, hopefully we'll see 'em again next April. If not sooner.

soxstarter
09-05-2007, 09:59 PM
OH :raincloud:

drewcifer
09-05-2007, 10:00 PM
Detroit really has hit the wall - and especially against us. Talk about failed hitting. What was the final count on runners stranded?

stl_sox_fan
09-05-2007, 10:01 PM
A glaring stat, other than the lack of offense....was 7 relief pitchers over 4 2/3 innings. I guess we shouldn't be concerned about injuries due to numerous short outings since a huge majority of this bullpen will not be back next year(I hope).

drewcifer
09-05-2007, 10:02 PM
A glaring stat, other than the lack of offense....was 7 relief pitchers over 4 2/3 innings. I guess we shouldn't be concerned about injuries due to numerous short outings since a huge majority of this bullpen will not be back next year(I hope).

You should have seen the Seattle/NY game.... and that comedy started an inning later than Floyd's departure and didn't require extra innings.

Patrick134
09-05-2007, 10:04 PM
A glaring stat, other than the lack of offense....was 7 relief pitchers over 4 2/3 innings. I guess we shouldn't be concerned about injuries due to numerous short outings since a huge majority of this bullpen will not be back next year(I hope).


Not glaring. 5 did their job. Bukvich walked 2 guys.

Tragg
09-05-2007, 10:06 PM
It's September, the offense is horrendous, but it's the same lineup every night. Owens at the top. A low-power, no-obp player in a key power position. How about a shakeup? How about moving Richar to 2, Fields to 5, and iOzzie's veteran hackers at the bottom.
And there's no room for Sweeney amongst this bunch? Come on.

Another nice outing by Floyd.

itsnotrequired
09-05-2007, 10:08 PM
It's September, the offense is horrendous, but it's the same lineup every night. Owens at the top. A low-power, no-obp player in a key power position. How about a shakeup? How about moving Richar to 2, Fields to 5, and iOzzie's veteran hackers at the bottom.
And there's no room for Sweeney amongst this bunch? Come on.

Another nice outing by Floyd.

Leadoff is a power position?

oeo
09-05-2007, 10:08 PM
Timo's clutch.

Brian26
09-05-2007, 10:09 PM
A glaring stat, other than the lack of offense....was 7 relief pitchers over 4 2/3 innings. I guess we shouldn't be concerned about injuries due to numerous short outings since a huge majority of this bullpen will not be back next year(I hope).

I wouldn't worry about the number of relievers used. Ozzie's just playing matchups now and using these guys because he's got a bullpen now of about 10 guys.

itsnotrequired
09-05-2007, 10:11 PM
Timo's clutch.

Coming into tonight, he was batting .143 with RISP but .500 with the bases empty.

TimoPerez
09-05-2007, 10:11 PM
Sorry, folks. It was strictly business.

The Dude
09-05-2007, 10:12 PM
Sorry, folks. It was strictly business.

Go back to New York!:angry:

Hitmen77
09-05-2007, 10:12 PM
A lineup that features Gonzalez, Uribe, Richar, Lucy, and Owens doesn't strike me as one that will win that many games. Especially when the other 4 guys in the lineup were a combined 1 for 18 (plus 2 walks).

At least Floyd looked good.

If Bukvich is in our bullpen on opening day, I'll know we're not serious about trying to be winners again.

Patrick134
09-05-2007, 10:17 PM
A lineup that features Gonzalez, Uribe, Richar, Lucy, and Owens doesn't strike me as one that will win that many games. Especially when the other 4 guys in the lineup were a combined 1 for 18 (plus 2 walks).

At least Floyd looked good.

If Bukvich is in our bullpen on opening day, I'll know we're not serious about trying to be winners again.


What lineup that features the guys, rooks or vets, on the sox this year looks like a run scoring juggernaut (taking into account the massive slumps of the veterans all year long) ?

veeter
09-05-2007, 10:18 PM
A lineup that features Gonzalez, Uribe, Richar, Lucy, and Owens doesn't strike me as one that will win that many games. Especially when the other 4 guys in the lineup were a combined 1 for 18 (plus 2 walks).

At least Floyd looked good.

If Bukvich is in our bullpen on opening day, I'll know we're not serious about trying to be winners again.I wouldn't group Richar, Lucy and Owens with those two bums. I'd throw Paulie with them.

jabrch
09-05-2007, 10:21 PM
Gavin is making a strong case for being the 5th starter next year.

Terrible trade...absolutely terrible

Tragg
09-05-2007, 10:22 PM
Leadoff is a power position?
No it isn't. Why do you ask? I was talking about the 5 hole, where Ozzie shifts the lineup around to get his favorite low-power, low-obp hitter a favorable batting position. Ozzie-offense is a disaster.

JGarlandrules20
09-05-2007, 10:23 PM
So, atleast they didn't lose in 9 innings? There's a positive.

Timo is clutch! :tongue:

I totally forgot Heath was a lefty. He kind of reminds me of Jon Adkins for some reason.

itsnotrequired
09-05-2007, 10:24 PM
No it isn't. Why do you ask? I was talking about the 5 hole, where Ozzie shifts the lineup around to get his favorite low-power, low-obp hitter a favorable batting position. Ozzie-offense is a disaster.

I thought you were still talking about Owens.

JB98
09-05-2007, 10:26 PM
Gavin is making a strong case for being the 5th starter next year.

Terrible trade...absolutely terrible

I hope not. I don't want Floyd anywhere near the rotation next year. I think he should be a candidate for the 2008 bullpen.

santo=dorf
09-05-2007, 10:27 PM
What was Timo's catch on Thome like?

Gavin is making a strong case for being the 5th starter next year.

Terrible trade...absolutely terrible
Maybe for the Tigers. Get back to me when he pitches well in a ballpark that isn't the size of the grand canyon (comerica and Safeco.) Why put so much stock in two starts? I thought performances during September games and garbage time were completely meaningless as evident by Mike Caruso in 1998?

Brian26
09-05-2007, 10:29 PM
What was Timo's catch on Thome like?

I didn't see it, but I bet it was one-handed.

drewcifer
09-05-2007, 10:31 PM
I didn't see it, but I bet it was one-handed. It was, preceded by some patented wagon circling...

Big Jim didn't miss by much, though.

Tragg
09-05-2007, 10:32 PM
I thought you were still talking about Owens.
Both - we put a low power, low obp in leadoff; and we do the same thing in the 5 hole.
Yea, power's not all that important in leadoff, but it doesn't hurt, especially when the obp is so awful.
I guess I can understand Owens since he's young, although the contrast between how Owens is treated (hits like garbage and he keeps his #1 position) v others (get jerked around and publically dogged) is interesting.

But why are at bats in the 5 hole being used on a low power veteran? That's just stubborness.

itsnotrequired
09-05-2007, 10:32 PM
Maybe for the Tigers. Get back to me when he pitches well in a ballpark that isn't the size of the grand canyon (comerica and Safeco.) Why put so much stock in two starts? I thought performances during September games and garbage time were completely meaningless as evident by Mike Caruso in 1998?

So far, the trade is a win for the Sox. Garcia is out for the year (will he ever return to form?), the Sox freed up $9+ million in payroll and got Gio back. Even if Floyd ends up being so-so, the SOx are still ahead on this deal.

Now if Gio comes up and can't handle the majors and Garcia wins 20 games next year, then the trade might not look so good.

Tragg
09-05-2007, 10:36 PM
Gavin is making a strong case for being the 5th starter next year.


He's certainly made a case for making the team. I know Ozzie loves his mediocre veterans be they pitchers or hitters, but Floyd's a lot more deserving than MacDougal, Bukvich, Meyers and several others in Ozzie's regular rotation.

I think he has some Vasquez in him - he blows up and it's not controlled as well as Vasquez' is (he's also not as good at his best as Vasquez). I think he's trustworthy about 2/3 of the time - is that better as a starter or as a reliever?

rowand33
09-05-2007, 10:45 PM
The sad thing about Floyd mixing in a good start in with his normal craptastic efforts is it means he might actually be on the southside next year.

We can do better as our 5th starter. I think we could do better within the organization (Haeger).

I'd consider Floyd in the bullpen and as spot starter, but we want him far away from our rotation

JB98
09-05-2007, 10:47 PM
He's certainly made a case for making the team. I know Ozzie loves his mediocre veterans be they pitchers or hitters, but Floyd's a lot more deserving than MacDougal, Bukvich, Meyers and several others in Ozzie's regular rotation.

I think he has some Vasquez in him - he blows up and it's not controlled as well as Vasquez' is (he's also not as good at his best as Vasquez). I think he's trustworthy about 2/3 of the time - is that better as a starter or as a reliever?

I think we have a lot more holes in our bullpen than in the rotation. Among starters, the only real question is what to do with Contreras. In the bullpen, we need 3-5 new arms for next year. If Floyd pitches well in his tryout here the rest of the year, he should be one of the 3-5 new arms in the 2008 bullpen. They can't all come from outside the organization.

Dealing Garland to open a spot in the rotation for Floyd would weaken the team, IMO, even if Gavin pieces together three more good outings between now and the end of the season.

Any contending Sox team in 2008 figures to have a rotation headed by Buehrle, Garland and Vazquez.

jabrch
09-05-2007, 11:00 PM
Owens is hitting .264/.323 since July 5th. He's hitting .255/.346 since August 11th. He's hitting .263/.331 since July 28th.

There's no reason not to believe Jerry can start for this team next year unless you don't want to believe. He has improved greatly since his first stint up, and is improving every day. Hard work pays off. JO acts like a pro. I am looking forward to watching him continue to develop.

DumpJerry
09-05-2007, 11:01 PM
Sorry, folks. It was strictly business.
Not good enough. I'm banning you for life for conduct unbecoming. We take these things personally. Very personally.:tongue:

jabrch
09-05-2007, 11:02 PM
Dealing Garland to open a spot in the rotation for Floyd would weaken the team, IMO, even if Gavin pieces together three more good outings between now and the end of the season.

Um - wouldn't that depend on what we get for Garland?

Dealing Jon is ok if we make the team better - that would require getting a young position player who fills a hole in the CF or SS.

thomas35forever
09-05-2007, 11:42 PM
Props to the poster who thought of the title for this thread.:D:

CLR01
09-05-2007, 11:47 PM
1.5 back. :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana:

WhiteSox5187
09-06-2007, 12:38 AM
Owens is hitting .264/.323 since July 5th. He's hitting .255/.346 since August 11th. He's hitting .263/.331 since July 28th.

There's no reason not to believe Jerry can start for this team next year unless you don't want to believe. He has improved greatly since his first stint up, and is improving every day. Hard work pays off. JO acts like a pro. I am looking forward to watching him continue to develop.
Well...he has no arm in center and he has no buisness leading off. Maybe he can start and be a nine hole hitter, but I don't think I want Jerry Owens as Plan A for the starting CF next year and I certainly don't want him as our leadoff hitter.

JB98
09-06-2007, 01:04 AM
Um - wouldn't that depend on what we get for Garland?

Dealing Jon is ok if we make the team better - that would require getting a young position player who fills a hole in the CF or SS.

If the rotation consists of Buehrle, Vazquez, Contreras, Danks and Floyd in 2008, we'd better score a ****load of runs if we want to win the division. And we better have great middle relief because you can't count on Danks and Floyd to get you through seven innings.

JB98
09-06-2007, 01:06 AM
Well...he has no arm in center and he has no buisness leading off. Maybe he can start and be a nine hole hitter, but I don't think I want Jerry Owens as Plan A for the starting CF next year and I certainly don't want him as our leadoff hitter.

I agree completely. If Owens is the starting CF and leading off next year, it's hard to envision us contending. If Owens is batting ninth and playing LF, I can live with that. If Owens is the fourth or fifth outfielder, we are in good shape.

TimoPerez
09-06-2007, 01:45 AM
Not good enough. I'm banning you for life for conduct unbecoming. We take these things personally. Very personally.:tongue:

Haha! Sorry.:tongue:

Frater Perdurabo
09-06-2007, 06:11 AM
How did Lucy look behind the plate? Did he have any trouble receiving the ball? How about his throwing arm? Thanks for any insights you can provide.

KyWhiSoxFan
09-06-2007, 08:33 AM
So far, the trade is a win for the Sox. Garcia is out for the year (will he ever return to form?), the Sox freed up $9+ million in payroll and got Gio back. Even if Floyd ends up being so-so, the SOx are still ahead on this deal.

Now if Gio comes up and can't handle the majors and Garcia wins 20 games next year, then the trade might not look so good.

I thought Garcia was a free agent after this year.

KyWhiSoxFan
09-06-2007, 08:35 AM
He's certainly made a case for making the team. I know Ozzie loves his mediocre veterans be they pitchers or hitters, but Floyd's a lot more deserving than MacDougal, Bukvich, Meyers and several others in Ozzie's regular rotation.

I think he has some Vasquez in him - he blows up and it's not controlled as well as Vasquez' is (he's also not as good at his best as Vasquez). I think he's trustworthy about 2/3 of the time - is that better as a starter or as a reliever?

I would like to see Floyd as the long reliever on the team next year, not the fifth starter. He's looked decent coming out of the pen recently and he has the stuff. It is now a question of maturity and confidence.

palehozenychicty
09-06-2007, 08:37 AM
Some awful hitting, decent pitching, and horrible bullpen....Oh yeah, the Sox were playing!

The sad part is that nobody has been held accountable. How Bukvich, Uribe, MacDougal, et. al are still on the team is beyond me. These guys simply aren't good at all.

salty99
09-06-2007, 08:39 AM
I thought Garcia was a free agent after this year.


He is.

SBSoxFan
09-06-2007, 09:09 AM
How did Lucy look behind the plate? Did he have any trouble receiving the ball? How about his throwing arm? Thanks for any insights you can provide.

6 SB's for Detroit, 5 while Lucy was catching. Didn't see the game, but that doesn't look good! He is batting 500 though. :bandance:

wilburaga
09-06-2007, 09:14 AM
6 SB's for Detroit, 5 while Lucy was catching. Didn't see the game, but that doesn't look good! He is batting 500 though. :bandance:

Maybe we should try Peppermint Patty.

W

Lip Man 1
09-06-2007, 11:37 AM
Ozzie had a pretty candid comment on Floyd to Nat Whalen of the Daily Southtown. Take it as you will:

"There's no doubt in my mind that this kid has the stuff. I have doubts that he can show that stuff every outing? Yes, I have doubts about that.''

Lip

JB98
09-06-2007, 12:17 PM
Some awful hitting, decent pitching, and horrible bullpen....Oh yeah, the Sox were playing!

The sad part is that nobody has been held accountable. How Bukvich, Uribe, MacDougal, et. al are still on the team is beyond me. These guys simply aren't good at all.

It's hard to make significant changes in the middle of the season. In the case of MacDougal, the Sox are on the hook for a lot of money. I don't like these subpar players anymore than you do, but the best thing to do is play out the season and circle the wagons this offseason.

Also, KW mentioned that he was extremely unhappy with what he saw in Charlotte this year. If you're going to DFA a Bukvich or anybody else, you have to replace them with somebody. I don't think KW is real eager to reward the mediocre-at-best effort he saw from players in Charlotte this year.

Hitmen77
09-07-2007, 10:15 AM
Did I hear correctly on the telecast Wed. night?

Hawk was talking about how the Tigers might be feeling like they've gone from the '27 Yankees to the '64 Phillies. And then DJ said he was too young to remember the '64 Phillies, but he assumes Hawk meant they must have been a bad team. So, DJ has never heard of the '64 Phillies infamous choke?:?:

I'm younger than he is and I've heard about it. I'm not saying that he has to know every last thing about baseball history, but I was surprise that someone who has made a living off of baseball hasn't heard of that team.