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View Full Version : Zambrano booed off the field.


It's Time
09-03-2007, 04:44 PM
And then the numbskull proceeds to nod his head: "Yes, yes, I hear you". He was mocking the crowd.

This could get interesting. 91M? :o:

thomas35forever
09-03-2007, 04:45 PM
And he gives up eight earned runs in 4 1/3 innings. I knew he was gonna suck again today.

JB98
09-03-2007, 04:51 PM
Derrick Turnbow is still the Cubs best player. If Turnbow didn't suck, Milwaukee would be six or seven games ahead.

TornLabrum
09-03-2007, 04:52 PM
And he gives up eight earned runs in 4 1/3 innings. I knew he was gonna suck again today.

Funny how he turned it all around after he signed that big contract.

It's Time
09-03-2007, 04:56 PM
Derrick Turnbow is still the Cubs best player. If Turnbow didn't suck, Milwaukee would be six or seven games ahead.

Yea, just another terrible late inning loss for the crew. Too many of those over the last month. The only reasons the Cubs win that division is that they have a better pen and they are a better road team.

Can't lose games in the 8th inning when you are up by 3 runs, at home, if you want to make the playoffs.

QCIASOXFAN
09-03-2007, 04:59 PM
They just showed the replay of him blowing off the stopsign from the 3rd base coach and getting thrown out by 10 feet.:lol: Man I hate that guy.

Etownsox13
09-03-2007, 05:02 PM
What a clown...91 mil well spent :lol:

thomas35forever
09-03-2007, 05:05 PM
Funny how he turned it all around after he signed that big contract.
That's probably the lifestyle of the hacks that live in the houses surrounding the Urinal. Once you ridicuously overpay for something with your hard earned money, you slack off and decide you can just do what you want as long as you have a big salary or live in expensive housing.

WhiteSox5187
09-03-2007, 05:06 PM
If he doesn't turn it around soon, the Cubs are in trouble too. It's amazing that as bad as the Brewers have played of late, they're still right in this thing. If they can get hot for just a week, they could put some distance between them and the Cubs. The Cardinals aren't dead either. My money is still on the Cardinals simply because of that series later in the month when the Cubs have to go down to St. Louis.

JB98
09-03-2007, 05:10 PM
If he doesn't turn it around soon, the Cubs are in trouble too. It's amazing that as bad as the Brewers have played of late, they're still right in this thing. If they can get hot for just a week, they could put some distance between them and the Cubs. The Cardinals aren't dead either. My money is still on the Cardinals simply because of that series later in the month when the Cubs have to go down to St. Louis.

If the Dodgers hold on and win, St. Louis is still only one back in the loss column. And four of the five remaining head-to-head meetings with the Cubs are at Busch Stadium.

I think the Cardinals have a better chance than Milwaukee. They have a chance to take care of the Cubs themselves, and the Brewers can't build any momentum because that gas can bullpen of theirs is blowing so many games in the seventh and eighth innings.

Brian26
09-03-2007, 05:24 PM
And then the numbskull proceeds to nod his head: "Yes, yes, I hear you". He was mocking the crowd.

This could get interesting. 91M? :o:

Hometown discount. :bandance:

JB98
09-03-2007, 05:25 PM
Hometown discount. :bandance:

And a full no-trade clause. :)

chisoxmike
09-03-2007, 05:27 PM
Damn, I missed it.

WSox597
09-03-2007, 05:27 PM
A B C

Anybody But the Cubs.

What's that old White Sox song? Root for the Go-Go White Sox, and whoever plays the Cubs?

Works for me.

JB98
09-03-2007, 05:37 PM
A B C

Anybody But the Cubs.

What's that old White Sox song? Root for the Go-Go White Sox, and whoever plays the Cubs?

Works for me.

When it comes to baseball,
we have two favorite clubs!
The Go-Go White Sox and
whoever plays the Cubs!

TDog
09-03-2007, 05:41 PM
Zambrano hasn't won a game since July. Was it 0-4 or 0-5 for him in August? His stats since the beginning of last month aren't that much different from Contreras", except that Contreras has a couple more wins. Do you think Danks has been pitching badly lately? If Zambrano didn't have a reputation as someone who could pitch a no-hitter every time out, as if he has thrown as many no-hitters as a Boston Red Sox rookie this season, there would be real concern instead of a huge contract this season.

It's entirely possible that the winner of the NL East could finish below .500. The teams at the bottom are beating teams on the top often enough. It isn't a matter of these teams not being very good. It's like when the Cubs and Brewers and Cardinals don't win, it's because the other team missed an opportunity. No one from this division deserves to go to the postseason, any more than the American League wild card should come from the Pacific Coast League.

Sadly, though, in October, when the weather cools down, Zambrano could be a much better pitcher.

JB98
09-03-2007, 05:42 PM
Zambrano hasn't won a game since July. Was it 0-4 or 0-5 for him in August? His stats since the beginning of last month aren't that much different from Contreras", except that Contreras has a couple more wins. Do you think Danks has been pitching badly lately? If Zambrano didn't have a reputation as someone who could pitch a no-hitter every time out, as if he has thrown as many no-hitters as a Boston Red Sox rookie this season, there would be real concern instead of a huge contract this season.

It's entirely possible that the winner of the NL East could finish below .500. The teams at the bottom are beating teams on the top often enough. It isn't a matter of these teams not being very good. It's like when the Cubs and Brewers and Cardinals don't win, it's because the other team missed an opportunity. No one from this division deserves to go to the postseason, any more than the American League wild card should come from the Pacific Coast League.

Sadly, though, in October, when the weather cools down, Zambrano could be a much better pitcher.

He won't be as good as Jake Peavy or Chris Young though. Don't worry, the Padres got this.

TDog
09-03-2007, 05:46 PM
He won't be as good as Jake Peavy or Chris Young though. Don't worry, the Padres got this.

I hope you're right. Twenty-three years ago I had Padres World Series tickets with the Cubs up 2-0 in the best-of-five NLCS, and that season worked out, except for the Tigers.

eriqjaffe
09-03-2007, 05:49 PM
Zambrano hasn't won a game since July. Was it 0-4 or 0-5 for him in August?Yeah, 0-4 in 5 starts with a 7.06 ERA. Of course, that followed up a July where he went 5-1 with a 1.38 ERA, so who knows. For there record, Contreras went 2-2 with a 4.00 ERA in August.

Sadly, though, in October, when the weather cools down, Zambrano could be a much better pitcher.Unless he continues to crack under the pressure of being their #1 guy in a playoff race. A guy that emotional is not necessarily a guy you can depend on down the stretch.

JB98
09-03-2007, 05:51 PM
I hope you're right. Twenty-three years ago I had Padres World Series tickets with the Cubs up 2-0 in the best-of-five NLCS, and that season worked out, except for the Tigers.

If pitching wins, the Padres will be in the World Series. As good as New York's bats are, San Diego has better arms both in the rotation and in the bullpen.

I'd prefer to see San Diego finish first and with the best record in the league. That gives the WC to Arizona. The NL Central champ would have to deal with the Padres right away. That's a bad matchup for any one of these three Central teams, including the special Cubbies.

soltrain21
09-03-2007, 05:53 PM
And then the numbskull proceeds to nod his head: "Yes, yes, I hear you". He was mocking the crowd.

This could get interesting. 91M? :o:


I didn't think he was mocking the crowd. I thought he was nodding his head as a "yes, I deserve to be booed."

Frontman
09-03-2007, 05:53 PM
Unbelievable meltdown of a good pitcher. Gets the bank, then forgets how to pitch.

I'm sure the Flubbie faithful will be now saying how it doesn't matter, since they went and got Trachsel.

thomas35forever
09-03-2007, 05:58 PM
Hahaha, look at this quote from a Cubs fan regarding Zambrano:
He decided to rest the last two months so that he's ready to dominate in the playoffs.
:lol:

kittle42
09-03-2007, 06:01 PM
That's probably the lifestyle of the hacks that live in the houses surrounding the Urinal. Once you ridicuously overpay for something with your hard earned money, you slack off and decide you can just do what you want as long as you have a big salary or live in expensive housing.

Stereotyping a bit, are we?

Foulke You
09-03-2007, 06:04 PM
If the Dodgers hold on and win, St. Louis is still only one back in the loss column. And four of the five remaining head-to-head meetings with the Cubs are at Busch Stadium.

I think the Cardinals have a better chance than Milwaukee. They have a chance to take care of the Cubs themselves, and the Brewers can't build any momentum because that gas can bullpen of theirs is blowing so many games in the seventh and eighth innings.
A week or so ago I would have agreed with you but I think the Cards are in trouble now that they've lost Rolen and Encarnacion for the remainder of the season. They have nobody in that lineup right now outside of Pujols and Ankiel. The Cards have also struggled in the head to head matchups against the Cubs. Sad as it is, I think the Brewers are the best hope to catch the special 2007 Cubs.

JB98
09-03-2007, 06:05 PM
Stereotyping a bit, are we?

Why not? They stereotype us.

JB98
09-03-2007, 06:07 PM
A week or so ago I would have agreed with you but I think the Cards are in trouble now that they've lost Rolen and Encarnacion for the remainder of the season. They have nobody in that lineup right now outside of Pujols and Ankiel. The Cards have also struggled in the head to head matchups against the Cubs. Sad as it is, I think the Brewers are the best hope to catch the special 2007 Cubs.

But the Cardinals have a more reliable pitching staff than the Brewers. I know, it's a sad commentary. I haven't checked the overall numbers, and St. Louis might be worse over the whole season. But the Cardinals have pitched light years better than the Brewers over the last month.

thomas35forever
09-03-2007, 06:08 PM
Ballgame.

Foulke You
09-03-2007, 06:09 PM
But the Cardinals have a more reliable pitching staff than the Brewers. I know, it's a sad commentary. I haven't checked the overall numbers, and St. Louis might be worse over the whole season. But the Cardinals have pitched light years better than the Brewers over the last month.
True. The Cards bullpen has definitely been better than Milwaukee's. I trust the Brewers bullpen about as much as I trust the White Sox bullpen these days.:o:

JB98
09-03-2007, 06:14 PM
True. The Cards bullpen has definitely been better than Milwaukee's. I trust the Brewers bullpen about as much as I trust the White Sox bullpen these days.:o:

They are nearly as inept in middle relief as we are, and I'd take Jenks over Cordero any day of the week. The Milwaukee rotation is well below average as well.

Wainwright and Looper have both been throwing the ball well for St. Louis, so they have two more hot pitchers than Milwaukee does. Also, the Cardinals are getting back Mulder and Maroth. That may or may not matter, but keep in mind that the special Cubbies can't hit for **** against left-handed pitching.

oeo
09-03-2007, 06:17 PM
That is definitely a playoff rotation.

JB98
09-03-2007, 06:19 PM
That is definitely a playoff rotation.

There are no playoff rotations in the NL Central, but somebody has to win.

itsnotrequired
09-03-2007, 06:21 PM
Why not? They stereotype us.

Well played.

oeo
09-03-2007, 06:21 PM
There are no playoff rotations in the NL Central, but somebody has to win.

Somebody in the NL Central has to win in the postseason? :?:

I said playoff rotation.

JB98
09-03-2007, 06:24 PM
Somebody in the NL Central has to win in the postseason? :?:

I said playoff rotation.

I don't even know what you're talking about, so forget I said anything.

oeo
09-03-2007, 06:34 PM
I don't even know what you're talking about, so forget I said anything.

I said the Cubs do not have a playoff rotation. Cubs fans think they're going all the way...they're not going all the way with that rotation. Then you brought up the NL Central for some reason. :?: I realize no one in the Central has a good rotation, and the Flubs may very well be the team that wins it because of that...but they won't win in the postseason with that rotation.

QCIASOXFAN
09-03-2007, 06:42 PM
I said the Cubs do not have a playoff rotation. Cubs fans think they're going all the way...they're not going all the way with that rotation. Then you brought up the NL Central for some reason. :?: I realize no one in the Central has a good rotation, and the Flubs may very well be the team that wins it because of that...but they won't win in the postseason with that rotation.
So basically your saying that inside the Central they are the best but when if you stack them up with team from the East or West they are mediocre. I buy this 100%.http://i1.tinypic.com/5ymecnq.gif

StillMissOzzie
09-03-2007, 07:13 PM
Funny how he turned it all around after he signed that big contract.

Steve Stone was pretty funny last week. He said Zambrano's biggest concern was going to be whether he was filthy rich (with the "hometown discount") or obscenely rich (getting a nine figure deal).

Nice problem to have...

SMO
:rolleyes:

DumpJerry
09-03-2007, 07:46 PM
On The Score tonight, it was pointed out that the Cubs have not done it at all against the playoff contending teams from the NL East and NL West, only against the NL Central.

Does not bode for a fun September for Cub fans.

robertks61
09-03-2007, 07:47 PM
The Cub TV announcers justified the booing saying that there was also booing happening in Milwaukee & St. Louis today due to poor play...........

SOXSINCE'70
09-03-2007, 07:54 PM
And then the numbskull proceeds to nod his head: "Yes, yes, I hear you". He was mocking the crowd.

This could get interesting. 91M? :o:


:jaime

"Stop stealing my moves,damn it!!
And nobody ever paid me 91 mil for
not being able to pitch under pressure.":D:

It's Time
09-03-2007, 08:21 PM
Zambrano was quoted as saying "they (fans) are supposed to be a family and that when times are tough, family needs to be there. I'll remember the boo's when things start to go well".

He also said that he thought Cubs fans were the best in Baseball, now he see's it that they only care about themselves.

Wow! This is one arrogant dude. Yea, Carlos, tell everyone before the season you are going to win the Cy Young, pitch like **** in a pennant drive, sign a 91M deal, blow off a stop sign rounding 3rd today and you want to feel the love?

:rolleyes:

WhiteSox5187
09-03-2007, 08:27 PM
Zambrano was quoted as saying "they (The Cubs and their fans) are supposed to be a family and that when times are tough, family needs to be there. I'll remember the boo's when things start to go well".

He also said that he thought Cubs fans were the best in Baseball, now he see's it that they only care about themselves.

Wow! This is one arrogant dude. Yea, Carlos, tell everyone before the season you are going to win the Cy Young, pitch like **** in a pennant drive, sign a 91M deal, blow off a stop sign rounding 3rd today and you want to feel the love?

:rolleyes:
:woo-woo
"Woo Carlos! I need some money! C'mon now, I'm family!"

DrCrawdad
09-03-2007, 08:30 PM
It was stupid to begin with, but Cubbie fans have forfeited the right to ever refer to the '05 as "lucky."

It's Time
09-03-2007, 08:37 PM
These 2004 Cubs are starting to smell like that 2004 team, did they not blow the division title in the final week of 2004? Actually, this might be worse. IIRC, that team blamed the MEDIA for picking on them. Zambrano, is now blaming the fans.

Just what you need in a close race down the stretch, Carlos. Calling out the fans will do wonders for you.

I see this blowing up the Cubs playoff chances. This guy has let the fans in his head and I EXPECT him to implode if that is indeed the case.

Grzegorz
09-03-2007, 08:39 PM
Does not bode for a fun September for Cub fans.

In this wacky world I'll believe the Cubs are out of it the day they are eliminated.

Only then will I 'celebrate'.

chisoxmike
09-03-2007, 08:39 PM
Sox fans booed the team in '05.

It's Time
09-03-2007, 08:42 PM
Sox fans booed the team in '05.

Now we just laugh at the 07 model. :redneck


As far as Zambrano, did he expect a standing ovation? :?:

WhiteSox5187
09-03-2007, 08:42 PM
These 2004 Cubs are starting to smell like that 2004 team, did they not blow the division title in the final week of 2004? Actually, this might be worse. IIRC, that team blamed the MEDIA for picking on them. Zambrano, is now blaming the fans.

Just what you need in a close race down the stretch, Carlos. Calling out the fans will do wonders for you.

I see this blowing up the Cubs playoff chances. This guy has let the fans in his head and I EXPECT him to implode if that is indeed the case.
In 2004 the Cardinals ran away with the division, the Cubs were up 1 1/2 games in the wild card with a week to go playing the likes of the lowly Mets, Pirates and then the Braves to close the season. As I recall, they didn't win a single game that week.

JB98
09-03-2007, 08:59 PM
In 2004 the Cardinals ran away with the division, the Cubs were up 1 1/2 games in the wild card with a week to go playing the likes of the lowly Mets, Pirates and then the Braves to close the season. As I recall, they didn't win a single game that week.

I believe it was the Reds, not the Pirates. Cincinnati kicked the Cubbies' ass three straight at Wrigley the last week of the season, and that was all she wrote.

TDog
09-03-2007, 09:07 PM
Zambrano was quoted as saying "they (fans) are supposed to be a family and that when times are tough, family needs to be there. I'll remember the boo's when things start to go well".

He also said that he thought Cubs fans were the best in Baseball, now he see's it that they only care about themselves.

Wow! This is one arrogant dude. Yea, Carlos, tell everyone before the season you are going to win the Cy Young, pitch like **** in a pennant drive, sign a 91M deal, blow off a stop sign rounding 3rd today and you want to feel the love?

:rolleyes:

Does he now, with that big-time contract extension, have the right to demand a trade to a city with better fans? If so, the worst that can happen to him is free agency without the need to concede the hometown discount.

I was in London the last two weeks of September 2004. I checked on the Internet while I was there and was depressed to see the Cubs had what appeared to be an insurmountable wild card lead. I got back to the country on a Saturday night and on Sunday morning at my hotel in San Francisco saw the good news about the Cubs being eliminated.

Do people still here Cubs fans confidently talking about the World Series this year?

It's Time
09-03-2007, 09:22 PM
Do people still here Cubs fans confidently talking about the World Series this year?

Not the ones I know. I think that the real fans understand that if they are good enough to get in, they realize that the mediocre NL central was the big reason.

This Cubs team is just a decent team in a bad division. End of story.

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 09:24 PM
That's probably the lifestyle of the hacks that live in the houses surrounding the Urinal. Once you ridicuously overpay for something with your hard earned money, you slack off and decide you can just do what you want as long as you have a big salary or live in expensive housing.

What does this have to do with Zambrano? The property value is high there because it is a desirable neighborhood to live in.

I can't find a smiley that looks jealous, so this banana will have to dance to illustrate my point. :bandance:

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 09:28 PM
Do people still hear Cubs fans confidently talking about the World Series this year?

They talk this way every year. This will be the 99th time in a row that they are wrong.

JB98
09-03-2007, 09:29 PM
What does this have to do with Zambrano? The property value is high there because it is a desirable neighborhood to live in.

I can't find a smiley that looks jealous, so this banana will have to dance to illustrate my point. :bandance:

Personally, I don't even want to visit the North Side. I'd rather shoot my dog than live there. That's a part of Chicago that I don't identify with in the least.

Different strokes for different folks. Assuming that other people want what you have, want to live where you do and want to be just like you, that is stereotypic North Side behavior and stereotypic Cub fan behavior.

WizardsofOzzie
09-03-2007, 10:12 PM
Actual Cub fan thoughts on the signing of Zambrano on August 17th

PHENOMENAL!! What a great deal. Amazing!Crisis averted.$91.5 is a lot to guarantee to any pitcher. If the Cubs had to do it, I'm glad it's Z though.Really good players make alot of money. I'm glad he's locked up tooActual Cub fan thoughts on Zambrano after today
Says Cubs fans only think about themselves by booing him. Screw you Zwe shouldn't have signed Z. i guess it's time to start the move to run him out of town, should be funJust for turning on the fans, Zambrano should be booed his next start. Can't believe Hendry gave so much money to this guy.
Here's how I look at it. There are plenty of horrendous teams out there that never hear boos. Wanna know why? Because their fans no longer care. This team has the most pathetic fanbase in the history of sports. They should start giving out windsocks for every game. I'm at a loss for words how truly sad Cubs fans are and feel bad for the few real Cub fans out there that are lumped in with these boneheads

Mercy!
09-03-2007, 10:13 PM
Tap, tap, kiss, kiss, point to the sky. I got me some schadenfreude.

Standing Ovation
09-03-2007, 10:17 PM
Assuming that other people want what you have, want to live where you do and want to be just like you, that is stereotypic North Side behavior and stereotypic Cub fan behavior.

His point was a desirable place that justifies the housing prices . It's not an "assumption" that people want to live there, if people are actually paying those prices...to live there.

ChiSoxGirl
09-03-2007, 10:22 PM
Actual Cub fan thoughts on the signing of Zambrano on August 17th

Actual Cub fan thoughts on Zambrano after today

This team has the most pathetic fanbase in the history of sports. They should start giving out windsocks for every game. I'm at a loss for words how truly sad Cubs fans are and feel bad for the few real Cub fans out there that are lumped in with these boneheads

:roflmao:! I saw Zambrano mimic the fans who were booing him this afternoon and couldn't believe that a Major League ballplayer was actually doing that. But then I considered what team, and more specifically, what player I was watching and it made complete sense. :tongue:

kobo
09-03-2007, 10:23 PM
Actual Cub fan thoughts on the signing of Zambrano on August 17th

Actual Cub fan thoughts on Zambrano after today

This team has the most pathetic fanbase in the history of sports. They should start giving out windsocks for every game. I'm at a loss for words how truly sad Cubs fans are and feel bad for the few real Cub fans out there that are lumped in with these boneheads
You know people on this board would do the same damn thing if it was a Sox player in the role of Zambrano. This type of behavior is not limited to Cubs fans.

IlliniSox4Life
09-03-2007, 10:26 PM
Cubs fans have to realize that part of the thing that makes Z good when he is on is his instability and emotions. They have to take the good (when he looks like an ace) with the bad (his last few starts). It's part of the package. To boo a guy who is that emotionally unstable after a few bad starts when he has pretty much been your best pitcher the last 5-10 years is ridiculous. They deserve whatever the result of this is.

I'm not saying Z should shoulder no blame, but I'm not surprised by his reaction today. Maybe a little bit by how publicly he made his feelings known, but even if he hadn't said it to reporters, you have to know it would piss him off.

WizardsofOzzie
09-03-2007, 10:28 PM
You know people on this board would do the same damn thing if it was a Sox player in the role of Zambrano. This type of behavior is not limited to Cubs fans.
Maybe I haven't been to enough games, maybe I went to the wrong games but I've never seen our crowd boo someone off the field (at least the majority of the crowd....there's always a few dolts)

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 10:30 PM
schadenfreude.



This word perfectly describes how I feel about the events at Wrigley Field today. It's the best German import since... http://youtube.com/watch?v=v1wG9g1wjSA&mode=related&search=

IlliniSox4Life
09-03-2007, 10:30 PM
You know people on this board would do the same damn thing if it was a Sox player in the role of Zambrano. This type of behavior is not limited to Cubs fans.

I agree. I would put more merit into those arguments if you had a long list of people who "loved" the signing then admitting to hating Zambrano after today, but the fact is there are millions of Cubs fans and any number of them are going to be passionate one way or another on a subject to post on a message board. If you know enough of the people on this board, you know there are certain ones who flip-flop on every subject, others who only post when it's negative, others who only post when it is positive, and others that are just insane. Plus more who post jokingly that would be taken out of context by somebody who doesn't know the inside joke.

IlliniSox4Life
09-03-2007, 10:31 PM
Maybe I haven't been to enough games, maybe I went to the wrong games but I've never seen our crowd boo someone off the field (at least the majority of the crowd....there's always a few dolts)

I think he meant in reference to the flip-flopping on opinions regarding re-signing Zambrano, and not the booing, but I could be wrong.

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 10:38 PM
As much as I would like to think he's actually this bad, Zambrano consistently pitches over 200 innings and his career ERA is 3.41.

kobo
09-03-2007, 10:38 PM
I think he meant in reference to the flip-flopping on opinions regarding re-signing Zambrano, and not the booing, but I could be wrong.
You are correct, sir.

Domeshot17
09-03-2007, 10:43 PM
Maybe I haven't been to enough games, maybe I went to the wrong games but I've never seen our crowd boo someone off the field (at least the majority of the crowd....there's always a few dolts)

Are you serious?!?! We boo'd Cotts off the field for a month last year, Contreras early on everytime he got shelled too. Booing is whjat fans do. You cant limit it to 1 team. Zambrano deserved it today, but don't play the holier than thou card because our fans do it too. I mean how many times did Cotts come in last year make a 2 run deficit a 4 run deficit in 3 pitches get pulled and get boo'd out of the stadium. Marte had it in 2005.

:whiner::whiner::whiner::whiner::whiner:And to Zambrano and his comments :whiner::whiner::whiner::whiner::whiner:

It's Time
09-03-2007, 10:46 PM
Maybe I haven't been to enough games, maybe I went to the wrong games but I've never seen our crowd boo someone off the field (at least the majority of the crowd....there's always a few dolts)

:?: Ever hear of Frank Thomas? Now obviously he is not a pitcher and didn't have to take the long walk from the mound to the dugout, however, he was booed pretty heavily for a time.

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 10:47 PM
:?: Ever hear of Frank Thomas? Now obviously he is not a pitcher and didn't have to take the long walk from the mound to the dugout, however, he was boo'd pretty heavily for a time.

Or Marte

WizardsofOzzie
09-03-2007, 10:50 PM
:?: Ever hear of Frank Thomas? Now obviously he is not a pitcher and didn't have to take the long walk from the mound to the dugout, however, he was boo'd pretty heavily for a time.
I just never heard it. When Frank came back in 06 and launched 2 bombs off Garland the fans were still cheering for him and giving him a standing ovation. I just must not have been at the right games, or maybe I just don't believe in boo-ing a player on your own team.

jdm2662
09-03-2007, 10:54 PM
You know people on this board would do the same damn thing if it was a Sox player in the role of Zambrano. This type of behavior is not limited to Cubs fans.

You mean like when the Sox extended Jose Contreras?

areilly
09-03-2007, 10:57 PM
I just never heard it. When Frank came back in 06 and launched 2 bombs off Garland the fans were still cheering for him and giving him a standing ovation. I just must not have been at the right games, or maybe I just don't believe in boo-ing a player on your own team.

I saw Jose Conteras get booed en masse during the first inning of the third game of the 2006 season after walking in a run. Off the top of my head, I can also think of Neal Cotts, Cliff Politte, Damaso Marte, Frank Thomas, and Mark Buehrle getting the same at one point or another all within the past four years.

DoItForDanPasqua
09-03-2007, 11:04 PM
I saw Jose Conteras get booed en masse during the first inning of the third game of the 2006 season after walking in a run. Off the top of my head, I can also think of Neal Cotts, Cliff Politte, Damaso Marte, Frank Thomas, and Mark Buehrle getting the same at one point or another all within the past four years.

To go back even further, Navarro, Ritchie, Koch, Navarro, Wells (Kip and David), Parque and Navarro.

soxinem1
09-03-2007, 11:19 PM
http://www.ketchupisavegetable.net/images/nelson.jpg

'$91 million for Zambrano? Ha, Ha!!!!!'

WhiteSox5187
09-03-2007, 11:37 PM
I saw Jose Conteras get booed en masse during the first inning of the third game of the 2006 season after walking in a run. Off the top of my head, I can also think of Neal Cotts, Cliff Politte, Damaso Marte, Frank Thomas, and Mark Buehrle getting the same at one point or another all within the past four years.
We do our fair share of booing (all fans do though) but I don't ever recall seeing Buerhle get booed, though I'm sure it happened. Did it happen before 2005?

As for the flip-flopping, you DO see that here (look at the Danks-McCarthy trade) but not to the extent you see it with Cubs' fans. I mean look at how INSTANTLY and unanimousily they turned on Sosa and now on Zambrano. Even if Buerhle put together a string of bad outtings I don't think you'd have anyone regretting us re-signing him. And going back to the Sosa analogy, some fans did start to turn on Frank, but it was a gradual process. It's not as if one day he's a hero the next he's a villian which was the case with Sosa. So yea, you see some flip-flopping amongst Sox fans, but nowhere near the extent you see it with Cubs fans.

kittle42
09-04-2007, 12:17 AM
Assuming that other people want what you have, want to live where you do and want to be just like you, that is stereotypic North Side behavior and stereotypic Cub fan behavior.

Wow. What a load of horse****. Should I start spouting off on common perceptions of the south side so we can start that tired debate again?

It's Time
09-04-2007, 12:21 AM
We do our fair share of booing (all fans do though) but I don't ever recall seeing Buerhle get booed, though I'm sure it happened. Did it happen before 2005?

As for the flip-flopping, you DO see that here (look at the Danks-McCarthy trade) but not to the extent you see it with Cubs' fans. I mean look at how INSTANTLY and unanimousily they turned on Sosa and now on Zambrano. Even if Buerhle put together a string of bad outtings I don't think you'd have anyone regretting us re-signing him. And going back to the Sosa analogy, some fans did start to turn on Frank, but it was a gradual process. It's not as if one day he's a hero the next he's a villian which was the case with Sosa. So yea, you see some flip-flopping amongst Sox fans, but nowhere near the extent you see it with Cubs fans.

Great comments. The difference, IMO, is that Buerhle would never claim he is going to with the CY Young before the season, point to the sky after every inning and then tell the world he is going to lead "his team" to the World Series.

Then thy guy proceeds to crap the bed and he WONDERS why he is being booed?

Zambrano is bringing this on himself, as did Soso, which is why they turned.

RadioheadRocks
09-04-2007, 12:26 AM
Great comments. The difference, IMO, is that Buerhle would never claim he is going to with the CY Young before the season, point to the sky after every inning and then tell the world he is going to lead "his team" to the World Series.

Then thy guy proceeds to crap the bed and he WONDERS why he is being boo'd?

Zambrano is bringing this on himself, as did Soso, which is why they turned.


Let's not forget him being a prime example of the "do as I say, not as I do" crowd (remember Zambozo telling Ozzie to "keep your guy (A.J.) calm"?????).

It's Time
09-04-2007, 12:32 AM
Let's not forget him being a prime example of the "do as I say, not as I do" crowd (remember Zambozo telling Ozzie to "keep your guy (A.J.) calm"?????).

Exactly! What's ever more ironic about this is that Zambrano is crying about Cubs fans showing EMOTION, which is EXACTLY what he does to the opposition every time out.

Heck, he did this with his own teammate (Barrett) when he put him in the hospital. He chalked that up to letting his emotions get the best of him. Now when Cubs fans call him out and react emotionally, he cries.

:rolleyes::?:

soltrain21
09-04-2007, 12:39 AM
I know all the Cubs got pretty mad when Tim Lincecum "showed them up" by pumping his fist after a big strikeout on his first start back after going to his grandfather's funeral.


First off, he had every right to show some emotion. Second off, there isn't enough mustard to go around for the Cubs' hot dogs - Zambrano and Soriano.


edit - and Aramis is pretty bad, too.

Nellie_Fox
09-04-2007, 12:55 AM
I know all the Cubs got pretty mad when Tim Lincecum "showed them up" by pumping his fist after a big strikeout on his first start back after going to his grandfather's funeral.


First off, he had every right to show some emotion. Second off, there isn't enough mustard to go around for the Cubs' hot dogs - Zambrano and Soriano.


edit - and Aramis is pretty bad, too.I've had a change of heart about pitchers "showing up" hitters after strikeouts. Since hitters can now stand at home plate and admire their home runs while doing a dismissive bat flip and casually removing their batting gloves, and if the pitcher dusts him the next time up he gets thrown out of the game, then the pitchers need to be able to get revenge by being showboats as well.

Mercy!
09-04-2007, 01:30 AM
Nice turn of phrase in the Trib:

In the CliffsNotes version of Zambrano's afternoon, he blew off a stop sign in the third inning and was easily thrown out at the plate, he walked three batters during a three-run fourth, he squatted on the mound in a deep funk instead of backing up home plate on a two-run single by pitcher Esteban Loaiza, he turned an easy out into a base hit by deflecting the ball with his bare hand, and he began taking off his jersey and gesturing toward his head while walking to the dugout as fans booed him during his fifth-inning exit.

Manager Lou Piniella said Zambrano "is letting things bother him when things aren't going right." Zambrano said he just wants some "love."
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/cs-070903cubsgamer,0,5163444.story?coll=chi-leisurearts-hed

By the by, nice to see Esteban Loaiza do well.

Steelrod
09-04-2007, 01:55 AM
Exactly! What's ever more ironic about this is that Zambrano is crying about Cubs fans showing EMOTION, which is EXACTLY what he does to the opposition every time out.

Heck, he did this with his own teammate (Barrett) when he put him in the hospital. He chalked that up to letting his emotions get the best of him. Now when Cubs fans call him out and react emotionally, he cries.

:rolleyes::?:
Contreras' contract is looking better by the minute!

IlliniSox4Life
09-04-2007, 03:02 AM
I've had a change of heart about pitchers "showing up" hitters after strikeouts. Since hitters can now stand at home plate and admire their home runs while doing a dismissive bat flip and casually removing their batting gloves, and if the pitcher dusts him the next time up he gets thrown out of the game, then the pitchers need to be able to get revenge by being showboats as well.

I don't have a problem with it if they are doing it in response to a hitter being an idiot (either a specific instance or just in general). However, if they do it without any instigation on the hitters part, I think they look like idiot (just like I think if a hitter showboats without any instigation on the pitchers part, they look like idiots). Certain instances are acceptable. Basically if a hitter or pitcher is caught up in their emotions by winning the game or coming up big in a clutch situation, it's acceptable (see Pods and Konerko in game 2 of the WS, or Jenks several times in big games). That's not really showing up the pitcher though, but just celebrating what they accomplished.

Frontman
09-04-2007, 07:00 AM
Maybe I haven't been to enough games, maybe I went to the wrong games but I've never seen our crowd boo someone off the field (at least the majority of the crowd....there's always a few dolts)

I've actually seen both behaviors, from the flip flop and the booing. I didn't like it to see Freddie get booed last year, even though at times he deserved it. I'm just one of those "boo a bad play" for the moment booers. I can't boo someone off the field. (Heck, I normally applaud. Let the player think I'm applauding him, I'm really praising Ozzie for the move.) I just don't like the concept of booing, but I understand it.

As far as the flip flops, anyone mutter something under their breath when Dye got his contract extention then went 0 for 4 a few days later? That's just normal reaction from fans. Heck, I even was annoyed when Mark Buehrle lost a game after his contract; but again, normal reaction.

The Cubs booing Z when they have a 1 game precarious lead in the Central after him going 5 full weeks without a win is completely understandable.

DumpJerry
09-04-2007, 07:17 AM
Come on, this thread is not about whether it is right or wrong to boo a player, but Zambozo's response to being booed for another performance that only Jaime Navarro would admire.

When fans boo a hometown player, it is usually deserved. The guy being booed did a crap job when more was expected of him. What Zambozo did wrong was to start a fight with the fans by saying that Cub fans are not, after all, the World's greatest fans but rather they are self-centered. As they pointed out on The Score yesterday, players never, never win a fight with the fans. The fans win each time. The proper response from Zambozo would have been to acknowledge he ****ed up and will try to get his head in the game for the stretch run so he can be a productive member of the team.

DrCrawdad
09-04-2007, 07:37 AM
When Zambrano signed a $91.5 million deal last month, it was considerably below market value. He said he agreed to accept less money because he only wanted to stay in Chicago and play for the Cubs. But Zambrano's tirade may ultimately lead to a strained relationship that could cause him to waive his no-trade clause this off-season. - Cubune

Zambozo is the highest paid pitcher per year in MLB.

The Immigrant
09-04-2007, 07:57 AM
Meh. The "Best Fans in the World" mercilessly booed Jacque Jones for two seasons, but once he started hitting and making some plays in CF he suddenly became a fan favorite. The next time Zambrano wins a game, which hopefully won't be this year, all will be forgotten. It's just another day at the "Friendly Confines."

itsnotrequired
09-04-2007, 08:21 AM
Zambozo is the highest paid pitcher per year in MLB.

For 2008, yes (as of today). But in 2009, Zito is due $18.5 million and Zambrano is due $17.875 million. Zambrano received a $5 million signing bonus but I am not sure how that is paid out. I believe it was a lump-sum payment right when he signed.

Zambrano gets more per year on average than Zito ($18.3 million vs. $18 million) when the overall contracts are examined but if you count Zito's pay starting in 2008 (when Zambrano's contract begins), Zito will be making $18.67 million a season on average.

VenturaFan23
09-04-2007, 08:36 AM
I didn't think he was mocking the crowd. I thought he was nodding his head as a "yes, I deserve to be booed."

That's what I thought when I saw the game thinking 'OK at least he's telling the fans he had a bad game and is acknowledging it'. But now after reading that he's whining about the fans booing, he's still a big *******, nothing's changed.

itsnotrequired
09-04-2007, 08:38 AM
That's what I thought when I saw the game thinking 'OK at least he's telling the fans he had a bad game and is acknowledging it'. But now after reading that he's whining about the fans booing, he's still a big *******, nothing's changed.

Same here. It looked like he was walking off with a "Yeah, I deserve it" attitude but now it looks as if he is just whining.

D. TODD
09-04-2007, 09:21 AM
I dislike "z" and his antics, but the man has been the horse for the Cubs, and booing him when he struggles is just another example of idiot fans. Yea you can voice your opinion, but it usually just shows the fanbase is fair weather or plain stupid.

RockJock07
09-04-2007, 09:25 AM
This whole thing just makes me happy that MB is the person he is. MB would never rip sox fans for the way they act. When Mark was going through his rough patch in 2006 i don't remember if fans were booing but they had a right to and if big Z wants the booing to stop, try acting like a major-league pitcher, on and off the diamond.

Whenever booing comes up in sports i can't stand it. Fans have the right to boo. I'll boo if if i see a guy not giving full effort or if he makes an bonehead play. Should these players expect anything less?

rocky biddle
09-04-2007, 09:46 AM
These people are idiots. Just look at Jaque Jones. They couldn't get him out of here fast enough. Now he's Willie Mays. Remember how they turned on Sammy Sosa, Michael Barrett? They're sheep.

But anyway, I'm guessing Zambrano will end his slump mid-Sept. and then say that he's been pitching hurt. The lemmings will eat it up and all will be forgiven.

D. TODD
09-04-2007, 09:53 AM
This whole thing just makes me happy that MB is the person he is. MB would never rip sox fans for the way they act. When Mark was going through his rough patch in 2006 i don't remember if fans were booing but they had a right to and if big Z wants the booing to stop, try acting like a major-league pitcher, on and off the diamond.

Whenever booing comes up in sports i can't stand it. Fans have the right to boo. I'll boo if if i see a guy not giving full effort or if he makes an bonehead play. Should these players expect anything less? I agree if he is half-assin' it on the field or makes a mental error because his head is elsewhere, but that's not the case with Zambrano or for Buehrle when he struggled. The booing is just plain stupidity for a guy not preforming well after he has been the backbone of your staff to this point.

Yes fans have the right to boo, but it shows stupidity as a fan. Tuesday night you get rocked and your a "BUM", Saturday you win and your da "man". STUPID what have you done for me lately fans!

Steelrod
09-04-2007, 10:17 AM
I agree if he is half-assin' it on the field or makes a mental error because his head is elsewhere, but that's not the case with Zambrano or for Buehrle when he struggled. The booing is just plain stupidity for a guy not preforming well after he has been the backbone of your staff to this point.

Yes fans have the right to boo, but it shows stupidity as a fan. Tuesday night you get rocked and your a "BUM", Saturday you win and your da "man". STUPID what have you done for me lately fans!
It's human nature and there's nothing wrong with it. You pay your money and let your emotions go. No different than a bad, movie, play.
Even been to a movie where the patrons applaud at the end? It's just expressing their feelings. No one but the projectionist hears it!

SBSoxFan
09-04-2007, 10:20 AM
Can we assume that the Contreras for Furcal rumor is now dead?

D. TODD
09-04-2007, 10:23 AM
It's human nature and there's nothing wrong with it. You pay your money and let your emotions go. No different than a bad, movie, play.
Even been to a movie where the patrons applaud at the end? It's just expressing their feelings. No one but the projectionist hears it! Well I boo any fans for their poor performance as fair weather supporters of their team if when they are struggling you try to pour it on. I see just support the good games of your teams players. Players unlike a movie will have another game to play. BOOOOOOO!!!!! fans.

Lip Man 1
09-04-2007, 01:00 PM
Here’s my take on this entire situation. It’s more of a general comment.

I realize I’m biased and a little slow on the uptake but I simply fail to understand the ‘devotion’ towards a franchise that just in the last ten years or so has produced such ‘memorable’ moments as:

* Having a fan run out of the bleachers and attack pitcher Randy Myers on the mound. Then try to market a slogan "It’s Gonna Happen..." to make money off of same franchise.

* Have drunken fans get into a brawl in the bullpen with the Dodgers.

* Have an individual, a Cub fan, according to his roommate and girlfriend, get smashed at an afternoon Cubs-Reds game then show up at Comiskey Park that night and attack an umpire.

* Have a team ‘blame’ the television announcers for their incompetence.

* Have their ‘superstar’ leave early the last game of the season, then lie about it when clubhouse cameras recorded it.

* Have their ‘superstar’ pitcher get into a war of words with the fan base after being booed.

* Have same ‘superstar’ pitcher get into a dugout brawl with his catcher.

* Have same catcher get into a home plate brawl with A.J. Pierzynski which he started with a sucker punch.

* Have the manager ‘blame’ (initially) a fan who reached for a foul ball instead of his team for a historic post season collapse.

* Have eight ‘winning’ seasons in the last 26 years.

I guess I don’t get it.

Instead of being ‘loved’ by the local and national media and baseball fans this incompetent boob of a franchise needs to be hung out to dry by their entrails.

Lip

esbrechtel
09-04-2007, 01:04 PM
what do you guys think of the cub fan bashing Zambrano post game comments?

Domeshot17
09-04-2007, 01:09 PM
I dislike "z" and his antics, but the man has been the horse for the Cubs, and booing him when he struggles is just another example of idiot fans. Yea you can voice your opinion, but it usually just shows the fanbase is fair weather or plain stupid.

I gotta call BS here too. Im not saying its right, but it happens EVERYWHERE. Especially when he is killing you in a playoff race. Cotts was the reliever of the year in 2005. He was the guy above anyone else you knew would get the big outs in the 8th when we needed it. He was go good Ozzie said he had thought multiple times of moving him to the closers role. 2006 comes, and hes getting shelled, and we are booing him off the field. Its just fans. It happens in New York, LA, Boston, everywhere.


Back to the point, Zambrano needs to, for lack of a better phrase, Grow a pair. You are sucking, you deserve the Boos. Just because you call yourself Big Z and pump your first on first inning strike outs and get shelled innings later doesnt mean the fans owe you a damn thing. The best thing to ever happen to Zambrano will be if his fat ass ever humbles. Because right now he thinks he can walk on water, and is finding out he can sink like anyone else.

D. TODD
09-04-2007, 02:11 PM
I gotta call BS here too. Im not saying its right, but it happens EVERYWHERE. Especially when he is killing you in a playoff race. Cotts was the reliever of the year in 2005. He was the guy above anyone else you knew would get the big outs in the 8th when we needed it. He was go good Ozzie said he had thought multiple times of moving him to the closers role. 2006 comes, and hes getting shelled, and we are booing him off the field. Its just fans. It happens in New York, LA, Boston, everywhere.


Back to the point, Zambrano needs to, for lack of a better phrase, Grow a pair. You are sucking, you deserve the Boos. Just because you call yourself Big Z and pump your first on first inning strike outs and get shelled innings later doesnt mean the fans owe you a damn thing. The best thing to ever happen to Zambrano will be if his fat ass ever humbles. Because right now he thinks he can walk on water, and is finding out he can sink like anyone else.
I agree it happens everywhere and our fans and every other group who boos off a lousy performance ESPECIALLY while in a pennant race is just frustrated and being idiotic when booing Zambrano or Damaso Marte while they are trying to get through a stretch of bad outings. Unless it is through a lack of intrest, lack of hustle, or indifference by the player.

Zambrano lost 4 straight and got rocked,. BOO YA BUM **** YOU!!!! Yea that's your "right" but it's mine to say your weak ass fans that do it, and you deserve the tongue lashing much more then the guy coming of the mound, no matter which team's fan base it is..

TDog
09-04-2007, 02:15 PM
It's human nature and there's nothing wrong with it. You pay your money and let your emotions go. No different than a bad, movie, play.
Even been to a movie where the patrons applaud at the end? It's just expressing their feelings. No one but the projectionist hears it!

I only go to movies I'm predisposed to see. The same applies for live theater. Baseball is the unexpected. I've seen Sox fans boo, of course. The cheers for Frank Thomas became louder and the boos diminished to nill when he left the team.

My favorite White Sox booing incident illustrates, though, that Sox fans are more thoughtful about booing if that's possible. On the hot, overcast Sunday afternoon before the 1974 All-Star break, with the Sox having pulled to within four games of the A's with a first-game win over the Brewers, Stan Bahnsen took a one-hitter and a 3-0 lead into the ninth. He gave up singles to the first two hitters before getting Robin Yount to fly out. Chuck Tanner went out to the mound to bring in Terry Forster to close it out. The fans gave Bahnsen a standing ovation as he came back to the dugout. Still standing, they booed Tanner who followed him. Tanner smiled and tipped his cap, as if to acknowlege he knew he made an unpopular move, but did it to try to win the game. The gesture turned the boos into applause.

Forster struck out John Briggs. After a single and a walk, he gave up a home run to Deron Johnson. So ended the Sox hopes in 1974. But the fans didn't boo after the home run. They just sat in stunned silence.

Domeshot17
09-04-2007, 02:20 PM
I agree it happens everywhere and our fans and every other group who boos off a lousy performance ESPECIALLY while in a pennant race is just frustrated and being idiotic when booing Zambrano or Damaso Marte while they are trying to get through a stretch of bad outings. Unless it is through a lack of intrest, lack of hustle, or indifference by the player.

Zambrano lost 4 straight and got rocked,. BOO YA BUM **** YOU!!!! Yea that's your "right" but it's mine to say your weak ass fans that do it, and you deserve the tongue lashing much more then the guy coming of the mound, no matter which team's fan base it is..


Oh yah, Im not saying its RIGHT by any means, but i took the first comment as a knock at flavor of the week cub fans. While they are out there, its not an entire base. I do think the Cubs have the least knowledgeable fan base in the NL, but I also will say it happens to every team.

I agree about the booing. I boo when Uribe takes his sweet ass time on a ground ball then fires a dart past Paulie. Thats laziness. But when Zambrano or Cotts or Buehlre or Contreras or anyone is getting boo'd on the mound, odds are it is only going to make matters worse. Cotts especially was such a head case in 06. In 2005 he came out with this look like you're screwed. In 2006 he came out with the look of I'm Screwed.

thomas35forever
09-04-2007, 02:41 PM
I'll admit it. I was at the opener of the last home series during the 2005 regular season and booed when Ozzie brought in Marte, who sucked as usual. I also booed him as he was leaving the field. I'm sure it was because I knew he was having a horrendous year and thought that it meant sure defeat. The Sox lost in eleven innings, but he wasn't charged with the loss. I would never boo a guy like Buerhle or Vazquez because they've pretty much been the only decent guys in the rotation this year. I can sort of understand why the Cubs fans would boo Big Z, seeing how he hasn't won a game since July. I guess what troubles me about it is that he said he was going to lead his team to a World Series victory and the fans answered his calling. As I'm typing this, I'm starting to realize more that these fans are flip-flopping. The Cubs have never been my primary team, so I wouldn't know what it's like a treat a pitcher like Zambrano.

skottyj242
09-04-2007, 02:42 PM
It's entirely possible that the winner of the NL East could finish below .500.
.

What the hell are you talking about? The Mets are 16 games over.

thomas35forever
09-04-2007, 02:43 PM
What the hell are you talking about? The Mets are 16 games over.
I'm sure he meant the NL Central.

Lip Man 1
09-04-2007, 02:49 PM
My attitude on booing has been consistent. As long as it's not racial or vulgar, fans have the right to boo for bad performance.

This isn't high school or college athletes we're talking about, they are highly paid professionals.

It comes with the territory.

If they can't handle it (and as has been noted some Sox players couldn't recently) then they need to try another profession or request a trade to another city.

Besides if they think Chicago is bad, they haven't been to New York or Philly. (And that includes the media...)

Lip

McCuddy
09-04-2007, 02:57 PM
What Lip said. I don't think that booing a lousy performance is "weak-ass" or whatever got thrown around.

The lyrics to Harry Simeone's "It's a Beautiful Day for a Ball Game" clearly state: "We're gonna cheer/and boo/and raise a hullabaloo at the ballgame today."

(Note: I am less comfortable with hullabaloo-raising.)

WizardsofOzzie
09-04-2007, 03:05 PM
Whether or not he deserves to be booed is debatable but I'm just shocked that he's being boo-ed by the same people that danced in the streets and signed up to have their WS parade the day Zambrano was re-signed. Yeah, he's pitching like crap, but aside from one month this season he's pretty much pitched like crap all season. The Cubbie tide went from treating the man like Steve Bartman to Ron Santo when he had that one dominant month and then back to the Bartman treatment after he started to regress. Yeah, he's getting paid alot of money to pitch well, which he's not. He constantly runs his mouth and doesn't back it up all the time, but if you ask me the only thing that has changed about Zambrano between April and now is his salary, which was foolishly given to him IMO. I don't see why the Cubs fans can flip flop back and forth so much on a guy who they claim to be their savior one month and want to run him out of town the next. Even when Buehrle sucked it up last year, I didn't know too many people who wanted him gone.....or maybe I just didn't read those threads

tebman
09-04-2007, 03:26 PM
There are two different topics in this thread: Zambrano's behavior and the appropriateness of booing your team's players.

On the first topic, I think Zambrano is a self-absorbed clown with a million-dollar arm and a ten-cent head. When he gets consistently rocked and then does stupid things like run through a stop sign into a certain out, he owes his fans an apology and not a petulant rant about looking for love. The fans only care about themselves, he says. Well, yeah. They're the ones who buy the tickets and support the sponsors that pay his salary.

Dolt.

On the second topic, I think fans have every right to boo poor performance. I've done my share, and consider myself a knowledgeable enough fan to know when one of the players on my team screws up, as opposed to being the victim of a bad hop, a good at-bat by the opposition, or some other event that wasn't brought on by a dumb mistake or lack of effort.

I'm certainly no Cub fan, but I've got to agree that the ones who booed Zambrano were on the mark.

Mercy!
09-04-2007, 04:27 PM
Just imagine if Stravinsky had gone into his shell after the reception of Le Sacre du Primtemps at its premiere.

voodoochile
09-04-2007, 04:43 PM
Just imagine if Stravinsky had gone into his shell after the reception of Le Sacre du Primtemps at its premiere.

Is that Igor or EYE-gor? Either way it begs the question, separated at birth? You decide...

http://mydivx.lihoman.ru/order/direct/brooks/brooks.frankenstein.jpg

http://assets.espn.go.com/i/mlb/profiles/players/65x90/6559.jpg

TDog
09-04-2007, 05:51 PM
What the hell are you talking about? The Mets are 16 games over.

Excuse the flashback to the 1973 season when the Cubs were part of a crappy NL East won by the 3-games-over-.500 Mets.

That year the 7-games-under-.500 Cubs finished just 5 games out.

Dick Allen
09-04-2007, 06:03 PM
I only go to movies I'm predisposed to see. The same applies for live theater. Baseball is the unexpected. I've seen Sox fans boo, of course. The cheers for Frank Thomas became louder and the boos diminished to nill when he left the team.

My favorite White Sox booing incident illustrates, though, that Sox fans are more thoughtful about booing if that's possible. On the hot, overcast Sunday afternoon before the 1974 All-Star break, with the Sox having pulled to within four games of the A's with a first-game win over the Brewers, Stan Bahnsen took a one-hitter and a 3-0 lead into the ninth. He gave up singles to the first two hitters before getting Robin Yount to fly out. Chuck Tanner went out to the mound to bring in Terry Forster to close it out. The fans gave Bahnsen a standing ovation as he came back to the dugout. Still standing, they booed Tanner who followed him. Tanner smiled and tipped his cap, as if to acknowlege he knew he made an unpopular move, but did it to try to win the game. The gesture turned the boos into applause.

Forster struck out John Briggs. After a single and a walk, he gave up a home run to Deron Johnson. So ended the Sox hopes in 1974. But the fans didn't boo after the home run. They just sat in stunned silence.Geez, I was at that game. Thanks for the fond memories.

thomas35forever
09-04-2007, 09:57 PM
For those who tuned in to the Cubs tonight, Ohman loaded the bases in the eighth with no outs and exited to boos from the Wrigley faithful.

TDog
09-04-2007, 10:04 PM
Geez, I was at that game. Thanks for the fond memories.

I remember that gray Sunday so distinctly. Winning the World Series was incredible, but that that game is our heritage as White Sox fans.

areilly
09-04-2007, 10:32 PM
We do our fair share of booing (all fans do though) but I don't ever recall seeing Buerhle get booed, though I'm sure it happened. Did it happen before 2005?

It was a late game against Minnesota in 2004 - he went the distance, but gave up four home runs in the process including one in the 9th to...Torii? It was sad to say the least.

EDIT: Found it - 9/20/2004. 8.0 innings + 1 batter in the 9th, which was the Luis Rivas homer.

Mercy!
09-04-2007, 10:41 PM
For those who tuned in to the Cubs tonight, Ohman loaded the bases in the eighth with no outs and exited to boos from the Wrigley faithful.
Shouldn't that be, "For those who are waiting for pigs to fly before they would consider tuning in to the Cubs tonight or any other night....."?

Soxfanspcu11
09-04-2007, 10:56 PM
I remember this one scrubs fan that I work with saying that Sox fans had no class because they Boo'd Frank Thomas upon his return with Oakland in May of 2006. He said it was nonstop Boo's and that even the PA guy made fun of Thomas. I replied with a :?:


I then brought my laptop to work the following day, showed him the game on the MLB.com archives, and proceeded to make him look like the jagbag he was.

Of course, not only did Frank recieve a standing O, the Sox also put together an AMAZING tribute for him on the big screen.

Some people, particuarly "those" people just have no connection to reality. It would be laughable if it weren't creepy.:rolleyes:

kittle42
09-05-2007, 01:12 AM
It's "booed" and "boos," damnit.

ZombieRob
09-05-2007, 03:35 AM
Well McDonough had his damage control meeting with "Z" so all is well.He's back to loving the fans and he said sorry .I just feel all warm and fuzzy inside now from his heart felt shallow apology.

slavko
09-05-2007, 09:35 AM
Just to reminisce a bit, when the Bears gave Jim Harbaugh a huge (for the time!) $4M contract, the fans started booing him from the start of the next year and pooped all over him on sportstalk radio. He was a useful, if sometimes inconsistent QB who had his career in Chicago ruined as a result of it. Of course, he later went on to Captain Comeback fame with the Colts.

So, it's the money, what else?

WizardsofOzzie
09-05-2007, 10:42 AM
I remember this one scrubs fan that I work with saying that Sox fans had no class because they Boo'd Frank Thomas upon his return with Oakland in May of 2006. He said it was nonstop Boo's and that even the PA guy made fun of Thomas. I replied with a :?:


I then brought my laptop to work the following day, showed him the game on the MLB.com archives, and proceeded to make him look like the jagbag he was.

Of course, not only did Frank recieve a standing O, the Sox also put together an AMAZING tribute for him on the big screen.

Some people, particuarly "those" people just have no connection to reality. It would be laughable if it weren't creepy.:rolleyes:

Well played sir. I was at that game. He was getting applause even after he took Garland deep. That game had a great finish to with the squeeze bunt walkoff

cheezheadsoxfan
09-05-2007, 10:55 AM
Well played sir. I was at that game. He was getting applause even after he took Garland deep. That game had a great finish to with the squeeze bunt walkoff

I also remember that game very clearly. Wasn't there but recall the broadcast and Frank was treated very well. I think there were a few boos when he hit the second one but still a far cry from the classless Cleveland fans who keep booing Thome.

russ99
09-05-2007, 12:00 PM
The funniest part of this Zambrano meltdown is that it's entirely self-inflicted.

Look at every game in his "streak" and you can point to an incident, be it breaking a bat over his knee, slamming down his helmet and punching the sky after being thrown out on a close play at first, fist-pumping and sky pointing after striking out a guy in the first inning! and now overruning a stop sign at 3rd - that throws him off his game and leads to a big inning against him by the opposition.

This crap from Cubs fans that he's "emotional" and "really wants to win" is so freaking lame. Call him what he is, an overpayed baby with a massive over-inflated ego who just happens to pitch well occasionally - most often when there's no pressure. Hopefully the fans continue to turn on him and his immature act, just like they did with Soso.

The Cubs have really set themselves up on that contract too, since Zambozo has a FULL no trade clause. :tongue: Too bad, cause I'd have loved to see the implosion, if Zambrano ever pitches for a New York team.

BTW - Telander in today's Times equating his attitude with Vick was super-cool! :D:

Foulke You
09-05-2007, 05:25 PM
Well played sir. I was at that game. He was getting applause even after he took Garland deep. That game had a great finish to with the squeeze bunt walkoff
I was at that one too. Frank got cheered the moment he stepped into the on deck circle and then got a long standing O during his AB and even as he was rounding the bases after he hit his HR. Cleveland fans should have taken notes on how you treat a future HOF player who gave you a ton of great years with your team. Jim Thome deserved the same reception from Indians fans in 2006 and he didn't get it.

Frontman
09-05-2007, 05:59 PM
I was at that one too. Frank got cheered the moment he stepped into the on deck circle and then got a long standing O during his AB and even as he was rounding the bases after he hit his HR. Cleveland fans should have taken notes on how you treat a future HOF player who gave you a ton of great years with your team. Jim Thome deserved the same reception from Indians fans in 2006 and he didn't get it.

I even cheered for Frank upon his return to Chicago. (And you all know how I have felt about Frank over the years; but he's our HoF candidate for the past two decades. You got to respect the player, even if you don't like the guy.)

Of course, when he went deep the SECOND time for the night, I was booing. Granted, I wasn't booing Frank per se, I was booing that we gave up another homer.

The way Jim gets treated upon his return to Cleveland is absolutely disgusting.

MarySwiss
09-05-2007, 06:11 PM
I even cheered for Frank upon his return to Chicago. (And you all know how I have felt about Frank over the years; but he's our HoF candidate for the past two decades. You got to respect the player, even if you don't like the guy.)

Of course, when he went deep the SECOND time for the night, I was booing. Granted, I wasn't booing Frank per se, I was booing that we gave up another homer.

The way Jim gets treated upon his return to Cleveland is absolutely disgusting.

I actually even cheered the second home run, but that was enough! And I agree about Thome. Maybe the first or second time back, but geez, Tribe fans, LET IT GO!

chisoxfanatic
09-05-2007, 06:30 PM
I actually even cheered the second home run, but that was enough! And I agree about Thome. Maybe the first or second time back, but geez, Tribe fans, LET IT GO!
That Core of the Core game had it all, didn't it, Mary? Frank's first return to Comiskey in a visiting uniform (the chills of the standing Ovation, as well as him hitting two home runs), game delayed for about 15 minutes due to a squirrel running on the field, game-tying 2-run shot by Mackowiak in the 8th, Ozuna's suicide squeeze, getting Pierzynski in from 3rd, worked like a charm!

PLUS...the COWBELL was ringing like crazy (and blood was even shed over it).

Soxfanspcu11
09-05-2007, 06:50 PM
game delayed for about 15 minutes due to a squirrel running on the field

HAHAHAHAHA!!!

That is GREAT!!! I had forgotten all about that!!!

My season tickets are out in the bleachers (Section 163), and that squirrel was pretty much right in front of us, a little off to the right. It was FANTASTIC entertainment!!!

I remember Pablo (who was playing leftfield) trying to chase after the thing! Pablo and a couple of security guards then tried to corner it down the leftfield line and he made a Reggie Bush like move and got past all of them! We were living it up in the bleachers watching it, it was one of those things where you just could not stop laughing! HAHA! I'm laughing right now just thinking about it!!! Good stuff!! The ending to the actual game was not bad either.:D::gulp::bandance:

TDog
09-05-2007, 10:57 PM
... Ozuna's suicide squeeze, getting Pierzynski in from 3rd, worked like a charm! ...

It was a great game, but it wasn't a suicide squeeze. It wasn't a safety squeeze. A suicide squeeze is an intended sacrifice bunt in which the runner from third is breaking with the pitch, so that, if bunted on the ground fair, the run will score. And if executed, there is nothing the defensive team can do about it. With a safety squeeze, the runner from third waits to see if the ball is safely bunted before breaking for the plate. For reference, the last play of the 2000 ALDS in Seattle was a squeeze bunt aimed at Frank Thomas.

The play that ended the May 22, 2006, game against the A's was a two-out bunt single on the right side of the infield. Had Pablo Ozuna been thrown out at first, the run would not have scored.

Cubs fans remember Thomas getting booed (he wasn't). Sox fans remember a squeeze play (it wasn't). Whether it was a squeeze play really is a minor point, of course. It's frustrating, though, that people believe what they want to believe about teams they dislike. When I was growing up, some kid at school said he hated the White Sox because for a time they moved the fences in at home when they were at bat. His father had told him this. Forget that this never happened. Such idiots. The origin came from a joking suggestion by Bill Veeck.

When Sox fans remember the Zambrano affair (and they will), I hope they remember it accurately.

WhiteSox5187
09-05-2007, 11:18 PM
It was a great game, but it wasn't a suicide squeeze. It wasn't a safety squeeze. A suicide squeeze is an intended sacrifice bunt in which the runner from third is breaking with the pitch, so that, if bunted on the ground fair, the run will score. And if executed, there is nothing the defensive team can do about it. With a safety squeeze, the runner from third waits to see if the ball is safely bunted before breaking for the plate. For reference, the last play of the 2000 ALDS in Seattle was a squeeze bunt aimed at Frank Thomas.

The play that ended the May 22, 2006, game against the A's was a two-out bunt single on the right side of the infield. Had Pablo Ozuna been thrown out at first, the run would not have scored.

Cubs fans remember Thomas getting booed (he wasn't). Sox fans remember a squeeze play (it wasn't). Whether it was a squeeze play really is a minor point, of course. It's frustrating, though, that people believe what they want to believe about teams they dislike. When I was growing up, some kid at school said he hated the White Sox because for a time they moved the fences in at home when they were at bat. His father had told him this. Forget that this never happened. Such idiots. The origin came from a joking suggestion by Bill Veeck.

When Sox fans remember the Zambrano affair (and they will), I hope they remember it accurately.
I don't mean to pick straws here, but I think Bill Veeck actually did do that, back when he owned the Milwaulkee Brewers (the minor league team) back in the 1940s. Of course, the next day the league made a rule change (what he did was techincally legal, he was great at finding loopholes) and it was never done again.

TDog
09-05-2007, 11:24 PM
I don't mean to pick straws here, but I think Bill Veeck actually did do that, back when he owned the Milwaulkee Brewers (the minor league team) back in the 1940s. Of course, the next day the league made a rule change (what he did was techincally legal, he was great at finding loopholes) and it was never done again.

You might be right. That would have been more than a decade before Veeck had any ownership interest in the White Sox and less than a decade after Veeck had planted the ivy at Wrigley Field. So at the time, Veeck would have been more associated with Cubs fences than White Sox fences.

Not that truth is a defense for the taunts from Cubs fans when you're in junior high school.

WhiteSox5187
09-06-2007, 12:41 AM
You might be right. That would have been more than a decade before Veeck had any ownership interest in the White Sox and less than a decade after Veeck had planted the ivy at Wrigley Field. So at the time, Veeck would have been more associated with Cubs fences than White Sox fences.

Not that truth is a defense for the taunts from Cubs fans when you're in junior high school.
Yea, that stunt had absolutely no bearing on the White Sox...now of course, the Allyns brought the fences in and planted astro-turf in the infield at Comiskey in a desperate attempt to inject some offense into our lineup in the late 1960s and early 1970s.

MarySwiss
09-06-2007, 08:12 AM
That Core of the Core game had it all, didn't it, Mary? Frank's first return to Comiskey in a visiting uniform (the chills of the standing Ovation, as well as him hitting two home runs), game delayed for about 15 minutes due to a squirrel running on the field, game-tying 2-run shot by Mackowiak in the 8th, Ozuna's suicide squeeze, getting Pierzynski in from 3rd, worked like a charm!

PLUS...the COWBELL was ringing like crazy (and blood was even shed over it).

Yes, it did! My only regret was trying to make that 11:35 Metra train to Tinley that had me cramming into the L, sprinting like a maniac down Van Buren, missing the damn thing anyway, and sitting in the LaSalle street station for an hour trying not to fall asleep. What I should have done was head out with you guys to the bar.

Of course, then I would have missed the last train--and Kevin57 would have had someone to talk to as he waited for the Tuesday 8 am train. :D:

Or we could have split a cab.

Anyway, it was a hell of a lot more fun than the first WSI Fest this year, that's for sure. :angry:

But back to booing. I wonder what would have happened had Frank hit a third home run?

kevin57
09-06-2007, 09:05 PM
Yes, it did! My only regret was trying to make that 11:35 Metra train to Tinley that had me cramming into the L, sprinting like a maniac down Van Buren, missing the damn thing anyway, and sitting in the LaSalle street station for an hour trying not to fall asleep. What I should have done was head out with you guys to the bar.

Of course, then I would have missed the last train--and Kevin57 would have had someone to talk to as he waited for the Tuesday 8 am train. :D:

Or we could have split a cab.

That story of mine will live in infamy. :tongue: