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Fenway
08-30-2007, 08:09 AM
I agree 100% with his column.

and he gives White Sox fans a thumbs up


Enough already. Get over yourselves, Red Sox fans. Better yet, follow the lead of White Sox fans. Their team went 88 years without winning a World Series. They went 46 years without even playing in one. Yet when they finally won in 2005, they had the decency to keep their celebration to themselves.


Shut up, Red Sox Nation (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=caple/070829&sportCat=mlb)

itsnotrequired
08-30-2007, 08:13 AM
It's like in "Can't Buy Me Love" when geeky Patrick Dempsey (in his pre-McDreamy youth) pays popular cheerleader Amanda Peterson to be his girlfriend for a month, and then he starts acting like an ass. (By the way, for some reason there is no photo of the amazing Ms. Peterson at the IMDb Web site. Meanwhile, Corey Haim and Corey Feldman have a reality show. And people are wasting their anger on Michael Vick?)

:roflmao::rolling::roflmao:

Scottiehaswheels
08-30-2007, 08:25 AM
Funny how the "Red Sox Nation's" mouthpiece is finally telling the monster they themselves created to shut up. Must be an underlying reason... Disney maybe considering buying the Yank's from George?

Fenway
08-30-2007, 08:33 AM
Funny how the "Red Sox Nation's" mouthpiece is finally telling the monster they themselves created to shut up. Must be an underlying reason... Disney maybe considering buying the Yank's from George?

ESPN certainly played a hand in this but my feeling is WEEI is the main culprit. They just added 11 stations in Maine to their talk network.

NESN is almost as bad. Their stupid dating show "Sox Appeal" has become a runaway hit with double digit ratings. Of course Tom Werner DOES know television.

http://www.sox-appeal.com/episode5-kevin-whitten.html

skobabe8
08-30-2007, 08:37 AM
What got into Caple?? Whatever it is, I like it!

Fenway
08-30-2007, 08:51 AM
What got into Caple?? Whatever it is, I like it!

Most members of the Boston media are now feeling the same way. It has to stop but the reality is it will get worse.

Baltimore 3 weeks ago was unreal. There had to be 35,000 Red Sox fans at each game.

tebman
08-30-2007, 09:06 AM
That whole article is on the mark. We were at last Saturday's game against the Red Sox, and while we were bothered that the White Sox lost in standard 2007 fashion, the sheer number of Boston fans there was incredible. I feel a little like Lee Elia -- don't these people have jobs? How can several thousand of them just up and go to Chicago (or Seattle, or Cleveland, or wherever) to annoy their opponents' hometown crowds?

I'm no sociologist, but there's got to be a fascinating study of tribal, herdlike behavior in what's happened with Red Sox fans and Cub fans in recent years. Mix in media fuel and large disposable incomes and you've got a comical version of a hostile invasion.

We can thank ESPN and the Tribune for a lot of this, but I'm sure it goes deeper.

Fenway
08-30-2007, 09:22 AM
and of course Red Sox fans are mad at Caple

Jim Caple tells us to shut up., Yeah, we get it Jim, bashing Sox fans is fashionable. Bravo. (http://www.redsoxnation.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25981)

chisoxmike
08-30-2007, 09:39 AM
:cheers:

:happyguy:

:)

IlliniSox4Life
08-30-2007, 10:14 AM
and of course Red Sox fans are mad at Caple

Jim Caple tells us to shut up., Yeah, we get it Jim, bashing Sox fans is fashionable. Bravo. (http://www.redsoxnation.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25981)


Red Sox fans making fun of somebody for doing what's "fashionable"? That's priceless.

And since when did bashing Red Sox fans become fashionable?

StillMissOzzie
08-30-2007, 10:17 AM
There's a lot of truth in what Caple's got to say. There's also a lot of irony in ESPN's aiding and abetting this thing as well.

And finally, it convinces me that Cub fans would be the most insufferable lot of them all if and when they ever win it all.

SMO
:angry:

MisterB
08-30-2007, 10:18 AM
and of course Red Sox fans are mad at Caple

Jim Caple tells us to shut up., Yeah, we get it Jim, bashing Sox fans is fashionable. Bravo. (http://www.redsoxnation.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25981)

Loved this response:

Oakland A's fans are obnoxious. Anyone who uses thundersticks and waves a rally monkey is obnoxious (LAA Angels fans). The wave is obnoxious (name a team, their fans do it, they're obnoxious). White Sox fans (and their broadcast crew) are obnoxious. Phillies fans are obnoxious. Atlanta fans (who still do the tomahawk chop) are obnoxious.

I don't see anything arrogant about "Red Sox Nation".

There's objectivity for ya... :rolleyes:

I also like how they blame it on the 'bandwagon' fans. Everytime I've tuned into an A's game when the Sawks are in town it's obvious that the crowd is mostly Boston fans, and they are quite vocal - and this has been going on for at least a decade, not just since 2004.

goon
08-30-2007, 10:46 AM
Great Article

drewcifer
08-30-2007, 10:51 AM
don't these people have jobs? How can several thousand of them just up and go to Chicago (or Seattle, or Cleveland, or wherever) to annoy their opponents' hometown crowds?


Yes - they are all "advance scouts".

IlliniSox4Life
08-30-2007, 12:01 PM
You know, there's a bit of irony in this thread being started by Fenway, and him agreeing with it. I wonder if that is going to cut down on the number of Red Sox related threads all over this board?

Risk
08-30-2007, 12:04 PM
I wonder if that is going to cut down on the number of Red Sox related threads all over this board?

One can only hope...

Risk

DSpivack
08-30-2007, 01:19 PM
ESPN publishing an article that complains about the obnoxiousness and bandwagon nature of "Red Sox Nation" is akin got Dr. Frankenstein criticizing man for creating a monster.

soxtalker
08-30-2007, 01:40 PM
You know, there's a bit of irony in this thread being started by Fenway, and him agreeing with it. I wonder if that is going to cut down on the number of Red Sox related threads all over this board?

I hope not. I've enjoyed reading Fenway's comments over the past few years. I only wish that we had a few more WSI members like him in other cities.

Artoo
08-30-2007, 01:50 PM
Liked the article a lot. Watching the White Sox lose to the Red Sox 11-1 last Sunday broke my heart. What broke my heart even more was the takeover of red shirts, chanting "Go-Go Red Sox", drowning out the 300-or-so White Sox fans who managed to stick around until the end of the game.
I'm very annoyed by the Red Sox and their fans. I know that sounds mean and, believe me, I am not a mean or competetitive person...but when visitng fans and fans of the opposing team start to shout "White Sox suck!" while you're exiting the ballpark, it kinda' gets you steamed.
Yes, yes...I know it's all in good fun. After the Red Sox won the World Series back in '04, well....people are still acting like it's '04 and no other teams have won. The White Sox celebration was local. It seemed like the Cardinals didn't even get recognition (at least IMO). I'm very tired of the "Red Sox Nation". I agree with the article, the are turning into Yankees fans.

nccwsfan
08-30-2007, 01:56 PM
and of course Red Sox fans are mad at Caple

Jim Caple tells us to shut up., Yeah, we get it Jim, bashing Sox fans is fashionable. Bravo. (http://www.redsoxnation.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=25981)


One columnist on ESPN writes an anti-Red Sox article and they're all up in arms?!?!? :rolleyes: They might need to get some thicker skin.

ChiSoxGirl
08-30-2007, 08:56 PM
This is a fantastic article and is SPOT-ON!!!! After experiencing "Red Sox Nation" at our ballpark at two games firsthand last weekend, I couldn't agree more with the entire article. We get it, Red Sox fans- you won. Now can we all move on with our lives, please?! Cub fans talk about us living in the past...? Have they met these people?! :rolleyes:

Oblong
08-30-2007, 09:07 PM
The Red Sox were a favorite team of mine growing up. Obviously you have Williams for history but I caught the tail end of Yaz's career. Got an autograph from him at his final game at Tiger Stadium. I liked Dewey. I like Fenway Park. I appreciated the history. Derek Lowe was from the same home town as I am and I got to play against him for 4 years in high school. I was genuinely happy when they won in 2004. But then afterwards it got crazy. I recall a Richard Roeper column a few years ago where he was discussing the HBO special on the 2004 team. Something like "Listening to these fans get going and crying, I swear to God you thought it was WWII vets talking about the Battle of the Bulge"

I wish I had the exact line but that pretty much summed it up.

Evil Empire Jr. really is a good nickname for them. Is there anything left at Fenway that doesn't have an advertisement on it?

thomas35forever
08-30-2007, 09:19 PM
I think I know what's going on at ESPN's offices right now:

"Hey Caple, don't let the door hit your ass on the way out."

:smile::D:

chisoxfanatic
08-30-2007, 10:27 PM
Loved this response:



There's objectivity for ya... :rolleyes:

I also like how they blame it on the 'bandwagon' fans. Everytime I've tuned into an A's game when the Sawks are in town it's obvious that the crowd is mostly Boston fans, and they are quite vocal - and this has been going on for at least a decade, not just since 2004.

Being obnoxious refers to a fan or fanbase trying to take over a visiting stadium like it was their own or something, not waving Rally Monkeys at Edison Field, singing the Go Go White Sox song at Comiskey, or doing the Tomahawk Chop at Turner Field. That's called supporting their team at their HOME ballpark! It's this trying to make every other stadium as Fenway Park West that sickens me. Just shut your pie holes and get a little class when you're visiting another ballpark! My boyfriend has done it all eight Sox/Carmine games he's attended here, and he's a Sawx fan himself! He did not say ONE thing this entire weekend. I think people can REALLY learn about how to behave in a visiting ballpark from him. At least he has a clue.

I'm very tired of the "Red Sox Nation". I agree with the article, the are turning into Yankees fans.
To me, Red Sox fans are even worse than Yankee...or Cub fans when they visit Comiskey! To that reason, I am rooting HARD for the Yankees to give the Red Sox one of the most epic divisional collapses in the history of the game, as well as the Mariners to win the Wild Card, making the Sawx stay home in October.
Evil Empire Jr. really is a good nickname for them.
I'll take $1,000 in royalties each time it is used for starting that nickname during my Game Report Friday! :cool:

whitesoxfan1986
08-30-2007, 11:21 PM
I can't believe I ever had a rooting intrest in this team. Believe it or not, I actually was rooting for them to win the series in 04. The Red Sox had been my 2nd favorite AL team for a while. Then they won the World Series. What turned me away from them forever is the ESPN bull**** about how the Red Sox were sooo great in 2005 while they had no pitching whatsoever, and the our Sox had the best pitching in the majors that year and somehow we were going to get wiped off the field when we played Boston in the ALDS. We all know that pitching wins championships. Now it seems that everybody in their mamma is either a Red Sox or Cub fan.(thread hijack) I can't imagine what it would be like if *shudder* the Cubs were to ever win the World Series. I am afraid of that day, because it will happen sooner or later, and I'm willing to bet on it being sooner rather than later. They're going to run into one by accident. Hell, this year has pretty much told me that happened to us in 2005. We had an awesome team that year. Everything that could go wrong, didn't and everything that could go right, did. When you win a championship that way you have to accept that the stars aligned perfectly for us to win that year. I don't believe that it was a fluke because Winning championships in a series playoff system, IMO is never a fluke. You can win a Super Bowl on a fluke though, because it only takes one wierd play to screw a team over. For that one season, we were better than everyone. No one can take that away. Eventually this will happen for the Cubs. I find it hard to believe that they could go more than 110 years without winning. I think they'll win within the next 10 years. The domino is going to fall. Boston won in 2004, we won in 2005. They're going to win soon, I just pray that it isn't this year when the Sox have reached a low that hasn't been seen in almost two decades.

A. Cavatica
08-30-2007, 11:40 PM
when visitng fans and fans of the opposing team start to shout "White Sox suck!" while you're exiting the ballpark, it kinda' gets you steamed.

Have you been watching this team? The shouts were probably coming from White Sox fans -- or the White Sox manager.

harwar
08-31-2007, 08:52 AM
The Red Sox were a favorite team of mine growing up. Obviously you have Williams for history but I caught the tail end of Yaz's career. Got an autograph from him at his final game at Tiger Stadium. I liked Dewey. I like Fenway Park.
Yea,the 67 world series is surpassed only by 2005 for me,in great memories of baseball.I was one of those kids who used to smuggle a transistor radio into class to listen to the games.It's a damn shame what baseball has become.

harwar
08-31-2007, 09:02 AM
I'm no sociologist, but there's got to be a fascinating study of tribal, herdlike behavior in what's happened with Red Sox fans and Cub fans in recent years. Mix in media fuel and large disposable incomes and you've got a comical version of a hostile invasion.

We can thank ESPN and the Tribune for a lot of this, but I'm sure it goes deeper.
It seems to me that the powers that be,use the natural warlike tribal behavior in all human males,to help lead us through the maze of their making,in order to put the chess pieces where they want.Of course we will never reach the cheese.

Fenway
08-31-2007, 11:25 AM
The Red Sox love the concept of Red Sox Nation....

The election for the President of RSN is now online

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/bos/fan_forum/redsox_nation_president.jsp

Names of note
Mike Barnicle (javascript:void(window.open('/bos/fan_forum/rsn/pop/candidate_barnicle.jsp','Candidate','width=466,hei ght=400,location=no,menubar=no,scrollbars=yes,stat us=no,toolbar=no,resizable=no'));)
Peter Gammons (javascript:void(window.open('/bos/fan_forum/rsn/pop/candidate_gammons.jsp','Candidate','width=466,heig ht=500,location=no,menubar=no,scrollbars=yes,statu s=no,toolbar=no,resizable=no'));)
Doris Kearns Goodwin (javascript:void(window.open('/bos/fan_forum/rsn/pop/candidate_goodwin.jsp','Candidate','width=466,heig ht=600,location=no,menubar=no,scrollbars=yes,statu s=no,toolbar=no,resizable=no'));)
Sam Horn (javascript:void(window.open('/bos/fan_forum/rsn/pop/candidate_horn.jsp','Candidate','width=466,height= 540,location=no,menubar=no,scrollbars=yes,status=n o,toolbar=no,resizable=no'));)

Doris gets my vote
I would ask Commissioner Selig to schedule more playoff and World Series games in the afternoons so that young fans can share in the excitement. I would encourage the Red Sox owners to do all in their power to keep our homegrown stars for their entire careers so they can become integral parts of the community as Cal Ripken and Tony Gwynn were in Baltimore and San Diego.

I would encourage NESN to bury every clip of Bucky Dent and Bill Buckner in an underground vault.

Oblong
08-31-2007, 11:37 AM
What good would it do to simply "ask" for more WS games in the afternoon. I'm sure she wouldn't be the first one to do it. Fox dictates that because Fox foots the bill.

I'll take Magnum PI over Kearns-Goodwin.... hawaiin shirt and cutoff jean shorts and all.... :tongue:

Fenway
08-31-2007, 11:51 AM
Bill Simmons on Red Sox fans

I flew down to Tampa for last week's series and can report the following: Sox fans made up 70% of the crowd, overwhelming Devil Rays fans, most of whom were in the Matlock demographic, anyway. From a noise standpoint, if you closed your eyes, you would have thought you were in Fenway. (Well, until you opened them and saw the dome on the ghoulishly outdated Tropicana Field, or the brownish-red shag carpety stuff on the warning track that was pulled from Austin Powers' flat.)

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/070829

He took photos at The Trop Devil Rays must be thrilled with this

http://espn.go.com/photo/2007/0828/simmons_tampa24.jpg
That's me partying in the party deck. Wouldn't it make more sense to convert this section into a de facto convalescent home and have bingo games and canasta?

PART I (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part1) | PART II (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part2) | PART III (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part3) | PART IV (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part4) | PART V (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part5) | PART VI (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part6) | PART VII (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part7) | PART VIII (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part8) | PART IX (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part9) | PART X (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/tampa/part10)

FloridaTigers
08-31-2007, 02:21 PM
What good would it do to simply "ask" for more WS games in the afternoon. I'm sure she wouldn't be the first one to do it. Fox dictates that because Fox foots the bill.

I'll take Magnum PI over Kearns-Goodwin.... hawaiin shirt and cutoff jean shorts and all.... :tongue:

Wasn't Selig throwing out the idea of one or two WS games in the afternoon due to poor ratings anyways?

WizardsofOzzie
08-31-2007, 03:26 PM
Some select gems from the article include:

"Damn," I said. "I was really looking forward to a Cubs-Red Sox World Series.""No, we didn't want that," he said. "Because right now we have one group of totally obnoxious fans we have to deal with. And if the Cubs or the Red Sox were to win, then we would have two."

What we really need is a wall, a moat and a minefield around New England to keep the spoiled citizens of Red Sox Nation from sneaking into the rest of the country and taking over seats in major league ballparks that should go to hard-working local fans. Everywhere the Red Sox play these days turns into a road version of Fenway Park, with Boston fans occasionally drowning out the hometown fans with their "Let's Go Red Sox!" chants

and best of all
Enough already. Get over yourselves, Red Sox fans. Better yet, follow the lead of White Sox fans. Their team went 88 years without winning a World Series. They went 46 years without even playing in one. Yet when they finally won in 2005, they had the decency to keep their celebration to themselves.




http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=caple/070829

thomas35forever
08-31-2007, 03:29 PM
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=92168&page=3

drewcifer
08-31-2007, 03:30 PM
Maybe a contract year for Caple? :dunno:

Fen already on the job (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=92168)

WizardsofOzzie
08-31-2007, 03:31 PM
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=92168&page=3

Doh. I didn't even bother looking in Talking Baseball because I figured it would be here. Please merge mods

WizardsofOzzie
08-31-2007, 03:34 PM
This is a fantastic article and is SPOT-ON!!!! After experiencing "Red Sox Nation" at our ballpark at two games firsthand last weekend, I couldn't agree more with the entire article. We get it, Red Sox fans- you won. Now can we all move on with our lives, please?! Cub fans talk about us living in the past...? Have they met these people?! :rolleyes:

Therein lies the problem Jen. 90% of Red Sox fans are Cubs fans too. It's a crazy thing I never noticed until these last few years.

ChiSoxGirl
08-31-2007, 08:54 PM
Therein lies the problem Jen. 90% of Red Sox fans are Cubs fans too. It's a crazy thing I never noticed until these last few years.

I know. I posted the other day about seeing and hearing about "Red Sox fans" in Cub gear or proclaiming their allegiance to the Cubs at the games last weekend. :rolleyes: I actually had typed, "That's right, most of these people ARE Cub fans," as part of my post, but chose not to include it for whatever reason. :dunno:

Railsplitter
09-01-2007, 06:51 AM
Thid thread may by more suited to the Parking Lot, but I'll try it here.
What's with all this antipathy towards Red Sox fans. They may a nuisence since the won the Series, but at least they're not talking about some stupid curse anymore.

Besides, they're no more obnoxious than we were after Super Bowl XX. The elevation of Mike Ditka to a god-like figure became a running joke on Saturday Night Live. Also remember the promotion Chicago area McDonald's had back in 1989? The Bears, win, Free burger, Bears loose free fries. Before the Bears played the Eagles, they ran a commercial with Eagles coach Buddy Ryan who said at the end "I hope you like your fries." Peope called in to a WGN radio talk show with the attidue "How Dare you think your team can win against our Bears." The bears did win that game, but only two more after that.

Fenway
09-01-2007, 07:00 AM
Thid thread may by more suited to the Parking Lot, but I'll try it here.
What's with all this antipathy towards Red Sox fans. They may a nuisence since the won the Series, but at least they're not talking about some stupid curse anymore.

Besides, they're no more obnoxious than we were after Super Bowl XX. The elevation of Mike Ditka to a god-like figure became a running joke on Saturday Night Live. Also remember the promotion Chicago area McDonald's had back in 1989? The Bears, win, Free burger, Bears loose free fries. Before the Bears played the Eagles, they ran a commercial with Eagles coach Buddy Ryan who said at the end "I hope you like your fries." Peope called in to a WGN radio talk show with the attidue "How Dare you think your team can win against our Bears." The bears did win that game, but only two more after that.

and Bears fans took over visiting parks when possibe especially Tampa.

DumpJerry
09-01-2007, 07:02 AM
Bears fans don't wear red.

FarWestChicago
09-01-2007, 07:53 AM
Have you been watching this team? The shouts were probably coming from White Sox fans -- or the White Sox manager.Only if you were at the game. :rolleyes:

Fenway
09-04-2007, 11:28 AM
This was discussed in great detail Sunday morning on WEEI's baseball show.

Everyone seems to agree that Red Sox Nation is a creation of the internet more than anything. Over the past 40 years, millions of people have passed through Boston for college ( 300,000 college students here ) and for many it was their first encounter to baseball. While they may have been a casual fan of another team growing up they get sucked in while in Boston especially since except for BC there is no major football program.

The internet made it possible to reconnect with the team.

The Cubs were a creation of WGN a decade before.

Still many New Englanders travel anywhere to see the team as they can't get tickets here.

Look Boston fans were very loud in Chicago last week but the games dictated that. There were 40,000 Boston fans at each game in August in Balto but the Orioles won 2 of 3. Losing shuts up Boston fans.

johnr1note
09-04-2007, 04:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oblong http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=1671417#post1671417)
Evil Empire Jr. really is a good nickname for them.

I'll take $1,000 in royalties each time it is used for starting that nickname during my Game Report Friday! :cool:

If the Yankees are the Evil Empire, and the Red Sox Evil Empire, Jr., a better comparison is if the Yanks are Nazi Germany, then the Red Sawx are Mussolini's Italy -- still Fascist, still evil, but not quite as dangerous.

Foulke You
09-04-2007, 04:43 PM
Everyone seems to agree that Red Sox Nation is a creation of the internet more than anything. Over the past 40 years, millions of people have passed through Boston for college ( 300,000 college students here ) and for many it was their first encounter to baseball. While they may have been a casual fan of another team growing up they get sucked in while in Boston especially since except for BC there is no major football program.
I think what you typed here above is also largely true about a big chunk of the Cubs fanbase. The Cubs have done a fantastic job suckering in the college kids that move to the North Side and live off of Mom and Dad's dime. Lots of Loyola college kids live in Rogers Park, lots of DePaul kids live in Lincoln Park, and then you have Northwestern in Evanston. All of these schools and neighborhoods are spitting distance from Wrigley Field and with all the nightlife surrounding the North Side ballpark combined with the party atmosphere inside, it is easy to see why so many out of town college kids automatically become Cubs "fans". If you take a look at the Wrigley bleachers on any given game and 75% of the fans are 18-24yr old college kids.

About 7 or 8 years ago, I used to hang out and party with some friends who went to school in Loyola. Almost all of the Loyola kids I met at parties were Cubs fans and a LOT of them were not native Chicagoans. I'd wear my Frank Thomas jersey to some of these social gatherings:gulp:and they'd look at me like I had a disease. The White Sox have IIT (Illinois Institute of Technology) and the UIC campus isn't too far but other than that, there isn't a lot of colleges and college kids living spitting distance from Comiskey.