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View Full Version : Phil Garner and GM fired from 'Stros


downstairs
08-27-2007, 03:01 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7160596

He gawn.

Chicken Dinner
08-27-2007, 03:11 PM
And the Astros have a better record than we do........hmmmmmmmmm

bestkosher
08-27-2007, 03:16 PM
Both teams since the 2005 season have seen dramatic declines in talent. White Sox with the rotation of outfielders and Houston with the rotation of the 5 man. Both teams have have high payrolls. Although Houston's is less with the Rocket and Petitte now Yankmes. Both teams depend on a fiery manager. Although, Ozzie has since tuned it down and without Bevington, Garner has less fire.

WIll Ozzie be next will Kenny? Probably not, for we all know Reinsdorf loyalty is strong to those he likes. Yet both Chicago and Houston could end up with matching records at the end of the season.

UserNameBlank
08-27-2007, 03:24 PM
I can see the GM getting fired, mainly due to the ugly Jennings trade, but Garner? I'm not defending him because I haven't watched the Stros play this year, but I wonder what he did that lumped him in with the poor job done by the GM?

kittle42
08-27-2007, 04:09 PM
I wouldn't be too upset if a manager and GM of a certain other team were canned.

jabrch
08-27-2007, 04:09 PM
Sounds shortsighted to me...

TDog
08-27-2007, 04:11 PM
Field and general managers aren't fired for losing games. They are fired because they aren't acting as the bosses want them to. Billy Martin was fired by the Twins after winning the AL West. He was fired by the Yankees at various times when the team's record was pretty much irrelevant. There are some who believe Mike Hargrove was forced to resign in Seattle, and Seattle is having a great year by current Seattle standards. If the Mariners played in the NL Central, Cubs fans wouldn't as we speak be arranging for second mortgages to finance their World Series tickets.

Kenny Williams and Oswaldo Jose (Barrios) Guillen are Jerry Reinsdorf's men. They aren't going anywhere.

Foulke You
08-27-2007, 04:28 PM
Kenny Williams and Oswaldo Jose (Barrios) Guillen are Jerry Reinsdorf's men. They aren't going anywhere.
Nor should they. They've earned a chance to right this ship. Now, after 2008 if we are in a similar position as we are now, then we can start talking about a change in management.

rdivaldi
08-27-2007, 04:53 PM
Nor should they. They've earned a chance to right this ship. Now, after 2008 if we are in a similar position as we are now, then we can start talking about a change in management.

Yep, they've earned that right. Personally I think Ozzie would quit if we perform this badly in 2008...

ZombieRob
08-27-2007, 04:56 PM
Thats to bad for "Gards"I liked him as a player and as a Manager

ZombieRob
08-27-2007, 04:58 PM
Nor should they. They've earned a chance to right this ship. Now, after 2008 if we are in a similar position as we are now, then we can start talking about a change in management.
Anything less then a 1st or 2nd place finish would deem unacceptle in my view.But I always hold all the teams i root for in high standard.They have earned the chance for 2008 for sure.

downstairs
08-27-2007, 05:15 PM
Thats to bad for "Gards"I liked him as a player and as a Manager

I actually did too. He'll land somewhere, for sure.

veeter
08-27-2007, 05:19 PM
Field and general managers aren't fired for losing games. They are fired because they aren't acting as the bosses want them to. Billy Martin was fired by the Twins after winning the AL West. He was fired by the Yankees at various times when the team's record was pretty much irrelevant. There are some who believe Mike Hargrove was forced to resign in Seattle, and Seattle is having a great year by current Seattle standards. If the Mariners played in the NL Central, Cubs fans wouldn't as we speak be arranging for second mortgages to finance their World Series tickets.

Kenny Williams and Oswaldo Jose (Barrios) Guillen are Jerry Reinsdorf's men. They aren't going anywhere.You're correct. They're joined at the hip.

The Immigrant
08-27-2007, 05:22 PM
Carl Everett must be smiling, wherever he is.

russ99
08-27-2007, 05:35 PM
Heck yeah, about time. To fall to last place in that division is a huge disappointment.

Former GM Tim Purpura was seen to be a yes man or more harshly, a puppet of the owner, McLane, so I have no clue which direction the Astros will go this time for GM. Doubtful they'll get another forceful personality like Gerry Hunsicker since he clashed with McLane many times.

I guess Garner's only failing was to try and give too many chances to lesser quality players like Lane & Bruntlett, when players like Burke and Scott were deserving of much more playing time.

He also stuck with some of the bad starters a bit too long too. If I had Williams, Jennings and Wandy Rodriguez stinking it up every 3rd, 4th and 5th day, I would have given prospects like Albers and Patton a chance a lot sooner.

I personally would love to see Biggio get the managerial job next year, but it might be too soon.

thomas35forever
08-27-2007, 06:03 PM
This is weird because I was just watching Game 4 of the 2005 World Series this afternoon. Oh well. The Astros can only look toward the future.

PennStater98r
08-27-2007, 06:13 PM
Thats to bad for "Gards"I liked him as a player and as a Manager

Fixed that for you.

"Gards" was/is a classless POS. I think back to the brawl of 2000 in which most of the COACHING staff of Detroit is throwing punches at the players. And I think of "Gards" yelling profanity at Crede in the World Series after Crede stares Oswalt down after being plunked in that 5 run inning.

This firing couldn't have happened to a nicer guy.

KyWhiSoxFan
08-27-2007, 06:24 PM
Purpura grew up a White Sox fan. I wonder if KW would be interested in finding a spot for him somewhere within the organization.

schmitty9800
08-27-2007, 06:38 PM
Field and general managers aren't fired for losing games. They are fired because they aren't acting as the bosses want them to. Billy Martin was fired by the Twins after winning the AL West. He was fired by the Yankees at various times when the team's record was pretty much irrelevant. There are some who believe Mike Hargrove was forced to resign in Seattle, and Seattle is having a great year by current Seattle standards. If the Mariners played in the NL Central, Cubs fans wouldn't as we speak be arranging for second mortgages to finance their World Series tickets.
Amen. The Pirates GM is ruining that franchise and losing boatloads of games, but he still has a job because he's a good PR guy and willing to take the lumps for the organization.

soxinem1
08-27-2007, 07:32 PM
Thats to bad for "Gards"I liked him as a player and as a Manager

There is no love lost with Garner as far as I'm concerned, as his MIL and DET shenanegnans against us would dictate, but it was unfair for HOU to fire him, as he did what he could with what he had, and the last two years, he had less than Ozzie by far.

Plus, substituting Jason Jennings and Woody Williams for Clemems and Petitte (even if Roger was only half the year) doomed this ship early.

Tragg
08-27-2007, 11:29 PM
I personally would love to see Biggio get the managerial job next year, but it might be too soon. Oh he's ready...he's been the shadow manager of the Astros for 10 years. That, however, is one of their problems....everybody has to please Biggio and the real manager.

I agree that Pupera was brought in to be a yes man. He made some bad moves this year - Jennings and he paid an awful lot for Lee, especially when they aren't contending (in retrospect). I still think he made a good move trading a career middle reliever for a 3B (who needs work, I know)

Astros and Sox have been similar for a long time; similar strengths and weaknesses. Similar managerial philosophies (Garner takes bunting to an extreme, although Ozzie's catching up), several stiff hitters in both lineups. And of course, Frank and Bagwell, both first basemen, both will be in the Hall, and both born on the same day in the same year. Both made the WS the same year, both turned sour 2 years later.

Kenny is JR's man and JR will never fire him. Ozzie's a different story and Kenny had to convince JR to let him hire Ozzie as manager (although since then, Ozzie did manage a WS team and JR may have confidence in Ozzie).
I don't think Williams did a bad job in the offseason, although the team turned out to be weak ( imo, Ozzie did a worse job managing the team than Kenny did in putting it together). But in the end, results count. Although, certainly they aren't going anywhere for a year, and probably a lot longer.

TDog
08-28-2007, 12:48 AM
Thats to bad for "Gards"I liked him as a player and as a Manager

Count me in the group that would find the post making more sense if it involves sarcasm. Phil Garner has been a classless act for years as a manager. I disliked him as a player.

In the 1970s, when baseball was promoting the "millionth run," the A's were playing on a Sunday afternoon in old Comiskey. The total was up to 999,999, and Phil Garner was in scoring position. My friend with the adjacent season ticket complained that it would be unfortunate if someone as classless and insignificant as Phil Garner scored the millionth run. I don't remember if Garner came around to score, because a moment later it was announced that Bob Watson had scored, running hard from second base on a home run, beating Dave Conception who had homered and was sprinting around the bases. Because most people don't know what I'm talking about, I guess it doesn't matter much today.

I didn't like Phil Garner when he managed the Astros, Brewers or Tigers. I didn't even like him when he played for the A's.

lakeviewsoxfan
08-28-2007, 01:02 AM
The way he threw his entire team under the bus after game 3 was the most classless and despicible act of his tenure. He is a complete piece of **** and I would just love to see a picture of his chair tossing episode after Blums HR. I loved how we shoved it up his ass in that wonderful 4 game series.

RadioheadRocks
08-28-2007, 02:48 AM
Count me in the group that would find the post making more sense if it involves sarcasm. Phil Garner has been a classless act for years as a manager. I disliked him as a player.

In the 1970s, when baseball was promoting the "millionth run," the A's were playing on a Sunday afternoon in old Comiskey. The total was up to 999,999, and Phil Garner was in scoring position. My friend with the adjacent season ticket complained that it would be unfortunate if someone as classless and insignificant as Phil Garner scored the millionth run. I don't remember if Garner came around to score, because a moment later it was announced that Bob Watson had scored, running hard from second base on a home run, beating Dave Conception who had homered and was sprinting around the bases. Because most people don't know what I'm talking about, I guess it doesn't matter much today.

I didn't like Phil Garner when he managed the Astros, Brewers or Tigers. I didn't even like him when he played for the A's.

I remember that, and I believe it was in 1974 or 1975. Considering the era (before the internet and GameCast, etc.) it was pretty remarkable that someone evidently was paying close enough attention to quite a few games simultaneously to see who would officially score that "millionth run".

The way he threw his entire team under the bus after game 3 was the most classless and despicible act of his tenure. He is a complete piece of **** and I would just love to see a picture of his chair tossing episode after Blums HR. I loved how we shoved it up his ass in that wonderful 4 game series.

The good news is that you can replay it over and over and over if you have the World Series DVD box set! :D:

Oblong
08-28-2007, 09:53 AM
When Garner took over the Tigers after the 1999 season, he didn't retain Trammell on his coaching staff from the previous Larry Parrish regime. Not that big of a deal by itself because I understand a manager wants his guys that he feels comfortable with. But then in his initial press conference somebody asked him what number he'd wear. He said he wanted #3 (Tram's number) but it wasn't available. Then he asked the press "Anyone know why?" in a smart ass way because he knew of the heat involved in letting Trammell go. Total lack of respect.

Speaking of Larry Parrish, he's a very classy guy. When he was fired after 1999 he stayed in the organization as an advance scout then took over the Toledo team again a couple of years later. When their seasons are done he's always brought up to help coach the ML team as a reward. He's one of those guys who is always smiling. I say that just to spread some cheer. Lots of good guys in baseball who do not get the attention they deserve.

PaleHoseGeorge
09-01-2007, 10:48 AM
I wouldn't be too upset if a manager and GM of a certain other team were canned.

Garner lost his job because he is a lousy manager who ALWAYS made his rants personal. Milwaukee... Detroit... Houston... Even during the World Series he was losing his cool in destructive ways... calling out specific ballplayers for failing in the clutch. His stupidity is only exceeded by Drayton McLane for getting rid of the only manager and general manager who ever led his wretched franchise to a pennant in 40+ pathetic major league seasons.

Ozzie is incoherent. It makes him more effective as a manager; not less. Be careful not to get it backwards.

The time to get personal with a ballplayer is after THIS season ends and before next season begins. There will be changes. Count on it.

voodoochile
09-01-2007, 10:54 AM
Garner lost his job because he is a lousy manager who ALWAYS made his rants personal. Milwaukee... Detroit... Houston... Even during the World Series he was losing his cool in destructive ways... calling out specific ballplayers for failing in the clutch. His stupidity is only exceeded by Drayton McLane for getting rid of the only manager and general manager who ever led his wretched franchise to a pennant in 40+ pathetic major league seasons.

Ozzie is incoherent. It makes him more effective as a manager; not less. Be careful not to get it backwards.

The time to get personal with a ballplayer is after THIS season ends and before next season begins. There will be changes. Count on it.

And the Astros have been redhot since scrap iron got fired. Guess they were letting their feelings show about their manager and the horse he road in on...

russ99
09-05-2007, 07:55 AM
And the Astros have been redhot since scrap iron got fired. Guess they were letting their feelings show about their manager and the horse he road in on...

I think that had a lot more to do with the Astros getting Hunter Pence back from the DL. But still, a lot of players were disgruntled with Garner giving lots of playing time to certain players who didn't deserve it. Cooper seems a lot more even-handed.

Things are looking better for the Astros, they just got Brandon Backe back from a long DL stint, and if he and phenom Troy Patton can shore up the middle part of the starting staff next year, that's 2 less starters they need to get in the offseason. Williams and Jennings hopefully won't be asked back.

They still have to figure out what to do with C, SS and 2B, with Burke getting an extended shot at starting every day and they should re-sign Loretta just in case. They could also use another outfielder, preferably someone with speed and could move Pence to RF for a new CF.