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View Full Version : How is SEA winning?


soxinem1
08-11-2007, 01:31 PM
How are the Mariners doing it? Going into tonight's game against our White Sox, they have only outscored their opposition by eleven runs, they are 10th in ERA and HR's, sixth in runs, last in put outs....

They are sixth in runs scored, but other than Ichiro, that line up is not very scary.

And the rotation? Kid K has been very hittable, Weaver is among the league leader in losses and high ERA, Ramirez is 7-3 with an era over 7.00, and if Miguel Batista is your ERA leader, you know you have issues.

So how are they doing it?

Looks like bullpen and lack of errors. Putz, Sherrill, and that kid Morrow throw bullets. Sean Green and Eric O'Flaherty have been excellent too.

The M's are right there with NYY and other for the WC spot, and hanging close to LAA for the West Division lead.

Does anyone recall a team with such a strange mixture like this even being close to first place this late in the season?

It just goes to show if you don't make many errors and have a decent bullpen, you can at least contend. None of the so-called experts saw this coming.

jdm2662
08-11-2007, 01:40 PM
Does anyone recall a team with such a strange mixture like this even being close to first place this late in the season?



Yes. The 1990 White Sox.

No .300 hitter
No player with more than 18 hrs
No player with more than 74 rbis
No starter with more than 14 wins
Their best position player was a 42-year-old catcher

The team won 94 games.

They had lots of speed, youth, and didn't make a whole lot of mistakes. No one knew how they were winning. They just did. Having a lights out bullpen of course didn't hurt.

soxinem1
08-11-2007, 01:44 PM
Yes. The 1990 White Sox.

No .300 hitter
No player with more than 18 hrs
No player with more than 74 rbis
No starter with more than 14 wins
Their best position player was a 42-year-old catcher

The team won 94 games.

They had lots of speed, youth, and didn't make a whole lot of mistakes. No one knew how they were winning. They just did. Having a lights out bullpen of course didn't hurt.

I thought of them, but their starting pitching was excellent, along with the pen. I think they were a lot better in SB's too.

SpartanSoxFan
08-11-2007, 01:51 PM
Seattle has decent starting pitching, a lights-out closer, and, oh yeah, that guy they call Ichiro leading off and hitting .350. Sounds like a simple recipe to me.

oeo
08-11-2007, 02:09 PM
Seattle has decent starting pitching, a lights-out closer, and, oh yeah, that guy they call Ichiro leading off and hitting .350. Sounds like a simple recipe to me.

Decent? It's only better than Tampa Bay's and Texas' in the AL. They have a good lineup and a great bullpen...that's how they're winning. They stay in the game with their offense and their bullpen keeps it there, giving them time to come back in games.

They're no good on the road, so that shows you how much that park means to their starting pitching.

nedlug
08-11-2007, 02:09 PM
Plus, only 18-17 in one-run games...

KempersRS
08-11-2007, 02:13 PM
Not to hijack the thread, but speaking of "how are they doing it?"...

The D-Backs are getting outscored by their opponents 516-495 (21 runs) on the season and they are current 15 games OVER .500.

Good thing those 1 run wins and 10+ run losses all count the same.

And the last place Giants are only getting outscored by 10 runs and they are 16 games BELOW .500.

soxinem1
08-11-2007, 02:21 PM
Seattle has decent starting pitching, a lights-out closer, and, oh yeah, that guy they call Ichiro leading off and hitting .350. Sounds like a simple recipe to me.

Is this really decent? These are their starters to date:


Washburn 4.30 ERA 8-9
Batista 4.17 11-8
Hernandez 3.97 8-6
Weaver 6.20 3-10
Ramirez 7.12 7-3
Baek 5.74 3-3
Feierabend 8.47 1-4

Plus, their run differential is only eleven. But their pen is great.

I think this just shows how important bullpens have become.

Gavin
08-11-2007, 02:28 PM
yes but what is the standard of deviation between the margin of victory / loss. it must be high

SpartanSoxFan
08-11-2007, 03:20 PM
Perhaps I should clarify what I meant. By "decent starting pitching," I should've said "good enough." Batista, Washburn, and Hernandez are all solid, and they have 2 guys at the back end who aren't (Weaver and Ramierez).

TheVulture
08-11-2007, 03:21 PM
Yes. The 1990 White Sox.



To be fair, though, that Sox team's starting rotation was fairly good. Hibbard went 14-9 3.16, McDowell 14-9 3.82, Eric King 12-4 3.28, Melido Perez 13-14 4.61 and young Alex Fernandez came up late season to go 5-5 3.80 in 13 starts. The team ERA was 2nd in the AL at 3.61. Also, the team featured Ron Karkovice, so that accounts for about 20-25 wins right there.

soxinem1
08-11-2007, 03:49 PM
To be fair, though, that Sox team's starting rotation was fairly good. Hibbard went 14-9 3.16, McDowell 14-9 3.82, Eric King 12-4 3.28, Melido Perez 13-14 4.61 and young Alex Fernandez came up late season to go 5-5 3.80 in 13 starts. The team ERA was 2nd in the AL at 3.61. Also, the team featured Ron Karkovice, so that accounts for about 20-25 wins right there.

Karko was a back up on that team. Do you think he was accountable for 20-25 more wins, versus............?

I don't remember him winning the Cy Young that year.

Domeshot17
08-11-2007, 04:42 PM
Best defensive team up the middle, that means a lot. C-2b-SS-CF all could be gold glovers. When you have that kind of defense, an offense and staff that can keep you in games, and a bullpen that doesn't blow games, you can win.

TheVulture
08-11-2007, 05:55 PM
Karko was a back up on that team. Do you think he was accountable for 20-25 more wins, versus............?


At least 20-25 games minimum.:D:

rowand33
08-11-2007, 07:24 PM
how is Seattle winning?

Well, for one, they get to play games where Gavin Floyd is the opposing pitcher.

That has to help.

palehozenychicty
08-12-2007, 03:28 PM
Best defensive team up the middle, that means a lot. C-2b-SS-CF all could be gold glovers. When you have that kind of defense, an offense and staff that can keep you in games, and a bullpen that doesn't blow games, you can win.


That is the reason. They have excellent defense and a good bullpen, which they showed this weekend.

WLL1855
08-12-2007, 08:35 PM
How are the Mariners doing it? Going into tonight's game against our White Sox, they have only outscored their opposition by eleven runs, they are 10th in ERA and HR's, sixth in runs, last in put outs....

They are sixth in runs scored, but other than Ichiro, that line up is not very scary.

And the rotation? Kid K has been very hittable, Weaver is among the league leader in losses and high ERA, Ramirez is 7-3 with an era over 7.00, and if Miguel Batista is your ERA leader, you know you have issues.

So how are they doing it?

Looks like bullpen and lack of errors. Putz, Sherrill, and that kid Morrow throw bullets. Sean Green and Eric O'Flaherty have been excellent too.

The M's are right there with NYY and other for the WC spot, and hanging close to LAA for the West Division lead.

Does anyone recall a team with such a strange mixture like this even being close to first place this late in the season?

It just goes to show if you don't make many errors and have a decent bullpen, you can at least contend. None of the so-called experts saw this coming.

It isn't what you do, but when you do it. Have at it you calculator sex obesessed nimrods.

WLL1855
08-12-2007, 08:36 PM
How are the Mariners doing it? Going into tonight's game against our White Sox, they have only outscored their opposition by eleven runs, they are 10th in ERA and HR's, sixth in runs, last in put outs....

They are sixth in runs scored, but other than Ichiro, that line up is not very scary.

And the rotation? Kid K has been very hittable, Weaver is among the league leader in losses and high ERA, Ramirez is 7-3 with an era over 7.00, and if Miguel Batista is your ERA leader, you know you have issues.

So how are they doing it?

Looks like bullpen and lack of errors. Putz, Sherrill, and that kid Morrow throw bullets. Sean Green and Eric O'Flaherty have been excellent too.

The M's are right there with NYY and other for the WC spot, and hanging close to LAA for the West Division lead.

Does anyone recall a team with such a strange mixture like this even being close to first place this late in the season?

It just goes to show if you don't make many errors and have a decent bullpen, you can at least contend. None of the so-called experts saw this coming.

Nothing to see here. Move along.