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soxfan43
07-26-2007, 01:00 PM
Just read an interesting nugget from CNNSI.com in Jon Heymans column. Apparently some scouts feel that part of Jose's problems could be from a divorce he's going through. I hadn't heard about this at all, but I remember a lot of people saying that they felt a big part of his 2005 success was due to his family finally being over here and with him. Do you guys think a divorce is partially to blame for his +6 ERA?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/jon_heyman/07/24/tuesday.scoop/1.html
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balke
07-26-2007, 01:08 PM
Too personal for a message board IMO. Who needs reasons or excuses right now? He's performing the way he performs. He's been able to turn things around in the past, hopefully he can do it again.

HotelWhiteSox
07-26-2007, 01:13 PM
I don't think so, he still sucked with NY when his family was already back, though he is a mental midget on the mound (can't handle errors behind him and folds in the tough situations) so who knows

eriqjaffe
07-26-2007, 01:14 PM
Apparently some scouts feel that part of Jose's problems could be from a divorce he's going through.Yeah, he's been divorced from his velocity and movement for about a year now.

oeo
07-26-2007, 01:16 PM
I don't think so, he still sucked with NY when his family was already back, though he is a mental midget on the mound (can't handle errors behind him and folds in the tough situations) so who knows

You mean the whole month before he was traded to us? :?:

It wouldn't surprise me in the least bit if this is what's going through his head. His velocity is going back upwards, so he's not hurt. His forkball looked good yesterday. Most of his problem was overusing the fastball, and getting it up. If all he's going to do is throw fastballs, he's not going to be very successful.

When Contreras was at the top of his game, at the end of 2005 and the beginning of 2006, he was oozing with confidence. I think each one of these terrible outings is just going to make the situation worse. If we're not going to dump him, Ozzie needs to be careful with him, and take him out when he starts getting into trouble (even if it's early). Coop said yesterday that he's a 'prideful' guy...he feels he's letting everyone down right now. He needs something (anything) to feel like he's helping the team, and then needs to build upon it. Maybe going to the Mets and being reunited with El Duque would help him, but I doubt they want to take a risk, and who would want to?

Chicken Dinner
07-26-2007, 01:27 PM
His biggest problem seems to be ......ball 1,........ball 2.......meatball HIT!!

oeo
07-26-2007, 01:29 PM
His biggest problem seems to be ......ball 1,........ball 2.......meatball HIT!!

Actually, yesterday his problem was leaving the fastball up with two strikes. Both of Raburn's homeruns were of that case.

Then the Tigers were just hitting everything he was throwing up there at the end of his outing.

Gavin
07-26-2007, 01:44 PM
Divorce issues? I'm sorry, we're still talking about multi-millionaire athletes who only have to show up every fifth day, right?

Give me a break...

soxfan43
07-26-2007, 02:08 PM
Divorce issues? I'm sorry, we're still talking about multi-millionaire athletes who only have to show up every fifth day, right?

Give me a break...


I didn't realize being a multi-millionaire made you immune to having emotions. Obviously going througha divorce isn't totally to blame, but I'm sure its effecting him a little bit. Big frank went through it too, he's admitted it effected him.

Madvora
07-26-2007, 02:10 PM
As far as I've been reading, Jose has said that'd he's felt great before pitching.

From the Trib (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-070725soxbrite,1,851146.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines) today...
"It was the most confident I felt coming out of the bullpen all year," Contreras said. "I thought I was going to have a good outing. I just left a couple of pitches high and nothing was working. I fell behind on the count a few times."

Gavin
07-26-2007, 02:56 PM
I didn't realize being a multi-millionaire made you immune to having emotions. Obviously going througha divorce isn't totally to blame, but I'm sure its effecting him a little bit. Big frank went through it too, he's admitted it effected him.

Yes, obviously it's affecting him. Obviously I don't care as a ticketholder and spectator. He gets paid millions of dollars. Lots of people go through personal struggles; few of them make millions of dollars. If it's too much to handle, don't play; worst of all, though, don't half-ass it.

Play through it or quit.

munchman33
07-26-2007, 03:57 PM
Divorce issues? I'm sorry, we're still talking about multi-millionaire athletes who only have to show up every fifth day, right?

Give me a break...


Not cool man. I don't care how much money you make, home always comes first. It's there before work and after work, and when things are bad, most certainly at work too.

AnkleSox
07-26-2007, 04:25 PM
Not cool man. I don't care how much money you make, home always comes first. It's there before work and after work, and when things are bad, most certainly at work too.

I'm kind of in the middle here. Sure I feel bad for him if he's hurting emotionally, but I'm pretty sure that most of us have had some painful personal issues, and we still have to go to work and do our job. It's acceptable to have a few mess-ups, but if any of us were to be as bad as Jose has been at our jobs, we'd probably have been fired a long time ago.

PatK
07-26-2007, 05:57 PM
I think more of his problems are from the arm angles he's using, or should I say lack thereof?

In 2004 when he was with us and struggling, he relied too heavily on the forkball.

When he got successful, he was mixing up his pitches and arm angles.

Now it seems as though he's going with the sidearm way too much.

KyWhiSoxFan
07-26-2007, 06:20 PM
They need to take him out of the rotation till he finds a new wife.

TDog
07-26-2007, 06:21 PM
It's entirely possible that personal problems could be contributing to Contreras' poor pitching this season.

Some seasons ago, Frank Thomas was having problems, and many Sox fans professed to believe part of the problem was his going through a divorce.

Gavin
07-26-2007, 06:27 PM
I can entirely understand personal problems affecting work performance; I just don't want to go to a game when I know the pitcher can't help but halfass it. Fans are entitled to more from a professional ball club.

Frater Perdurabo
07-26-2007, 09:13 PM
In the Cubune's "Hardball" blog, Phil Rogers is reporting that the Mets haven't given up on Contreras (they prefer Vazquez), but wouldn't give up much for him. I say make the deal anyway.

The salary relief alone would help the Sox fill holes this offseason. Anything the Mets are willing to throw in is gravy.

Also, with this season down the tubes (sigh), it's important to open a spot in the rotation to see if Floyd can figure it out at long last. If at the end of the season he's still sucking, then we know that he's definitely not the answer going into 2008. Forwarned is fore-armed, after all. That's why I'd rather give the remainder of the starts to Floyd instead of Contreras.

oeo
07-26-2007, 09:28 PM
In the Cubune's "Hardball" blog, Phil Rogers is reporting that the Mets haven't given up on Contreras (they prefer Vazquez), but wouldn't give up much for him. I say make the deal anyway.

The salary relief alone would help the Sox fill holes this offseason. Anything the Mets are willing to throw in is gravy.

I really think the best thing for Contreras would be to be reunited with El Duque, as well as pitch in the NL. Even if we have to pay some of his salary, I say get something done...we can't keep throwing this guy out there every 5th day.

SOXfnNlansing
07-26-2007, 10:36 PM
I didn't know he was getting divorced. He was with is wife and kids in TB last month:?:

JB98
07-26-2007, 10:36 PM
I can entirely understand personal problems affecting work performance; I just don't want to go to a game when I know the pitcher can't help but halfass it. Fans are entitled to more from a professional ball club.

I don't think Jose is half-assing it. I think he is performing very poorly, but I also believe he is trying.

julio-cruz
07-26-2007, 10:47 PM
I really think the best thing for Contreras would be to be reunited with El Duque, as well as pitch in the NL. Even if we have to pay some of his salary, I say get something done...we can't keep throwing this guy out there every 5th day.


I agree with this. Hopefully El Duque is pressing hard (towards Omar Minaya)to get this done as well. Just when he was with the Yankees, Contrearas is really in a mental rut. It seems that the only time he really rose above that was with someone with higher self confidence and familiarity (El Duque). These atheletes are people after all, and the people that surround them really can have a negative or positive effect on the outcome.
I do think that Jose is probably really feeling the effects of the divorce-- how could it not effect him?

Frater Perdurabo
07-26-2007, 10:52 PM
but I also believe he is trying.

Yes, he is trying. Very trying... :tongue: :(:

decolores9628
07-26-2007, 10:55 PM
Just because someone isn't playing well doesn't mean he doesnt care or isn't trying. Hes probably overthrowing now because of all the bad outings adding up, add the divorce to that and its just not good. Its not like its all his fault we aren't going to the playoffs this year.

thomas35forever
07-26-2007, 11:04 PM
They need to take him out of the rotation till he finds a new wife.
In today's "Notes" section on the team's web site, there was talk of him possibly moving to the bullpen due to his recent struggles. Wouldn't surprise me if this happened sooner than later if he isn't traded.

soxfan43
07-27-2007, 10:26 AM
I think the key to him being moved is how much of his salary the Sox will pick up. I'm sure JR doesn't want to pick up much, but if you replace Jose with Floyd or Haeger in the rotation, you would be saving so much money there. Hopefully that would push Jerry to OK paying some of his salary, so we can ship him out.

Juice16
07-27-2007, 10:41 AM
I didn't realize being a multi-millionaire made you immune to having emotions. Obviously going througha divorce isn't totally to blame, but I'm sure its effecting him a little bit. Big frank went through it too, he's admitted it effected him.

I'm glad you said something, i couldn't believe I read that. Didn't Frank have the same situation a few years back?

soxfan43
07-27-2007, 11:54 AM
I'm glad you said something, i couldn't believe I read that. Didn't Frank have the same situation a few years back?


Yes, he went through what I think was a nasty one. He got cleaned out, and I believe I read that his contract with Toronto he got a ton of money upfront.

upperdeckusc
07-31-2007, 12:06 AM
anyone hear or read about any updates on the jose contreras trade-front? i think we need to move him more than we need to move dye.

JB98
07-31-2007, 12:21 AM
I think it's possible Contreras could be dealt in an August waiver deal. Jose's value is very low right now, and I think KW and the Sox hope he can put a few good starts together to rebuild his worth. That is why Jose is remaining in the rotation, despite his massive struggles.

Given Jose's hefty salary, I don't think it would be real hard to get him through waivers.

He could be dealt tomorrow, but I'd be a bit surprised.

ilsox7
07-31-2007, 12:22 AM
I think it's possible Contreras could be dealt in an August waiver deal. Jose's value is very low right now, and I think KW and the Sox hope he can put a few good starts together to rebuild his worth. That is why Jose is remaining in the rotation, despite his massive struggles.

Given Jose's hefty salary, I don't think it would be real hard to get him through waivers.

He could be dealt tomorrow, but I'd be a bit surprised.

I think the Sox would be thrilled if he didn't clear waivers. That means they let him go and have no obligation for any of his remaining salary.

JB98
07-31-2007, 12:26 AM
I think the Sox would be thrilled if he didn't clear waivers. That means they let him go and have no obligation for any of his remaining salary.

I think they'd like to get something for him, but yeah, they would probably be pretty pleased to get rid of that contract and free up that money.

ilsox7
07-31-2007, 12:29 AM
I think they'd like to get something for him, but yeah, they would probably be pretty pleased to get rid of that contract and free up that money.

I think the only way they get something for him is by paying a chunk of his remaining salary. If they could clear $20MM, that may be worth more to the organization b/c it allows them to invest it elsewhere (Gar?). It's sad b/c Jose has been one of my favorite players and a guy I really respect, but he has just struggled mightily. Hopefully he turns it around for us, but if KW can get rid of him for a piece of our future or clear his entire salary, I think he'd have done well.

JB98
07-31-2007, 12:39 AM
I think the only way they get something for him is by paying a chunk of his remaining salary. If they could clear $20MM, that may be worth more to the organization b/c it allows them to invest it elsewhere (Gar?). It's sad b/c Jose has been one of my favorite players and a guy I really respect, but he has just struggled mightily. Hopefully he turns it around for us, but if KW can get rid of him for a piece of our future or clear his entire salary, I think he'd have done well.

I'm also a Jose fan. It just kills me to see him struggling like this. Watching him pitch is sort of like watching your family pet mope around the last few days before you have to put him down. It sucks.

ilsox7
07-31-2007, 12:49 AM
I'm also a Jose fan. It just kills me to see him struggling like this. Watching him pitch is sort of like watching your family pet mope around the last few days before you have to put him down. It sucks.

That's a good way to put it. I have a feeling we will see him in a Sox uniform the next two years, though. So hopefully whatever is wrong with him can be fixed this winter.