PDA

View Full Version : Gavin Floyd now starter game 2/DH


letsgosox1592
07-23-2007, 11:33 AM
A day later MLB's preview for the Sox now have Gavin Floyd starting and no Charlie Haeger.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070722&content_id=2102201&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

letsgosox1592
07-23-2007, 11:36 AM
I really wanted to see Haeger pitch and now I'm pissed...If Gavin gets rocked again I will be pissed. Hopefully he does well.

Martinigirl
07-23-2007, 11:37 AM
I was much happier when I thought I was going to see Haeger. I have very little faith in Floyd.

Jerko
07-23-2007, 11:39 AM
It has to better than the last "2nd game of a doubleheader" he started. Doesn't it? Doesn't it?????????????? Well Haeger had to throw 60 some pitches yesterday because the walk machine that was wearing Jon Garland's jersey could not get anybody out. :angry::angry:

soxinem1
07-23-2007, 11:45 AM
I hate to say this, but I don't really care who starts. Thornton or Sisco could start and I'm not sure what it does to better the team situation.

areilly
07-23-2007, 01:20 PM
I hate to say this, but I don't really care who starts. Thornton or Sisco could start and I'm not sure what it does to better the team situation.

Agreed. All I'm hoping is that the Sox magically find a way to avoid a five-game sweep.

Chicken Dinner
07-23-2007, 01:42 PM
I just hope that the opponents don't score more than 30 runs in one day. :o:

Sargeant79
07-23-2007, 01:44 PM
Did I miss something? When did Floyd get called back up? And what was the corresponding roster move?

TDog
07-23-2007, 01:46 PM
No one should have been expecting Haeger to start Tuesday after he came on in middle relief Sunday. If Floyd doesn't do well, I expect he will stay up to work out of the bullpen.

oeo
07-23-2007, 01:48 PM
It has to better than the last "2nd game of a doubleheader" he started. Doesn't it? Doesn't it?????????????? Well Haeger had to throw 60 some pitches yesterday because the walk machine that was wearing Jon Garland's jersey could not get anybody out. :angry::angry:

That's two double headers that Garland has ****ed up the plans for this year.

salty99
07-23-2007, 01:52 PM
Did I miss something? When did Floyd get called back up? And what was the corresponding roster move?

I'm sure Day or Wassermann would be dumped back down.

Chicken Dinner
07-23-2007, 02:22 PM
I'm sure Day or Wassermann would be dumped back down.

Wassermann hasn't had a true try-out yet. Day is the logical move.

MetroPD
07-23-2007, 02:24 PM
maybe we could get Uribe to throw a couple of innings........

jenn2080
07-23-2007, 02:30 PM
Seriously why do they have to ruin the second game. I was much happier going tomorrow knowing Charlie was pitching.

kittle42
07-23-2007, 03:24 PM
Seriously why do they have to ruin the second game. I was much happier going tomorrow knowing Charlie was pitching.

Since when is Charlie Haeger the second coming of Hoyt Wilhelm? His AAA ERA was bad. He hasn't shown all that much at the big league level.

One does not become good just because everyone else around him is even more horrible.

Frontman
07-23-2007, 03:28 PM
Can we just forfeit the second game?

jenn2080
07-23-2007, 03:41 PM
Since when is Charlie Haeger the second coming of Hoyt Wilhelm? His AAA ERA was bad. He hasn't shown all that much at the big league level.

One does not become good just because everyone else around him is even more horrible.


Pretty positive I did not say that.

kittle42
07-23-2007, 03:59 PM
Pretty positive I did not say that.

I knew I shouldn't have quoted you.

I was directing it toward anyone on this site who seems to think Haeger is the answer to any question other than, "Who is that crappy knuchleballer we have?"

jenn2080
07-23-2007, 04:02 PM
I knew I shouldn't have quoted you.

I was directing it toward anyone on this site who seems to think Haeger is the answer to any question other than, "Who is that crappy knuchleballer we have?"


I think that after Gavin's last perfomance people are not to keen on seeing him again. I certainly am not. I think that is what everyone's point was.

Nellie_Fox
07-23-2007, 04:02 PM
I knew I shouldn't have quoted you.

I was directing it toward anyone on this site who seems to think Haeger is the answer to any question other than, "Who is that crappy knuchleballer we have?"I disagree, I think Haeger can be a real asset, but then I'm wrong more often than I'm right.

thomas35forever
07-23-2007, 04:05 PM
Can we just forfeit the second game?
Maybe, if we decide to blow up disco records again.

Hitmen77
07-23-2007, 04:07 PM
I actually want to see Floyd pitch on Tuesday. Like it or not, the Sox are going to give this guy a chance at the rotation at some point. He's out of options next year - so they either have to keep him on the 25 man roster next April or "outright" him or trade him by opening day.

I want to see what this guy has got and whether he can actually have some success in the big leagues NOW when we're already out of the race as opposed to avoiding him until next April when hopefully the Sox plan to be competitive again. I know some of you guys are ready to "forfeit" a game rather than at least try to begin to see if any of these guys who are having success at AAA can succeed in the majors, but I disagree.

JermaineDye05
07-23-2007, 04:16 PM
what's with the love fest for Haeger? Granted I like him too, but I don't see why Gavin shouldn't get another shot. He had one bad start for us against a Twinkie offense which was hitting everything that day. Gavin's minor league numbers have been very nice (7-3 3.12 ERA 96 SO 35 BB). Haeger's numbers haven't been too well this season in AAA (4-11 4.81 ERA 92 SO 57 BB). Charlie also had 1 start for us in 2006 and didn't fair too well (5 ER in 4.1 IP). Give Gavin another shot I say he deserves it.

soxtalker
07-23-2007, 04:18 PM
I also want to see Floyd pitch. And even if doesn't do too well, I want to see him pitch a few more times. He had a nice streak in the minors. The rest of the season is going to be rough to watch, but at least it is an opportunity for these young pitchers to learn at the major league level.

Corlose 15
07-23-2007, 04:22 PM
Haeger has pitched well in the big leagues so far.

He had a 3.44 ERA in his time last year in 18.1 innings and thus far in 9 innings this year he has a 3.00 ERA. Considerably better than most of his colleagues in the pen.

I'm not sure why we need to compare the two. If I had my way I'd trade Contreras and put Floyd in his spot for the rest of the year and keep Haeger in the pen the rest of the year.

Chicken Dinner
07-23-2007, 04:26 PM
IIRC Gavin gave up 6 runs in 5.2 innings in the second game against the Twinks. Garland gave up 12 in 3.2 in the 1st game. Looks like Floyd might be pitching the day game.

balke
07-23-2007, 04:27 PM
Did Coop "Fix-em" yet? Floyd was a bad move, but with Garcia out its a wash. It is actually pretty nice that the Sox don't have Garcia's extra salary looming over their heads right now.

esbrechtel
07-23-2007, 10:33 PM
Maybe, if we decide to blow up disco records again.
:rolling:

oeo
07-23-2007, 10:35 PM
Haeger has pitched well in the big leagues so far.

He had a 3.44 ERA in his time last year in 18.1 innings and thus far in 9 innings this year he has a 3.00 ERA. Considerably better than most of his colleagues in the pen.

I'm not sure why we need to compare the two. If I had my way I'd trade Contreras and put Floyd in his spot for the rest of the year and keep Haeger in the pen the rest of the year.

I'm sure if Kenny had it his way, he'd do the same. The only problem is, we need someone to take him.

santo=dorf
07-23-2007, 10:36 PM
Did Coop "Fix-em" yet? Floyd was a bad move, but with Garcia out its a wash. It is actually pretty nice that the Sox don't have Garcia's extra salary looming over their heads right now.
Yeah because they money was really spent well on Crede, Hall, Podsednik and our big free agent acquisition, Darin Erstad.

Martinigirl
07-23-2007, 10:54 PM
Looks like Floyd might be pitching the day game.

Where did you hear this? I would be thrilled to see Garland as opposed to Floyd.

chisoxjtrain
07-23-2007, 10:56 PM
on the white sox website where the schedule is on the right side of the screen, it says floyd is pitching for the first game.

Frontman
07-24-2007, 07:57 AM
on the white sox website where the schedule is on the right side of the screen, it says floyd is pitching for the first game.

Well, then we at least have a shot at winning game 2.......

Jaffar
07-24-2007, 08:02 AM
I was looking forward to him pitching the 2nd game so I could see him on tv since I missed his last start. I haven't seen him throw since ST so I'd like to see how he looks.

Edit* I looked at the Sox website and it has Javy going at 1:05 with Floyd pitching game 2.....

balke
07-24-2007, 08:24 AM
Yeah because they money was really spent well on Crede, Hall, Podsednik and our big free agent acquisition, Darin Erstad.

Well, it could be a big contributor to resigning Buehrle. And its an extra 9+ million this team has to work with

Martinigirl
07-24-2007, 12:23 PM
Javy? What happened to Garland?

oeo
07-24-2007, 12:24 PM
Javy? What happened to Garland?

He pitched on Sunday...his next start isn't until Friday.

jabrch
07-24-2007, 12:48 PM
Did Coop "Fix-em" yet? Floyd was a bad move, but with Garcia out its a wash. It is actually pretty nice that the Sox don't have Garcia's extra salary looming over their heads right now.

We freed up a 9mm boatanchor and we added Gio Gonzalez. I'm not sure how that's a bad move.

upperdeckusc
07-24-2007, 12:55 PM
Wassermann hasn't had a true try-out yet. Day is the logical move.

from what i saw from yesterdays detroit game, i really like his makeup. as long as he doesnt walk ppl (i dont think he had many in the minors), he could be very effective. hopefully best case scenario he can become like a pat neshek and be effective because of his motion. he had some good offspeed stuff around 72-73, then a fastball at 90 on the hands. i hope he does get some full innings to work and prove himself. on that note, i truly have NO idea how dewon day piled up all those K's in AA. he has a fastball and a slider. neither is overpowering. also, aj does a terrible job at pitch-calling with him. it seems like he throws a slider every pitch until its 3-0 then here come meatballs. haeger and wasserman give me hope that a FEW of these young arms can pan out. i wouldnt mind seeing wasserman in our bullpen this yr and yrs to come and and haeger as our 5th starter next yr as well after we trade contreras and to give gio one more yr to mature before he comes up.

kittle42
07-24-2007, 01:16 PM
Ugh. More of this Haeger junk.

Chicken Dinner
07-24-2007, 01:22 PM
Any word of the roster move or are they waiting until the night game?

thomas35forever
07-24-2007, 02:59 PM
:rowand
"What's with all this Haeger love? Have I been forgotten about already?"

santo=dorf
07-24-2007, 04:13 PM
We freed up a 9mm boatanchor and we added Gio Gonzalez. I'm not sure how that's a bad move.
Gonzalez's value was HIGHER when the Sox moved him as opposed to when they traded for him. That's a loss.

What kind of magically beans did Kenny spend that $9 million on?

santo=dorf
07-24-2007, 04:19 PM
Well, it could be a big contributor to resigning Buehrle. And its an extra 9+ million this team has to work with
No it doesn't because Buehrle was already signed for this year and Garcia wasn't signed for next year.

The following players were arbitration eligible after the 2006 season:
Crede, Riske, Alex Cintron, and Scott Podsednik.
None of those players are helping the Sox this year. Three of them are on the team and are combining to waste $9.8 million. Is that where Garcia's money went?
The Sox's only free agent signings were Erstad and Hall. They are combining to be a $2.75 million waste of money.

spawn
07-24-2007, 04:27 PM
I think that after Gavin's last perfomance people are not to keen on seeing him again. I certainly am not. I think that is what everyone's point was.
I want to see Floyd pitch again. The guy gave up some long balls agains the Twins. Who on the Sox pitching staff right now hasn't? Danks has given up plenty. I'm not ready to cast the guy aside just yet. He's pitched one official major league game in a Sox uniform, and already everyone wants him lynched.

The Immigrant
07-24-2007, 04:34 PM
What kind of magically beans did Kenny spend that $9 million on?

He spent it on salary escalators for guys like Buehrle ($3.5m), Garland ($3m), Crede ($2m), A.J. ($1.5m), as well as Dye, Uribe, Podsednik and Contreras ($1m each). MacDougal and Cintron also got big raises, and Hall is paid a lot more than his predecessors at backup catcher.

balke
07-24-2007, 04:35 PM
No it doesn't because Buehrle was already signed for this year and Garcia wasn't signed for next year.

The following players were arbitration eligible after the 2006 season:
Crede, Riske, Alex Cintron, and Scott Podsednik.
None of those players are helping the Sox this year. Three of them are on the team and are combining to waste $9.8 million. Is that where Garcia's money went?
The Sox's only free agent signings were Erstad and Hall. They are combining to be a $2.75 million waste of money.

Injuries are going to happen every season, no matter who the Sox put on the field. Name me a team that doesn't have them. That doesn't equate to being a waste of money.

10 million dollars right now are not being spent on Garcia, end of story. Did that money help re-sign Buehrle, or was it "blown" on Crede and Pods and Cintron? Doesn't really matter, those players would most likely still be here if Garcia had stayed. But, the exchange financially looks really good right now with what happened to Garcia. I was against letting Garcia go, but I wasn't aware he was having arm troubles last season. I was overseas and only saw games on Sundays. Some posters here said it was obvious. I just thought he was possibly struggling.

JB98
07-24-2007, 06:13 PM
Any word of the roster move or are they waiting until the night game?

Day was optioned to Charlotte today to make room for Floyd.

UserNameBlank
07-24-2007, 07:08 PM
Gavin Floyd needs to shave that hideous neck fuzz and forget the whole beard idea. He looks like an adolescent wolfman and kind of reminds me of an episode of Beavis and Butthead from back in the day when they cut off chunks of their hair and glued it to their faces.

Tragg
07-24-2007, 07:11 PM
Cintron also got big raises Why?

Lip Man 1
07-24-2007, 10:37 PM
User:

Gavin apparently pitches like Bevis and Butthead as well!

:D:

Lip

ndgt10
07-24-2007, 10:51 PM
I know he's given up a few runs in his first couple starts, but he has some wicked stuff. 5 K's today against the Tigers. Not bad at all. This guy is going to be making hitters look silly for a long time to come.

Hitmen77
07-24-2007, 11:01 PM
I wasn't too impressed today with Floyd, but I do want to see him have some more starts with the Sox this year.

I'd rather the Sox find out now if Floyd isn't showing any improvement.... or if he indeed can succeed up here. The alternative is for the Sox to just let Floyd rack up impressive stats at AAA for the rest of the year and have KW go into the '08 season thinking Floyd is the answer to our 5th starter question.

Tragg
07-24-2007, 11:01 PM
5Ks and no walks tells me he can make this bullpen.

But I didnt' see Flyed pitch, so I have no idea what he really has.

kittle42
07-24-2007, 11:07 PM
5Ks and no walks tells me he can make this bullpen.

But I didnt' see Flyed pitch, so I have no idea what he really has.

He has the mound presence of that kid from Rookie of the Year.

It was kinda funny being at the gym today and watching Kip Wells throw on one TV and watching Kip Wells II throw on the other.

Huisj
07-24-2007, 11:09 PM
Sure, the k's and walks look good, but got hammered anyway. He left tons of pitches right out over the plate on a platter for them to hit.

y2j2785
07-24-2007, 11:10 PM
This kid can be nasty, but right now he's a headcase and doesnt have the mentality to pitch up here.

ilsox7
07-24-2007, 11:10 PM
Sure, the k's and walks look good, but got hammered anyway. He left tons of pitches right out over the plate on a platter for them to hit.

I missed the part of the game that Floyd pitched, but keep in mind that the Tigers are a damn good hitting team. And walking no one shows he is at least throwing strikes. For Gavin, that seems to be a solid step forward. Does that mean he is going to be a major league pitcher? Not necessarily. But at least he did some good things tonight.

rdivaldi
07-24-2007, 11:16 PM
It's really a judgment call on the Sox. Do they leave him up in the majors and learn on the job? It's tough to become a solid major league starter in Charlotte. Sadly, this season appears to give us a chance to evaluate talent for the last 2 months or so.

julio-cruz
07-24-2007, 11:19 PM
Good to see Gary Shefield get hit:D:; even if it was accidental.
Gavin should get as much major league experience as possible when one of the starters are finally traded. Really want to see what he looks like when he has full command of each pitch.
But, yeah, he hung many of his pitches. If he gets his confidence and command together, he will be something. But that is a big if!

oeo
07-24-2007, 11:20 PM
I know he's given up a few runs in his first couple starts, but he has some wicked stuff. 5 K's today against the Tigers. Not bad at all. This guy is going to be making hitters look silly for a long time to come.

If he wasn't such a mental midget, he could be quite the starter. He gets himself in trouble and cannot work out of it...instead makes the situation worse. For instance, the first inning he hits Sheffield. Instead of getting the next out quickly, he forgets to keep an eye on Sheffield, who steals second and before you know it, he's losing 1-0.

The guy has some serious confidence issues...who knows if he'll ever get over them. But I do have to say, after he finally got a couple breaking balls over the plate in the 3rd...damn, that thing is nasty. I hope Ozzie and Co. can instill some confidence in the guy, because he can be flat out nasty.

goon
07-24-2007, 11:22 PM
I missed the part of the game that Floyd pitched, but keep in mind that the Tigers are a damn good hitting team. And walking no one shows he is at least throwing strikes. For Gavin, that seems to be a solid step forward. Does that mean he is going to be a major league pitcher? Not necessarily. But at least he did some good things tonight.

That's a good point. Remember, Buehrle gave up 14 Hits, 7 ER (with help from the bullpen) in 6.1 innings yesterday. Gavin didn't walk anybody, great... let's hope he keeps getting better and actually throws a quality start sometime in the near future.

rdivaldi
07-24-2007, 11:23 PM
The guy has some serious confidence issues...who knows if he'll ever get over them.

Well, he should spend the next two months talking to Garland who was our poster child for confidence issues from 2000- 2004.

Do we give him that long?

oeo
07-24-2007, 11:25 PM
Well, he should spend the next two months talking to Garland who was our poster child for confidence issues from 2000- 2004.

Do we give him that long?

I honestly believe Ozzie has a lot to do with Garland's recent success. He showed confidence in Garland, and that's when Garland finally started doing the same. I really hope he can do the same with Gavin, because he can still be quite the pitcher.

Tragg
07-24-2007, 11:28 PM
If he wasn't such a mental midget, he could be quite the starter. He gets himself in trouble and cannot work out of it...instead makes the situation worse. For instance, the first inning he hits Sheffield. Instead of getting the next out quickly, he forgets to keep an eye on Sheffield, who steals second and before you know it, he's losing 1-0.

The guy has some serious confidence issues...who knows if he'll ever get over them. But I do have to say, after he finally got a couple breaking balls over the plate in the 3rd...damn, that thing is nasty. I hope Ozzie and Co. can instill some confidence in the guy, because he can be flat out nasty.
I'm glad to read what you said about the breaking balls. As for getting himself out of trouble, 1/2 the current pen CAN'T do it and are routinely rescued (ahem Buckvich and that phony ERA) so he should fit right in. But he needs to learn how to do it...as someone else mentioned, Garland was inconsistent as hell until 2005. Floyd's had 2 ML appearances for us.

rdivaldi
07-24-2007, 11:28 PM
I honestly believe Ozzie has a lot to do with Garland's recent success. He showed confidence in Garland, and that's when Garland finally started doing the same. I really hope he can do the same with Gavin, because he can still be quite the pitcher.

Ah, so you're referring to Manuel's tendancy to pull Jon the instant he gave up a hit after the 5th inning. That is an interesting theory.

dickallen15
07-24-2007, 11:35 PM
I know he's given up a few runs in his first couple starts, but he has some wicked stuff. 5 K's today against the Tigers. Not bad at all. This guy is going to be making hitters look silly for a long time to come.
And vice versa.

dickallen15
07-24-2007, 11:37 PM
Ah, so you're referring to Manuel's tendancy to pull Jon the instant he gave up a hit after the 5th inning. That is an interesting theory.
Garland has averaged less than 1 inning more per start under Ozzie than he did under Manuel. Most of that talk is Hawk BS. Garland matured as a pitcher and cut his walk rate in half, making him a better pitcher.

CharlieN2008
07-24-2007, 11:42 PM
I like Haeger myself. I guess that is becuase he is a good friend of mine. I was pissed that they scratched him after sunday night game. Gavin and him are friends. I hope they both make it.

WhiteSox5187
07-24-2007, 11:43 PM
Floyd had his moments. He still got hit around pretty good, but he got hit by two of the better hitting teams in the AL (the Twins and Tigers)...Obviously, I'd like to see him pitch a bit more, but yea, he could be good.

CharlieN2008
07-24-2007, 11:46 PM
Since when is Charlie Haeger the second coming of Hoyt Wilhelm? His AAA ERA was bad. He hasn't shown all that much at the big league level.

One does not become good just because everyone else around him is even more horrible.

He was number four in Strike out in the entire MILB AND had the best era in MILB when he was down there last year. You can't help your ERA when your fielding is not helping!!!!

oeo
07-24-2007, 11:49 PM
Floyd had his moments. He still got hit around pretty good, but he got hit by two of the better hitting teams in the AL (the Twins and Tigers)...Obviously, I'd like to see him pitch a bit more, but yea, he could be good.

His major problem was the lack of that breaking ball early on. He really needs to get that thing over for a strike consistently, and that will make the rest of his repertoire that much better. Early in the game, he was throwing mostly fastballs (and that's why Hessman absolutely crushed that one...as Hawk would say, that ball was 'kilt').

If he can get ahead in the count and throw that breaking ball over, he's going to be awfully good. He's very hesitant to throw it when he gets behind/goes full.

The Immigrant
07-25-2007, 09:54 AM
Why?

Because we offered him arbitration and that's how the system works. His raise was *only* $300k from his 2006 salary, BTW.

SBSoxFan
07-25-2007, 10:00 AM
His major problem was the lack of that breaking ball early on. He really needs to get that thing over for a strike consistently, and that will make the rest of his repertoire that much better. Early in the game, he was throwing mostly fastballs (and that's why Hessman absolutely crushed that one...as Hawk would say, that ball was 'kilt').

If he can get ahead in the count and throw that breaking ball over, he's going to be awfully good. He's very hesitant to throw it when he gets behind/goes full.

Didn't Hessman hit a hanging curve ball? Also Floyd hit Sheffield with a curve --- as you said he couldn't throw his curve early. However, no walks and 5 K's is a good sign.

Chicken Dinner
07-25-2007, 10:16 AM
Didn't Hessman hit a hanging curve ball? Also Floyd hit Sheffield with a curve --- as you said he couldn't throw his curve early. However, no walks and 5 K's is a good sign.

The best pitch Floyd threw was the one that hit Sheffield. :cool:

balke
07-25-2007, 10:22 AM
Question:

When do you give up on the idea of Floyd being a starter? Could he be an effective long reliever for the Sox right now and next season? If the Sox had a long reliever who was quality, along with Jenks, Thornton, and Logan that might be enough at this point to have a tolerable bullpen.

Does Floyd HAVE to be a future starter? It just seems like he might fill in the long reliever role really well for the Sox.

SBSoxFan
07-25-2007, 10:57 AM
The best pitch Floyd threw was the one that hit Sheffield. :cool:

hehe, guess he should've used a fastball then! As for people questioning Floyd's psyche, that first inning did seem to rattle him a bit. He looked great --- two easy outs and a 1-2 count on Sheffield, and very nearly striking Sheff out on the previous pitch. If not for the HBP, the no-look SB, and the 2 unearned runs, his line would have looked much better. I kind of agree that his development could go along the line of Garland's, but I'm not sure the Sox are going to give Floyd that much time.

kittle42
07-25-2007, 11:02 AM
He was number four in Strike out in the entire MILB AND had the best era in MILB when he was down there last year. You can't help your ERA when your fielding is not helping!!!!

Yes, but what have you done for me lately?

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=t_ibp&cid=494&stn=true&sid=t494