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kermittheefrog
03-30-2002, 02:44 PM
http://espn.go.com/page2/s/simmons/020328.html

This the kind of crap that annoys me. First of all robo-journalism is not clever and not funny. The thing about Jeter? Well if he READ the Baseball Prospectus he'd know that in the last couple editions the BP has pretty much said the same thing about Jeter "We give him a hard time about his fielding but he's a great player and he could still get better." Maybe I shouldn't get upset because the guy clearly doesn't know enough about the BP to rip it but I hate people talking about statheads like we're from another planet.

czalgosz
03-30-2002, 02:56 PM
I like Simmons - he understands sports isn't a very serious subject, so I enjoy his column.

But he ranks his favorite sports this way -

1) NBA
2) NFL
3) MLB

That, right there, tells you what kind of sports fan he is. Nothing wrong with that, he's just qualitatively different than guys like you and I, Kermit. (BTW, you can rank those in reverse order for me, except you can put the NHL, the PGA, the PBA, the WLAF, the XFL, the WWF, MLS, Sumo, Australian Rules Football, Jai Alai, and Table Tennis as sports I find more entertaining than the NBA.)

kermittheefrog
03-30-2002, 03:03 PM
I like Simmons too but I don't like it when people take shots at things they don't know enough to comment about. For example you're not going to see me talking about the quality of WNBA coaches.

Also, why do people roast statheads so much but blindly accept the NFL's QB rating?

czalgosz
03-30-2002, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I like Simmons too but I don't like it when people take shots at things they don't know enough to comment about. For example you're not going to see me talking about the quality of WNBA coaches.

Also, why do people roast statheads so much but blindly accept the NFL's QB rating?

He does have some valid points about the records becoming meaningless. That's the only thing that I agree with him on. Other than that -

1) If my wife wouldn't let me watch "Baseball Tonight", I would get an immediate divorce.

2) I've never heard anyone but sportswriters complain about baseball games taking too long, but they always act as if it's a universal complaint.

3) As someone who lives on the West Coast, I can tell you that it betrays a smug East Coast bias to complain about World Series games ending at midnight. If they didn't put in 5 minutes of commercials every half-inning, the games wouldn't go so long, and believe me, I'd rather stay up until 1 AM watching a game than miss the first 3 innings because the game started at 4 Pacific time.

TimChamp
03-30-2002, 04:00 PM
Hey, he mentioned GUAM!!! I used to live there...and let me tell you, that would be a bad place to have baseball considering they have so much rain during the spring and summer...like everyday...AND they have some pretty scary storms... :o:

I think this is some funny stuff...this guy is totally retarded...

CerberusWG
03-30-2002, 04:46 PM
I just picked up the Baseball Prspectus today. Pretty freaking cool. I was glancing at the Stats and stuff, and was kind of baffled by the ERA for most players on the Sox was higher than it actually was. Shrug, I'll find out what it means. :D:

czalgosz
03-30-2002, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by CerberusWG
I just picked up the Baseball Prspectus today. Pretty freaking cool. I was glancing at the Stats and stuff, and was kind of baffled by the ERA for most players on the Sox was higher than it actually was. Shrug, I'll find out what it means. :D:

Couple things you should know -

1) The ERA they print is adjusted for a neutral ballpark (as opposed to a hitter's or a pitcher's park.) their philosophy is that you can get the real stats anywhere.

2) A typo resulted in them switching the ERA and PERA. They printed a correction on their website -

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/book/book.shtml

Vsahajpal
03-30-2002, 09:46 PM
Bill Simmons is absolutley correct when he says:

James spawned a number of knockoff artists that took his work to the next level, only without the same feeling and spirit. You know these guys. You've read them. They're condescending, they're comprehensive and they could suck the fun out of an amusement park ride


Its infuriating to read most of those guys, they believe they are God's gift to baseball journalism.

There are definitely some exceptions, apart from Bill James, John Sickels and Rany Jazayerli come to mind.


I do think using sabermetric evaluation is a useful MLB tool, though. But certainly not the only means of evaluation.

czalgosz
03-30-2002, 09:53 PM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal

Its infuriating to read most of those guys, they believe they are God's gift to baseball journalism.

There are definitely some exceptions, apart from Bill James, John Sickels and Rany Jazayerli come to mind.


I do think using sabermetric evaluation is a useful MLB tool, though. But certainly not the only means of evaluation.

Well, that discussion has been had, so I won't rehash it, but you're right.

I like Chris Karhl, but some guys, like Clay Davenport, are just boring. When they start running regressions and showing plot points, it does suck some of the life out of the game.

But Sabermetricians have a point when they point out that managers and GMs could learn something by looking at actual production, as opposed to potential or personality.

kermittheefrog
03-31-2002, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal
Bill Simmons is absolutley correct when he says:

James spawned a number of knockoff artists that took his work to the next level, only without the same feeling and spirit. You know these guys. You've read them. They're condescending, they're comprehensive and they could suck the fun out of an amusement park ride


Its infuriating to read most of those guys, they believe they are God's gift to baseball journalism.

There are definitely some exceptions, apart from Bill James, John Sickels and Rany Jazayerli come to mind.


I do think using sabermetric evaluation is a useful MLB tool, though. But certainly not the only means of evaluation.

Reading the Baseball Prospectus is interesting. In addition to being informative there is definitely a sense of humor in the player comments. I'm not trying to knock anyone here but Baseball America's Prospect Handbook is dry and factual. I understand it's meant to be that way but I can't figure out how one can say the Baseball Prospectus sucks the fun out of an amusement park ride if they've ever read one of BA's top ten prospect lists.