PDA

View Full Version : Can Ozzie please stop the bullpen insanity?


kittle42
04-24-2007, 12:40 AM
I mentioned this in the gamethread. I, for one, am sick and tired of Ozzie pulling the ol' LaRussa lefty/righty matchups every at-bat, especially when these decisions include characters like Sisco and Logan. What's wrong with leaving MacDougal in for a whole inning? It didn't end up in a loss tonight, but I think it's a questionable strategy going forward.

Look at a team like San Diego. They leave Linebrink and Meredith out there for full innings (generally) before Hoffman takes over. I'd like to see more of that from the Sox.

whitesoxfan
04-24-2007, 01:05 AM
Agreed. And then say if one of the bullpen guys blow it, you're screwed in extra innings with hardly any pitchers left.

MacDougal is a good enough reliever to face more than one batter. So is Thornton. So is Aardsma. And I think Sisco is too (hoping that tonight was only an aberation). I love Ozzie to death, but this is easily the number one thing that bugs me the most about him.

oeo
04-24-2007, 01:08 AM
I mentioned this in the gamethread. I, for one, am sick and tired of Ozzie pulling the ol' LaRussa lefty/righty matchups every at-bat, especially when these decisions include characters like Sisco and Logan. What's wrong with leaving MacDougal in for a whole inning? It didn't end up in a loss tonight, but I think it's a questionable strategy going forward.

Look at a team like San Diego. They leave Linebrink and Meredith out there for full innings (generally) before Hoffman takes over. I'd like to see more of that from the Sox.

I agree. I've liked the way Ozzie has been managing the bullpen lately, but today was an exception.

Can we please send Logan down, as well? That guy and his size 30 feet are worthless. I wish Kenny would have tried to get something (anything?) for him while his value was high after Spring Training.

BainesHOF
04-24-2007, 01:16 AM
Every win doesn't have to feature a big production from the bullpen. It's overmanaging.

If a pitcher is getting the job done, leave him in for awhile. And just because Jenks is our closer doesn't mean he has to finish every game even when we have a 2- or 3-run lead.

Eddo144
04-24-2007, 08:23 AM
There was a game two years ago, one of Bobby's first up in the majors, against the Red Sox, where Ozzie misused the pen.

It was about the sixth inning, and the Sox were up by one or tied. Boston had Damon, Renteria, Ortiz coming up, so Ozzie brings in Cotts. Good call. Cotts was nearly unhittable in 2005.

Cotts gets Damon out, which brings up a righty, Renteria. Keep in mind that on the year, righties actually hit for a lower average against Cotts that lefties did. What does Ozzie do? Brings in Jenks, who had been up less than a week. Jenks walks Renteria, bringing up a lefty, Ortiz. Ozzie decides to keep Jenks in to face Big Papi. Result: two run homer.

:rolleyes:

Although, I don't think he's overusing Jenks so far this year. He used Aardsma on Sunday to close out the Tiger game. Even though that didn't work out, it was the right move; Aardsma's been awesome up to this point, so Ozzie trusted him to keep it up.

CRAW
04-24-2007, 08:35 AM
I don't particularly care for it either, but I always say...In Ozzie I Trust. :D:

itsnotrequired
04-24-2007, 08:57 AM
I didn't see a big deal with it in terms of last night's game. Buehrle was done so Sisco came in. He walked two so Ozzie pulled him for MacDougal. Can't fault him there. MacDougal gets out the right-handed Sweeney and then Thornton is brought in to get the lefty. Jenks closed it out.

The only move that can really be questioned is Thornton for MacDougal. Pulling Sisco was a no-brainer. Jenks in the ninth was a no-brainer. Maybe Ozzie felt KC knew MacDougal's stuff too well? Beats me.

spiffie
04-24-2007, 09:08 AM
Every win doesn't have to feature a big production from the bullpen. It's overmanaging.

If a pitcher is getting the job done, leave him in for awhile. And just because Jenks is our closer doesn't mean he has to finish every game even when we have a 2- or 3-run lead.
Of course, when a day like Sunday happens then everyone chimes in, "Why wasn't Bobby in there to close it out?!"

The Immigrant
04-24-2007, 09:08 AM
The only move that can really be questioned is Thornton for MacDougal. Pulling Sisco was a no-brainer. Jenks in the ninth was a no-brainer. Maybe Ozzie felt KC knew MacDougal's stuff too well? Beats me.

He pulled him because Gload came on deck to pinch hit. Ozzie's head might explode if he allowed a RH pitcher to face a LH batter, so he had to act fast.

Jerko
04-24-2007, 09:40 AM
I don't care if Bobby is in there EVERY 9th inning or not, but I DO worry about guys being "unavailable" 3 weeks into the season. Nobody from the pen even pitched last Wed (the no hitter) and by Sunday 2 guys are "unavailable"?? And that's WITH an extra pitcher out there (Logan). What's gonna happen later in the year if we keep using pitchers at this pace? That's my only area of concern.

itsnotrequired
04-24-2007, 09:56 AM
He pulled him because Gload came on deck to pinch hit. Ozzie's head might explode if he allowed a RH pitcher to face a LH batter, so he had to act fast.

And that's why that appears to be the only "matchup" switch of the game. I can live with one of those. If he makes 3 or 4 and the pitchers aren't struggling, then it starts to sound silly.

Jjav829
04-24-2007, 09:56 AM
I mentioned this in the gamethread. I, for one, am sick and tired of Ozzie pulling the ol' LaRussa lefty/righty matchups every at-bat, especially when these decisions include characters like Sisco and Logan. What's wrong with leaving MacDougal in for a whole inning? It didn't end up in a loss tonight, but I think it's a questionable strategy going forward.

Look at a team like San Diego. They leave Linebrink and Meredith out there for full innings (generally) before Hoffman takes over. I'd like to see more of that from the Sox.

In fairness to Ozzie, San Diego does so because they have no quality lefties. The Pads have one lefty in their bullpen, Justin Hampson, who has pitched in 6 career games. Plus, Linebrink is actually better against lefties, so they don't really need to play the matchups.

Chicken Dinner
04-24-2007, 10:03 AM
Ozzie has been using the Lefty/Lefty, Righty/Righty thing since his first day as a manager. He Luv's it.:smile:

champagne030
04-24-2007, 11:10 AM
Of course, when a day like Sunday happens then everyone chimes in, "Why wasn't Bobby in there to close it out?!"

Or MacDougal? Or Thornton?

Aardsma, at this point, should be the fourth option to close games.

Ozzie has been using the Lefty/Lefty, Righty/Righty thing since his first day as a manager. He Luv's it.:smile:

Yes, he has. And probably learned it from LaRussa. The bad thing with Ozzie, and unlike LaRussa, is that he does it even when the numbers and reality don't back him up. See Cotts, Neal or Thornton, Matt. Or RH batters that hit righties better than lefties. See Iguchi, Tadahito or Anderson, Brian.

TDog
04-24-2007, 11:25 AM
I wish other teams' managers wouldn't bring in lefties to face Thome.

D. TODD
04-24-2007, 11:37 AM
He pulled him because Gload came on deck to pinch hit. Ozzie's head might explode if he allowed a RH pitcher to face a LH batter, so he had to act fast. I don't know if Ozzie is always aware of who the opponent has left on the bench. He probably is and I just disagree with his choice, but sometimes I question if Ozzie is taking this into consideration when he reacts to some guy being announced as a pinch hitter. I would much rather have McDougal face Gload then have Thorton face the powerful Reggie Sanders, which is the choice Ozzie should have been considering when Gload was announced to pinch hit.

kittle42
04-24-2007, 01:24 PM
In fairness to Ozzie, San Diego does so because they have no quality lefties. The Pads have one lefty in their bullpen, Justin Hampson, who has pitched in 6 career games. Plus, Linebrink is actually better against lefties, so they don't really need to play the matchups.

Politte was better against lefties and Guillen would still pull this crap with him, though I guess not quite as often.

My point is, I don't think Ozzie actually looks at the numbers, but instead goes on this preconceived notion that a guy MUST be better against a righty hitter because he's an RHP, etc.

pythons007
04-24-2007, 01:39 PM
I don't like the situational pitching either but when the game is on the line you have to do that. Also, when you have a new inning and you have a reliever starting that inning and he walks the first and/or second hitter with a 2 run lead...you have to yank him. That pitcher needs to be shown that walks are unexcusable in those types of situations! MacDougal and Sisco have been doing this lately, just throw strikes! They have good enough stuff to get guys out, but they need to throw strikes. I think they have a great bullpen and everyone of them with PLUS arms. I can't stand when a reliever comes in and walks hitters, there is no reason for it. I believe Ozzie is trying to show them this. If you walk someone, I'm going to take you out. Bottom line throw strikes!

JB98
04-24-2007, 05:47 PM
What concerns me is almost every pitcher in our bullpen has appeared three or four times in the last five days.

Jenks: Four times in the last five days.
MacDougal: Ditto
Aardsma: Three times in the last four days.
Etc., Etc.

Thornton and MacDougal came in to throw a grand total of two pitches each last night. Why make these guys get warmed up in the bullpen EVERY SINGLE NIGHT to come in and face just one batter?

It's working OK now, but I worried about the toll it's going to take over the long haul.

Tragg
04-24-2007, 05:56 PM
Close games in that 10-15 cumulative run range scored use the heck out of a bullpen. Ozzie's matchup hunting might cause a tad of that, but not most. McDougal, Thornton and Jenks have pitched 3/4 games beause they are our 3 best relievers and the games have been close.

A couple of blowout games will take care of the overtaxing the bullpen issue shooting for matchups is a matter of philosophy).