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View Full Version : Fire Nardi Now!


bjmarte
03-20-2002, 01:25 PM
Why isn't Nardi taking more crap for the pitching situation? First, almost every hot young pitcher on the team blows their arm out last year. Now this year half the pitchers coming back from injury can't get their fastball to register on the gun. Why isn't this Nardi's responsibility? Von Joshua was gone last year after a batting slump and nobody looked back. How is Nardi any different?

cheeses_h_rice
03-20-2002, 01:28 PM
Welcome to the White Sox Zone, bj!

foulkesfan11
03-20-2002, 01:29 PM
I agree. He's as much to blame as Joshua was for hitting last year. How long has Nardi been here anyway? I think it's time we said Na Na Hey Hey GOODBYE to Nardi!

pearso66
03-20-2002, 01:32 PM
im sure most other pitching coaches would be fired after what happend to our pitching staff last yaer, sure 1 blown arm can be a fluke, but when you have, what, 6? that has to be the pitching coaches fault, youd think right??
he must have some dirt on reinsdorf

duke of dorwood
03-20-2002, 01:36 PM
Nardi is the managers buddy. Enough said.

No-Neck
03-20-2002, 01:41 PM
I remember Lou Pinellas stating that Nardi was the worst pitching coach he had ever seen in the majors right after the Mariners fired him.

The Sox scored over 13 runs against that years Mariner's team a few times.

And I remember thinking after leaving a game that year (97?) after the Sox scored about 18 runs against Seattle how pitiful their pitchers were.

I feel the same exact way about the White Sox's staff this Spring, and Nardi is the one constant.

This guy should be booted quickly, he's no darn good.

PANFIRECRACKER
03-20-2002, 01:57 PM
If they continue their performance in ST into the "championship" season, we won't have to worry about Nardi too long.

kermittheefrog
03-20-2002, 01:59 PM
I'm not on the fire Nardi bandwagon yet but the one thing I have noticed abotu him is the guys who have had success under him are prodominantly soft tossers, Foulke, Buehrle, Sirotka, Parque, Lowe and Baldwin that I can think of. The only hard thrower the Sox have had be successful under Nardi is Howry and he threw his arm out, I'm not worried about that or any other arm troubles frankly. Arm trouble with pitchers is the nature of the beast. Look at Ryan Anderson and his back-to-back torn labrums. The guy's career might be done now. I am interested to see what Nardi does this year though although not particularly encouraged. We're going to start the season with a rotation with 4 guys who haev good fastballs. What will Nardi do with em?

CiscoCarlos
03-20-2002, 02:36 PM
I concur with all the comments. It's sad that the manager's friend should be fired, but if they don't turn this around by the end of April Nardi should go. The pitching certainly doesn't seem to be getting better. As I'm reading this thread, Wright just gave up four runs in the first inning against the Brewers. Even if Parque is throwing the ball 83 miles an hour he's probably better than Wright game-by-game.

foulkesfan11
03-20-2002, 05:11 PM
I never thought Wright was that good anyway.

RedPinStripes
03-20-2002, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
Nardi is the managers buddy. Enough said.

Yup. That's how White Sox management is. If you're in the circle of friends, you're untouchable. Example: Hawk, KW. Both have Jobs because they're "Jerry's Kids"

bjmarte
03-20-2002, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes


Yup. That's how White Sox management is. If you're in the circle of friends, you're untouchable. Example: Hawk, KW. Both have Jobs because they're "Jerry's Kids"

Fine, then let him broadcast the games or take over the marketing department or tend bar at the Bullpen Sports Bar.

bjmarte
03-20-2002, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by bjmarte


Fine, then let him broadcast the games or take over the marketing department or tend bar at the Bullpen Sports Bar.

I look at the paradox of having a ton of young pitching talent but yet not having enough pitchers in shape to start the season with. How can that be anything but the coach? I feel like we have the talent to turn the pitching problem around, but I don't have any faith in the coach to be able to get them where they need to be without their arms falling off.

Fire Nardi before it's too late!

SOXit2EM
03-20-2002, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by PANFIRECRACKER
If they continue their performance in ST into the "championship" season, we won't have to worry about Nardi too long. I agree.

bc2k
03-21-2002, 12:14 AM
As I said before, Oscar Acosta was available and looking good right about now. The injuries to the pitchers really doesn't get me angry at Nardi. But the fact we have all this young pitching talent who aren't showing their potential or any progress is very frustrating to watch. Since Oscar is taken, anyone for Cal Eldred?

baggio202
03-21-2002, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes


Yup. That's how White Sox management is. If you're in the circle of friends, you're untouchable. Example: Hawk, KW. Both have Jobs because they're "Jerry's Kids"

dont forget the head of scouting..scott ??i wanna say sullivan???..anyways we made a trade with california..sent dan mozingo to the angles..a young lefty that pitched real well last year and had caught the eye od scouts from BA...we traded him and another pitcher for two back up outfielders on cal;i's A team..rancho cucamunga...i wondered long and hard about that trade...why would we even trade two single A players for t wo other single A players???..then i found the answer..one of the guys on the cali team was the son of this sullivan guy...

give up a left handed pitcher for a back up single A outfielder???

baggio202
03-21-2002, 01:05 AM
Originally posted by No-Neck
I remember Lou Pinellas stating that Nardi was the worst pitching coach he had ever seen in the majors right after the Mariners fired him.

The Sox scored over 13 runs against that years Mariner's team a few times.

And I remember thinking after leaving a game that year (97?) after the Sox scored about 18 runs against Seattle how pitiful their pitchers were.

I feel the same exact way about the White Sox's staff this Spring, and Nardi is the one constant.

This guy should be booted quickly, he's no darn good.

do you have a link to this story where pinella said that??..god id love to have it

RichH55
03-21-2002, 02:32 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
As I said before, Oscar Acosta was available and looking good right about now. The injuries to the pitchers really doesn't get me angry at Nardi. But the fact we have all this young pitching talent who aren't showing their potential or any progress is very frustrating to watch. Since Oscar is taken, anyone for Cal Eldred?


Just to play some Devils Advocate(not saying im against firing Nardi), but Buerhle did develop into something of a stud last year, Glover came along nicely....Im not sure exactly when Nardi got here so I cant offer a great summary of his pluses and minuses...but developing pitching has always almost been more luck than skill(never say Pitching Prospect).....I think this is Nardi's decesion year....Develop one of Garland, Rauch, Wright, and have either Glover or Osuna step into the set-up role and alot of problems take care of themselves

kermittheefrog
03-21-2002, 08:30 AM
Oh yeah Cal Eldred that's exactly who we should hire a guy with no experience in the position who isn't even a year out of baseball.

baggio202
03-21-2002, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
Oh yeah Cal Eldred that's exactly who we should hire a guy with no experience in the position who isn't even a year out of baseball.

what about kirk champion..pitching coach for charlotte???...when sean lowe went down last april he notice a slight flaw in sean's delivery...made a minor adjustment and two weeks sean was back with the sox and eventually moved into the rotation..pitched some great games...thats got to be a plus for the guy..nardi didnt notice it

also i remeber in '00 when sean lowe noticed that kieth foulke was tipping his change..this happened right after kieth got hammered for 5 runs against texas pitching with a 6 run lead and howry had to close it out..kieth had about 3 rough outings in a row..sean told him what he saw..he corrected it and got back on track...again...where was nardi???...arnt these things part of his job???

bc2k
03-21-2002, 11:28 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
Oh yeah Cal Eldred that's exactly who we should hire a guy with no experience in the position who isn't even a year out of baseball.

No experience at the position? Who are you, George Karl? A year removed from baseball is an advantage. He knows the pitchers, catchers, and coaches he will be working with. He may not have paid his dues at a lower level, but could he be any worse than Nardi? Cal isn't the best answer (acosta was) but I don't think my statement of Cal for coach was out of line or an irrational suggestion. A little brainstorming, that's all.

kermittheefrog
03-22-2002, 01:43 AM
Originally posted by bc2k


No experience at the position? Who are you, George Karl? A year removed from baseball is an advantage. He knows the pitchers, catchers, and coaches he will be working with. He may not have paid his dues at a lower level, but could he be any worse than Nardi? Cal isn't the best answer (acosta was) but I don't think my statement of Cal for coach was out of line or an irrational suggestion. A little brainstorming, that's all.

Time spent as an instruactor isn't just paying dues buddy. To be a pitching coach you have influence throughout the organization on pitchers. You need to have a philosophy and a plan and I don't think many major leaguers end their careers with plans mapped out for an organization's pitching talent.

bc2k
03-22-2002, 02:29 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


Time spent as an instruactor isn't just paying dues buddy. To be a pitching coach you have influence throughout the organization on pitchers. You need to have a philosophy and a plan and I don't think many major leaguers end their careers with plans mapped out for an organization's pitching talent.

???? When a pitching coach is first hired he doesn't have plans mapped out for an organizations pitching talent. He wouldn't make any prior judgements on pitchers before he has a chance to first see them pitch, and secondly get a chance to work with them.

Being as he spent time with the team, Cal would know more about the sox pitchers than any other pitching coach just coming to the organization. Whether he can become a successful pitching coach has yet to be decided, but to say he doesn't know his organization is just ridiculous.

Oh and what "philosophy" does Nardi preach.

Iguana775
03-22-2002, 09:13 AM
Tommy John??? i heard that name thrown around by a few guys last year. i believe daver was one of them. i dont know much about him but i have heard that he has a pretty good mind/eye when it comes to evaluating pitchers.

pearso66
03-22-2002, 10:00 AM
i wouldnt mind tommy john, or cal when it comes to pitching coach, cal has the respect of the players already, and was a great clubhouse guy. im sure he could be a pretty good pitching coach, and well, tommy john, is just tommy john

Paulwny
03-22-2002, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by Iguana775
Tommy John??? i heard that name thrown around by a few guys last year. i believe daver was one of them. i dont know much about him but i have heard that he has a pretty good mind/eye when it comes to evaluating pitchers.

Tommy John speaking at the Tennessee baseball kickoff banquet, 1/27/02


John, the community relations director for the Class AAA Charlotte Knights, said he is asked about the surgery now more than ever. And that's disconcerting to him.

"One thing that upsets me is I've seen kids that are younger and younger and younger having the surgery," he said.

John said that he serves on the USA Baseball Health and Safety Committee along with Dr. James Andrews, the orthopedic specialist from Birmingham, Ala. John suggested to Andrews that he do a comparative study on training methods past and present.

"Either doctors are operating unconscionably or we in the baseball business are doing something wrong in the training of these athletes," John said. "I think it's the latter."

John thinks today's pitchers suffer under the scrutiny of today's scout and his radar device used to measure the velocity of pitches.

"They pitch to the Jugs gun instead of trying to get somebody out," John said. "They pitch for maximum effort. You don't have to pitch for maximum effort to be successful."

Iwritecode
03-22-2002, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Paulwny
"They pitch to the Jugs gun instead of trying to get somebody out," John said. "They pitch for maximum effort. You don't have to pitch for maximum effort to be successful."

I think that's what :butter has been trying to tell :jerry for awhile now...

Mathew
03-22-2002, 10:21 PM
They are forced to pitch too many innings, too hard, too young. Chris Reistma of the Cinncy Reds is from Calgary and I was at the game when he threw his arm off litteraly. It was really awful to watch. His delivery is still atrocious, but I'm amaised he came back at all.