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View Full Version : Another "curse" to explain the Cubs 2003 collapse


Domeshot17
03-21-2007, 12:25 PM
Espn at it again.

This morning on Cold Pizza they had Bernie Mac on, and explained how HE was the reason they lost because HE called them the CHAMPS in take me out to the ball game. That turned into Alou freaking out a fan caught a foul ball, Gonzalez dropping the double play ball, and Prior collapsing, then Wood getting shelled in game 7

Railsplitter
03-21-2007, 12:52 PM
There is only won curse that leads to prolonged ineptitude among sports teams: the curse of bad ownership.

Mr.1Dog
03-21-2007, 12:55 PM
I have heard that one before. I believe it was in a Maxim issue last year just before the start of the baseball season. Mac singing "champs" during the 7th inning didn't force Gonzalez to drop that ball.

minutia
03-21-2007, 01:00 PM
Everyone always forgets there was a Game 7 that they blew. They had another shot and they collapsed. Of course the paper headlines were much friendlier regarding their demise then they were durring August of 2005.

WhiteSox5187
03-21-2007, 01:12 PM
The Cubs collapsed because Gonzalez couldn't turn a double play and because ultimately, the Marlins were the better team.

C-Dawg
03-21-2007, 01:15 PM
Everyone always forgets there was a Game 7 that they blew.

I knew it! It was that slippery patch of grass in RF where Sammy slipped in Game 7 that ended all their hopes!

DumpJerry
03-21-2007, 02:09 PM
The Cubs collapsed because Gonzalez couldn't turn a double play and because ultimately, the Marlins were the better team.
Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner! Of course, this contradicts their fans' strong sense of victimhood.

However, this might explain why those two nights caused the careers of Prior and Wood to crash and burn.

minutia
03-21-2007, 02:29 PM
Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner! Of course, this contradicts their fans' strong sense of victimhood.

However, this might explain why those two nights caused the careers of Prior and Wood to crash and burn.

I have always wondered what would have happened if after the Bartman ball a coaching visit was made to the mound and they settled Prior down, the ending might have been different. I mean he was young and all they had to do was say to him "alright we lost that one, let it go and get this guy, you can beat him" or something like that. I mean seriously that then put a tremendous amount of pressure on rookie Wood for the next night. It was just a recipe for disaster. Which is why when I hear some or the people I work with of local celeberties bellyache about how they were 3 outs a way from the World Series I tell them no they weren't a champion team would have come back and won after all of that drama.

Palehose Pete
03-21-2007, 02:33 PM
Everyone always forgets there was a Game 7 that they blew. They had another shot and they collapsed. Of course the paper headlines were much friendlier regarding their demise then they were durring August of 2005.

Just like people forget that the Red Sox had another chance in Game 7 in the '86 WS. Blame Buckner, forget the fact that there was another game to win.

People never let the truth get in the way of a good story, I guess.

Iwritecode
03-21-2007, 02:45 PM
I mean seriously that then put a tremendous amount of pressure on rookie Wood for the next night.

Rookie? :?:


BTW, I believe Bernie Mac singing "champions" was one of the top 5 reasons to not blame Bartman that ESPN ran a couple of years ago.

Edit: Fenway mentions it in the thread. (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=47811)

Irishsox1
03-21-2007, 02:47 PM
Another interesting side note was that Dusty Baker was the manager of Giants in 2002 when they blew a 3 games to 2 lead in the World Series and then did it again with the Flubbies in 2003. Yet, people are still talking about curses.

minutia
03-21-2007, 03:04 PM
Rookie? :?:


BTW, I believe Bernie Mac singing "champions" was one of the top 5 reasons to not blame Bartman that ESPN ran a couple of years ago.

Edit: Fenway mentions it in the thread. (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=47811)
Sorry, I thought he was a rookie. I stand corrected.

minutia
03-21-2007, 03:05 PM
Just like people forget that the Red Sox had another chance in Game 7 in the '86 WS. Blame Buckner, forget the fact that there was another game to win.

People never let the truth get in the way of a good story, I guess.
Facts just get in the way, especially if you are a fan that likes to celebrate failure.

IndianWhiteSox
03-21-2007, 03:58 PM
Another interesting side note was that Dusty Baker was the manager of Giants in 2002 when they blew a 3 games to 2 lead in the World Series and then did it again with the Flubbies in 2003. Yet, people are still talking about curses.

And then, people wonder why Dusty hasn't gotten a Managing job since then.

Iwritecode
03-21-2007, 04:37 PM
And then, people wonder why Dusty hasn't gotten a Managing job since then.

You have to go way, way back to find ANYONE that had any kind of sucess as a manager after leaving the Cubs.

IndianWhiteSox
03-21-2007, 04:50 PM
You have to go way, way back to find ANYONE that had any kind of sucess as a manager after leaving the Cubs.


Joe McCarthy, but that was a long time ago

http://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/mccarjo99.shtml

Iwritecode
03-21-2007, 05:05 PM
Joe McCarthy, but that was a long time ago

http://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/mccarjo99.shtml

Exactly. They've had 14 managers up to and including Sweet Lou since then. Only 2 (Rogers Hornsby and Charlie Grimm) managed for more than 3 years afterwards.

Everyone else either never managed again or only manged for another year or 3.

DumpJerry
03-21-2007, 05:15 PM
Another interesting side note was that Dusty Baker was the manager of Giants in 2002 when they blew a 3 games to 2 lead in the World Series and then did it again with the Flubbies in 2003. Yet, people are still talking about curses.
Rusty Dusty did not take the Cubs to the World Series.

RadioheadRocks
03-21-2007, 06:07 PM
Took COLD PIZZA long enough to work that angle. Apparently someone here at WSI mentioned this way back at square one:

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=257825&postcount=172

PKalltheway
03-21-2007, 06:52 PM
Another interesting side note was that Dusty Baker was the manager of Giants in 2002 when they blew a 3 games to 2 lead in the World Series and then did it again with the Flubbies in 2003. Yet, people are still talking about curses.
Haha, you're giving Dusty and the Cubs too much credit. They blew a 3 games to 1 lead!:redneck

WhiteSox5187
03-22-2007, 01:41 AM
You have to go way, way back to find ANYONE that had any kind of sucess as a manager after leaving the Cubs.
Wrigley Field is where managers to die.

PatK
03-22-2007, 10:31 AM
Somebody really needs to come up with the tape that Steve Dahl has of Bernie completely dissing the White Sox and saying how he's "done" with them back in 2004.

twentywontowin
03-22-2007, 11:23 AM
The Cubs collapsed because Gonzalez couldn't turn a double play and because ultimately, the Marlins were the better team.

IIRC, if Gonzalez fielded the ball correctly, he could have only gotten the out at first. That would still put them with two outs though, and then the Derek Lee sacrifice fly would have gotten them out of the inning with the score tied.

It really is Gonzalez's fault either way.

Iwritecode
03-22-2007, 11:31 AM
IIRC, if Gonzalez fielded the ball correctly, he could have only gotten the out at first. That would still put them with two outs though, and then the Derek Lee sacrifice fly would have gotten them out of the inning with the score tied.

It really is Gonzalez's fault either way.

I think he could've turned 2.

BTW, how do you get a sac fly with 2 outs? :?:

Thome25
03-22-2007, 11:44 AM
Forget all of the curses the Cubs and their fans keep coming up with. A curse to me is just an excuse as to why the Cubs have sucked for so long.

It's that "whoa is me" attitude. There always has to be an underlying reason to why the Cubs always lose. There's no such thing......the reason the Cubs lose is because they SUCK.

If you ask me, The Cubs aren't cursed......they ARE the curse.

twentywontowin
03-22-2007, 12:31 PM
I think he could've turned 2.

BTW, how do you get a sac fly with 2 outs? :?:

It would have been close. I'm remembering when I saw it on Youtube last, it didn't look like he could turn two.

And I worded it weird. I meant if Gonzalez doesn't bobble it and plays it clean, Derek Lee's sac fly at the next AB then becomes the inning ending out.

TommyJohn
03-22-2007, 01:33 PM
It would have been close. I'm remembering when I saw it on Youtube last, it didn't look like he could turn two.

And I worded it weird. I meant if Gonzalez doesn't bobble it and plays it clean, Derek Lee's sac fly at the next AB then becomes the inning ending out.


Of course, geniuses who blame Bartman say that the reason Gonzalez
dropped the ball is because he was psyched out by the foul ball and
was in a hurry to end the inning. Well, maybe they're mind readers.

The best thing that night would've have been for Baker to go out to
the mound after the play and calm Prior down. That he didn't is on him.
But, hey. Bartman is small and helpless looking, he is the target for fat
*******s like Teinowitz and Mariotti because they are bigger than him.
They probably fantasize about kicking his ass.

And finally, a good team will overcome mistakes and win, no matter
what. Does anyone still remember that home run that Ligde served
up to Pujols in 2005 when the Astros were on the verge of winning
the pennant? Does anyone still remember Byung Hung Kim's contributions
to World Series history? And there were two plays in the 2005 Series
that could have swung momentum in the Astros favor and turned the
Series completely around. Does anyone know which plays I'm talking
about? Probably, because it was the White Sox, but the plays them-
selves are lost to history.

vegyrex
03-22-2007, 03:22 PM
The flubbies are like a curse magnet. :o: