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View Full Version : Philly paper's perspective on Floyd


Vernam
02-26-2007, 07:19 PM
OK, not Philly so much as Wilkes-Barre. LINK (http://www.timesleader.com/mld/timesleader/sports/baseball/mlb/philadelphia_phillies/16785300.htm)

He doesn't come across quite so whiny as McCarthy did in that Sun-Times interview, but Floyd doesn't exactly exude confidence. He tends to blame himself, though he does say "outside people put pressure on me." http://www.cipherdom.com/pix/yawn.gif

It's kind of a rhetorical question, but how do you help a player whose professed problem is that he's listened too much to his coaches?! No worry, I'm sure Coop has a plan founded mainly on "Throw ****ing strikes." :cool:

Vernam

Save McCuddy's
02-26-2007, 10:49 PM
Sounds scary to me. Sounds like he realized that his talent was pretty mainstream when it came to getting big pros out.

WhiteSox5187
02-27-2007, 12:58 AM
Doubt is a double edged sword. On one hand to be a good big league pitcher you need to have that killer instinct, but if you're a cocky bastard who goes around thinking "I'm so good, I'm soo good" and you get shelled a little, it can help. It depends. Some people need to be coddled and other people need to get their ass kicked. This year is going to tell what Floyd needs.

DMarte708
02-27-2007, 02:20 AM
I just get this feeling he's going to drive us crazy all season.

Just good enough to remain the 5th starter (~5ERA), but bad enough on occasions to reminding everyone why Philadelphia soured on him.

caulfield12
02-27-2007, 02:38 AM
I just get this feeling he's going to drive us crazy all season.

Just good enough to remain the 5th starter (~5ERA), but bad enough on occasions to reminding everyone why Philadelphia soured on him.

That sounds like Vazquez, Garcia, Buehrle and pretty much every member of our rotation at one point or another last year.

PaulDrake
02-27-2007, 09:09 AM
This guy looks like the longest of long shots to me.

soxtalker
02-27-2007, 10:10 AM
Well, these are all guesses based on very little information right now, but a new organization might be just what he needs. If we were counting on him to fill the 5th spot in the rotation, I'd be nervous. But we're not. He's one of several options. If he doesn't quite have it right now, he can always go back to the minors and work on some things. I know that a lot of people on WSI completely discount prospects, based on our fairly dismal experience. But 4th overall is a lot better than anything we've drafted in recent memory.

WhiteSox5187
02-27-2007, 12:08 PM
Well, these are all guesses based on very little information right now, but a new organization might be just what he needs. If we were counting on him to fill the 5th spot in the rotation, I'd be nervous. But we're not. He's one of several options. If he doesn't quite have it right now, he can always go back to the minors and work on some things. I know that a lot of people on WSI completely discount prospects, based on our fairly dismal experience. But 4th overall is a lot better than anything we've drafted in recent memory.
Just because someone is the fourth overall pick doesn't mean he will be any good in the majors...but I agree, I think the change in scenery will do him well. But there's going to be just as much pressure here as in Philly.

caulfield12
02-27-2007, 12:12 PM
Just because someone is the fourth overall pick doesn't mean he will be any good in the majors...but I agree, I think the change in scenery will do him well. But there's going to be just as much pressure here as in Philly.

Well, the 5th starter's spot is more intense and "pressure filled" in Chicago, due to past history.

Unfortunately, he will be more scrutinized and can't sneak up on us, like Thornton did last year. OTOH, Floyd was going through "Borchard Syndrome" in Philly, where the fans are even tougher than here, and they had #4 pick expectations, as Hamels and Floyd were the "saviors" of the franchise for the future.

He doesn't have the same pressure here, it's not even close. Maybe it would have been higher defending a World Series championship....but not quite so much this year.

whitesoxfan1986
02-27-2007, 04:21 PM
I believe Floyd only has 1 minor league option left, so if he doesn't make the team out of ST and the other guy is crap, and he gets called up, and is crap, if we send him down we would likely lose him to waivers, which would then mean that the Garcia trade was Freddy for Gio straight up, which sucks.

goon
02-27-2007, 05:34 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/images/players/mugshot/ph_446624.jpg

don't worry about it, i'm still here.

WhiteSox5187
02-27-2007, 05:40 PM
Well, the 5th starter's spot is more intense and "pressure filled" in Chicago, due to past history.

Unfortunately, he will be more scrutinized and can't sneak up on us, like Thornton did last year. OTOH, Floyd was going through "Borchard Syndrome" in Philly, where the fans are even tougher than here, and they had #4 pick expectations, as Hamels and Floyd were the "saviors" of the franchise for the future.

He doesn't have the same pressure here, it's not even close. Maybe it would have been higher defending a World Series championship....but not quite so much this year.
I think the fact that we're not repeating champs makes it MORE intense. The Freddy trade has come under a lot of scrunity and if we have a struggling fifth spot in the rotation and don't make it to the playoffs, and God forbid the Cubs somehow do, then there are going to be a lot of fingers pointing at Floyd and also at Kenny. That being said, we DO have more options, so Floyd flopping isn't that big of a concern to me. But if Floyd does flop, then all of a sudden the Freddy trade doesn't look taht good because Freddy for Gio straight up isn't a very good trade.

veeter
02-27-2007, 05:59 PM
I think the fact that we're not repeating champs makes it MORE intense. The Freddy trade has come under a lot of scrunity and if we have a struggling fifth spot in the rotation and don't make it to the playoffs, and God forbid the Cubs somehow do, then there are going to be a lot of fingers pointing at Floyd and also at Kenny. That being said, we DO have more options, so Floyd flopping isn't that big of a concern to me. But if Floyd does flop, then all of a sudden the Freddy trade doesn't look taht good because Freddy for Gio straight up isn't a very good trade.My hope is that with Freddy's money off the books, they'll sign Buehrle. If they trade Freddy, then lose Mark, I'll be pissed. Hopefully Floyd is o.k. and Gio is terrific.

caulfield12
02-27-2007, 06:03 PM
I think the fact that we're not repeating champs makes it MORE intense. The Freddy trade has come under a lot of scrunity and if we have a struggling fifth spot in the rotation and don't make it to the playoffs, and God forbid the Cubs somehow do, then there are going to be a lot of fingers pointing at Floyd and also at Kenny. That being said, we DO have more options, so Floyd flopping isn't that big of a concern to me. But if Floyd does flop, then all of a sudden the Freddy trade doesn't look taht good because Freddy for Gio straight up isn't a very good trade.

Even then, it's not too bad...because we would have only received draft picks, which would have taken 2-3 years to contribute. Gio, from everything I saw when we drafted him (he had some character issues dogging him at the time) was a legit mid to late first rounder before the draft. So Floyd flops and I'm still happy if Gio becomes a member of the rotation for 6 seasons.

I understand there will always be some who felt KW jumped the gun and could have gotten more in return.

Also, you have to figure in the money saved on the rotation in Garcia's $10 million allowing us more flexibility to fix the team in mid-season.

WhiteSox5187
02-27-2007, 09:50 PM
My hope is that with Freddy's money off the books, they'll sign Buehrle. If they trade Freddy, then lose Mark, I'll be pissed. Hopefully Floyd is o.k. and Gio is terrific.
That's true, I never thought of it like that. Again, all trades take time to tell how they pan out. But assuming we lose both Freddy and Mark and Floyd busts, it's not worth it. I don't see the logic in trading for two starters straight up which is essentially what would have happened ASSUMING that Floyd busts. If he doesn't, it makes sense, two for the price of one.

Sargeant79
02-27-2007, 10:38 PM
Also, you have to figure in the money saved on the rotation in Garcia's $10 million allowing us more flexibility to fix the team in mid-season.

Actually, it pretty much only paid for the raises due arbitration-eligible players and those with escalating salaries in their contracts.

Flight #24
02-27-2007, 10:48 PM
I believe Floyd only has 1 minor league option left, so if he doesn't make the team out of ST and the other guy is crap, and he gets called up, and is crap, if we send him down we would likely lose him to waivers, which would then mean that the Garcia trade was Freddy for Gio straight up, which sucks.

I may be wrong, but IIRC the way options work is that you use them up not per callup, but per year in which you send a guy down. So the Sox use up Floyd's last option by sending him down this year, but can yoyo him up and down all year with that same option.

champagne030
02-28-2007, 11:27 AM
Actually, it pretty much only paid for the raises due arbitration-eligible players and those with escalating salaries in their contracts.

That was paid for by the increase in ticket prices, plus the Javy/Arizona cash and Frank and Carl coming of the books. Most of the Garcia salary is cash in Jerry's pocket right now. Hopefully, he'll take it back out and put into keeping one of our potential free agents.

caulfield12
02-28-2007, 12:08 PM
That was paid for by the increase in ticket prices, plus the Javy/Arizona cash and Frank and Carl coming of the books. Most of the Garcia salary is cash in Jerry's pocket right now. Hopefully, he'll take it back out and put into keeping one of our potential free agents.


We're getting more money for Vazquez this year, I think $3 million. Plus the money for Thome, and we're saving $4 million from Thomas and Everett for their buyouts.

All told, I would guess we're at a net "positive" savings of $6-9 million dollars compared to last year's payroll, factoring in the increases.