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SluggersAway
02-22-2007, 01:40 PM
"It's a very comfortable [Rangers] clubhouse,'' McCarthy said. ''I love the guys in Chicago, but it was a somewhat older clubhouse. Most of the guys there are married and they have kids and it's tough for guys like [Brian] Anderson and me to relate. We didn't get to hang out with them as much. As much as I like those guys in Chicago, this is much more my age, my speed.''

and,


''The second Jon Daniels called me, it was just a different attitude right off the bat,'' McCarthy said. ''[With the Sox] I was constantly hearing, 'This is what we don't like. This is what we think you are doing wrong. This is what's bad, this is bad.' It always seemed to be focused on the negative. Here, it's just, 'Here is your spot, and we expect you to do well and we think the world of you. Let's see you go do it.'


''And that has made it a lot more comfortable. To finally have that support, instead of wondering, 'What's going to happen next?' in terms of something negative.''


http://www.suntimes.com/sports/deluca/265755,CST-SPT-deluca21.article

getonbckthr
02-22-2007, 01:44 PM
Guess what kid if you can't handle constructive criticism get out of the business. If you want everyone to hold you hand and wipe your ass for you grow up.

PaulDrake
02-22-2007, 01:50 PM
It works both ways. He needed to be told what he was doing wrong because his pitches were flying out of the park at a record pace. I'm very sorry that Freddy Garcia is gone. Not so with Brandon McCarthy. I just can't envision him ever being anything close to an ace.

skottyj242
02-22-2007, 01:51 PM
Now he's sitting next to Sammy in the clubhouse and eveything's cool?

Madvora
02-22-2007, 01:51 PM
OK, let's please not let this turn into an attack on the guy just because he left the team. He's not ripping the Sox or talking trash. He's just giving an interview here.
WSI is big on jumping on guys once they leave.

thedudeabides
02-22-2007, 01:54 PM
Now he's sitting next to Sammy in the clubhouse and eveything's cool?


...and Kenny Lofton.

gobears1987
02-22-2007, 01:55 PM
WSI is big on jumping on guys once they leave.Tell that to all of the Rowand and Frank fans here.

Madvora
02-22-2007, 02:00 PM
Tell that to all of the Rowand and Frank fans here.
I know Frank and Rowand have a lot of supporters here, but Rowand has recieved almost as much backlash from people, just because other people like him. Rowand fits this category perfectly.

Jaffar
02-22-2007, 02:01 PM
I have been a huge BMAC supporter but the more I hear the more I realize why KW traded him.

Justagirl
02-22-2007, 02:03 PM
Blasphemy.
OK, let's please not let this turn into an attack on the guy just because he left the team. He's not ripping the Sox or talking trash. He's just giving an interview here.

[With the Sox] I was constantly hearing, 'This is what we don't like. This is what we think you are doing wrong. This is what's bad, this is bad.' It always seemed to be focused on the negative. Here, it's just, 'Here is your spot, and we expect you to do well and we think the world of you. Let's see you go do it.'

That sounds like a rip to me. Maybe I read that in the wrong tone.

..but why he feels as though he should have been treated with kid gloves for mediocrity is beyond me.

ewokpelts
02-22-2007, 02:09 PM
Blasphemy.



That sounds like a rip to me. Maybe I read that in the wrong tone.

..but why he feels as though he should have been treated with kid gloves for mediocrity is beyond me. crede got exactly that from 2003 til mid 2005 when he sucked ass

same as garland

Madvora
02-22-2007, 02:10 PM
Blasphemy.



That sounds like a rip to me. Maybe I read that in the wrong tone.

..but why he feels as though he should have been treated with kid gloves for mediocrity is beyond me.
I read the whole article yesterday and in context it didn't seem anything like that to me.

MincHiaPettito
02-22-2007, 09:16 PM
Some people respond differently to different management. A lot of the game is mental. He may be talking about the Sox, but just because its because of the team you support, doesnt mean they shouldnt be ripped. You guys cry that he wants his ass wiped, but the reason youre mad is because your teams ass isnt being wiped

guillen4life13
02-22-2007, 09:46 PM
I just want to point out something. As far as I know, McCarthy is the only Sox player to have ever posted on WSI. I think that his willingness to actually interact on this type of a level is pretty commendable, even if he hasn't posted in a few years. So Brandon McCarthy gets points from me just for that.

Secondly, these just seem like honest opinions more than rips. Some people respond better to negative encouragement, others to positive although positive encouragement seems more PC nowadays. And the nature of the clubhouse is different here I'm sure. You are going to find more mentors here but more friends there. For him he's probably still getting used to the changes, when differences are a lot more evident than they will be in the next few months/years.

I think the world of BMac and I hope he has an excellent career, except when he's pitching against the White Sox. And maybe he can come back at some point...

oeo
02-22-2007, 09:53 PM
Guess what kid if you can't handle constructive criticism get out of the business. If you want everyone to hold you hand and wipe your ass for you grow up.

Maybe that's what's wrong with Rangers pitching. :dunno:

IMO, it sounds like sour grapes. Oh well, I'm happy with Masset and Danks...good luck in Texas, FNOBB.

ondafarm
02-22-2007, 10:00 PM
Everybody needs criticism and needs to constantly work at it to play major league ball. While some few guys can relax in the majors, I think a lot more including McCarthy, do need constant criticism. Sorry if he didn't like it.

Vernam
02-22-2007, 10:00 PM
Some people respond differently to different management. A lot of the game is mental. He may be talking about the Sox, but just because its because of the team you support, doesnt mean they shouldnt be ripped. You guys cry that he wants his ass wiped, but the reason youre mad is because your teams ass isnt being wipedYou lost me there, but I love the M&M jacket. :thumbsup:

I was sort of defending McCarthy and his fellow whiner Logan in another thread, but what really stuck in my craw is that McCarthy is bragging about his World Series ring as if HE ACTUALLY HELPED WIN THE WORLD SERIES, which he didn't. He does say he lucked into it, and don't get me wrong, he deserves the ring for pitching a couple of big regular season games. But maybe this is the crap that pisses some veterans off. If I were a pitcher for the Texas Rangers, sure, I'd get as much mileage out of a championship ring as I could. :cool:

Vernam

NardiWasHere
02-22-2007, 10:22 PM
-I'd never stop throwing up if I had to spend any significant time with Sosa.

-McCarthy sounds a little immature in this article. I would want and/or expect the team to tell me what I was doing incorrectly.

-McCarthy a proven commodity? Come on now, bud. Is that De Luca, his editor, or someone in the Rangers' organization?

voodoochile
02-22-2007, 11:25 PM
Some people respond differently to different management. A lot of the game is mental. He may be talking about the Sox, but just because its because of the team you support, doesnt mean they shouldnt be ripped. You guys cry that he wants his ass wiped, but the reason youre mad is because your teams ass isnt being wiped

Your what hurts?

Can you say that again in English...

Oh nevermind... not sure I really want to know. Too much ass wiping hurts the brain...

JB98
02-22-2007, 11:42 PM
Your what hurts?

Can you say that again in English...

Oh nevermind... not sure I really want to know. Too much ass wiping hurts the brain...

It can also lead to skin irritation.

TheOldRoman
02-22-2007, 11:56 PM
This is a familiar situation. Anyone ever get transfered to the new floor where everyone hates their job and nobody cares? "I dunno, we just do whatever". Anyone ever see the parents smile and claim their child is a freespirit who is "just expressing himself" while he destroys a department store?
Well, that is the Rangers organization. When was the last time they produced a halfway decent pitcher? Hey Brandon, maybe that is part of the reason why. Their "everything is cool, you're gonna be a star, kid" philosophy hasn't really worked out too well for them.
Maybe you need to strive for perfection to achieve excellence?

PaleHoseGeorge
02-24-2007, 10:09 AM
I wish I had a dollar for every one of the stories I've read just like this one. "I'm really glad to be here... this place is soooooo much better than the last place I was at..."

Bob Howry pitches for the Cubs.
Magglio Ordonez plays right field for Detroit.
Keith Foulke used to pitch for Boston, but now he is retired.
Jerry Manuel is first base coach for the Mets.

:jerry
"Don't lead off, they're expecting you to do that. Just keep your eye on second base and wait for my sign."

And now Brandon McCarthy pitches for Texas. He figures to finally collect his tenth major league victory there. Count me as unimpressed.

IndianWhiteSox
02-24-2007, 10:47 AM
It can also lead to skin irritation.

This is a familiar situation. Anyone ever get transfered to the new floor where everyone hates their job and nobody cares? "I dunno, we just do whatever". Anyone ever see the parents smile and claim their child is a freespirit who is "just expressing himself" while he destroys a department store?
Well, that is the Rangers organization. When was the last time they produced a halfway decent pitcher? Hey Brandon, maybe that is part of the reason why. Their "everything is cool, you're gonna be a star, kid" philosophy hasn't really worked out too well for them.
Maybe you need to strive for perfection to achieve excellence?


I guess FNOBB doesn't have the grit to become a winner in this league.

tick53
02-24-2007, 01:14 PM
Good for him, but he's gone now. I wish him the best of everything but now he's an apponent. Bring on the new guys.

Justagirl
02-24-2007, 02:34 PM
I wish I had a dollar for every one of the stories I've read just like this one. "I'm really glad to be here... this place is soooooo much better than the last place I was at..."

:thome:

gr8mexico
02-24-2007, 04:08 PM
Brandon is going to be a 5th starter if he's lucky. Brandon is more worried about going to party then playing. At the start of last year Brandon and Brian spend most of there nights in clubs drinking. Halfway thru the year Brian stop going with him and you can tell by the way Brian improved the second half that going out every night was affecting him. Brain has a better chance in making then Brandon.

ewokpelts
02-25-2007, 03:27 AM
:thome:

i think his comments were " i like the phillies, and the fans love me, but ryan howard pretty much made me obsolete in philly, and let's face it, i was never going to win a world series in philly anyways. might as well come to chicago. I'll still get to play in wrigley field 3 times a year!"

Chisox003
02-25-2007, 05:30 AM
Brandon is going to be a 5th starter if he's lucky. Brandon is more worried about going to party then playing. At the start of last year Brandon and Brian spend most of there nights in clubs drinking. Halfway thru the year Brian stop going with him and you can tell by the way Brian improved the second half that going out every night was affecting him. Brain has a better chance in making then Brandon.
:roflmao:

Are you their secretary or something?

Jurr
02-25-2007, 10:08 AM
crede got exactly that from 2003 til mid 2005 when he sucked ass

same as garland
Crede, Rowand, and Garland all were ripped apart time and again on this board. Every week, someone else would be pipe dreaming about a trade to replace them.

rdwj
02-25-2007, 11:19 AM
crede got exactly that from 2003 til mid 2005 when he sucked ass

Sorry, but Crede never sucked. Just because he didn't hit great all the time doesn't mean he didn't make solid contributions to the club.

Jurr
02-25-2007, 11:21 AM
It can also lead to skin irritation.
Unless you use the baby wipes with aloe.

IndianWhiteSox
02-25-2007, 11:22 AM
Unless you use the baby wipes with aloe.

:roflmao::roflmao:

Foulke You
02-25-2007, 02:07 PM
Maybe that's what's wrong with Rangers pitching. :dunno:

IMO, it sounds like sour grapes. Oh well, I'm happy with Masset and Danks...good luck in Texas, FNOBB.
You took the words out of my mouth. Perhaps there is a reason Rangers pitching has been mediocre at best and they were never able to fully realize the potential that Masset and Danks have. I'm not saying Cooper and A.J. are miracle workers but they certainly have a track record for figuring out what a pitcher is doing wrong. Ask Matt Thornton if he is glad that Cooper pointed out the flaw in his delivery rather than tell him "Matt, we think you are awesome and just go out there and pitch, buddy!"

caulfield12
02-25-2007, 03:32 PM
You took the words out of my mouth. Perhaps there is a reason Rangers pitching has been mediocre at best and they were never able to fully realize the potential that Masset and Danks have. I'm not saying Cooper and A.J. are miracle workers but they certainly have a track record for figuring out what a pitcher is doing wrong. Ask Matt Thornton if he is glad that Cooper pointed out the flaw in his delivery rather than tell him "Matt, we think you are awesome and just go out there and pitch, buddy!"


Actually, he kind of did both...

Domeshot17
02-25-2007, 07:52 PM
I think Brandon needed the change of scenery. Lets be fair to Texas. This is only Daniels 2nd year as GM, and he has brought in guys like Millwood and Brandon. Texas was still shelling out a ton of money to Chan ho Park and is still shelling out money for Arod. Daniels came in to a tough situation and has done a pretty fair job.

People have to keep in mind this is Brandon's career. If you worked at a company, trained for 4 months to be an account manager, then got told you to go learn to work in accounting on the fly, but be sharp because you could be moved back to account manager at any time, your head would probably be spinning.

Brandon was just caught between the rock and the hard place here. He said many times he did not feel good in relief because it takes him a long time to get ready and loose. If you watched him pitch as a starter, he was always a guy who had his best innings LATER in games, who got stronger with the game. That does not usually generate into success as a reliever. For 2 years in a row his name was mentioned in trade rumors for 80% of the year, he never really had a role here, it just was not the right fit. That is not Ozzie or Kenny, but its also not Brandon. It is very much like Gavin Floyd. I am sure plenty of people back in Philly are posting on their boards how big of a bust he is, how they are happy he is gone.

The one thing with Brandon that got me was the survery done with major league coaches and managers over who is going to break out this year. 70% said Brandon (over guys like King Felix). I hope they are right. I liked Brandon here, and I hope he does well in Texas every start that isnt against us.

And as far as the age thing, that can suck sometimes. When I worked for my first investment firm, I was one of few guys under 30, most over 40. We could talk about the Sox or Bears or whatever for a while, but sometimes it was just hard to relate.

And who ever was going off about them going out and Drinking, these guys are pro baseball players. They all go out and drink most nights. Its not really a big deal seeing as how if they go drink until 2 am, they can still go to bed at 3, be up by 12 and at the park by 3. Baseball players work the night shift 80% of the year.

caulfield12
02-25-2007, 08:53 PM
I disagree with Daniels about doing a good job.

He gave up too much just to rent C-Lee for a couple of months. He made the mistake of trading away a young starting pitcher in Chris Young (not unlike the Wells/Fogg for Ritchie deal). Then he lost Eaton to Free Agency, forcing him to trade for a pitcher in the 3 hole the White Sox weren't quite ready to give the 5 spot to.

Blalock has really regressed under his administration.

They have a very dicey situation at closer with Otsuka displaced and Gagne recovering from surgery.

They have no fourth and fifth starters.

Their outfield is Catalanotto, Lofton and Wilkerson...which might be the worst OF in major league baseball.

They're going to be lucky to win 75 games.

Frontman
02-25-2007, 09:15 PM
Blasphemy.



That sounds like a rip to me. Maybe I read that in the wrong tone.

..but why he feels as though he should have been treated with kid gloves for mediocrity is beyond me.


I have to agree with that assessment. "The Sox told me what I was doing wrong. And that was bad."

Whatever Brandon. Just serve up the spicy meatball like you did last year, especially when the Sox play.

;)

ComiskeyBrewer
02-26-2007, 09:12 AM
:roflmao::roflmao:

Hey, don't knock it. After a Mexican food eating contest i had with a friend of mine, those things were a godsent.

kevin57
02-27-2007, 01:33 PM
I remember a baseball manager once told me, "You've got to know how to approach each player individually." He related his experience of having indentical twins on his pitching staff. One, he said, needed lots of praise and responded well to that approach. The other one wanted and responded well to swift kicks in the ass.

soxinem1
02-27-2007, 04:57 PM
It works both ways. He needed to be told what he was doing wrong because his pitches were flying out of the park at a record pace. I'm very sorry that Freddy Garcia is gone. Not so with Brandon McCarthy. I just can't envision him ever being anything close to an ace.

Maybe not an ace, but I predict he will be better than the 4 and 5 starters we have this year.

oeo
02-27-2007, 05:17 PM
Maybe not an ace, but I predict he will be better than the 4 and 5 starters we have this year.

You think he'll be better than Vazquez? I doubt it; not in the ballpark he won't.

soxinem1
02-27-2007, 05:56 PM
You think he'll be better than Vazquez? I doubt it; not in the ballpark he won't.

Like Vazquez won't give up a ton of HR's either? The Cell yields plenty of them, and Vazquez does too.

I think Brandon is a little tougher than Vazquez.

esbrechtel
02-27-2007, 06:04 PM
I think Brandon is a little tougher than Vazquez.
based on what?

oeo
02-27-2007, 06:50 PM
Like Vazquez won't give up a ton of HR's either? The Cell yields plenty of them, and Vazquez does too.

I think Brandon is a little tougher than Vazquez.

Last year, in Javy's first year at the Cell, he only surrendered 23 HR's in 202 innings...McCarthy surrendered 17 in only 84.

based on what?

Based on him never coming in and getting a big out. :dunno:

If McCarthy was so "tough", he would have been able to handle the bullpen last year. And this is a guy that complains about constructive criticism...that's tough.

soxinem1
02-27-2007, 07:01 PM
Based on him never coming in and getting a big out. :dunno:

If McCarthy was so "tough", he would have been able to handle the bullpen last year. And this is a guy that complains about constructive criticism...that's tough.

I'm not going to rip the guy because he was traded, or because he was dissapointed at not being a starter. All I know is down the stretch in 2005 when El Duque couldn't go two innings McCarthy stepped in and did well. Sure, being a major leaguer is something these guys should be proud of, even if they have to clean the clubhouse showers as part of their duties. But I think this guy has the makings to be a pretty decent major league starter. Vazquez has proven nothing except that he is inconsistent as Chicago weather.

Will he be an ace? Who knows. Would I rather have him than Vazquez, especially at $11 million? Without a doubt. I still say when all is said and done, Mccarthy will have a better 2007 than Vazquez, Floyd, or whoever is the White Sox 4-5 starters.

oeo
02-27-2007, 07:04 PM
I'm not going to rip the guy because he was traded, or because he was dissapointed at not being a starter. All I know is down the stretch in 2005 when El Duque couldn't go two innings McCarthy stepped in and did well. Sure, being a major leaguer is something these guys should be proud of, even if they have to clean the clubhouse showers as part of their duties. But I think this guy has the makings to be a pretty decent major league starter. Vazquez has proven nothing except that he is inconsistent as Chicago weather.

Will he be an ace? Who knows. Would I rather have him than Vazquez, especially at $11 million? Without a doubt. I still say when all is said and done, Mccarthy will have a better 2007 than Vazquez, Floyd, or whoever is the White Sox 4-5 starters.

Yes, he did step up at the end of 2005. But that's all he's done in his career. There's no reason to believe that he can continue that, because he was awful last year. And one thing stands out in both 2005 and 2006...he gives up the longball like a madman. For whatever reason, Javy had a huge decrease in homeruns last year, in one of the worst pitchers parks in the league. I guarantee he has the better year.

He's only had a few good starts in his career. He's not proven, so to say he will have a better year than a veteran like Vazquez is ridiculous.

soxinem1
02-27-2007, 07:43 PM
Yes, he did step up at the end of 2005. But that's all he's done in his career. There's no reason to believe that he can continue that, because he was awful last year. And one thing stands out in both 2005 and 2006...he gives up the longball like a madman. For whatever reason, Javy had a huge decrease in homeruns last year, in one of the worst pitchers parks in the league. I guarantee he has the better year.

He's only had a few good starts in his career. He's not proven, so to say he will have a better year than a veteran like Vazquez is ridiculous.

It's a prediction. Let's see what happens.

Vernam
02-27-2007, 08:22 PM
Will he be an ace? Who knows. Would I rather have him than Vazquez, especially at $11 million? Without a doubt. I still say when all is said and done, Mccarthy will have a better 2007 than Vazquez, Floyd, or whoever is the White Sox 4-5 starters.I'd take that bet, re: Vazquez vs. McCarthy. I'm just glad we don't have to see both McCarthy and Floyd in our rotation, especially if it would've meant Garland going to the Astros.

I wonder how fans would've reacted if KW had traded Vazquez to Houston for the same package we got for McCarthy. I'm sure it would've looked to some people like a pure salary dump; I never understood the media criticism that the Sox were "going cheap," because McCarthy is cheap.

Vernam

shoelessshaun27!
02-27-2007, 08:44 PM
I still wish we had him and Freddy.

SABRSox
02-27-2007, 08:53 PM
Tell that to all of the Rowand and Frank fans here.

Excuse me, but Frank Thomas earned that respect.

Frontman
02-27-2007, 10:50 PM
Excuse me, but Frank Thomas earned that respect.

Even as a guy who didn't like Frank, I respected him and his ability. I loved the fact he never really "adimred" a homerun. He took off out of the box as soon as he dropped the bat.

rainbow6
02-27-2007, 11:01 PM
To predict McCarthy will have a better year than Vazquez is guessing he will finish one game over and and have an ERA slightly less than 5.00....

I don't know if it will happen, but it sure doesn't sound ridiculous...


Yes, he did step up at the end of 2005. But that's all he's done in his career. There's no reason to believe that he can continue that, because he was awful last year. And one thing stands out in both 2005 and 2006...he gives up the longball like a madman. For whatever reason, Javy had a huge decrease in homeruns last year, in one of the worst pitchers parks in the league. I guarantee he has the better year.

He's only had a few good starts in his career. He's not proven, so to say he will have a better year than a veteran like Vazquez is ridiculous.

oeo
02-27-2007, 11:11 PM
To predict McCarthy will have a better year than Vazquez is guessing he will finish one game over and and have an ERA slightly less than 5.00....

I don't know if it will happen, but it sure doesn't sound ridiculous...

So now you're predicting 2007 stats? :?:

Vazquez will have a better year than last year. He was not the reason we didn't make the playoffs last year, so people need to get off his back. He was our fifth starter and gave us better numbers than El Duque did in 2005, yet Javy was awful and people forget that El Duque was less than stellar. Makes a lot of sense. :rolleyes:

And besides, McCarthy has not done anything in his career to prove that he will have better stats than Javy's 2006.

rainbow6
02-28-2007, 08:32 AM
Vazquez has a losing record in his career...his two years in the AL saw his ERA sail toward the five...Why do people think stating these facts are "getting on his back?"

And you're right he's not the reason we didn't make the playoffs - but he's in the team picture. I still haven't forgotten game after game that he pissed away by having a melt down in the fourth, fifth or six innings. When people keep going on about his "experience" I have to wonder if I was watching the same team last year.

If people are fans of his that's cool - I hope he wins twenty games - but don't pretend he's something he isn't.

Comparing Vazquez with El Duque is meaningless...El Duque was never going to be considred a starting candidate in 2006.

So now you're predicting 2007 stats? :?:

Vazquez will have a better year than last year. He was not the reason we didn't make the playoffs last year, so people need to get off his back. He was our fifth starter and gave us better numbers than El Duque did in 2005, yet Javy was awful and people forget that El Duque was less than stellar. Makes a lot of sense. :rolleyes:

And besides, McCarthy has not done anything in his career to prove that he will have better stats than Javy's 2006.

ewokpelts
02-28-2007, 12:31 PM
Vazquez has a losing record in his career...his two years in the AL saw his ERA sail toward the five...Why do people think stating these facts are "getting on his back?"

And you're right he's not the reason we didn't make the playoffs - but he's in the team picture. I still haven't forgotten game after game that he pissed away by having a melt down in the fourth, fifth or six innings. When people keep going on about his "experience" I have to wonder if I was watching the same team last year.

If people are fans of his that's cool - I hope he wins twenty games - but don't pretend he's something he isn't.

Comparing Vazquez with El Duque is meaningless...El Duque was never going to be considred a starting candidate in 2006.not to defend javier or anything, but el duque did start in 2006..in the nlcs and nlds

rainbow6
02-28-2007, 12:43 PM
I was referring to the fact that El Duque wasn't going to be counted on as a starter for the Sox in '06.

not to defend javier or anything, but el duque did start in 2006..in the nlcs and nlds

soxinem1
03-01-2007, 02:00 AM
El Duque had a better, more consistent 2006 than Vazquez.

I still say McCarthy will out perform him. I think he will have a chip on his shoulder, especially after KW's labeling him as a 'serviceable' MLB pitcher.

oeo
03-01-2007, 02:22 AM
Vazquez has a losing record in his career...his two years in the AL saw his ERA sail toward the five...Why do people think stating these facts are "getting on his back?"

And you're right he's not the reason we didn't make the playoffs - but he's in the team picture. I still haven't forgotten game after game that he pissed away by having a melt down in the fourth, fifth or six innings. When people keep going on about his "experience" I have to wonder if I was watching the same team last year.

If people are fans of his that's cool - I hope he wins twenty games - but don't pretend he's something he isn't.

Comparing Vazquez with El Duque is meaningless...El Duque was never going to be considred a starting candidate in 2006.

And McCarthy has started a total of 12 games in his career...how does that imply that McCarthy will have a better season than Vazquez? I made my prediction on experience, you based yours off of potential. I don't understand how you can say that a young pitcher like McCarthy, who has not started every five days in the big leagues ever, will have a better year than a veteran like Vazquez.

I compared Javy and El Duque because I definitely do not remember El Duque getting the same crap Javy does back in 2005. The reason? The team was winning. And if we were winning consistently last year, I guarantee people wouldn't be worried about Javy, because some even wanted El Duque back.

caulfield12
03-01-2007, 09:52 AM
El Duque had a better, more consistent 2006 than Vazquez.

I still say McCarthy will out perform him. I think he will have a chip on his shoulder, especially after KW's labeling him as a 'serviceable' MLB pitcher.

You can't compare the NL East to the AL Central in terms of pitchers. I'm sure somebody will post Garcia's stats after every stat and compare them to Floyd, and it won't mean a thing. Just look at the records of MIN/DET/CHW against the NL Central last year.

Almost NOBODY wanted El Duque to come back as a starter in 2006. In fact, we didn't believe we could trade him without eating part of his $6.5 million salary...which we didn't, we had to give them Chris Young instead.

caulfield12
03-01-2007, 09:53 AM
El Duque had a better, more consistent 2006 than Vazquez.

I still say McCarthy will out perform him. I think he will have a chip on his shoulder, especially after KW's labeling him as a 'serviceable' MLB pitcher.

Nobody had a consistent year in the Sox rotation....baseball has always been a game of streaks and momentum, like Contreras' extended run of dominance.

rainbow6
03-01-2007, 10:07 AM
I never said McCarthy would outperform Vavquez - I said I don't think it's "ridiculous" to predict that he will.

The argument is this: is it possible that Brandon can be a servicable fifth starter this year? Can he notch 11-13 wins and keep his era just north of 5.00. If so, he stands a good chance of equaling or bettering Vazquez's year.

Will it happen? I dunno, but I wouldn't bet against it.

And McCarthy has started a total of 12 games in his career...how does that imply that McCarthy will have a better season than Vazquez? I made my prediction on experience, you based yours off of potential. I don't understand how you can say that a young pitcher like McCarthy, who has not started every five days in the big leagues ever, will have a better year than a veteran like Vazquez.

I compared Javy and El Duque because I definitely do not remember El Duque getting the same crap Javy does back in 2005. The reason? The team was winning. And if we were winning consistently last year, I guarantee people wouldn't be worried about Javy, because some even wanted El Duque back.

SBSoxFan
03-01-2007, 10:24 AM
I never said McCarthy would outperform Vavquez - I said I don't think it's "ridiculous" to predict that he will.

The argument is this: is it possible that Brandon can be a servicable fifth starter this year? Can he notch 11-13 wins and keep his era just north of 5.00. If so, he stands a good chance of equaling or bettering Vazquez's year.

Will it happen? I dunno, but I wouldn't bet against it.

Except I think he's going to be a #3 in Texas. Combining that with my optimism that Vazquez is going to be much better this year than last, I'll predict Vazquez has the better year.

rainbow6
03-01-2007, 12:07 PM
I hope you're right. As much as I lack confidence in him, I'll be rooting for Vazquez all year long.



Except I think he's going to be a #3 in Texas. Combining that with my optimism that Vazquez is going to be much better this year than last, I'll predict Vazquez has the better year.

SBSoxFan
03-01-2007, 12:50 PM
I hope you're right. As much as I lack confidence in him, I'll be rooting for Vazquez all year long.


:praying:

gr8mexico
03-02-2007, 06:25 PM
:roflmao:

Are you their secretary or something?
Ozzie came out today and told everyone exactly what I been saying about Brandon.

gr8mexico
03-02-2007, 06:27 PM
Brandon is going to be a 5th starter if he's lucky. Brandon is more worried about going to party then playing. At the start of last year Brandon and Brian spend most of there nights in clubs drinking. Halfway thru the year Brian stop going with him and you can tell by the way Brian improved the second half that going out every night was affecting him. Brain has a better chance in making then Brandon.:gulp:

psyclonis
03-02-2007, 07:14 PM
If you're bashing bmc you're a tool... simple as that. He was misused in Chicago and was put in a position where he could only fail. HES A STARTING PITCHER. :angry:

gr8mexico
03-03-2007, 02:38 PM
If you're bashing bmc you're a tool... simple as that. He was misused in Chicago and was put in a position where he could only fail. HES A STARTING PITCHER. :angry:
Are you for real!!!. Only if you knew. Brandon would get to the game with hang overs almost every day and if he keeps up doing that he will never be good. Thank You for calling me a tool because it looks like you knoe more then I do.:cool:

ewokpelts
03-03-2007, 04:38 PM
Are you for real!!!. Only if you knew. Brandon would get to the game with hang overs almost every day and if he keeps up doing that he will never be good. Thank You for calling me a tool because it looks like you knoe more then I do.:cool:but do you knoe more than me?

soxfan13
03-03-2007, 04:41 PM
If you're bashing bmc you're a tool... simple as that. He was misused in Chicago and was put in a position where he could only fail. HES A STARTING PITCHER. :angry:

Sorry but alot of starters begin their careers as relief. It is their shot to show what they can do. A prime example of this is Mark Buehrle.

Frontman
03-03-2007, 07:52 PM
If you're bashing bmc you're a tool... simple as that. He was misused in Chicago and was put in a position where he could only fail. HES A STARTING PITCHER. :angry:

Yeah, since it isn't the responsibility of a starting pitcher to get guys out. Or to handle a base runner or two.

Waitaminit, it is.

Look, as much as Ozzie went off (and maybe a bit too much info to throw our way about Brandon) I think he was right to stick up for clubhouse atmosphere. Brandon made the Sox players out to be not relatable to anyone, that they don't care about the player, only results, etc. And as much as past history shows that the Sox can be rough on former players, they do support their current roster. If a player can't handle Ozzie's style of management, then the player doesn't fit the team KW and Ozzie has built.

Brandon didn't fit, and to me, Brandon annoyed the living begeesus out of me by being on Boers and Bernstein every week, yukkin' it up, no matter how bad he did; while AJ would say "Yeah, I blew that one yesterday, all on me," when talking to North on Mondays.

Brandon seems to be a guy who looks at every problem as being someone else's fault. I think the kid needs to step up, do phenomenal down in Texas, to prove the Sox wrong at this point. Otherwise, all it is is sour grapes.

gr8mexico
03-03-2007, 08:37 PM
but do you knoe more than me? Next time Ill hit the spell check just for you.:rolleyes:

IndianWhiteSox
03-04-2007, 05:07 PM
If you're bashing bmc you're a tool... simple as that. He was misused in Chicago and was put in a position where he could only fail. HES A STARTING PITCHER. :angry:

That makes no sense what so ever, as Jack McDowell or some other pitcher said it best, once you get out on to the mound its still 60ft and 6ins from the batter you're facing. Not to mention, he really wasn't that good to begin with outside of a few months in 2005.