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JohnTucker0814
02-19-2007, 06:20 PM
With the obvois turmoil going on in NY, would anyone be against A-rod coming to the Sox for Crede and a minor league pitcher? I think Big George would be happy to get rid of A-rod and fill him with a gem defensive player like Crede... we would be able to move A-rod to SS and Fields at 3B... I still worry that Uribe won't be available as a full time player... and he's a sub-par full time player anyways...

I know, I know... we've discuss this several times over the off season!

chaerulez
02-19-2007, 06:26 PM
If A-Rod is traded for Joe Crede and a minor league pitcher, either Georgie boy is more senile than we thought or Cashman is trying to get fired.

CLR01
02-19-2007, 06:27 PM
We haven't had a good A-Rod to the Sox thread in a while now.....

WhiteSox5187
02-19-2007, 06:34 PM
Hmm...Crede for A-Rod...I'm not so sure that A-Rod can still play short anymore. I also think that A-Rod and Ozzie would clash. A-Rod is a better ballplayer, but I think Crede is a better a fit for the Sox.

CLR01
02-19-2007, 07:29 PM
Hmm...Crede for A-Rod...I'm not so sure that A-Rod can still play short anymore.


I think he could manage to fake it for awhile.


I'll take him over Uribe 7 days a week.

nodiggity59
02-19-2007, 07:31 PM
I'd like an excuse to trade Dye. Love what he's done for us, but his days as a 3/4 hitter are numbered. If we got Arod, he slips in nicely at that role, taking importance off Thome to stay healthy. Also, Arod + Konerko stabilizes our lineup for a while, allowing us to focus the ayroll on one big name SP rather than requiring contracts for Dye and Crede. Even if its not one of our guys, the Sox can't afford to not pay at least one pitcher fair market money.

crazyozzie02
02-19-2007, 07:49 PM
i hate to say it, but i would be all for it. i think that arod can still play short. maybe not as good as he could, but good enough

WizardsofOzzie
02-19-2007, 07:54 PM
We haven't had a good A-Rod to the Sox thread in a while now.....
Of course that dosen't mean we needed one :mad:

caulfield12
02-19-2007, 08:52 PM
Um...everyone thinking we could get A-Rod for JUST Crede is absolutely nuts.

To think we could get a pitcher and A-Rod is beyond that.

They would think about giving us A-Rod for Crede and Danks. They certainly don't need any more outfielders, they already ditched Bernie and Sheffield. They have Cabrera, Matsui, Damon and Abreu. That's one too many already. Why would they need Dye with Abreu there?

jcw218
02-19-2007, 09:00 PM
I don't think that the Sox will trade for Alex Rodriguez. The two main reasons for this are the fact that the Yankees would be asking price would be astronomical, the Sox would owe Alex aprox 73 mil over the next three years and his agent is Scott Boras. There is a clause in the contract which allows Alex to opt out of the deal after the 2007 season. If things are that bad in NY for Alex, he may choose to use that clause and become a free agent. As a free agent, the Sox would only have to deal with Boras.

Story here (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/spring2007/news/story?id=2771141&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines). There's a thread discussing this here (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=84382).

WhiteSox5187
02-19-2007, 11:48 PM
I think he could manage to fake it for awhile.


I'll take him over Uribe 7 days a week.
Oh yea, obviously you'd take him over Uribe. I have a low opinion of Uribe.

getonbckthr
02-20-2007, 02:13 AM
I'm willing to bet if Kenny was willing to take on Pavano Arod would come a bit cheaper.

IndianWhiteSox
02-23-2007, 02:35 PM
I'm willing to bet if Kenny was willing to take on Pavano Arod would come a bit cheaper.

Obviously because then with Pavano the question would be.....

:hawk

"Where's he gonna play?"


I don't think that the Sox will trade for Alex Rodriguez. The two main reasons for this are the fact that the Yankees would be asking price would be astronomical, the Sox would owe Alex aprox clause in the contract which allows Alex to opt out of the deal after the 2007 season. If things are that bad in NY for Alex, he may choose to use that clause and become a free agent. As a free agent, the Sox would only have to deal with Boras.

Story here (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/spring2007/news/story?id=2771141&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines). There's a thread discussing this here (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=84382).

Hey, if Rick Hahn is the guy to deal with Boras, then it might not be such a far fetched idea.

caulfield12
02-23-2007, 03:29 PM
It wouldn't be the craziest thing in the world, IF Pavano is healthy and has his head screwed on straight. Everything you see in the press says this move would be crazy...but I would have said the same about Carl Everett, Uribe, Rowand and AJ helping to lead our team to a WS title as well.

That would give us two former Montreal "aces" with contracts around $10 million...although that's the same (more or less) that we were going to pay Garcia.

However, we would control the rights to both Vazquez and Pavano through 2008 (option for 09) on Pavano. And this would provide insurance for our rotation and allow Floyd to get his act together in AAA and for Danks/Haeger/Gio/Broadway to mature without being rushed to the bigs too soon.

We burned the Yankees with Contreras, not sure it will happen twice. And I think they would definitely want a pitcher (one of those listed above) along with Crede for A-Rod. Not to mention the talent we give up would have a direct effect on how much of the Rangers' subsidy for A-Rod's deal to pass on (like the Vazquez, Contreras and Thome deals).

caulfield12
02-23-2007, 03:36 PM
But the Yankees would have to be concerned about A-Rod and Pavano coming back to bite them in the A-- (like the investment they made in El Gran Titan de Bronze). They've gotten almost no return on Pavano, and less than expected from A-Rod in the playoffs. At $15 million or so, A-Rod is very much a bargain in this market, especially as a SS.

Another huge risk would be Crede. 1) His back. 2) Boras and his being a FA after 2008. 3) His reaction to playing in NYC.

If it was Danks and Crede for A-Rod and Pavano, I think they might at least consider it. Once again, Yankee subsidies (with the Pavano and A-Rod deals) and A-Rod's ability to leave at the end of this season would be the largest factors.

There's also the fact of building an even stronger competitor out of the White Sox, and that team knocking the Yankees out of the playoffs. It will be six years since the last World Series title in the Bronx. Trading both A-Rod and making Pavano the fifth starter in Chicago could become a season-long sore point for Cashman.

BlackAndWhite
02-23-2007, 03:44 PM
From everybody's favorite blog, a pretty funny take on A-Rod vs. Jeter: http://www.bat-girl.com/archives/001805.php

PS: It's a guest blogger, as Batgirl is on maternity leave.

Vernam
02-23-2007, 03:55 PM
I think he could manage to fake it for awhile.


I'll take him over Uribe 7 days a week.I'd agree, so long as A-Rod's case of the throwing yips isn't lingering. Wouldn't want to see a Knoblauch/Sax type playing at SS, even one who hits like Rodriguez.

Vernam

Frater Perdurabo
02-23-2007, 04:05 PM
I'd like an excuse to trade Dye. Love what he's done for us, but his days as a 3/4 hitter are numbered.

I agree that ARod is a fantastic #3/#4 hitter.

No offense, but you are crazy to suggest that "Dye's days as a 3/4 hitter are numbered."

:?:

Dye was the #3 hitter for the 2005 World Champs, and then followed that up with the best statistical season of his career in 2006. In fact, other than his lower walk totals and therefore lower OBP, his 2006 numbers are comparable with Frank Thomas in his prime. Only the Sox failure to make the playoffs doomed his chances to win the AL MVP.

IndianWhiteSox
02-23-2007, 11:47 PM
I'd agree, so long as A-Rod's case of the throwing yips isn't lingering. Wouldn't want to see a Knoblauch/Sax type playing at SS, even one who hits like Rodriguez.

Vernam

Hey a left side of the infield wit 3B Crede and SS A-Rod would be great regardless

caulfield12
02-24-2007, 08:22 AM
Hey a left side of the infield wit 3B Crede and SS A-Rod would be great regardless

Who are you going to trade to pull that one off?

Vernam
02-24-2007, 08:59 AM
Hey a left side of the infield wit 3B Crede and SS A-Rod would be great regardlessRegardless of whether fans sitting behind first base need to wear helmets to protect them against A-Rod's throws?

Besides, most of the trade scenarios (such as they are) would have Crede going to NY with a couple of our prized pitchers. I'd like to see Rodriguez in a Sox uniform, I just wouldn't like the price we'd pay.

Vernam

IndianWhiteSox
02-24-2007, 10:14 AM
Regardless of whether fans sitting behind first base need to wear helmets to protect them against A-Rod's throws?

Besides, most of the trade scenarios (such as they are) would have Crede going to NY with a couple of our prized pitchers. I'd like to see Rodriguez in a Sox uniform, I just wouldn't like the price we'd pay.

Vernam

Vernam, the thing is A-Rod may be back to his old self if he left NY and moved back to SS. Part of the reason he's had so many errors is because, he's playing out of position. I think it would end up being a great defensive left side of the infield as well. The only problem is, is A-Rod going to opt out for the money or for the chance at happiness and a longer but also cheaper deal?

jabrch
02-24-2007, 12:40 PM
I think this is what PHG refers to as contemplating your navel?

Seriously - I'd do it in a heartbeat. But I don't think the Yanks are ready to give up one of the 2 or 3 best position players in baseball quite yet.

IndianWhiteSox
02-24-2007, 12:58 PM
I think this is what PHG refers to as contemplating your navel?

Seriously - I'd do it in a heartbeat. But I don't think the Yanks are ready to give up one of the 2 or 3 best position players in baseball quite yet.

They wouldn't have to give up A-Rod if he opts out for nothing.
:cool:

caulfield12
02-24-2007, 01:03 PM
They wouldn't have to give up A-Rod if he opts out for nothing.
:cool:

Then that will be after the season, and you're left with A-Rod and a $20-22 milllion dollar salary, I'm guessing.

Would he come here if Buehrle and Dye weren't coming back, to be part of a rebuilding effort around a young rotation? You would take all of the money from those two guys and put it back into one player. That's usually not the best strategic move.

Not anymore, he's in his 30's now and wants to win (I think).

IndianWhiteSox
02-24-2007, 01:08 PM
Then that will be after the season, and you're left with A-Rod and a $20-22 milllion dollar salary, I'm guessing.

Would he come here if Buehrle and Dye weren't coming back, to be part of a rebuilding effort around a young rotation? You would take all of the money from those two guys and put it back into one player. That's usually not the best strategic move.

Not anymore, he's in his 30's now and wants to win (I think).

You do realize that if the Sox win the World Series again and they keep coming through the turnstyles, then Reinsdorf and Company will definitely sing everyone back and I know they'll increase payroll to about 130million. Then at that rate, A-Rod could be signed by the Sox for 5yr/75mil if he really wants to win.

tick53
02-24-2007, 01:17 PM
Hmm...Crede for A-Rod...I'm not so sure that A-Rod can still play short anymore. I also think that A-Rod and Ozzie would clash. A-Rod is a better ballplayer, but I think Crede is a better a fit for the Sox.

Oh yes, Ozzie & Alex do have a history. I say we keep Joe.

caulfield12
02-24-2007, 03:03 PM
You do realize that if the Sox win the World Series again and they keep coming through the turnstyles, then Reinsdorf and Company will definitely sing everyone back and I know they'll increase payroll to about 130million. Then at that rate, A-Rod could be signed by the Sox for 5yr/75mil if he really wants to win.

Ummm....no.

What do you mean you "know" they will increase payroll by another 20%? What have they done this offseason that makes you think so?

They should remain in the $90-110 million range, but I am not expecting anything more than that.

Besides, if we win a second World Series, KW will want to go the Cardinals' route and dump mediocre veteran pitching (Marquis, Suppan, Weaver) for youngsters. He will have even more of an impetus to prove that he can do it on his own, with almost all players that he has acquired.

IndianWhiteSox
02-24-2007, 03:08 PM
Ummm....no.

What do you mean you "know" they will increase payroll by another 20%? What have they done this offseason that makes you think so?

They should remain in the $90-110 million range, but I am not expecting anything more than that.

Besides, if we win a second World Series, KW will want to go the Cardinals' route and dump mediocre veteran pitching (Marquis, Suppan, Weaver) for youngsters. He will have even more of an impetus to prove that he can do it on his own, with almost all players that he has acquired.

Because that's the history of Reinsdorf and Co. When they lose, they'll be stingy. When they win, they'll usually spend what's needed. The reason why I also say that, is because the fact they didn't spend money on dumb contracts this year, I'm sure they'll keep up with the times. If anything, after they win the World Series, they'll get rid of Contreras and Vazquez to keep the payroll between $100-115mil. But by that time Gavin Floyd will be 15-8, 3.50 ERA and 200IP this year with Danks and Massett having more than enough command during spring training to fill out the 4th and 5th spots leading to 18-6, 2.75ERA and 210IP in 2008.

caulfield12
02-24-2007, 04:00 PM
Because that's the history of Reinsdorf and Co. When they lose, they'll be stingy. When they win, they'll usually spend what's needed. The reason why I also say that, is because the fact they didn't spend money on dumb contracts this year, I'm sure they'll keep up with the times. If anything, after they win the World Series, they'll get rid of Contreras and Vazquez to keep the payroll between $100-115mil. But by that time Gavin Floyd will be 15-8, 3.50 ERA and 200IP this year with Danks and Massett having more than enough command during spring training to fill out the 4th and 5th spots leading to 18-6, 2.75ERA and 210IP in 2008.


Without Vazquez, Contreras, Buehrle, Crede and Dye, the payroll would be be chopped by $42 million. That would put them in the mid-$60's, aka Twins, A's and Indians territory. That's perhaps more far-fetched than the Sox going up to $125-130 million.

OTOH, if they go with all almost all young pitching (maybe keeping Garland), then their rotation goes from $50 million to $12 million in the blink of an eye.

IndianWhiteSox
02-25-2007, 01:43 AM
Without Vazquez, Contreras,Buehrle, Crede and Dye, the payroll would be be chopped by $42 million. That would put them in the mid-$60's, aka Twins, A's and Indians territory. That's perhaps more far-fetched than the Sox going up to $125-130 million.

OTOH, if they go with all almost all young pitching (maybe keeping Garland), then their rotation goes from $50 million to $12 million in the blink of an eye.

Because that's the history of Reinsdorf and Co. When they lose, they'll be stingy. When they win, they'll usually spend what's needed. The reason why I also say that, is because the fact they didn't spend money on dumb contracts this year, I'm sure they'll keep up with the times. If anything, after they win the World Series, they'll get rid of Contreras and Vazquez to keep the payroll between $100-115mil. But by that time Gavin Floyd will be 15-8, 3.50 ERA and 200IP this year with Danks and Massett having more than enough command during spring training to fill out the 4th and 5th spots leading to 18-6, 2.75ERA and 210IP in 2008.

If Vazquez and Contreras get traded after '07, then the rest will stay, including the ones mentioned in bold, and then the Sox can sign A-Rod to a 5year/$75million deal.