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View Full Version : Phil Rogers rates 7 or 8 MLB GMs ahead of KW


lakeviewsoxfan
01-23-2007, 10:58 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove06/columns/story?columnist=rogers_phil&id=2738814&lpos=tv1&lid=tab2pos1

I know we traded 1 vet in Freddy but when did McCarthy become a vet.

SoxxoS
01-23-2007, 11:41 AM
Putting Cashman over KW is borderline brain damaged.

lakeviewsoxfan
01-23-2007, 11:46 AM
Mods please move to Talkin Baseball

FedEx227
01-23-2007, 11:53 AM
Putting Cashman over KW is borderline brain damaged.

Yes, that's an absolute joke. I agree with just about everything else he said, but Cashman is an idiot.

maurice
01-23-2007, 12:23 PM
Linky (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove06/columns/story?columnist=rogers_phil&id=2738814)

Some of the guys on the list are no brainers, but Brian Freaking Cashman at #5?

West will be thrilled to learn that Rogers rates Billy Beane #2 (tie).

You can tell that this was published by ESPN and not the Trib, because it doesn't include Hendry but at least mentions KW.

cbotnyse
01-23-2007, 12:26 PM
I'd love to see Phil come on here and debate it with West. http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f21/cbotnyse/popcorn.gif

caulfield12
01-23-2007, 12:38 PM
There's no way Ryan and Beane are outside of the Top 5.

Cashman, as noted in some of the "ratings" on various sites, well, it's hard to judge him because you don't know much is him (on his own, like the Sheffield deal) and how much is him following orders from the Boss.

Same with KW, with the dumping of Baldwin, Howry, Lofton and Durham. You can debate Adkins, saving the money on Durham to play Harris, or Barry/Berry/Matsuoka, but it probably wasn't his idea. Actually, he got a really good return for Howry in Francisco, who liked like he could have become a stud with the Rangers.

soxtalker
01-23-2007, 01:30 PM
Hey guys, Phil's article was already posted and discussed yesterday in the ESPN.com GM poll (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=83423) thread. Not a bad topic, but it might make sense to merge the threads.

caulfield12
01-23-2007, 01:32 PM
Ominously missing...a ranking or assessment of the GM from the other side of town.

FloridaSox
01-23-2007, 01:33 PM
We can all go the ESPN.com and insert our rankings. Current fan rankings have Billy Beane at #1 and KW at #6 (and Jim Hendry at #18).

soxtalker
01-23-2007, 01:57 PM
Linky (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove06/columns/story?columnist=rogers_phil&id=2738814)

Some of the guys on the list are no brainers, but Brian Freaking Cashman at #5?

....

I'm not sure how you evaluate/compare Cashman. Phil's attempt is as good as any, but I can also understand how people could completely disagree. He just has so much more in the way of resources. What other team comes close? Maybe the Dodgers?

spiffie
01-23-2007, 02:10 PM
If the list is creating teams that continually choke under playoff pressure and cannot win the big one, then yes Terry Ryan and Billy Beane should be right at the top.

I'm sure Kenny would be concerned, but the glare off his World Series ring made him blind to this crap.

infohawk
01-23-2007, 02:46 PM
While not in the same order, many of the GMs Phil ranked were in my top few. I will say that John Schuerholz belongs ahead of Terry Ryan. I ranked Ryan highly as well, but c'mon, Ryan's winning teams (2002, 2003, 2004 and 2006) for the most part dominated a weak division (except for 2006) and never reached the World Series. The Braves won what, 12 consecutive division titles and at least one World Series while making at least one other World Series appearance?

You can also argue that Jocketty should be ranked ahead of Ryan considering that the Cardinals make the playoffs on a fairly consistent basis and have made two World Series appearances in the last three years while winning one of them. If Phil's criteria factors in market size, then Cashman probably shouldn't have been ranked as high. Again, I don't quibble with his top GMs, just the particular order. Just my thoughts!

chisoxmike
01-23-2007, 03:17 PM
I really don't understand all the Phil Rodgers hate lately. He's been one of the biggest Sox supporters over the years and has praised a lot of things the Sox stand for---HE WROTE A ****ING BOOK ON 2005!!!!!

I too think having a hole in the 5th starter role is going to be a problem this year becuase I can't imagine Floyd, Danks, or Haegar will be able to fill the void and be a dependable starter.

ondafarm
01-23-2007, 04:08 PM
We can all go the ESPN.com and insert our rankings. Current fan rankings have Billy Beane at #1 and KW at #6 (and Jim Hendry at #18).

Inserting my rankings isn't the first thing I'd think to do on ESPN.

caulfield12
01-23-2007, 04:58 PM
While not in the same order, many of the GMs Phil ranked were in my top few. I will say that John Schuerholz belongs ahead of Terry Ryan. I ranked Ryan highly as well, but c'mon, Ryan's winning teams (2002, 2003, 2004 and 2006) for the most part dominated a weak division (except for 2006) and never reached the World Series. The Braves won what, 12 consecutive division titles and at least one World Series while making at least one other World Series appearance?

You can also argue that Jocketty should be ranked ahead of Ryan considering that the Cardinals make the playoffs on a fairly consistent basis and have made two World Series appearances in the last three years while winning one of them. If Phil's criteria factors in market size, then Cashman probably shouldn't have been ranked as high. Again, I don't quibble with his top GMs, just the particular order. Just my thoughts!


It's like Phil Jackson coaching the Washington Generals. We'll never know how he would do without talent around him.

Jocketty has a much bigger budget and fanbase to work with than Ryan...comparing Ryan to Jocketty is like comparing Jocketty's working margin to Cashman's. Cashman can make multiple mistakes and cover for them with money, like the Abreu deal. 85% of GM's don't have the luxury of making the big mistake.

Schuerholz I agree on, although he is a pompous ass and his book might be the most worthless I have ever read....wow, they almost had a deal for Barry Bonds worked out with Ted Simmons!

Epstein, too, has an immense margin of error because of their payroll and franchise net worth.