A. Cavatica
01-08-2007, 12:29 AM
The Bill James poll thread got me thinking about James' contributions. Of course, one of his recurring subjects is how to predict whether player X will get into the Hall of Fame. In fact, there's a 2002 WSI thread about this, where X = Frank Thomas:
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=13415
In 2002, Frank was a likely Hall of Famer according to James' criteria. It's interesting to see how much stronger his case has become. The only question in my mind is whether he'll go in on the first ballot.
1>Was he ever regarded as the best player in baseball? Did anybody, while he was active, ever suggest that he was the best player in baseball?
Yes. Griffey Jr. is the only real competition. The other guy (Bonds) is now disgraced.
2> Was he the best player on his team?
Yes.
3>Was he the best player in baseball at his position? Was he the best player in the league at his position?
Yes and yes. McGwire, Palmeiro, Giambi have also been disgraced.
4> Did he have an impact on a number of pennant races?
Add 2003, 2005, and 2006 to the others. Frank's injuries had a negative impact on a few other races.
5> Was he good enough that he could play regularly after passing his prime?
Certainly. Frank could barely walk in 2005, so he simply tried to hit home runs, and he made a big (if brief) contribution to the championship run.
6> Is he the very best baseball player in history who is not in the Hall of Fame?
NA (still active).
7> Are most players who have comparable statistics in the Hall of Fame?
Players with comparable statistics are on the short list of greatest hitters of all time.
8> Do the player's numbers meet Hall of Fame standards?
Without a doubt. His peak numbers were off the charts, his career averages are .305/38/122, and he's up to 487 home runs. baseball-reference.com has him at 209.0 on the "HoF Monitor", where a score > 100 indicates a likely Hall of Famer.
9>Is there any evidence to suggest that the player was significantly better or worse than is suggested by his statistics?
The evidence suggests that he was steroid-free when he put those numbers up. This makes him look even better in hindsight.
10>Is he the best player at his position who is eligible for the Hall of Fame?
He's certainly the best DH ever. (And there's the rub.)
11>How many MVP-type seasons did he have? Did he ever win an MVP award? If not, how many times was he close?
Won the award in 1993 and 1994; finished second, narrowly, to a juicer in 2000; finished third in 1991 and 1997; finished fourth in 2006; also got votes in 1992, 1995, 1996, and 2003.
12> How many All-Star-type seasons did he have? How many All-Star games did he play in? Did most of the players who played in this many All-Star games go into the Hall of Fame?
I count ten All-Star-type seasons (1991-1997, 2000, 2003, 2006). I can only find five All-Star appearances, which is even fewer than his number of top-four MVP finishes. Clearly, being a DH worked against him.
13> If this man were the best player on his team, would it be likely that the team could win the pennant?
Yes.
14>What impact did the player have on baseball history? Was he responsible for any rule changes? Did he introduce any new equipment? Did he change the game in any way?
None outside of his contributions on the field.
15>Did the player uphold the standards of sportsmanship and character that the Hall of Fame, in its written guidelines, instructs us to consider?
Yes. Being grumpy once in a while is no great sin.
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=13415
In 2002, Frank was a likely Hall of Famer according to James' criteria. It's interesting to see how much stronger his case has become. The only question in my mind is whether he'll go in on the first ballot.
1>Was he ever regarded as the best player in baseball? Did anybody, while he was active, ever suggest that he was the best player in baseball?
Yes. Griffey Jr. is the only real competition. The other guy (Bonds) is now disgraced.
2> Was he the best player on his team?
Yes.
3>Was he the best player in baseball at his position? Was he the best player in the league at his position?
Yes and yes. McGwire, Palmeiro, Giambi have also been disgraced.
4> Did he have an impact on a number of pennant races?
Add 2003, 2005, and 2006 to the others. Frank's injuries had a negative impact on a few other races.
5> Was he good enough that he could play regularly after passing his prime?
Certainly. Frank could barely walk in 2005, so he simply tried to hit home runs, and he made a big (if brief) contribution to the championship run.
6> Is he the very best baseball player in history who is not in the Hall of Fame?
NA (still active).
7> Are most players who have comparable statistics in the Hall of Fame?
Players with comparable statistics are on the short list of greatest hitters of all time.
8> Do the player's numbers meet Hall of Fame standards?
Without a doubt. His peak numbers were off the charts, his career averages are .305/38/122, and he's up to 487 home runs. baseball-reference.com has him at 209.0 on the "HoF Monitor", where a score > 100 indicates a likely Hall of Famer.
9>Is there any evidence to suggest that the player was significantly better or worse than is suggested by his statistics?
The evidence suggests that he was steroid-free when he put those numbers up. This makes him look even better in hindsight.
10>Is he the best player at his position who is eligible for the Hall of Fame?
He's certainly the best DH ever. (And there's the rub.)
11>How many MVP-type seasons did he have? Did he ever win an MVP award? If not, how many times was he close?
Won the award in 1993 and 1994; finished second, narrowly, to a juicer in 2000; finished third in 1991 and 1997; finished fourth in 2006; also got votes in 1992, 1995, 1996, and 2003.
12> How many All-Star-type seasons did he have? How many All-Star games did he play in? Did most of the players who played in this many All-Star games go into the Hall of Fame?
I count ten All-Star-type seasons (1991-1997, 2000, 2003, 2006). I can only find five All-Star appearances, which is even fewer than his number of top-four MVP finishes. Clearly, being a DH worked against him.
13> If this man were the best player on his team, would it be likely that the team could win the pennant?
Yes.
14>What impact did the player have on baseball history? Was he responsible for any rule changes? Did he introduce any new equipment? Did he change the game in any way?
None outside of his contributions on the field.
15>Did the player uphold the standards of sportsmanship and character that the Hall of Fame, in its written guidelines, instructs us to consider?
Yes. Being grumpy once in a while is no great sin.