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Fenway
11-30-2006, 10:20 AM
Hey Albert **** You won the World Series after almost blowing a playoff spot.


SANTO DOMINGO, Dominican Republic (AP) -- Albert Pujols (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/6619/) thinks he was snubbed. The St. Louis Cardinals (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/teams/stl/)' slugger is upset he lost out to Philadelphia's Ryan Howard (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7437/) for the National League MVP award, saying Wednesday the honor should go to someone on a playoff team.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=ApYKBl3bPFz1f2rr6pHGmIA5nYcB?slug=ap-cardinals-pujols&prov=ap&type=lgns

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 10:24 AM
Hey Albert **** You won the World Series after almost blowing a playoff spot.


SANTO DOMINGO, Dominican Republic (AP) -- Albert Pujols (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/6619/) thinks he was snubbed. The St. Louis Cardinals (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/teams/stl/)' slugger is upset he lost out to Philadelphia's Ryan Howard (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7437/) for the National League MVP award, saying Wednesday the honor should go to someone on a playoff team.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=ApYKBl3bPFz1f2rr6pHGmIA5nYcB?slug=ap-cardinals-pujols&prov=ap&type=lgns

I tend to agree with Pujols.

I think he deserved the MVP this year

itsnotrequired
11-30-2006, 10:24 AM
Remove Howard from the Phillies and Pujols form the Cardinals. Which team would go in the tank faster? Methinks it is the Phillies...

oeo
11-30-2006, 10:27 AM
I tend to agree with Pujols.

I think he deserved the MVP this year

Agree or not, I think it's pretty classless to come out and say he got snubbed in public. Tell your wife that, your family that, your friends that...don't let it be publicly known.

I used to have a lot of respect for Pujols, but he really seems to be turning into an *******.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 10:28 AM
Agree or not, I think it's pretty classless to come out and say he got snubbed in public. Tell your wife that, your family that, your friends that...don't let it be publicly known.

I used to have a lot of respect for Pujols, but he really seems to be turning into an *******.

It's a soundbyte.

Also: Pujols is probably going to win a lot of MVP awards. Yet he's already falling victim to the "We expect him to put up great numbers, so we'll give the MVP to people we didn't expect to put up great numbers"

How many MVP's has he already lost to Bonds's cheating ass, and now he's got to lose one to Howard because Howard's "great for baseball"?

oeo
11-30-2006, 10:32 AM
It's a soundbyte.

And your point?

Sometimes you just need to keep your mouth shut. If this were flip-flopped and the Phillies made the playoffs, I have a hard time believing Howard would ever come out and say he thinks it should come from a playoff team.

How many MVP's has he already lost to Bonds's cheating ass, and now he's got to lose one to Howard because Howard's "great for baseball"?

These two examples are nothing alike. Bonds cheated his way to those awards, and your acting as if Howard did not have a monster season. Personally, I think it could have went either way. Pujols definately did not get snubbed...he lost, boohoo. This argument is the same crap the New York media was spewing about Jeter.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 10:36 AM
And your point?

Sometimes you just need to keep your mouth shut. If this were flip-flopped and the Phillies made the playoffs, I have a hard time believing Howard would ever come out and say he thinks it should come from a playoff team.

My point is I can see why Pujols is upset about losing out on a number of MVP awards he probably should have won.

Yeah it would be nice if he'd be quiet. But he wasn't and now it's time to evaluate the truth behind his statements.

My point about the soundbyte is it's obvious that sports journalists have a way of trying to create the story rather than report it. Reading that article it seemed to me he was prodded into commenting.

And you know what? If Pujols is cocky about his playing ability who cares? He's a great person, gives a lot to charity, has never used steroids, is a good teammate by all accounts, and plays great fundamental baseball.

If he wants to be confident about being the best player in baseball, let him.

oeo
11-30-2006, 10:40 AM
My point is I can see why Pujols is upset about losing out on a number of MVP awards he probably should have won.

Yeah it would be nice if he'd be quiet. But he wasn't and now it's time to evaluate the truth behind his statements.

My point about the soundbyte is it's obvious that sports journalists have a way of trying to create the story rather than report it. Reading that article it seemed to me he was prodded into commenting.

And you know what? If Pujols is cocky about his playing ability who cares? He's a great person, gives a lot to charity, has never used steroids, is a good teammate by all accounts, and plays great fundamental baseball.

If he wants to be confident about being the best player in baseball, let him.

Big Frank, who has a lot of foot in mouth moments, was ripped off by the cheater Giambi in 2000...and he didn't (as far as I know), complain about it.

And I understand what sports journalists do with some quotes, but as a baseball player, you should know that, as well. Watch what you say so that they can't twist it however they please. Again, he still said what he said, and I don't think he should have said it. If he was in Dye's situation, when he said it should come from a playoff team, that's fine. In Pujols' case, it sounds like sour grapes.

And the thing is, he wasn't like this a couple of years ago. That's why I respected him, he went about his business and didn't complain. I'm not a fan of cocky baseball players, I don't care how good you are.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 10:47 AM
Big Frank, who has a lot of foot in mouth moments, was ripped off by the cheater Giambi in 2000...and he didn't (as far as I know), complain about it.

And I understand what sports journalists do with some quotes, but as a baseball player, you should know that, as well. Watch what you say so that they can't twist it however they please. Again, he still said what he said, and I don't think he should have said it. If he was in Dye's situation, when he said it should come from a playoff team, that's fine. In Pujols' case, it sounds like sour grapes.

And the thing is, he wasn't like this a couple of years ago. That's why I respected him, he went about his business and didn't complain. I'm not a fan of cocky baseball players, I don't care how good you are.

Frank "complained" about a lot of other things. So what's your point?

With a FEW exceptions(Ken Griffey Jr, Mickey Mantle), baseball fans have always had begrudging respect for players who are outright superstars. (and actually do you remember how delighted some people were when Griffey had his fall from grace?)

There's always going to be a bad light under the microscope of lower-than-dirt sports journalists. It's just the way it is. If it wasn't this they'd have found som eother reason to rip Pujols. Just look at Frank for an example of this. No Frank never complained about the MVP. Instead he was "whining" about being underpaid. Or "being a cancer" to Jerry Manuel.

**** all this Mariotti bull****. Pujols is a great ballplayer, a good human being (by all accounts) and he probably deserved the MVP (although Howard did have an excellent season as well)

AuroraSoxFan
11-30-2006, 10:54 AM
Pujols should be glad that he got a ring after his team barely finished 500 and be quiet. Sure he's a great player. But he got a ring for God's sake. What the hell more does he want? He should enjoy his offseason as a champ and work on his conditioning to avoid getting hurt again. He roached his leg last season backpedaling for a simple pop up. He should work on that so it doesn't happen again and focus on his ring and WS trophy and not worry about much else. IMO he really has nothing to complain about.

jenn2080
11-30-2006, 10:59 AM
Pretty positive good old Albert should shut the **** up. That was a polite way of him saying he should get it.

tstrike2000
11-30-2006, 11:03 AM
I tend to agree with Pujols.

I think he deserved the MVP this year

I thought he deserved it, too just based on the number of injuries on the team, including himself, and the poor starting pitching. Without him, the Cardinals could've easily been 10 games under .500. However, it's a moot point because the Phillies had a slightly better record and after such a monster year it's very difficult to argue against Howard.

oeo
11-30-2006, 11:14 AM
Frank "complained" about a lot of other things. So what's your point?

Even Frank, who did whine and complain about a lot, didn't basically come out and say that he deserved the award (and IMO, that's what Pujols is saying).

**** all this Mariotti bull****. Pujols is a great ballplayer, a good human being (by all accounts) and he probably deserved the MVP (although Howard did have an excellent season as well)

And there's my point...Pujols didn't get snubbed. Howard had a great season; it could have went either way, so there's no reason for the sour grapes. And actually, as someone just pointed out, the Phillies had a better record than the Cardinals, and if they played in the weakest division in baseball like the Cardinals do, they would have won probably 7-8 more games than the Cardinals. It's one thing if your team won 100 games, and the guy who wins the MVP only wins 70 games...but the Phillies were actually a better team than the Cardinals...so he can just keep his mouth shut.

wsoxfan
11-30-2006, 11:22 AM
Pujols should be happy the Cardinals even made the playoffs having the 5th best record in the NL, behind even the Phillies. He should just shut up and enjoy the fact they somehow won a World Series when they probably shouldn't have even been in the playoffs...

Steelrod
11-30-2006, 11:23 AM
Next He'll Complain About Salary!

Jerome
11-30-2006, 11:29 AM
hahahaha what ****ing bull **** a "playoff" team?!?!? The Phillies had a better record than the Cards did and played in a tougher division. If the Cards didn't play in the central they wouldn't have made the playoffs and baseball would have been spared the lamest WS champ in years.

Albert you are a living legend and without you your team doesnt win 50 games. But ****

AuroraSoxFan
11-30-2006, 11:35 AM
The 05 Sox won 16 games more than the 06 cards and had a better playoff record despite being in a tougher division/league. And nobody on that squad complained about not winning any individual awards. I know it's the offseason and they won't see each other for another 2 plus months. But I am curious as to what LaRussa would have to say about his complaints.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 11:37 AM
Next He'll Complain About Salary!

You mean the guy who took a lot less money than he could have got to stay in St. Louis.

Yeah, I expect to see him complaining about salary by the end of the month.

Gosh I really hate Pujols. He's, like, good at baseball, so therefore let's look for excuses to hate him.

In fact I think I'll write an article about how I wish he acted more like Sammy Sosa in the playoffs:rolleyes:

AuroraSoxFan
11-30-2006, 11:41 AM
You mean the guy who took a lot less money than he could have got to stay in St. Louis.

Yeah, I expect to see him complaining about salary by the end of the month.

Gosh I really hate Pujols. He's, like, good at baseball, so therefore let's look for excuses to hate him.

In fact I think I'll write an article about how I wish he acted more like Sammy Sosa in the playoffs:rolleyes:

I don't think anyone hates the guy. He's always been a class act and his numbers speak for themselves. It didn't even seem like he was taking shots at Howard directly. Most just do not see what the guy has to gripe about.

oeo
11-30-2006, 11:42 AM
You mean the guy who took a lot less money than he could have got to stay in St. Louis.

Yeah, I expect to see him complaining about salary by the end of the month.

Gosh I really hate Pujols. He's, like, good at baseball, so therefore let's look for excuses to hate him.

In fact I think I'll write an article about how I wish he acted more like Sammy Sosa in the playoffs:rolleyes:

It has nothing to do with being good at baseball. Like I said, I used to have a lot of respect for him because he was an All Star player, that just went about his business. The problem comes when you start thinking you're God's gift to baseball. Suck it up and tell them that Howard had a great season, he deserved it...don't say that you deserve it. He lost a lot of respect, and would have gained a lot if he had said the right thing.

PKalltheway
11-30-2006, 11:49 AM
Honestly the award could have went either way, but c'mon Albert. Just shut up. Which would you rather have: a ring, or a MVP trophy (which Pujols won last year anyway). Pujols did not get snubbed. Heck, talk to Dontrelle Willis if you want to talk about snubs. You didn't see him complain when he didn't win the Cy Young in 2005.

soxinem1
11-30-2006, 11:50 AM
Agree or not, I think it's pretty classless to come out and say he got snubbed in public. Tell your wife that, your family that, your friends that...don't let it be publicly known.

I used to have a lot of respect for Pujols, but he really seems to be turning into an *******.

I agree.

If he didn't get hurt he would have won it running away. His lack of respect for Howard is pretty appalling. Just shows you the class level of some players this day and age.

As it is, he should be happy about his team backdooring into a World Series win, and talking about how excited he is to be defending champions. As Cal Ripken will tell you, you never know when the next one may come......

PKalltheway
11-30-2006, 11:53 AM
I agree.

If he didn't get hurt he would have won it running away. His lack of respect for Howard is pretty appalling. Just shows you the class level of some players this day and age.

As it is, he should be happy about his team backdooring into a World Series win, and talking about how excited he is to be defending champions. As Cal Ripken will tell you, you never know when the next one may come......
Exactly. Ripken won in 1983, then he played his last 18 years without seeing another one. Just enjoy your title, Albert.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 11:57 AM
It has nothing to do with being good at baseball. Like I said, I used to have a lot of respect for him because he was an All Star player, that just went about his business. The problem comes when you start thinking you're God's gift to baseball. Suck it up and tell them that Howard had a great season, he deserved it...don't say that you deserve it. He lost a lot of respect, and would have gained a lot if he had said the right thing.

He is God's gift to baseball. Unless you want to count Bonds, he's probably the best pure hitter I will see in my lifetime

oeo
11-30-2006, 12:05 PM
He is God's gift to baseball. Unless you want to count Bonds, he's probably the best pure hitter I will see in my lifetime

No one is God's gift to baseball. Believe it or not, baseball would still be going if Albert never played a big league game in his life. Any player that thinks they are is just a cocky *******.

spawn
11-30-2006, 12:12 PM
Wow...I always thought every players dream was to win the WS? I always thought it was a team game. Pujols is a great player and probably deserved the MVP this year...but that's a me me me atitude...I always thought he was above that. I guess I was wrong.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 12:18 PM
No one is God's gift to baseball. Believe it or not, baseball would still be going if Albert never played a big league game in his life. Any player that thinks they are is just a cocky *******.

probably it would. It would also be a lot less fun to watch. And I don't recall him saying he was God's gift, nor him saying he thought he was. That was someone else's assessment...and I happen to think he is, if not God's gift to baseball, the best thing to happen to it in the past 20 some years

Wow...I always thought every players dream was to win the WS? I always thought it was a team game. Pujols is a great player and probably deserved the MVP this year...but that's a me me me atitude...I always thought he was above that. I guess I was wrong.


Well, Pujols has never really shown a me-first attitude, signing for less than he probably could have gotten on open market, and furthermore being a good teammate by all accounts. He also said this well after winning the WS...I'm sure if we went back to the time of the WS win we could find a lot of quotes by him saying how thrilled he was the Cardinals won the WS and how happy he is for the city of STL.

Clearly his words here were poorly chosen and he probably regrets the ****storm this has brewed. I'm merely trying to point out

a.) Pujols is probably right in his assertion

b.) sportswriters are dirtbags and we clearly did not see the whole conversation

mccoydp
11-30-2006, 01:14 PM
Pretty positive good old Albert should shut the **** up. That was a polite way of him saying he should get it.

The last sentence was what I was going to write...thank goodness I read all of the comments before I post.:D:

mjmcend
11-30-2006, 01:19 PM
Agree or not, I think it's pretty classless to come out and say he got snubbed in public. Tell your wife that, your family that, your friends that...don't let it be publicly known.

I used to have a lot of respect for Pujols, but he really seems to be turning into an *******.

I agree. He used to seem like a hard-working, soft-spoken, great baseball player. Since the playoffs this year, he has come off as an *******, as you said.

oeo
11-30-2006, 01:45 PM
probably it would. It would also be a lot less fun to watch. And I don't recall him saying he was God's gift, nor him saying he thought he was. That was someone else's assessment...and I happen to think he is, if not God's gift to baseball, the best thing to happen to it in the past 20 some years

Probably??? I'm pretty sure Albert didn't save baseball from disappearing off the face of the Earth.

He's a great baseball player, but the game wouldn't be any more or any less exciting without him. That's going a little overboard.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 02:29 PM
Probably??? I'm pretty sure Albert didn't save baseball from disappearing off the face of the Earth.

He's a great baseball player, but the game wouldn't be any more or any less exciting without him. That's going a little overboard.
Probably was an understatement. Surely you don't think I believe that the game wouldn't continue without Pujols. However, I do believe it would be less exciting to watch. Anytime you have one less player who could be considered one of the best hitters of all time playing, it's going to be less fun to watch.

Consider the NFL without Manning (actually I wouldn't mind seeing that) or the NBA without Lebron. Less exciting.

Cardinals won the WS this year. That was exciting for a lot of people. Almost certainly doesn't happen without Pujols. Less exciting.

oeo
11-30-2006, 02:37 PM
Probably was an understatement. Surely you don't think I believe that the game wouldn't continue without Pujols. However, I do believe it would be less exciting to watch. Anytime you have one less player who could be considered one of the best hitters of all time playing, it's going to be less fun to watch.

Consider the NFL without Manning (actually I wouldn't mind seeing that) or the NBA without Lebron. Less exciting.

Cardinals won the WS this year. That was exciting for a lot of people. Almost certainly doesn't happen without Pujols. Less exciting.

I don't think you believe that, but I do think you're overrating Pujols' meaning to the game. In my opinion, Pujols doesn't change how exciting the game is. I would watch baseball with or without Pujols, he hasn't changed a thing for me in respect to how exciting the sport is.

chaerulez
11-30-2006, 02:55 PM
Pujols should stop whining like a little girl. When is a reporter going to ask him if it's fair for him to be consider when his personal trainer was named by Jason Grimsley as a HGH supplier?

Screw Pujols and "Cardinal Nation".

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 03:01 PM
I don't think you believe that, but I do think you're overrating Pujols' meaning to the game. In my opinion, Pujols doesn't change how exciting the game is. I would watch baseball with or without Pujols, he hasn't changed a thing for me in respect to how exciting the sport is.

You don't care much about Pujols, but a lot of people do a great deal. Would baseball in the 90's have been ruined without Griffey? Or Frank? No. But it wouldn't have been nearly as fun to watch.

The more hall of famers playing at any given time, the better, imo. Especially when two of those HOFers (Pujols and ARod) rank among the best hitters in baseball history.

Grzegorz
11-30-2006, 03:21 PM
Albert Pujols is a petulant child; from his dismissal of Tom Galvin's performance in the playoffs to his whining about losing out on the MVP award.

Please Albert, just shut up and play. The rest will take care of itself.

RKMeibalane
11-30-2006, 04:57 PM
Albert Pujols is a petulant child; from his dismissal of Tom Galvin's performance in the playoffs to his whining about losing out on the MVP award.

Please Albert, just shut up and play. The rest will take care of itself.

Who's Tom Glavin?

Unregistered
11-30-2006, 04:59 PM
Who's Tom Glavin?
He actually said "Tom Galvin."

You're twice as bad for misspelling a misspelling. :bandance:

RKMeibalane
11-30-2006, 05:01 PM
He actually said "Tom Galvin."

You're twice as bad for misspelling a misspelling. :bandance:

Wow. He did do that. I need to keep better records. :cool:

Unregistered
11-30-2006, 05:03 PM
Wow. He did do that. I need to keep better records. :cool:

:D:

23Ventura
11-30-2006, 05:42 PM
The only reason the Cards made the playoffs and the Phillies didn't was because the Cards play in an easier division.

FarWestChicago
11-30-2006, 05:55 PM
Pujols is now in a self-created jag bag prison. What a jerk. That was some serious Bondsian behavior, no matter what his apologists say.

WizardsofOzzie
11-30-2006, 08:29 PM
Talk to anyone who's won an MVP and im sure they will gladly give it up for even a shot at a World Series.....notice i said "shot at a world series". Thats how important an MVP award is. Show me someone who never got to the World Series, but did win an MVP, and wouldn't trade his MVP title for a bid to the World Series, and i'll show you an idiot

Pujols, please shut the **** up and enjoy your ring you ungrateful ass
:whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner:

Grzegorz
11-30-2006, 10:19 PM
Jeez, I looked at the box score for that game and still misspelled the name.

Tom Glavine...

I am with FarWestChicago on this one; Albert Pujols is a jerk.

chaerulez
11-30-2006, 10:59 PM
Also, I recently remember reading an article either on ESPN or SI's website about how Pujlos' attitude towards the media was changing and it was becoming Bonds like. It'll be interesting to see what kind of person Pujlos becomes, a nice guy or a jerk.

fquaye149
11-30-2006, 11:06 PM
Also, I recently remember reading an article either on ESPN or SI's website about how Pujlos' attitude towards the media was changing and it was becoming Bonds like. It'll be interesting to see what kind of person Pujlos becomes, a nice guy or a jerk.

I want to say this, and this is the last I'll say because it's clear that I'm in the minority in supporting Pujols and I respect that. I don't defend what he said. But I sympathize with him. Why?

It seems clear to me that to be a superstar in baseball by merit of your actual performance (in other words, if you're not Jeter) is a gruelling thing. Three years ago Pujols looked like one of the greatest guys in the world, doing tons of community service, keeping his mouth shut when Bonds won MVP's tainted with steroid cream.

Now all of a sudden he's a ********. In the playoffs he was a "jerk" because he wasn't kissing his fingers on HR and pointing at the crowd. Superstars today seem to be resented by the media, for some reason, and it kind of depresses me. Look at all the great hitters in baseball: Manny, Delgado, A-Rod, Pujols, Frank. If you've been a superstar hitter more than 3 years (i.e. Ortiz is not eligible) and if you speak english enough to say something "stupid" (i.e. Ichiro is not eligible) you probably look like an *******.

Is it possible every great baseball player we have who has been great for a long time is a jerk? I don't know.

What I do know is I blame sportswriters, especially ESPN for trying to find the most interesting story possible at the expense of just keeping athletes in their place as "just athletes." Now they're supposed to say all the right things and never get into trouble or else they're jerks.

Ugh. I'm sick of this whole fiasco. I wish Pujols had just kept his big mouth shut or said that he respected Howard's performance. But he didn't and he's an ******* in this very specific instance.

But I find it interesting that, according to what we read in the media, everyone who's anyone in baseball is a self-obsessed *******.

And I also find it interesting that Pujols, the selfish, self-obsessed *******, has given a lot of time and money to help the mentally handicapped that he very damn well didn't have to do.

drewcifer
11-30-2006, 11:41 PM
I want to say this, and this is the last I'll say because it's clear that I'm in the minority in supporting Pujols and I respect that. I don't defend what he said. But I sympathize with him. Why?

It seems clear to me that to be a superstar in baseball by merit of your actual performance (in other words, if you're not Jeter) is a gruelling thing. Three years ago Pujols looked like one of the greatest guys in the world, doing tons of community service, keeping his mouth shut when Bonds won MVP's tainted with steroid cream.

Now all of a sudden he's a ********. In the playoffs he was a "jerk" because he wasn't kissing his fingers on HR and pointing at the crowd. Superstars today seem to be resented by the media, for some reason, and it kind of depresses me. Look at all the great hitters in baseball: Manny, Delgado, A-Rod, Pujols, Frank. If you've been a superstar hitter more than 3 years (i.e. Ortiz is not eligible) and if you speak english enough to say something "stupid" (i.e. Ichiro is not eligible) you probably look like an *******.

Is it possible every great baseball player we have who has been great for a long time is a jerk? I don't know.

What I do know is I blame sportswriters, especially ESPN for trying to find the most interesting story possible at the expense of just keeping athletes in their place as "just athletes." Now they're supposed to say all the right things and never get into trouble or else they're jerks.

Ugh. I'm sick of this whole fiasco. I wish Pujols had just kept his big mouth shut or said that he respected Howard's performance. But he didn't and he's an ******* in this very specific instance.

But I find it interesting that, according to what we read in the media, everyone who's anyone in baseball is a self-obsessed *******.

And I also find it interesting that Pujols, the selfish, self-obsessed *******, has given a lot of time and money to help the mentally handicapped that he very damn well didn't have to do.

:nod: Not all disagree with your posts.

oeo
12-01-2006, 02:40 AM
I want to say this, and this is the last I'll say because it's clear that I'm in the minority in supporting Pujols and I respect that. I don't defend what he said. But I sympathize with him. Why?

It seems clear to me that to be a superstar in baseball by merit of your actual performance (in other words, if you're not Jeter) is a gruelling thing. Three years ago Pujols looked like one of the greatest guys in the world, doing tons of community service, keeping his mouth shut when Bonds won MVP's tainted with steroid cream.

Now all of a sudden he's a ********. In the playoffs he was a "jerk" because he wasn't kissing his fingers on HR and pointing at the crowd. Superstars today seem to be resented by the media, for some reason, and it kind of depresses me. Look at all the great hitters in baseball: Manny, Delgado, A-Rod, Pujols, Frank. If you've been a superstar hitter more than 3 years (i.e. Ortiz is not eligible) and if you speak english enough to say something "stupid" (i.e. Ichiro is not eligible) you probably look like an *******.

Is it possible every great baseball player we have who has been great for a long time is a jerk? I don't know.

What I do know is I blame sportswriters, especially ESPN for trying to find the most interesting story possible at the expense of just keeping athletes in their place as "just athletes." Now they're supposed to say all the right things and never get into trouble or else they're jerks.

Ugh. I'm sick of this whole fiasco. I wish Pujols had just kept his big mouth shut or said that he respected Howard's performance. But he didn't and he's an ******* in this very specific instance.

But I find it interesting that, according to what we read in the media, everyone who's anyone in baseball is a self-obsessed *******.

And I also find it interesting that Pujols, the selfish, self-obsessed *******, has given a lot of time and money to help the mentally handicapped that he very damn well didn't have to do.

I don't buy that at all. I think all the attention gets to their heads, that's why they act like jerks. They think they're superior because they're raking in millions of dollars each year. It's not like Pujols is new to this whole superstar thing, he's been around it for years now. All of a sudden sports writers just get on his back? I doubt it. And even if they were, Pujols would know by now that they're going to try to do. Here's ome advice: think before you talk.

We'll see what happens with Ryan Howard...I think that guy is pure class, but I also thought that about Pujols as well.

fquaye149
12-01-2006, 03:09 AM
I don't buy that at all. I think all the attention gets to their heads, that's why they act like jerks. They think they're superior because they're raking in millions of dollars each year. It's not like Pujols is new to this whole superstar thing, he's been around it for years now. All of a sudden sports writers just get on his back? I doubt it. And even if they were, Pujols would know by now that they're going to try to do. Here's ome advice: think before you talk.

We'll see what happens with Ryan Howard...I think that guy is pure class, but I also thought that about Pujols as well.

And you'll think that about every baseball player until the media finds a way to make them look bad.

If Paulie was a superstar some of the stuff he has said would look pretty bad. But he's not so it's gone mostly unnoticed.

Give Ortiz a year and the media will find a way to skewer him. Maybe it will take them two years. I'm not sure.

oeo
12-01-2006, 03:18 AM
And you'll think that about every baseball player until the media finds a way to make them look bad.

If Paulie was a superstar some of the stuff he has said would look pretty bad. But he's not so it's gone mostly unnoticed.

Give Ortiz a year and the media will find a way to skewer him. Maybe it will take them two years. I'm not sure.

What, when people absolutely freak out about everything he says? If Konerko opens his mouth, it's reported here, and there will be pages and pages of whining. I don't think Konerko would ever make a comment like Pujols'. The same goes for Dye. If the Sox had made the playoffs, he should have won...but would he have said that it should go to a guy on a playoff team? I doubt it.

Saying sports writers do this because they want to shed a bad light on superstars is just an awful excuse. Every one of those guys listed above have a brain...use it; think about what you say before you say it.

fquaye149
12-01-2006, 03:25 AM
What, when people absolutely freak out about everything he says? If Konerko opens his mouth, it's reported here, and there will be pages and pages of whining. I don't think Konerko would ever make a comment like Pujols'. The same goes for Dye. If the Sox had made the playoffs, he should have won...but would he have said that it should go to a guy on a playoff team? I doubt it.

Saying sports writers do this because they want to shed a bad light on superstars is just an awful excuse. Every one of those guys listed above have a brain...use it; think about what you say before you say it.

good point.

so why doesn't paulie?

Since you brought it up, when Paulie sells Dye out by saying "that's not the way you play baseball," or sells Uribe out by saying "Clayton's the best ss I ever played with" that's "overblown"

But when Pujols brings up the team nature of the game by saying that the MVP should reflect team achievement and not individual statistics, that's him being a pompous *******?

Ok. That's fine. I'm not saying that Paulie's a bad teammate, b/c that's clearly not the case. I just want to know ***, since you decided to talk about how overblown this board gets about Paulie's comments

oeo
12-01-2006, 03:28 AM
good point.

so why doesn't paulie?

I haven't had a problem with anything Paulie has said. People around here blow it way out of proportion, and it's nothing like this situation.

fquaye149
12-01-2006, 03:31 AM
I haven't had a problem with anything Paulie has said. People around here blow it way out of proportion, and it's nothing like this situation.see above. I edited.

MUsoxfan
12-01-2006, 03:40 AM
But when Pujols brings up the team nature of the game by saying that the MVP should reflect team achievement and not individual statistics, that's him being a pompous *******?



His timing was all off. If he says it in Spring Training next year, little would be made of it. Right after the "snub" he calls it out.

oeo
12-01-2006, 03:44 AM
see above. I edited.

Because from all reports, Paulie is a leader in the clubhouse and a very good teammate (like you said). I don't remember the Dye situation you're referring to. But, I don't recall Dye or Uribe saying anything after his comments, or any problems in the clubhouse because of them. IMO, it's different when Pujols thinks he deserves an award over a guy that had a great year. There's no need for that, you come off as an *******.

I agree that writers will twist what they say (like I said before), but I still think you're crossing the line when you say (basically) that you had a better year than another guy...especially when Pujols probably doesn't know Howard all that well.

I need some sleep, I'll continue tomorrow. :redneck

Mohoney
12-01-2006, 05:42 AM
Side question: is anybody else still puking their guts out that an 83 win team won the World Series?

This guy missed 20 or so games due to injury, didn't he?

Just enjoy your ring and buy David Eckstein, Jeff Weaver, and Jeff Suppan steak dinners for making it possible, because as thoroughly mediocre as your team was, it might be your only chance at a ring.

FarWestChicago
12-01-2006, 10:27 PM
And you'll think that about every baseball player until the media finds a way to make them look bad.Obviously, you are from the "no responsiblity, society made me do it" crowd. Pujols, and only Pujols, is responsible for his big fat, whining, cry baby mouth. I'm sure this will be a major revelation to you, but people are actually responsible for their own behavior. :o:

Brian26
12-01-2006, 10:58 PM
Side question: is anybody else still puking their guts out that an 83 win team won the World Series?

I'm more annoyed that this is the team we beat by 20 runs one night, beat them with one hit the next night, and swept them out of town like a bunch of little leaguers.

SABRSox
12-01-2006, 11:08 PM
I'm more annoyed that this is the team we beat by 20 runs one night, beat them with one hit the next night, and swept them out of town like a bunch of little leaguers.

If I'm not mistaken, the winner of the MVP, Howard, led his team to more regular season victories than did Pujols.

Jerome
12-01-2006, 11:17 PM
Side question: is anybody else still puking their guts out that an 83 win team won the World Series?

yes. although thankfully thanks to The Bulls and Bears I have forgotten about baseball until spring or until a big white sox trade is made

23Ventura
12-01-2006, 11:28 PM
Side question: is anybody else still puking their guts out that an 83 win team won the World Series?
Yes. If only the Sox played in the NL. It bothers me quite a bit that the "champs" would've finished 4th maybe 5th in the AL Central.

RadioheadRocks
12-01-2006, 11:29 PM
Gee thanks Albert, maybe now they have the green light to take back that MVP award that Andre Dawson earned in 1987 with the last-place sCrUBS. :rolleyes:

fquaye149
12-02-2006, 01:18 AM
Obviously, you are from the "no responsiblity, society made me do it" crowd. Pujols, and only Pujols, is responsible for his big fat, whining, cry baby mouth. I'm sure this will be a major revelation to you, but people are actually responsible for their own behavior. :o:


obviously i'm from the nothing crowd

i hate crowds

i just guarantee that if i had the media in my face asking questions all the time i'd say stupid things every now and then

i'd be wrong to say them, but i'd still be the same person i am now.

LuvSox
12-02-2006, 01:35 AM
Side question: is anybody else still puking their guts out that an 83 win team won the World Series?



That's called Baseball. Don't like it, get your fat ass a try out. Become Commissioner. Change the damn rules.

"Hey, you can't win, you didn't win 90+ games"


Our damn team didn't do **** last year. Congrats to St Louis, the team that won when they had to.

FarWestChicago
12-02-2006, 08:34 AM
i just guarantee that if i had the media in my face asking questions all the time i'd say stupid things every now and then

i'd be wrong to say them, but i'd still be the same person i am now.We'll just assume some reporter forced you to say the things you've said in this thread. :redneck

fquaye149
12-02-2006, 10:01 AM
We'll just assume some reporter forced you to say the things you've said in this thread. :redneck

No. I'll have said it myself. But if I have a track record of being a good person and a good teammate or whatever, and I say something stupid I'll hope you'll chalk it up to the fact that almost every single baseball player says something stupid every now and then, especially the ones reporters have hardons for

RKMeibalane
12-02-2006, 10:15 AM
That's called Baseball. Don't like it, get your fat ass a try out. Become Commissioner. Change the damn rules.

"Hey, you can't win, you didn't win 90+ games"


Our damn team didn't do **** last year. Congrats to St Louis, the team that won when they had to.

Calm down. I don't think he was completely serious.

churlish
12-02-2006, 12:18 PM
And you'll think that about every baseball player until the media finds a way to make them look bad.

If Paulie was a superstar some of the stuff he has said would look pretty bad. But he's not so it's gone mostly unnoticed.

Give Ortiz a year and the media will find a way to skewer him. Maybe it will take them two years. I'm not sure.

Unfortunately for the media, they are not an all-powerful source that everyone worships blindly. Sure, the media tries to tear stars down. They're trying to sell papers, increase viewership, etc.

In the 90s, when Chicago was graced by an all-world basketball star, writers didn't just focus on his basketball achievements, they focused on his gambling and womanizing, among other things. How is Michael Jordan remembered? Is it skewered by the media?

The Big Hurt's another easy example. Frank has said some dumb things, and others have been blown out of proportion. Ozzie and KW had a fairly public campaign to trash him, and they media loved every minute of it. Then, a strange thing happened, the fans turned on Ozzie and KW. Now, how did the fans realize that a lot of the things being said was unsubstantiated bull****? Maybe becuse the media doesn't run the world. WSI has had plenty of topics centering about Thomas, and the positive fan interactions. I've talked to people in person who have got his autograph. How is Frank Thomas remembered by most Sox fans? 90% want a statue the moment he retires. Yup, sure looks likes the media won again.

RKMeibalane
12-02-2006, 12:32 PM
Unfortunately for the media, they are not an all-powerful source that everyone worships blindly. Sure, the media tries to tear stars down. They're trying to sell papers, increase viewership, etc.

In the 90s, when Chicago was graced by an all-world basketball star, writers didn't just focus on his basketball achievements, they focused on his gambling and womanizing, among other things. How is Michael Jordan remembered? Is it skewered by the media?

The Big Hurt's another easy example. Frank has said some dumb things, and others have been blown out of proportion. Ozzie and KW had a fairly public campaign to trash him, and they media loved every minute of it. Then, a strange thing happened, the fans turned on Ozzie and KW. Now, how did the fans realize that a lot of the things being said was unsubstantiated bull****? Maybe becuse the media doesn't run the world. WSI has had plenty of topics centering about Thomas, and the positive fan interactions. I've talked to people in person who have got his autograph. How is Frank Thomas remembered by most Sox fans? 90% want a statue the moment he retires. Yup, sure looks likes the media won again.

Great post! I would add that the only people who are actually influenced by the media are those who aren't able to think for themselves. Fans of a certain North Side team come quickly to mind. Most people are capable of forming their own opinions about who and what they like or dislike, and don't allow an idiot with a notepad and pen to do their thinking for them.

The sooner the media realizes that it should stop trying to trick people, the better off things will be for everyone. Unfortunately, there remain enough stupid people in the world that this isn't likey to happen anytime soon.

fquaye149
12-02-2006, 12:37 PM
Unfortunately for the media, they are not an all-powerful source that everyone worships blindly. Sure, the media tries to tear stars down. They're trying to sell papers, increase viewership, etc.

In the 90s, when Chicago was graced by an all-world basketball star, writers didn't just focus on his basketball achievements, they focused on his gambling and womanizing, among other things. How is Michael Jordan remembered? Is it skewered by the media?

The Big Hurt's another easy example. Frank has said some dumb things, and others have been blown out of proportion. Ozzie and KW had a fairly public campaign to trash him, and they media loved every minute of it. Then, a strange thing happened, the fans turned on Ozzie and KW. Now, how did the fans realize that a lot of the things being said was unsubstantiated bull****? Maybe becuse the media doesn't run the world. WSI has had plenty of topics centering about Thomas, and the positive fan interactions. I've talked to people in person who have got his autograph. How is Frank Thomas remembered by most Sox fans? 90% want a statue the moment he retires. Yup, sure looks likes the media won again.

Sure. That's kind of my point. Notice that we don't live in St. Louis and that we quickly forget the good things Pujol does

http://mlbplayers.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/pa/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050505&content_id=1039640&vkey=mlbpa_news&fext=.jsp

http://mlbplayers.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/pa/releases/releases.jsp?content=0912

http://www.pujolsfamilyfoundation.org/

but one quote and all of a sudden he's Bonds. These quotes are certainly Bondsian, I agree West:

"I'm a teammate guy, so whatever I can do to help my team to win like I have the past two years, that's what I want to do. If it takes for me to play first base, third base, right field, I just want to win the game."


I thought about it a lot (losing the 2002 NLCS). It's something you have to go home and wrap it up because if you keep thinking about it, you're going to take that to Spring Training and you're not going to be able to concentrate on your work

This is a great city to play. Anywhere you go, you're going to have great fans, but not like you have here in St. Louis. I've only played in St. Louis, I haven't played anywhere else, but even when the other teams come here they tell us, 'Man I can't believe how nice the fans are here.

What motivates me more than money are God and my family

Albert Pujols: guy who said one foolish thing, and all of a sudden, career *******

fquaye149
12-02-2006, 12:39 PM
Great post! I would add that the only people who are actually influenced by the media are those who aren't able to think for themselves. Fans of a certain North Side team come quickly to mind. Most people are capable of forming their own opinions about who and what they like or dislike, and don't allow an idiot with a notepad and pen to do their thinking for them.

The sooner the media realizes that it should stop trying to trick people, the better off things will be for everyone. Unfortunately, there remain enough stupid people in the world that this isn't likey to happen anytime soon.

Well, a lot of posters here seem pretty easily influenced in their opinion of Pujols based on one quote, out of context.

Do you think fans from other cities who maybe aren't as familiar with Frank's good qualities were any different when the national media painted Frank as a jerk?

I can tell you that any non-Chicagoan I've met thinks Frank Thomas is a jerk, and I have to do my best to try to convince them that's not the case. (strangely, they had the opposite opinion of Sosa...you know, because of how the national media portrayed him before the steroids scandal...and Frank was 100,000 times the teammate Sosa was)

RKMeibalane
12-02-2006, 12:51 PM
Do you think fans from other cities who maybe aren't as familiar with Frank's good qualities were any different when the national media painted Frank as a jerk?

I can tell you that any non-Chicagoan I've met thinks Frank Thomas is a jerk, and I have to do my best to try to convince them that's not the case.

Actually, I've never had that problem, and I've also never lived in Chicago. Most of my friends who follow sports don't mind Frank at all. In fact, most of them have a much stronger dislike of Sosa because of his show-boating (i.e. the homerun hop).

I'd be interested to know how closely the fans you're referring to actually follow baseball. Most serious fans that I've been around don't believe a word of what the media says. It's only the casual fans who fall into that trap. Maybe you and I just meet different types of people.

fquaye149
12-02-2006, 12:53 PM
Actually, I've never had that problem, and I've also never lived in Chicago. Most of my friends who follow sports don't mind Frank at all. In fact, most of them have a much stronger dislike of Sosa because of his show-boating (i.e. the homerun hop).

I'd be interested to know how closely the fans you're referring to actually follow baseball. Most serious fans that I've been around don't believe a word of what the media says. It's only the casual fans who fall into that trap. Maybe you and I just meet different types of people.

They follow baseball pretty intensely---hardcore Orioles fans, Padres fans, Brewer fans, Cardinals fans, Rockies fans, Reds fans, you name it.

Of course, they're all around my age 23, so they were really coming of age when Frank was getting skewered HARD (1998-2003). Maybe that would explain why your friends have different opinions---if you were just a couple years older, you guys might have come up with Frank when the climate was generally more favorable towards him

RKMeibalane
12-02-2006, 03:51 PM
They follow baseball pretty intensely---hardcore Orioles fans, Padres fans, Brewer fans, Cardinals fans, Rockies fans, Reds fans, you name it.

Of course, they're all around my age 23, so they were really coming of age when Frank was getting skewered HARD (1998-2003). Maybe that would explain why your friends have different opinions---if you were just a couple years older, you guys might have come up with Frank when the climate was generally more favorable towards him

Well, I'm 24, so there shouldn't be that much of a difference. A few of them started following baseball around the same time I did (circa '91-92), which was early in Frank's career, so that may explain why they have a more favorable view of him.

FarWestChicago
12-02-2006, 05:02 PM
Albert Pujols: guy who said one foolish thing, and all of a sudden, career *******

Well, a lot of posters here seem pretty easily influenced in their opinion of Pujols based on one quoteYou're very young, so I'll share some wisdom I got from a very successful older fellow I used to work with.

"West, you've done a lot of great things here. But, it only takes one 'oh ****' to **** up a thousand 'attaboys'."

It's not one to one. It is more like a thousand to one. His egregious character flaws exposed in one whining, candid moment wipe out mountains of planned positive moments. It's just the way things are. You can argue until you're blue in the face, but you won't change it.