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View Full Version : Rowand a Free Agent - Rowand/Phillies Decline Options


Mickster
11-02-2006, 09:47 AM
XM175 announced that Rowand declined the $3.5M player option and the Phillies declined the $5M team option making him a free agent. Let the Rowand love-fest/speculation begin!

cleanwsox
11-02-2006, 10:07 AM
That is surprising to me, wonder where he will end up.

Huisj
11-02-2006, 10:09 AM
not so fast. apparently he's not really a free agent. He'll just go to arbitration now with the Phillies.

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20061101&content_id=1729202&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Blob
11-02-2006, 10:27 AM
I wont believe it until some college kid takes a picture with him, at game 3 and puts it in his blog!

southside rocks
11-02-2006, 10:36 AM
XM175 announced that Rowand declined the $3.5M player option and the Phillies declined the $5M team option making him a free agent. Let the Rowand love-fest/speculation begin!

That doesn't make him a free agent. It makes him arbitration eligible. And the article linked said that the decline of options by both parties was "a formality" and that barring a trade, Rowand will be back with the Phils. It also said "Unless the sides reach an agreement -- a likely scenario -- Rowand's salary will be determined by an arbitrator."

Not that reason or reality should interfere with a good A-Row thread. :rolleyes:

D. TODD
11-02-2006, 11:01 AM
Rowand isn't going anywhere. The Phils liked him and A-Row is happy there. They will have to avoid arbitration, but he is not a free agent. They will come to an agreeable salary somewhere between 3.25 and the 5 million that was turned down by each side.

kraut83
11-02-2006, 11:32 AM
There's plenty of room for him in Phils OF, especially if they can unload Burrell and his ridiculous contract this offseason. He's not going anywhere.

Chisox003
11-02-2006, 12:00 PM
The Phils liked him and A-Row is happy there.
When did you speak with them to find out this inside info?

mjmcend
11-02-2006, 12:13 PM
Rowand isn't going anywhere. The Phils liked him and A-Row is happy there. They will have to avoid arbitration, but he is not a free agent. They will come to an agreeable salary somewhere between 3.25 and the 5 million that was turned down by each side.

Might even be more than the 5 million. It will be a multi-year deal though. This move makes it even less likely Rowand will ever be back on the Sox.

mjmcend
11-02-2006, 12:14 PM
When did you speak with them to find out this inside info?

The news out of Philly all year was a Rowand love-fest. It was obvious both parties liked the deal.

D. TODD
11-02-2006, 12:31 PM
When did you speak with them to find out this inside info?
It's in the statements from his agent and the Phils GM.

salty99
11-02-2006, 01:52 PM
And good luck to him, hope he gets to Soldier Field for the NFC Championship game.

Rowand was at Schwartz Sports in Northbrook a short time ago and told serveral of us there he has been to a bunch of Bears games including the one in Arizona. He was a total class act as always.

SouthSide_HitMen
11-02-2006, 03:40 PM
I'd take Rowand over Podsednik or Mackowiak. Rowand is a borderline 3rd / 4th OF. Then again so is Anderson.

Hopefully Kenny will bring in a starting LF to compliment Jermaine Dye and let "The Greatest American Hero" run around and catch balls (that is if pigheaded Ozzie lets him play :rolleyes: ).

Ol' No. 2
11-02-2006, 05:35 PM
I'd take Rowand over Podsednik or Mackowiak. Rowand is a borderline 3rd / 4th OF. Then again so is Anderson.

Hopefully Kenny will bring in a starting LF to compliment Jermaine Dye and let "The Greatest American Hero" run around and catch balls (that is if pigheaded Ozzie lets him play :rolleyes: ).Let's not get carried away. Rowand is no HoF player, but I'd take him over maybe half the CF in MLB.

JUribe1989
11-02-2006, 05:40 PM
Let's not get carried away. Rowand is no HoF player, but I'd take him over maybe half the CF in MLB.

You are absolutely correct. It is ridiculous undervaluing to say that he is a 4th OF on any team. He is a very good CF that many teams would want.

buehrle4cy05
11-02-2006, 05:47 PM
It wouldn't surprise me if the Phillies didn't want him back, as they seem to be really big on Shane Victorino.

HotelWhiteSox
11-02-2006, 05:48 PM
I would like him in left. Then trade SP and prospect for Jimmy Rollins. Make bullpen tweaks, and you're set

SouthSide_HitMen
11-02-2006, 09:43 PM
You are absolutely correct. It is ridiculous undervaluing to say that he is a 4th OF on any team. He is a very good CF that many teams would want.

Let's not get carried away. Rowand is no HoF player, but I'd take him over maybe half the CF in MLB.

With all due respect he ranks in the lower tier of CFers. He has an average glove and bat and is beginning his decline phase not counting the injuries which are mounting each season.

Above average CFers

Grady Sizemore
Carlos Beltran
Vernon Wells
Gary Matthews Jr.
Andrew Jones
Johnny Damon
Mike Cameron
Rocco Baldelli
Torri Hunter
Eric Byrnes
Curtis Granderson
Jim Edmonds
Juan Pierre
Ken Griffey Jr.
Chone Figgins

Rowand ranks somewhere in the Kenny Lofton, Corey Patterson, Ryan Church oh that is who we are going to play in CF keep our fingers crossed range of CFers. He is below average (not the worst but not an above average) starter but would also make an excellent fourth OF. Rowand is better than Mackowiak who is a good corner fill in. Anderson is a much better fielder than Rowand and has a few years before he reaches his peak offensively.

Age 24 seasons:
Rowand - 2002 - 126 G, 302 AB, .258 BA, .298 OBP, .394 SLG
Anderson - 2006 - 134 G, 365 AB, .225 BA, .290 OBP, .359 SLG

On a go forward, I would much rather have Anderson. Hopefully Ozzie will have enough sense to play him in 2007.

PS - I am not one of the Rowand posters here. I enjoyed him on the team, recognized his strengths and weaknesses and wished him well in Philadelphia. I think he was an excellent teammate and his personality helped jell the 2005 squad.

chaerulez
11-03-2006, 10:19 AM
My question is was this an agreement by both parties to just go to aribitration? Or do the Phillies not think he's worth 5 million a year? As overrated as he is around this board and amongst certain media members, I would say in the respect to baseball economics he's at least a $5 million a year player, probably a little bit more.

voodoochile
11-03-2006, 10:30 AM
My question is was this an agreement by both parties to just go to aribitration? Or do the Phillies not think he's worth 5 million a year? As overrated as he is around this board and amongst certain media members, I would say in the respect to baseball economics he's at least a $5 million a year player, probably a little bit more.

Maybe, if he has career years and can stay healthy, but the odds on both happening are remote.

fquaye149
11-03-2006, 10:40 AM
My question is was this an agreement by both parties to just go to aribitration? Or do the Phillies not think he's worth 5 million a year? As overrated as he is around this board and amongst certain media members, I would say in the respect to baseball economics he's at least a $5 million a year player, probably a little bit more.

4th outfielders are rarely worth 5 million a year. If he can hit .280 next year with decent power numbers and play a better cf than he does, then he will be worth 5 million a year. But when you consider that he hardly walks at all, he might not be worth it even then.

Ol' No. 2
11-03-2006, 12:16 PM
With all due respect he ranks in the lower tier of CFers. He has an average glove and bat and is beginning his decline phase not counting the injuries which are mounting each season.

Above average CFers

Grady Sizemore
Carlos Beltran
Vernon Wells
Gary Matthews Jr.
Andrew Jones
Johnny Damon
Mike Cameron
Rocco Baldelli
Torri Hunter
Eric Byrnes
Curtis Granderson
Jim Edmonds
Juan Pierre
Ken Griffey Jr.
Chone Figgins

Rowand ranks somewhere in the Kenny Lofton, Corey Patterson, Ryan Church oh that is who we are going to play in CF keep our fingers crossed range of CFers. He is below average (not the worst but not an above average) starter but would also make an excellent fourth OF. Rowand is better than Mackowiak who is a good corner fill in. Anderson is a much better fielder than Rowand and has a few years before he reaches his peak offensively.
First of all, your list is 15 players, which is exactly half the major league CF, which is what I said in the first place.

Going further, I would take Rowand over Rocco Baldelli and Mike Cameron. Baldelli can hit, but he's a butcher in CF. Cameron thinks he's Sammy Sosa, and his approach at the plate is much the same. I'd also take Rowand over Pierre if I wasn't so desperate for a leadoff hitter that Pierre would look good to me. Eric Byrnes - meh, he's not better than Rowand. Neither is Matthews, really. And Figgins is not a big step up. So on your list there are 8-9 who are significantly better - out of 30 major league CF.

EastCoastSoxFan
11-03-2006, 12:29 PM
My question is was this an agreement by both parties to just go to aribitration? Or do the Phillies not think he's worth 5 million a year? As overrated as he is around this board and amongst certain media members, I would say in the respect to baseball economics he's at least a $5 million a year player, probably a little bit more.The Phillies, like every other team, are trying to trim payroll. They already unloaded a bunch by trading Abreu, Lidle, and Bell last year; and they are shopping Burrell to American League teams as a DH. I guess they figure that an arbitrator will probably split the difference between the player option ($3M) and the team option ($5M).
Rowand has never been anything but a favorite among players, fans, and media in his time with the Phillies. If he has a solid season in '07 and remains injury-free he'll probably get an extension. The '05 Sox proved that even if he's not the guy you build your team around you can win with him in your everyday lineup...

kraut83
11-03-2006, 12:51 PM
4th outfielders are rarely worth 5 million a year. If he can hit .280 next year with decent power numbers and play a better cf than he does, then he will be worth 5 million a year. But when you consider that he hardly walks at all, he might not be worth it even then.

Your sig is a perfect analysis of Rowand. Well done sir! :gulp:

SouthSide_HitMen
11-03-2006, 07:43 PM
First of all, your list is 15 players, which is exactly half the major league CF, which is what I said in the first place.

Going further, I would take Rowand over Rocco Baldelli and Mike Cameron. Baldelli can hit, but he's a butcher in CF. Cameron thinks he's Sammy Sosa, and his approach at the plate is much the same. I'd also take Rowand over Pierre if I wasn't so desperate for a leadoff hitter that Pierre would look good to me. Eric Byrnes - meh, he's not better than Rowand. Neither is Matthews, really. And Figgins is not a big step up. So on your list there are 8-9 who are significantly better - out of 30 major league CF.

I would take Matthews, Byrne and Figgins over Rowand. Patterson had a much better season and will probably outperform him from here on out. Church's aborted season was better than Rowand's and Lofton had a better 2006 as well though Rowand will be a better bet going forward due to age.

I definitely would not want to pony up $4-5 mil / season for Rowand. He was a great player to have for the league minimum as the White Sox had him through 2004. The $2 mil in 2005 didn't bother me. He made $3.25 mil last year and that figure will probably be around $4 - $4.5 mil which is a bit much for him IMO. I am glad Kenny Williams received maximum value for him (getting Thome at his lowest possible value due to his injuries / contract).

Anderson's condition (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=80796) may force Kenny to bring in another centerfielder. Ozzie's temperament may also force this to happen. Rowand can start in CF (vs. Mackowiak who should be in the corners) but I am hoping Kenny can bring in someone who can field the position and also be a plus offensively.

I guess this what makes the "Hot Stove league" interesting - debating the merits of your past, present and possible future ballplayers. Kenny Williams makes sure White Sox fans are among the most entertained each offseason. :cool:

I do see this thread was significantly trimmed today. I guess we can count on Aaron Rowand leading the league / this site in controversy until he hangs up the spikes (hopefully on his own terms and not due to a career ending injury). He was one of my favorites on the White Sox and I cheer for just about every player after they leave (except while playing the White Sox and of course David Wells which goes without saying).

Your sig is a perfect analysis of Rowand. Well done sir! :gulp:

Though I don't recall Aaron Rowand's bus dumping raw sewage on unsuspecting Chicagoans / tourists. :cool:

Ol' No. 2
11-04-2006, 12:07 AM
I would take Matthews, Byrne and Figgins over Rowand. Patterson had a much better season and will probably outperform him from here on out. Church's aborted season was better than Rowand's and Lofton had a better 2006 as well though Rowand will be a better bet going forward due to age.

I definitely would not want to pony up $4-5 mil / season for Rowand. He was a great player to have for the league minimum as the White Sox had him through 2004. The $2 mil in 2005 didn't bother me. He made $3.25 mil last year and that figure will probably be around $4 - $4.5 mil which is a bit much for him IMO. I am glad Kenny Williams received maximum value for him (getting Thome at his lowest possible value due to his injuries / contract).

Anderson's condition (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=80796) may force Kenny to bring in another centerfielder. Ozzie's temperament may also force this to happen. Rowand can start in CF (vs. Mackowiak who should be in the corners) but I am hoping Kenny can bring in someone who can field the position and also be a plus offensively.

I guess this what makes the "Hot Stove league" interesting - debating the merits of your past, present and possible future ballplayers. Kenny Williams makes sure White Sox fans are among the most entertained each offseason. :cool:

I do see this thread was significantly trimmed today. I guess we can count on Aaron Rowand leading the league / this site in controversy until he hangs up the spikes (hopefully on his own terms and not due to a career ending injury). He was one of my favorites on the White Sox and I cheer for just about every player after they leave (except while playing the White Sox and of course David Wells which goes without saying).



Though I don't recall Aaron Rowand's bus dumping raw sewage on unsuspecting Chicagoans / tourists. :cool:Byrne and Matthews are both .260 career hitters. Rowand hits almost 20 pts higher. Matthews gets a small edge defensively, but I don't see Byrne being any great shakes in CF. Figgins isn't any better hitter, but he gets an edge only because of his speed. Which brings me back to my original statement, and that is that I would take Rowand over half the CF in baseball. And that's looking rather conservative the more I look at it.

MDF3530
11-04-2006, 12:30 AM
You are absolutely correct. It is ridiculous undervaluing to say that he is a 4th OF on any team. He is a very good CF that many teams would want.OK, here's my .02 worth.

I liked seeing Aaron Rowand go crashing face first into the CF fence too, but there is a reason why he did that. He'd get bad initial reads on the ball coming off the bat and had to run as fast as he could to compensate.

Rockman218
11-05-2006, 10:39 AM
Maybe this is all a part of Aron Rowand and the Whitesox's evil plan to get him back to Chicago. They'd get Rowand and Thome. What a steal if that happened.

fquaye149
11-05-2006, 10:58 AM
Byrne and Matthews are both .260 career hitters. Rowand hits almost 20 pts higher. Matthews gets a small edge defensively, but I don't see Byrne being any great shakes in CF. Figgins isn't any better hitter, but he gets an edge only because of his speed. Which brings me back to my original statement, and that is that I would take Rowand over half the CF in baseball. And that's looking rather conservative the more I look at it.

Yes Rowand's career avg is at .279, but that's mostly due to a strong 2002 and 2004. No, you can't just throw that out but in 2005 he must have been all tuckered out from hearting this team (sorry, can't help it) because he hit a sleep-inducing .270. Last year he hit .262. At least you could make the argument with Matthews that his career's on the upswing (it's probably just the contract year jazz, but still).

What's really disappointing about Rowand though is his declining OBP. Rowand never walked much, but the last two years his obp has been .329 and .321 respectively. You want a little more production from an outfielder. Even Cameron with his uneven approach at the plate has a career OBP that's ten points higher than Rowand's, despite a career BA that's 30 points lower.

Rowand's offense, especially the last two years, is barely above replacement level, if at all---especially when you consider his power is almost non-existent.

Brian26
11-05-2006, 08:54 PM
It wouldn't surprise me if the Phillies didn't want him back, as they seem to be really big on Shane Victorino.

The Phils' GM is quoted in the paper as saying Rowand isn't going anywhere.

CLR01
11-05-2006, 11:40 PM
The Phils' GM is quoted in the paper as saying Rowand isn't going anywhere.


Please, please, please let there be a 100% no trade clause in any contract he is given. None of that "Rowand has the right to veto the trade" crap I want a "the Phillies have no right to even suggest to another team he is available" NTC. At the very least tie him up on a 25 ft chain in CF. They won't notice a difference in the defense.

fquaye149
11-06-2006, 02:11 AM
Please, please, please let there be a 100% no trade clause in any contract he is given. None of that "Rowand has the right to veto the trade" crap I want a "the Phillies have no right to even suggest to another team he is available" NTC. At the very least tie him up on a 25 ft chain in CF. They won't notice a difference in the defense.

Rowand would bust that chain running down a flyball. He would not bust it with arm muscles or leg muscles but with HEART muscles

rowand33
11-06-2006, 04:41 AM
First of all, your list is 15 players, which is exactly half the major league CF, which is what I said in the first place.

Going further, I would take Rowand over Rocco Baldelli and Mike Cameron. Baldelli can hit, but he's a butcher in CF. Cameron thinks he's Sammy Sosa, and his approach at the plate is much the same. I'd also take Rowand over Pierre if I wasn't so desperate for a leadoff hitter that Pierre would look good to me. Eric Byrnes - meh, he's not better than Rowand. Neither is Matthews, really. And Figgins is not a big step up. So on your list there are 8-9 who are significantly better - out of 30 major league CF.

As a Rowand fan, I'm actually kind of offended by his inclusion of Eric Byrnes in that list.

First off, Byrnes isn't exactly good at the plate. To classify him in the top half of MLB CF is ridiculous. His numbers are very similar to Rowand, and I think Rowand has more upside.

Second, the fielding. Rowand is better. I think Sox fans in general overrate Rowand as a fielder (anderson is better), but Rowand was still damn good.

Rotoworld.com even once described Rowand by using the line "don't think of him as a poor man's carlos beltran. think of him as a rich man's Eric Byrnes."

There's a lot of other ridiculous names on that list too. Granderson?

I think Granderson's gonna be awesome, but don't crown him yet. A lot of players come into the league with a lot of potential and just end up being mediocre. A lot of recent top rookies are garbage now.

fquaye149
11-06-2006, 09:47 AM
I think Granderson's gonna be awesome, but don't crown him yet. A lot of players come into the league with a lot of potential and just end up being mediocre. A lot of recent top rookies are garbage now.

But I WANT to crown him. Can't I just crown his ass?