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View Full Version : Do you realize..................


NoNeckEra
09-20-2006, 10:07 PM
that the all the Sox runs the entire series were scored off home runs?
7 solo shots and A.J.'s slam.
This epitomizes the problem with this team.
Hit an occasional mistake out of the yard, but zero capability to mfgr runs.

QCIASOXFAN
09-20-2006, 10:11 PM
Its abundantly obvious there will be some minor tweaking of the lineup next season. Thome, Konerko, A.J. and Crede will definitely not be hitting in a row. Also, I did notice that and it sucked.

Myrtle72
09-20-2006, 10:27 PM
... Yep.

whitesoxfan
09-20-2006, 10:37 PM
I think Kenny and Ozzie definitely realize this. There are definitely going to be some changes in the offseason.

This year's offseason is probably the most anticipated offseason that I think we've had in quite some time.

JB98
09-20-2006, 10:38 PM
Its abundantly obvious there will be some minor tweaking of the lineup next season. Thome, Konerko, A.J. and Crede will definitely not be hitting in a row. Also, I did notice that and it sucked.

They weren't hitting in a row for the first half of this year either. The offense has blown chunks since Dye moved to the third spot. That's not meant as a slap at Dye, just an observation.

0o0o0
09-20-2006, 10:52 PM
I don't understand this homerun approach by the hitters. What are they 8 yrs old? It just seems so absurd to go up to the plate and try to hit a homerun.

patbooyah
09-20-2006, 10:55 PM
"that you have the most beautiful face. do you realize we're floating in space. do you realize that happiness makes you cry. do you realize... that everyone... you know... some day... will die."

23Ventura
09-20-2006, 11:02 PM
They need to get a solid lead off man. I'll always appreciate what Pods did for the Sox in '05, but he's not that player anymore. He's clearly lost a step, and is no longer a threat at the top of the order or on the basepaths. I think that this, more than anything, has caused the decline in small ball. Without Pods getting on and stealing, Iguchi hasn't had the opportunity to advance runners and play small ball, which he was great at last year. As a result, or offense has become one-dimensional. We need somebody that can spark the offense, so we don't have to rely on Thome/Konerko/Dye/Crede to hit homers all season. Most importantly, though, get some relievers that can get somebody out, please.

oeo
09-20-2006, 11:02 PM
that the all the Sox runs the entire series were scored off home runs?
7 solo shots and A.J.'s slam.
This epitomizes the problem with this team.
Hit an occasional mistake out of the yard, but zero capability to mfgr runs.

They can manufacture runs, they just can't do it consistently. Just like every other facet of their game...the rotation, the bullpen, etc.

Just an example...they scored 9 runs last week against the Angels without any homeruns. This squad is just inconsistent, and hopefully that changes next year. But honestly, I think there was some stuff going on behind the scenes that we don't know about. I know they've been inconsistent all year, but these last 6 games have been awful (there was no team effort, it was all individual...as evidenced by the 7 solo shots)...something gave in the clubhouse.

markopat
09-20-2006, 11:07 PM
"that you have the most beautiful face. do you realize we're floating in space. do you realize that happiness makes you cry. do you realize... that everyone... you know... some day... will die."

Dude...You been in CA too long!
:bong:

HotelWhiteSox
09-20-2006, 11:08 PM
I think Kenny and Ozzie definitely realize this. There are definitely going to be some changes in the offseason.

This year's offseason is probably the most anticipated offseason that I think we've had in quite some time.

I agree, wouldn't be surprised at all to see Kenny make a real risky type deal (similar to Carlos Lee). I am hoping someone like Carl Crawford, but who wouldn't love him

Soxfanspcu11
09-20-2006, 11:18 PM
I don't understand this homerun approach by the hitters. What are they 8 yrs old? It just seems so absurd to go up to the plate and try to hit a homerun.

Someone needs to tell Jim Thome that this is not softball and opposite field does not equal an out.

Perfect example today, Pods was on 3rd with 2 outs and Thome was STILL trying to jack one, even when a simple opposite field hit would have worked. He continued to try and hit a homerun with 2 strikes on him. And of course the results were not good.

It's not just Thome though, it has affected AJ, Crede and Konerko a lot this year.

JB98
09-21-2006, 12:56 AM
Someone needs to tell Jim Thome that this is not softball and opposite field does not equal an out.

Perfect example today, Pods was on 3rd with 2 outs and Thome was STILL trying to jack one, even when a simple opposite field hit would have worked. He continued to try and hit a homerun with 2 strikes on him. And of course the results were not good.

It's not just Thome though, it has affected AJ, Crede and Konerko a lot this year.

You're suggesting Thome doesn't know how to use the opposite field? He's hit four home runs to left field in this month alone.

Jim takes a mighty cut every time he swings. Using that approach, he has put up career numbers that come close to Hall-of-Fame caliber. I don't think Thome needs your advice.

lumpyspun
09-21-2006, 01:00 AM
"that you have the most beautiful face. do you realize we're floating in space. do you realize that happiness makes you cry. do you realize... that everyone... you know... some day... will die."

"but instead of saying all of your goodbyes...let them know you realize that life goes fast, it's hard to make the good things last..."

kraut83
09-21-2006, 07:52 AM
They need to get a solid lead off man. I'll always appreciate what Pods did for the Sox in '05, but he's not that player anymore. He's clearly lost a step, and is no longer a threat at the top of the order or on the basepaths. I think that this, more than anything, has caused the decline in small ball. Without Pods getting on and stealing, Iguchi hasn't had the opportunity to advance runners and play small ball, which he was great at last year. As a result, or offense has become one-dimensional. We need somebody that can spark the offense, so we don't have to rely on Thome/Konerko/Dye/Crede to hit homers all season. Most importantly, though, get some relievers that can get somebody out, please.

Couldn't have said it better. The lack of getting on base, and being agressive and smart on the basepaths from Pods has killed this team this year.

Domeshot17
09-21-2006, 08:00 AM
You're suggesting Thome doesn't know how to use the opposite field? He's hit four home runs to left field in this month alone.

Jim takes a mighty cut every time he swings. Using that approach, he has put up career numbers that come close to Hall-of-Fame caliber. I don't think Thome needs your advice.

While I agree Thome is a professional hitter, he is very frusterating to watch. We all knew he was a strikeout machine, and can live with that, but how many times when we needed a base runner and not a solo home run has he taking his usual monster cut, and grounded out to the 2b in medium right field, when he could have EASILY hit a soft groundout to 3rd base which probably would have went for a double with the 3b lined up at SS. Giambi every now and then to beat the shift will put a bunt down the 3b line. I would like to see thome do that, he could bat 1000

wdelaney72
09-21-2006, 08:08 AM
While this is true, manufacuring runs is a bit ineffective when you are almost always trailing on the scoreboard. The problem with the starting pitching needs to be figured more than the lineup needs to be improved.

As far as Thome goes, I don't care what hall-of-fame stats he has, I want him to help the team win. I know he's a great hitter, but I'd settle for fewer HR if it meant a decrease in strike outs and increase in hits. Soxfanspcu11 has a valid point.

Law11
09-21-2006, 08:09 AM
Many of us said it back in April. - Look for "ozzie ball" to go buh-bye with all these power hitters.. and it did...
but with the pitching at least on paper looking like it did it didnt seem to matter.

Baby Fisk
09-21-2006, 08:31 AM
They've been swinging for the fences all year like some frustrating Sox teams of recent years. Too bad the pitching didn't support that approach this season -- 2005 wasn't an anomaly, it was the stud pitching that supported the longball approach. They seemed to drift from one series to the next and became brutally inconsistent.

hold2dibber
09-21-2006, 08:38 AM
Couldn't have said it better. The lack of getting on base, and being agressive and smart on the basepaths from Pods has killed this team this year.

I think this is a total fallacy. This team has scored more than enough runs this year. They've had some rough spots (what offense doesn't), but Pods' diminished effectiveness has been more than offset by the huge years by Dye, Thome, Konerko and Crede and the improved offensive output of AJ, Iguchi and the bench. The offense hasn't been the problem. The starters ERA is nearly a run higher than last year. The bullpen's ERA is 1.20 runs (!) higher than last year. That's why this team went from a 99 win team to (at best) a 90 win team. Improved production from the lead off spot certainly could have helped to overcome the pitching deficiencies, but in the end, pitching wins championships and even if Pods had had a huge year and the Sox had been able to bash their way into the postseason, they wouldn't have much of a chance to win with that approach in the playoffs. The story of '06 is the lousy pitching. Period.

Jaffar
09-21-2006, 08:57 AM
I think this is a total fallacy. This team has scored more than enough runs this year. They've had some rough spots (what offense doesn't), but Pods' diminished effectiveness has been more than offset by the huge years by Dye, Thome, Konerko and Crede and the improved offensive output of AJ, Iguchi and the bench. The offense hasn't been the problem. The starters ERA is nearly a run higher than last year. The bullpen's ERA is 1.20 runs (!) higher than last year. That's why this team went from a 99 win team to (at best) a 90 win team. Improved production from the lead off spot certainly could have helped to overcome the pitching deficiencies, but in the end, pitching wins championships and even if Pods had had a huge year and the Sox had been able to bash their way into the postseason, they wouldn't have much of a chance to win with that approach in the playoffs. The story of '06 is the lousy pitching. Period.

My thoughts exactly. If I get a chance I'll get a breakdown of the Sox record and runs scored by the sox. I bet we have a lot of games where we scored 4,5,6 or more runs and lost.

EDIT* ok, so I didn't really find what I thought I would but found something else. They went 65-15 when scoring 5+. Here is the kicker, they are 20-52 when scoring fewer than 5 runs. Basically if they didn't score 5 they didn't win.

spiffie
09-21-2006, 09:38 AM
Someone needs to tell Jim Thome that this is not softball and opposite field does not equal an out.

Perfect example today, Pods was on 3rd with 2 outs and Thome was STILL trying to jack one, even when a simple opposite field hit would have worked. He continued to try and hit a homerun with 2 strikes on him. And of course the results were not good.

Jim Thome in 2006:
with runners on: 327/451/659
with RISP: 325/463/694
with men on and 2 outs: 296/430/605

But hey everyone, don't let the facts get in the way of trying to blame Thome for this season! No need to point out that nearly HALF THE TIME with men in scoring position Jim gets on base. No, that would get in the way of the totally ridiculous position that he has hurt the team.

soxinem1
09-21-2006, 09:49 AM
Its abundantly obvious there will be some minor tweaking of the lineup next season. Thome, Konerko, A.J. and Crede will definitely not be hitting in a row. Also, I did notice that and it sucked.

Echos of the 2000, 2002, 2003, and 2004 White Sox.........

viagracat
09-21-2006, 10:38 AM
Couldn't have said it better. The lack of getting on base, and being agressive and smart on the basepaths from Pods has killed this team this year.

Not only that, but the bottom of the order too. Put all that together and there were too many times when there was nothing for the big thumpers in the middle to work with. It's either station-to-station or home runs with those guys. Or double plays. :angry:

If Anderson's all he's cracked up to be, can work out whatever problem he has with Ozzie and follows up on his pledge to become a contact and speed guy with some power, he could be a guy to break up the middle of the lineup next year.

Jurr
09-21-2006, 12:31 PM
They need to get a solid lead off man. I'll always appreciate what Pods did for the Sox in '05, but he's not that player anymore. He's clearly lost a step, and is no longer a threat at the top of the order or on the basepaths. I think that this, more than anything, has caused the decline in small ball. Without Pods getting on and stealing, Iguchi hasn't had the opportunity to advance runners and play small ball, which he was great at last year. As a result, or offense has become one-dimensional. We need somebody that can spark the offense, so we don't have to rely on Thome/Konerko/Dye/Crede to hit homers all season. Most importantly, though, get some relievers that can get somebody out, please.
A solid leadoff man? They're not going to let him run because they're waiting for the three run bomb! This team has become the Moneyball Sox. They don't put anyone in motion to put stress on the opposing pitcher because so many guys are capable of knocking the ball out of the yard. What needs to happen is for KW to tell the team 'from the top down, you guys lost focus on how to play good baseball'....fall in with a team concept or get the hell out.'

Domeshot17
09-21-2006, 02:30 PM
my problem with that statement is we seemed to either win games 10-7 or lose them 3-1. The Offense may have scored a lot of runs, but it has been VERY inconsistent. The Entire team has. We hit a stretch where we scored in bunches and gave them up in busshels. Then we couldnt score and our pitches were lights out. We had a stretch where the bullpen would have to come in in the 6th and preserve a 1 run 7-6 lead for 4 innings and got it done, and then we hit a stretch where they couldnt hold any lead

There is alot of fingers to point

JB98
09-21-2006, 04:22 PM
While I agree Thome is a professional hitter, he is very frusterating to watch. We all knew he was a strikeout machine, and can live with that, but how many times when we needed a base runner and not a solo home run has he taking his usual monster cut, and grounded out to the 2b in medium right field, when he could have EASILY hit a soft groundout to 3rd base which probably would have went for a double with the 3b lined up at SS. Giambi every now and then to beat the shift will put a bunt down the 3b line. I would like to see thome do that, he could bat 1000

Taking that crappy little single to left is exactly what the opposition hopes Thome will do. That way, he'll lose his power swing and become a non-factor in terms of run production.

I've never gotten frustrated watching Thome hit. Pods, Uribe and Anderson frustrate me.

oscars gamble
09-21-2006, 05:15 PM
I agree with the statement that Thome is frustrating to watch. Although his average with men in scoring posistion is good he is terrible in late innings of close games. I swear he only hits early in the game or if the sox are down by 4 or up by 4. So i went to MLB.com and looked it up.


Late inning of close games

Home: 22 games 28 AB 8 runs 5 hits 2 HR .179 Avg.

Away: 17 games 22 AB 3 runs 4 hits 2 HR .182 Avg.

ARod laughs at those stats.

He did carry us in the first half. He does not come through in the late innings when you need him most.

Very frustrating.

wassagstdu
09-21-2006, 05:47 PM
This team has scored more than enough runs this year. They've had some rough spots.
...
The story of '06 is the lousy pitching. Period.

The roughest of those rough spots has been the most critical last couple of weeks. And while the pitching had its "rough spots" earlier, it has come around (BP excluded) only to be abandoned by the offense.

wassagstdu
09-21-2006, 05:54 PM
Jim Thome in 2006:
with runners on: 327/451/659
with RISP: 325/463/694
with men on and 2 outs: 296/430/605

But hey everyone, don't let the facts get in the way of trying to blame Thome for this season! No need to point out that nearly HALF THE TIME with men in scoring position Jim gets on base. No, that would get in the way of the totally ridiculous position that he has hurt the team.

Jim Thome has been a great acquisition. The problem is that so many lesser hitters, like Crede, Anderson (first half), Uribe, Iguchi on occasion, appeared to try to emulate him. Thome's only concession to situational hitting is that he will take a walk when needed. You would think that if he would punch the ball on the ground to the left side once in a while he could get some critical hits. But Ted Williams never gave in and neither will Thome, apparently. But Crede, and Uribe are not Ted Williams and damn it they should go the other way once in a while.

.