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Lip Man 1
09-19-2006, 02:17 PM
I found this to be interesting and perhaps another observation to go along with Chris DeLuca's story on certain players talking about the off season for months now and that supposedly some players couldn't wait for the season to end.

This is from a story by Joe Cowley in the Sun-Times:

"And while no one will name names, it's evident that there are players in the clubhouse that are lacking the 'edge' they carried last season."

"I will say that might have happened with a couple guys maybe they aren't as hungry." -- Ozzie Guillen in the same story.

Lip

Uncle_Patrick
09-19-2006, 02:19 PM
Let the speculation begin.

I trust that Kenny and Ozzie already know who these players are and they will be dealt with over the off season.

Chicken Dinner
09-19-2006, 02:26 PM
Some managers too.

jenn2080
09-19-2006, 02:35 PM
:booty: :bs:

Isnt the goal in mind every year to get to the WS. Whoever it is all I have to say is SEE YA!

salty99
09-19-2006, 02:43 PM
This makes me sick. Isn't it the managers/coaches/leaders in the clubhouses job to make sure they are as hungry? Or am I just delusional? Why even show up to play if you're going to have this attitude? Go home and let someone who wants to be there play.

NoNeckEra
09-19-2006, 02:55 PM
"And while no one will name names, it's evident that there are players in the clubhouse that are lacking the 'edge' they carried last season."
Now that it's mid-Sept and it's finger pointing season, people will speak up. If the Sox had not made the playoffs last year, there would be all kinds of finger pointing at guys like Carl for poisoning the clubhouse.

How many Sox on this current roster are beyond reproach? JD? JC? JT? PK?
While they may be "producing" and almost all others are subject to being singled out for underachieving, these 4 guys clog up the middle of the lineup and can be blamed too.

This is not a clear cut case of "the butler did it". So many areas didn't click over the past few months that it's too hard to pinpoint.

CaptainBallz
09-19-2006, 03:04 PM
Now that it's mid-Sept and it's finger pointing season, people will speak up. If the Sox had not made the playoffs last year, there would be all kinds of finger pointing at guys like Carl for poisoning the clubhouse.

How many Sox on this current roster are beyond reproach? JD? JC? JT? PK?
While they may be "producing" and almost all others are subject to being singled out for underachieving, these 4 guys clog up the middle of the lineup and can be blamed too.

This is not a clear cut case of "the butler did it". So many areas didn't click over the past few months that it's too hard to pinpoint.

Nobody is beyond reproach when dogging it. And let's quit using code words to describe it-- "killer instinct", "hunger", "edge"--- all fancy ways of saying that certain players were doggin it. Inexcusable and insulting to the millions that turned out this year to see a competitive team play.

StillMissOzzie
09-19-2006, 03:09 PM
How many Sox on this current roster are beyond reproach? JD? JC? JT? PK?
While they may be "producing" and almost all others are subject to being singled out for underachieving, these 4 guys clog up the middle of the lineup and can be blamed too.

This is not a clear cut case of "the butler did it". So many areas didn't click over the past few months that it's too hard to pinpoint.

Better to clog the basepaths than not get on base often enough at all. Yes, Pods & Uribe, I'm looking at you.

The starting pitching wasn't as good for long stretches, the bullpen stunk out loud, and some pitching gems were wasted when the bats went dormant. Yep, plenty of blame to dole out here, but I too expect the "attitude" problems to be dealt with in the off-season.

SMO
:gulp:

southside rocks
09-19-2006, 03:17 PM
This makes me sick. Isn't it the managers/coaches/leaders in the clubhouses job to make sure they are as hungry? Or am I just delusional? Why even show up to play if you're going to have this attitude? Go home and let someone who wants to be there play.

I know there are lots of different opinions on this, on how much a manager contributes and motivates or doesn't -- but I have a couple of problems with the idea that the lack of effort is the fault of management.

First of all, these are grown men and professional athletes we're talking about. Not a Little League team. Not a college football team. They can't motivate themselves?!?!

Second, most managers make a relatively small fraction of what their established and star players make, and have shorter contracts. What's Ozzie making, $2-3 million a year? And he's supposed to "motivate" Paul Konerko, let's say, who makes $12 million a year? Um, doesn't compute.

Money motivates. But how do you motivate a guy who already has plenty of money?? I hear talk from people who work at the park, that this team is chillin' in the locker room talking about the $$$$ they're raking in from appearances and endorsements and autographs. I have no idea how true that is, but this team sure hasn't appeared to be motivated by the World Series shares this year -- I guess it's easier to sign a thousand baseballs than to beat the Twins, huh?

The players should be motivating each other, and the manager should be keeping it rolling. Last year's team did that. This year's team hasn't done that.

Jurr
09-19-2006, 03:24 PM
These guys, though it seems ridiculous to say, played like they were absolutely exhausted from the entire whirlwind of being instant Chicago (and national) celebrities.

They went from role players to headliners on Oprah. There are tons of examples to illustrate that they had one helluva offseason.

When it came time to get to spring training, they were all jazzed up and ready to roll, and it showed.

When the dog days hit, it seemed like this team tuned out, and that led to some pretty mediocre play over the span of 3 months. 3 MONTHS!!!

I believe that with a little tweaking and a full offseason to stew about this season's disappointment, they'll be back and hungrier next year.

I'm just hoping they get some speed to counterbalance this mashing.
Hawk said it last night. That homer hitting mindset is a pathology. It's something that takes hold in the mindset of a team, and we saw it point blank this season. Yes, the pitching struggled, but the hitting never came out and set a "grinding" tone.

soxfan13
09-19-2006, 03:35 PM
How many Sox on this current roster are beyond reproach? JD? JC? JT? PK?
While they may be "producing" and almost all others are subject to being singled out for underachieving, these 4 guys clog up the middle of the lineup and can be blamed too.




I guess JD, JC, JT, and PK will all have to bat about .500 and hit all HRs so they dont clog the bases anymore.

gobears1987
09-19-2006, 03:41 PM
Some managers too.:dtroll:

Ozzie is hungry. I think his multiple ejections this year show he really does want to keep winning.

Paulwny
09-19-2006, 03:43 PM
Money motivates. But how do you motivate a guy who already has plenty of money?? I hear talk from people who work at the park, that this team is chillin' in the locker room talking about the $$$$ they're raking in from appearances and endorsements and autographs. I have no idea how true that is, but this team sure hasn't appeared to be motivated by the World Series shares this year -- I guess it's easier to sign a thousand baseballs than to beat the Twins, huh?

The players should be motivating each other, and the manager should be keeping it rolling. Last year's team did that. This year's team hasn't done that.

Ding, Ding, we have a winner.

ode to veeck
09-19-2006, 03:52 PM
Sorry, I just can't put any credence to whatever Joe Cowardly puts in writing, the guy is drooling for any opportunity to trash the Sox right behind Moronatti and Greenfield.

The season's still here, so let's focus on the upcoming games, not dwell on a season mispent before it's over

NoNeckEra
09-19-2006, 03:54 PM
I guess JD, JC, JT, and PK will all have to bat about .500 and hit all HRs so they dont clog the bases anymore.
The point is, that our 3-7 hitters(including A.J.) can't run. That's not THEIR fault, and I didn't say it was. This is not exactly the "go-go Sox", and I doubt we'll have as slow a line up next year.

Lip Man 1
09-19-2006, 04:00 PM
Ode:

I'm assuming you saw Daver's comment's about what took place in the thread about what Jimmy Greenfield supposedly said in that e-mail?

Lip