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View Full Version : *Official* [teal]Bobby's finished[/teal] postgame thread!


rdwj
09-13-2006, 01:14 AM
Remember being excited about this O??

Seems soooooo long ago!

Now it's just a team of easy outs flailing away

zmz723
09-13-2006, 01:14 AM
remember when we thought we had 5 aces? seems sooooo long ago

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:15 AM
Remember when we were ahead of the Twins?


....

kevingrt
09-13-2006, 01:15 AM
remember when we thought we had 5 aces? seems sooooo long ago


Now we do, we just dont have a bullpen or clutch hitting. Oh well this sucks.

TheLittleBulldog
09-13-2006, 01:15 AM
Seems soooooo long ago!

Now it's just a team of easy outs flailing away


I actually think some guys had real good at bats tonight. The season is over at this point, but there were some good at bats tonight.

NoShoesJoe
09-13-2006, 01:15 AM
**** it. I love the team, but I am not investing any more emotional capital this season. I don't have any more to spare. If they win, fantastic, if not, I'm spent.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:16 AM
Not sure what is going on, but something needs to be said. This is just silly.

kevingrt
09-13-2006, 01:16 AM
I actually think some guys had real good at bats tonight. The season is over at this point, but there were some good at bats tonight.

That's the spirit, keep on kicking trooper.

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:18 AM
I actually think some guys had real good at bats tonight. The season is over at this point, but there were some good at bats tonight.
Do you just concede to diarrhea or do you do something about it? We are going to take this division and win the world series.

QCIASOXFAN
09-13-2006, 01:18 AM
Remember in the late innings when you always had a great feeling that we were going to pull through....... long ago.

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:19 AM
Macdougal > Jenks :?:

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:19 AM
Jenks is done......no better then Riske or Cotts.

kitekrazy
09-13-2006, 01:19 AM
**** it. I love the team, but I am not investing any more emotional capital this season. I don't have any more to spare. If they win, fantastic, if not, I'm spent.

They'll win 4 in a row just to mess with you.

kevingrt
09-13-2006, 01:19 AM
Remember in the late innings when you always had a great feeling that we were going to pull through....... long ago.

About a half season ago. Very long ago.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:19 AM
Rubber game tommorrow... we need a win to keep us on a high note till Friday.

Deuce

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:20 AM
Do you just concede to diarrhea or do you do something about it? We are going to take this division and win the world series.


Hahahahahaha! :D:

Oh my god, that was hilarious. You made me laugh even though we lost tonight. Thanks!

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:20 AM
Tough loss. We just have to find a way to score some runs tomorrow, bounce back and take the series.

Our starting pitching is coming around. That's a reason for optimism. Unfortunately, this offense is slumping, and we've wasted a number of good pitching performances as of late. Tonight is no exception.

rookie
09-13-2006, 01:20 AM
I love you Joe, but I place this one on you.
There are only so many games left, and we can't seem to gain any ground. I don't know...

kevingrt
09-13-2006, 01:20 AM
Jenks is done......no better then Riske or Cotts.

You guys are insane. We mite as well jsut throw him under the bus. You guys figure out that Crede had runners on 1st and 3rd 1 out and did absolutely nothing! Why is he not done for? Come on kids, we should have never gotten to extra innings.

0o0o0
09-13-2006, 01:21 AM
This team has some big, big problems.

ajismyhero
09-13-2006, 01:21 AM
If we can take the series tomorrow, we're in fine shape. This should be the "i could have been asleep" thread - but oh well. Tonight proved how important JD is to this ball club. When he goes 0 for 4 - it's tough to pull out a win. Hopefully, it was a one day slump.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:21 AM
Jenks is done......no better then Riske or Cotts.:whatever:

Jenks is hurting. He needs time off. If he is not ready to play, Ozzie should do us all a favor and rest him. He is not "done" though.

Deuce

PorkChopExpress
09-13-2006, 01:21 AM
That was a tough loss to a tough team fighting for their own playoff spot. Burls had a great start and the runs he gave up were a homer that was hit off a pitch 2 inches off the ground, and a bloop single. Our offense let us down tonight. What happened to clutch Crede? All we needed was a long fly ball Joe. You seem to hit those all the time. Oh well. Let's get em tomorrow and hope Minny falters a little.

Qdaddy
09-13-2006, 01:21 AM
Jenks is just throwing a very hittable fastball right now. His down 4-6 mph off his fastball and it has no life on it. Once we lose him....we're officially done. We're getting to the point of a must sweep Detroit situation.

I wish I had more faith, but we just can't come up with a big hit or pitch.

Boondock Saint
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
The Chicago White Sox...it's the new anti-clutch.

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
You guys are insane. We mite as well jsut throw him under the bus. You guys figure out that Crede had runners on 1st and 3rd 1 out and did absolutely nothing! Why is he not done for? Come on kids, we should have never gotten to extra innings.

3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
You guys are insane. We mite as well jsut throw him under the bus. You guys figure out that Crede had runners on 1st and 3rd 1 out and did absolutely nothing! Why is he not done for? Come on kids, we should have never gotten to extra innings.

I agree. I think sometimes pitchers take more of the blame (and credit) than they deserve. Its not like Bobby was playing this entire game by himself.

CHISOXFAN13
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
Jenks is done......no better then Riske or Cotts.

He gets a ground ball that would have been a double play if anyone else was running...

The Twins score four runs off a reliever who had an ERA of 1.02 entering action, and the Rangers fail to capitalize on several scoring opportunities as the Tigers win.

Baseball magic is a bitch, and unfortunately, the White Sox don't have it, while the other two teams in the division have a horseshoe so far up their asses that it won't fall out.

Crede's at-bat against K-Rod was horse****, and don't even get me started on A.J.'s little weak come backer.

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

Out of how many sucessful saves...?

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:22 AM
3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

Your what hurts? Bobby got the save last night.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:23 AM
3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

He didn't blow yesterday's save... hello!?!?!?!

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:24 AM
He gets a ground ball that would have been a double play if anyone else was running...

The Twins score four runs off a reliever who had an ERA of 1.02 entering action, and the Rangers fail to capitalize on several scoring opportunities as the Tigers win.

Baseball magic is a bitch, and unfortunately, the White Sox don't have it, while the other two teams in the division have a horseshoe so far up their asses that it won't fall out.

Crede's at-bat against K-Rod was horse****, and don't even get me started on A.J.'s little weak come backer.

Crede got caught looking for a slider, and K-Rod threw a fastball right by him. Against a guy who throws 95+, you can't look for a breaking ball with two strikes. Bad approach by Joe.

Playah
09-13-2006, 01:24 AM
This thread title sucks for 2 reasons:

1) it has nothing to with the original title which was something like "Remember when we had offense" ... and this new title makes no sense given the posts on the first page.

2) After a crappy loss like this, nothing is more annoying than a thread title that is seeminly dismissive to people that are PISSED OFF. This teal bull**** just does that: tries to pre-emptively make fun of people that are pissed about what happened.

PorkChopExpress
09-13-2006, 01:24 AM
3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

Not a blown save tonight, just a loss.

roadrunner
09-13-2006, 01:25 AM
I blame pods for running us out of our one big inning. what the **** did he slow down for? simply inexcusable. thanks for last year but i'll be glad when he's off the team.

ND_Sox_Fan
09-13-2006, 01:25 AM
3 runs in 11 innings just won't cut it.

Our 3-5 hitters were 1-13, not including Gload's double.

CLR01
09-13-2006, 01:25 AM
rock > ndgt10+chicken dinner

rdwj
09-13-2006, 01:26 AM
This one isn't on Bobby - or any of the pitchers. It's on a pathetic offense that can't seem to string together a couple of hits OR even hit a fly ball with a man on third.

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:26 AM
rock > ndgt10+chicken dinner
Somebody's obsessed with me. LMAO

QCIASOXFAN
09-13-2006, 01:26 AM
:whatever:

Jenks is hurting. He needs time off. If he is not ready to play, Ozzie should do us all a favor and rest him. He is not "done" though.

Deuce
I love Jenks as much as you, but if he is hurt why the hell does Ozzie keep putting him out there? I'm not throwing him under the bus or anything but Ozzie said he was fine the other day so whats the deal? Also he is not built to go more than 1 inning!

CLR01
09-13-2006, 01:27 AM
This thread title sucks for 2 reasons:

1) it has nothing to with the original title which was something like "Remember when we had offense" ... and this new title makes no sense given the posts on the first page.

2) After a crappy loss like this, nothing is more annoying than a thread title that is seeminly dismissive to people that are PISSED OFF. This teal bull**** just does that: tries to pre-emptively make fun of people that are pissed about what happened.


They deserve it. Title stays.

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:27 AM
Not a blown save tonight, just a loss.

I agree....sorry and last night he did get the save but was very scary. He just can't throw strikes anymore and getting behind in the count is costing him every time.

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 01:27 AM
Bobby shouldn't have been out there because a) I don't think he is 100%, b) we didn't have the lead, and c) McCarthy should have grown a pair by now and learned to pitch in the majors. When we hit the 10th, that should be McCarthy territory. Since he would have promptly served up a homer, Bobby and Thornton had to go out there.

It has become painfully obvious that Iguchi cannot turn a double play to save his life. He is a pretty good 2B, but he is horrible at getting out of the way and getting the throw off. The inning should have ended before Figgins came up.

Once again, our offense is horrible, and we lost a well pitched game. Everytime we get into an extra inning game, we see the difference between our offense and better ones (and for the record, I would trust the Angels' offense more than ours right now). Whoever we play in extras always seems to get leadoff singles, hit and run, bunt runners over, and slap out a victory. In contrast, every time our hitters step up to the plate in extras, they try to hit it 700 feet (as opposed to the 600 feet they normally aim for). We got one decent AB in the last two innings, a great hustle double from Gload, and AJ couldn't hit a weak grounder fast enough. This "powerful" offense is the downfall of the team. But hey, when they are golfing in October they will be happy to brag to their friends that they hit 250 homers this year!

CHISOXFAN13
09-13-2006, 01:27 AM
This one isn't on Bobby - or any of the pitchers. It's on a pathetic offense that can't seem to string together a couple of hits OR even hit a fly ball with a man on third.

The Sox have managed to score in only two of 20 innings in this series. The offense needs to wake up and in a hurry.

I still hold out hope that with the improved starting pitching, that this team can rattle off eight in a row or something.

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:28 AM
Also he is not built to go more than 1 inning!
Maybe not, but he is built to eat 10 steaks in one sitting.

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:28 AM
3 runs in 11 innings just won't cut it.

Our 3-5 hitters were 1-13, not including Gload's double.

Concerning stat about our offense: We have only scored runs in three of our last 31 offensive innings, dating back to Saturday night.

Two runs in the first Sunday.
Three runs in the fifth last night.
Three runs in the fifth tonight.

Other than that, a bunch of zeroes.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:29 AM
2) After a crappy loss like this, nothing is more annoying than a thread title that is seeminly dismissive to people that are PISSED OFF. This teal bull**** just does that: tries to pre-emptively make fun of people that are pissed about what happened.No one is happy about losing. However, this knee-jerk reaction people have when someone is in a slump is predictable and tired. Jenks isn't done, but people will say it because they are pissed. Then, a few days from now Jenks will rule again and everyone will love him for it... pathetic.

CHISOXFAN13
09-13-2006, 01:29 AM
Concerning stat about our offense: We have only scored runs in three of our last 31 offensive innings, dating back to Saturday night.

Two runs in the first Sunday.
Three runs in the fifth last night.
Three runs in the fifth tonight.

Other than that, a bunch of zeroes.

Wow, I hadn't given thought to the struggles of Sunday added to the first two games in Anaheim.

Thome needs to get it going...

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:29 AM
Bobby shouldn't have been out there because a) I don't think he is 100%, b) we didn't have the lead, and c) McCarthy should have grown a pair by now and learned to pitch in the majors. When we hit the 10th, that should be McCarthy territory. Since he would have promptly served up a homer, Bobby and Thornton had to go out there.

It has become painfully obvious that Iguchi cannot turn a double play to save his life. He is a pretty good 2B, but he is horrible at getting out of the way and getting the throw off. The inning should have ended before Figgins came up.

Once again, our offense is horrible, and we lost a well pitched game. Everytime we get into an extra inning game, we see the difference between our offense and better ones (and for the record, I would trust the Angels' offense more than ours right now). Whoever we play in extras always seems to get leadoff singles, hit and run, bunt runners over, and slap out a victory. In contrast, every time our hitters step up to the plate in extras, they try to hit it 700 feet (as opposed to the 600 feet they normally aim for). We got one decent AB in the last two innings, a great hustle double from Gload, and AJ couldn't hit a weak grounder fast enough. This "powerful" offense is the downfall of the team. But hey, when they are golfing in October they will be happy to brag to their friends that they hit 250 homers this year!

You are dead wrong about Iguchi. In the American League, only Luis Castillo is better at turning a DP.

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:30 AM
Wow, I hadn't given thought to the struggles of Sunday added to the first two games in Anaheim.

Thome needs to get it going...

Yes, he does. And so do several other people. We're also having some bad luck. Quite a few liners hit right at fielders tonight.

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:31 AM
The only clear reality is that this kind of baseball isn't cutting it.

PorkChopExpress
09-13-2006, 01:31 AM
Maybe not, but he is built to eat 10 steaks in one sitting.

If only he was built to eat a Figgins.

:jenks:
"I'm bigger than you. I'm higher on the food chain. Get in my belly!"

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:32 AM
[quote=PorkChopExpress;1344100]If only he was built to eat a Figgins.quote]
Winner!

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:32 AM
I love Jenks as much as you, but if he is hurt why the hell does Ozzie keep putting him out there? I'm not throwing him under the bus or anything but Ozzie said he was fine the other day so whats the deal? Also he is not built to go more than 1 inning!This isn't new for Ozzie. He has a tendancy to leave pitchers in too long. Jenks is having pains, but there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him. However, Ozzie can see that his velocity is down and he still puts him out there. Honestly, I don't know why, but that is Ozzie's way.

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 01:33 AM
I love Jenks as much as you, but if he is hurt why the hell does Ozzie keep putting him out there? I'm not throwing him under the bus or anything but Ozzie said he was fine the other day so whats the deal? Also he is not built to go more than 1 inning!
Who the **** is going to pitch? The phenom McCarthy is serving up homers left and right. The "untouchable" one has been horrible lately. Ditto Cotts. Ditto Riske in his last 6 appearances. We have three reliable relievers right now.

ndgt10
09-13-2006, 01:33 AM
This isn't new for Ozzie. He has a tendancy to leave pitchers in too long. Jenks is having pains, but there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him. However, Ozzie can see that his velocity is down and he still puts him out there. Honestly, I don't know why, but that is Ozzie's way.
Ozzie = stubborn? :?:

0o0o0
09-13-2006, 01:33 AM
We all could have been asleep a lot earlier if they just gave the Sox 2 strikes as they came to the plate. Unreal how often they were behind in the count.

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:33 AM
This isn't new for Ozzie. He has a tendancy to leave pitchers in too long. Jenks is having pains, but there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him. However, Ozzie can see that his velocity is down and he still puts him out there. Honestly, I don't know why, but that is Ozzie's way.

He has few options. I suppose he could have gone to MacDougal, but other than that, who do you trust? McCarthy? Cotts? Riske? Logan?

Boondock Saint
09-13-2006, 01:33 AM
Thome needs to get it going...

Yeah, he does, but he's not the only one. When we score like we have been lately, EVERYONE needs to get it going. You can point the finger in nine different directions, and you'll end up pointing at someone that's not getting the job done offensively.

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:34 AM
On a positive note:

Buehrle looked good tonight. Much better than last time. Aparently, him and AJ work pretty decently together.

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:35 AM
On a positive note:

Buehrle looked good tonight. Much better than last time. Aparently, him and AJ work pretty decently together.

The starting pitching SHOULD give us all hope. Everyone is starting to throw the ball better. The offense is killing us right now.

Damn, I wish we could get all the parts working at once.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 01:36 AM
Ozzie = stubborn? :?:I don't know if it is stubbornness or a philosophical belief that only by pitching will pitchers work through their problems.

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 01:36 AM
You are dead wrong about Iguchi. In the American League, only Luis Castillo is better at turning a DP.
He can turn the double play very well on a ball hit to him, but we have seen him countless times not get the throw off, or not be able to avoid contact, causing him to either lob it (which he did in the 11th) or throw it wide. It is frustrating to know that inning should have been over, but it isn't he fault we lost. He had 2 of the 3 RBIs for the best offense in baseball.

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 01:36 AM
Don't know if this has been mentioned or not but in seven of the last ten games the Sox have scored three runs or fewer.

I don't know what to say about this, pretty surprising (and disappointing).

The starters have been pitching well...now the offense goes into a funk. These guys simply can't 'get it together' this season.

Lip

southsideirish71
09-13-2006, 01:36 AM
Our offense has decided to mail it in here in the 2nd half.

Over 500 runs in the first half best in baseball.

In the 2nd half, we decide to become pull and lift hitters and how we are 12th in baseball with 272 runs scored and 17 games left. Our O has scored a whole 3 runs more than KC. And here is the best part, we have scored 8 less than the 14 million dollar Marlins.

The only time we score in the last two games is in one inning. Were we abandon the pull offense and hit the ball back up the middle and the other way. I mean if something succeeds why go against it. The next inning they are swining for the fences and King and hitting 3 dog bounces to the SS.

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:36 AM
I don't know if it is stubbornness or a philosophical belief that only by pitching will pitchers work through their problems.

It's more a lack of options than anything else.

Injured Jenks > McCarthy, Cotts, Riske

PorkChopExpress
09-13-2006, 01:37 AM
On a positive note:

Buehrle looked good tonight. Much better than last time. Aparently, him and AJ work pretty decently together.

Totally. Like I had mentioned earlier, the runs he gave up were of ts-type (tough sssituation). It really does look like our starters are picking it up. I just hope it's not too little too late.

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:37 AM
Time is running out....and we lost a full game on both teams we were trying to catch......not good.

Playah
09-13-2006, 01:38 AM
No one is happy about losing. However, this knee-jerk reaction people have when someone is in a slump is predictable and tired. Jenks isn't done, but people will say it because they are pissed. Then, a few days from now Jenks will rule again and everyone will love him for it... pathetic.

Excuse me, but who said he is done? No one that I saw..

I like Jenks and I don't blame him for tonight's loss in the least. (that honor I save for Pods and/or Ozzie)

My point is that these titles are annoying in their pre-emptiveness. It goes something like this:

"I just KNOW a dark cloud will come out and say something after a crappy loss like this .. so I am going to look superior by making fun of them before it happens... and pretend this loss doesnt sting because at least I put this imaginary dark cloud in his place."

-Leo

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 01:38 AM
Roman:

I think Ozzie mentioned last month something along the lines of 'double plays being down,' and that was hurting the Sox.

I understand about Uribe (his concentration comes and goes) but perhaps Iguchi's ankle is still bothering him. (I remember reading something last week or so talking about him having problems for four months now...another one of those 'minor' 'nagging' injuries that have been killing the Sox since early in spring training.)

Lip

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 01:42 AM
Roman:

I think Ozzie mentioned last month something along the lines of 'double plays being down,' and that was hurting the Sox.

I understand about Uribe (his concentration comes and goes) but perhaps Iguchi's ankle is still bothering him. (I remember reading something last week or so talking about him having problems for four months now...another one of those 'minor' 'nagging' injuries that have been killing the Sox since early in spring training.)

Lip
That may be, but the whole time he has been here, he hasn't been able to avoid contact, causing him to a) not get a throw off, b) throw it wide, or c) make a weak throw. I heard that they play differently in Japan, and guys don't go into second hard like they do here. Either way, he should have adjusted by now.

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:44 AM
You can't blame this loss (or any other) on nagging injuries. That's BS.

SoxandtheCityTee
09-13-2006, 01:46 AM
It really does look like our starters are picking it up. I just hope it's not too little too late.

Me too. I'm just hoping to win every series from here on out, I figure good starting pitching and reasonable offense and relief can do that. If it takes more than that to get into the playoffs -- if the Twins don't cool off a bit and Detroit manages to stop the slide, if the Sox need a real streak -- then everything will have to come together in a way it hasn't done lately. Still could happen, but till then just win two of every three and we'll see. G'night.

DeadMoney
09-13-2006, 01:46 AM
2.5 out and 17 to go. I hope they show all they've got, because that's what it's going to take to keep pace and play catch-up (with a tough schedule).

The only thing I'm going to say about tonight are:
- I don't know if I like Jenks in a tie game on the road, but Ozzie's the manager and I'm not making the decisions.

Bill Naharodny
09-13-2006, 01:47 AM
Roman:

I think Ozzie mentioned last month something along the lines of 'double plays being down,' and that was hurting the Sox.

I understand about Uribe (his concentration comes and goes) but perhaps Iguchi's ankle is still bothering him. (I remember reading something last week or so talking about him having problems for four months now...another one of those 'minor' 'nagging' injuries that have been killing the Sox since early in spring training.)

Lip

That was going to be a tough one to turn, but -- if anything -- I thought Uribe was a little too deliberate getting it to Iguchi. Tough to find fault there, though.

BNLSox
09-13-2006, 01:50 AM
**** it. I love the team, but I am not investing any more emotional capital this season. I don't have any more to spare. If they win, fantastic, if not, I'm spent.

That's why I sadly sold my tickets to both last night and tonight's games. I don't enjoy wins anymore, I just dread losses. Too much of a rollercoaster for me at this point. Now I'm just hoping from a little bit further down the sideline as I watch through my hands covering my eyes.

kitekrazy
09-13-2006, 01:51 AM
Do you just concede to diarrhea or do you do something about it? We are going to take this division and win the world series.

I could see Ray Charles or Stevie Wonder saying that.

This team can't put together a winning streak.

Quality starts are negated by inconsistent bullpen and lack of clutch hitting.

Not being able to beat the teams under .500.

2 1/2 out of the wild card behind a team that plays good fundamental baseball.

Bad luck.

You'd think after 2 months it would go away. I wish it would but it hasn't.

This isn't team that should be in the playoffs. Too bad they are not in the Natl League.

kitekrazy
09-13-2006, 01:53 AM
The Chicago White Sox...it's the new anti-clutch.

That's pretty much it. It's like a 180 from last year.

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 01:54 AM
Bill:

More and more I think Uribe is out the door this off season. I think Ozzie has started to sour on him and they don't really need his 18 home runs as much as they need reliable defense, speed and a guy near the bottom of the order who can get on, get guys over and turning over the lineup.

Chicken:

I'm not making excuses for anybody. I'm simply stating that unlike the Twins and Yankees who have lost guys, then had them come back healthy, the Sox have had player after player after player suffer these damn back, shoulder, sciatic nerve, ankle injuries since Posednik and Contreras went down in the spring. It's never bad enough to cost them a lot of time but it IS affecting their performance. They aren't 100% and missing games is doing little to stabilize the lineup or give Ozzie any reason to stick with a set one (even if he wanted to...)

Lip

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 01:58 AM
This isn't team that should be in the playoffs. Too bad they are not in the Natl League.

Too bad they're not in almost ANY other division!

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 01:59 AM
Lip

I don't think there is any team out there that's not going through the same health issues that we are. We flat out haven't been playing good baseball. Pitching and defense with some offense sprinkled in. The pitching sucks. The starters have been better but the pen (except for Thornton) has been pathetic.

drewcifer
09-13-2006, 01:59 AM
Bill:

More and more I think Uribe is out the door this off season. I think Ozzie has started to sour on him and they don't really need his 18 home runs as much as they need reliable defense, speed and a guy near the bottom of the order who can get on, get guys over and turning over the lineup.

Chicken:

I'm not making excuses for anybody. I'm simply stating that unlike the Twins and Yankees who have lost guys, then had them come back healthy, the Sox have had player after player after player suffer these damn back, shoulder, sciatic nerve, ankle injuries since Posednik and Contreras went down in the spring. It's never bad enough to cost them a lot of time but it IS affecting their performance. They aren't 100% and missing games is doing little to stabilize the lineup or give Ozzie any reason to stick with a set one (even if he wanted to...)

Lip

Lip:

When does consistent winning happen AGAIN?????

soxinem1
09-13-2006, 02:00 AM
3 blown saves in a row......hello!!!

3-2 win saved by Bobby last night?

And no save tonight chief! Buerhle blew it. Besides, the big guy is obviously battling out there, he has nothing in terms of stuff right now.

MUsoxfan
09-13-2006, 02:01 AM
We're a very jaded group at this point. The one bad thing about winning the World Series is that it can really only go down from there. One World Series in 88 years and many of us turn into Yankee-like fans

Myrtle72
09-13-2006, 02:02 AM
And no save tonight chief! Buerhle blew it.

Did you watch the game?

(Or was that supposed to be in teal?)

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 02:04 AM
3-2 win saved by Bobby last night?

And no save tonight chief! Buerhle blew it. Besides, the big guy is obviously battling out there, he has nothing in terms of stuff right now.

I already posted correcting my error. He still keeps giving up runs though. MB did not blow this game. That 1st inning homer was actually a good (decent) pitch.

kitekrazy
09-13-2006, 02:05 AM
This isn't new for Ozzie. He has a tendancy to leave pitchers in too long. Jenks is having pains, but there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with him. However, Ozzie can see that his velocity is down and he still puts him out there. Honestly, I don't know why, but that is Ozzie's way.

Ozzie had hope that maybe Jenks would also be reliable. There's only 2 guys out of 70 in that pen that are reliable. It's hard to win in extra innings on that or yank your starter after 6.

Bill Naharodny
09-13-2006, 02:05 AM
Bill:

More and more I think Uribe is out the door this off season. I think Ozzie has started to sour on him and they don't really need his 18 home runs as much as they need reliable defense, speed and a guy near the bottom of the order who can get on, get guys over and turning over the lineup.


Lip


Jimmy Rollins. He'll be here next year. I think it'll happen.

drewcifer
09-13-2006, 02:05 AM
Whatever happens, happens. It all boils down to tomorrow and the series against the A's.

Our boys give a **** and win, or they don't.

They got more talent and depth than ANY other team out there. Their fans have been behind them.

It's that simple.

They get it done, or they don't.

I'm tired - Another wasted opportunity/night.

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 02:07 AM
Jimmy Rollins. He'll be here next year. I think it'll happen.
Batting 9th? Wonderful
Batting 1st? No thanks. His OBP is no bueno.

Nellie_Fox
09-13-2006, 02:07 AM
They got more talent and depth than ANY other team out there.Without being a "dark cloud" or a "Pollyanna," have you looked at the Yankees lineup?

Playah
09-13-2006, 02:07 AM
I hate pods. Who's with me

BA: The Hitman
09-13-2006, 02:10 AM
Last year was all about great starting pitching, timely hitting, and a solid and reliable bullpen.

These are things that we have yet to see on a regular basis this season. I don't even know what else to say except that this really blows. But hey, at least we have the bears to look forward to! :D:

Chicken Dinner
09-13-2006, 02:10 AM
I think everyone is tired and frustrated. Hopefully a good nights sleep will clear our heads (and the players too). 17 to go!!

TheOldRoman
09-13-2006, 02:11 AM
I hate pods. Who's with me
Totally. I was so pissed when he made AJ take that horrible swing at a bad pitch and hit a weak grounder after Gload's hustle double. Damn that Pods!

I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, but Owens ****ed up big time when AJ hit that single in the 9th. He stopped and started to go back right as the ball got to Guerrero, which was stupid. If Vlad catches that, Owens is doubled off by 30 feet. He should have kept on running, and he might have been able to score.

BA: The Hitman
09-13-2006, 02:11 AM
I hate pods. Who's with me


There's plenty who are with you on that one.........I wouldn't expect to see him patrolling left field at the cell next year.

drewcifer
09-13-2006, 02:11 AM
Without being a "dark cloud" or a "Pollyanna," have you looked at the Yankees lineup?

Yes.

I live in NY.

100 Year Itch
09-13-2006, 02:12 AM
It looks like Thome is making a concerted effort to cut down on his strike out ratio.

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs/409_DH_daily_full_4_20060911.png

... and draw more walks.

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs/409_DH_daily_full_3_20060911.png

However, the change in plate philosophy is negatively impacting his power numbers.

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs/409_DH_daily_full_6_20060911.png

Charts courtesy of Fangraphs.
(http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs.aspx?playerid=409&position=DH&page=6&type=full)

MUsoxfan
09-13-2006, 02:12 AM
I hate pods. Who's with me

Not me.

http://media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper410/stills/iq9pmtds.jpg

You shouldn't be with you either

Nellie_Fox
09-13-2006, 02:13 AM
Yes.

I live in NY.And you avoid the implied question. You still think the Sox have more talent than any other team "out there?"

kitekrazy
09-13-2006, 02:15 AM
Bill:

More and more I think Uribe is out the door this off season. I think Ozzie has started to sour on him and they don't really need his 18 home runs as much as they need reliable defense, speed and a guy near the bottom of the order who can get on, get guys over and turning over the lineup.

Chicken:

I'm not making excuses for anybody. I'm simply stating that unlike the Twins and Yankees who have lost guys, then had them come back healthy, the Sox have had player after player after player suffer these damn back, shoulder, sciatic nerve, ankle injuries since Posednik and Contreras went down in the spring. It's never bad enough to cost them a lot of time but it IS affecting their performance. They aren't 100% and missing games is doing little to stabilize the lineup or give Ozzie any reason to stick with a set one (even if he wanted to...)

Lip

I think Uribe will be there next season. He's just going to have to compete for a starting job.

CYGarland20
09-13-2006, 03:17 AM
Another wasted opportunity/night. That's been the Sox mantra for the past month or so. This team is just not going to go on any extended streak, they can't seem to put everything together at the same time. When the offense is raking, the pitching sucks, and when the starters get it going, the BP and the Offense sucks.......... It's been frustrating to say the least, and i hope they turn it around quick, but I'm certainly not holding my breath........ At this point I'd rather they either go on a roll or tank it, I can't take this rollercoaster ride anymore....

WhiteSox1983
09-13-2006, 03:19 AM
Totally. I was so pissed when he made AJ take that horrible swing at a bad pitch and hit a weak grounder after Gload's hustle double. Damn that Pods!

I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, but Owens ****ed up big time when AJ hit that single in the 9th. He stopped and started to go back right as the ball got to Guerrero, which was stupid. If Vlad catches that, Owens is doubled off by 30 feet. He should have kept on running, and he might have been able to score.

I agree, i was thinkin the same thing. Oh well me and my freind will be at the game tomorrow, guarenteed victory with me in attendance! :bandance:

JB98
09-13-2006, 03:20 AM
That's been the Sox mantra for the past month or so. This team is just not going to go on any extended streak, they can't seem to put everything together at the same time. When the offense is raking, the pitching sucks, and when the starters get it going, the BP and the Offense sucks.......... It's been frustrating to say the least, and i hope they turn it around quick, but I'm certainly not holding my breath........ At this point I'd rather they either go on a roll or tank it, I can't take this rollercoaster ride anymore....

Look at it this way: One way or another the rollercoaster ride is going to be over soon. Either the Sox will turn it on, make the playoffs and make everybody happy. Or the season will end in 19 days.

CYGarland20
09-13-2006, 03:21 AM
Oh well me and my freind will be at the game tomorrow, guarenteed victory with me in attendance! :bandance:Were facing a LH we've never seen before, That's a Guaranteed loss unfortunately

gbergman
09-13-2006, 03:21 AM
I'm pissed. Gload made no effort to field the grounder that Anderson hit in the 11th inning. That was a horse **** effort after he ****ing dives for a foul grounder the pitch before. Jerry Owens made a mistake of not running through second on AJ's hit that would of scored him. I could tell from my seat along third base upper view he wasn't going to catch that.

Plys can we score more than 3 runs against these guys. In 20 innings played we have scored in 2 of them. We need to win tomorrow and have Detroit and Minnesota lose so we can make up this game.

CYGarland20
09-13-2006, 03:24 AM
Look at it this way: One way or another the rollercoaster ride is going to be over soon. Either the Sox will turn it on, make the playoffs and make everybody happy. Or the season will end in 19 days.
At this point I would say the latter will happen. We have had golden opportunities to gain ground the last few weeks, and we have blown it....I guess all we can hope for at this point is that those last 3 games in Minnesota ACTUALLY mean something....

SOXintheBURGH
09-13-2006, 04:23 AM
Can't win the World Series every year.

TDog
09-13-2006, 04:45 AM
Reading about the loss was depressing enough. Reading this thread makes me feel worse.

Grzegorz
09-13-2006, 05:54 AM
Were facing a LH we've never seen before, That's a Guaranteed loss unfortunately

Easy with the negative waves man... :D:

Take care of business tonight and hope the Tigers & Twins lose...

The White Sox need help from the outside that's for sure but if the White Sox don't control their own situation it's over.

BTW, I do not hate Pods; to put the team's entire playoff situation on his shoulders is inaccurate. Baseball is a team game and the number of times this team has hit on all cylinders has been few and far between.

IF the White Sox do not make the playoffs the biggest hurt for me will be that this franchise has never made the playoffs in consecutive years. Consistency builds fans, winning traditions, and sheds the loser label.

DrCrawdad
09-13-2006, 06:23 AM
He gets a ground ball that would have been a double play if anyone else was running...

The Twins score four runs off a reliever who had an ERA of 1.02 entering action, and the Rangers fail to capitalize on several scoring opportunities as the Tigers win.

Baseball magic is a bitch, and unfortunately, the White Sox don't have it, while the other two teams in the division have a horseshoe so far up their asses that it won't fall out.

Crede's at-bat against K-Rod was horse****, and don't even get me started on A.J.'s little weak come backer.

Seems like I've been waiting for months for this team to go on a winning streak. Tonight I turned the TV off and went to bed w/o the radio on. I needed to get uninterupted rest.

After last seasons high, it's so sad to see this team piss away the chance(s) they've had to grab a firm hold of either the division or wild card lead.

Now, I still will hope for last run, but that hope is just a flicker.

wsoxfan111
09-13-2006, 07:05 AM
It aint over til it's over

Get MacDougal in there

soxfanatlanta
09-13-2006, 07:35 AM
That is one nasty whole our team is digging. Not to late to work out of it, though.

DaveIsHere
09-13-2006, 07:42 AM
Seems like I've been waiting for months for this team to go on a winning streak. Tonight I turned the TV off and went to bed w/o the radio on. I needed to get uninterupted rest.

After last seasons high, it's so sad to see this team piss away the chance(s) they've had to grab a firm hold of either the division or wild card lead.

Now, I still will hope for last run, but that hope is just a flicker.

Exaclty what i have been doing. The most frustrating thing over any pitching woes, is the 2nd half opportunities to be winning this division and getting runners home in scoring position, that is the actual issue. I am at wits end, I dont know how to feel at this point......I am numb

Malgar 12
09-13-2006, 07:52 AM
Do you just concede to diarrhea or do you do something about it? We are going to take this division and win the world series.

From one extreme to the other. Any realistic person knows that there is hope, but that its very slim.

Deuce
09-13-2006, 08:08 AM
Excuse me, but who said he is done? No one that I saw..

Then you didn't look very hard.

Jenks is done......no better then Riske or Cotts.

My point is that these titles are annoying in their pre-emptiveness. And the dark clouds are equally, if not more, annoying in their predictability. We win, they are in love. We lose, they want to "end the experiment" or pick on someone for something he didn't create.

I hate pods. Who's with me:rolleyes:

Definately, not I. I'm not happy with Pods' performance as of late, but I don't hate him for it. The guy helped the Sox win their first World Series title in 88 years... he has my respect for as long as I am a fan. Besides, Pods is just part of the problem. Our entire offense is underperforming as of late.

Deuce

TomBradley72
09-13-2006, 08:48 AM
JD has had some big games/homers lately. So has PK.

I know Thome's banged up and still has some nice overall numbers...but sure seems like he's disappearing right when we need him the most.

Thome25
09-13-2006, 08:57 AM
The 2006 White Sox are playing like so many other teams we've seen in the past.

They look awesome on paper but, they are playing with bad team chemistry. i.e. When we're hitting we're not pitching and vice versa.

It's too bad we can't win the World Series on paper because we look alot better than most of the teams in the playoff hunt.

I will continue to believe in this team until we are mathmatically eliminated. (Hopefully, that doen't happen.)

Dan H
09-13-2006, 08:59 AM
Remember in the late innings when you always had a great feeling that we were going to pull through....... long ago.


Exactly. This is their fourth straight extra inning loss. Along with bad relief pitching, the offense comes up with no key hits in the late innings.(Except for Dye.) You can't go to the playoffs compiling one game winning streaks. It is over. It has been over.

esbrechtel
09-13-2006, 09:08 AM
(Except for Dye.)

dye does not have a hit so far this series....
that being said you cannot blame just one guy on the offense...
i dont think it is fair to blame crede who had two stellar ABs and one bad one just because it was at the end of the game...im with those guys who said owens should have just kept running, he was already toast if vlad caught it might as well gamble....maybe he would have scored maybe not...it is also important to note that k-rod hasnt allowed a run in quite awhile so hes pretty locked in...the sox just need to step it up a bit

samram
09-13-2006, 09:23 AM
We're a very jaded group at this point. The one bad thing about winning the World Series is that it can really only go down from there. One World Series in 88 years and many of us turn into Yankee-like fans

Sorry, but I expect the Sox to win the WS every year, and I certainly expected this group to do so.

Rooney4Prez56
09-13-2006, 09:28 AM
We can win all we want, but if Minnesota and Detroit don't lose, its all for nothing. The Sox have done the worst thing possible.


They have left their fate in the hands of someone else.

ZombieRob
09-13-2006, 09:31 AM
Lets face even if we don't want to .The Sox have a chance sure,but honestly don't you think they are big trouble now?The offense is lacking ,the bullpen really stinks all of a sudden and the defense isn't really there.I believe the Sox best chance is if Detroit completely falls flat on their faces.

samram
09-13-2006, 09:33 AM
Ok, here's the deal. The Sox have 17 games left, as do the Tigers; the Twins have 18. If the Tigers go 8-9, the Sox have to go 12-5 to catch them. If the Twins go 9-9, the Sox have to go 11-6 to catch them. I have strong doubts that the fellas have either of those runs in them. They haven't shown that ability in three months. That's wonderful if you think the Sox will do that, but admit that it's not based on any type of real evidence, but on faith or hope.

The Sox, IMO, have to win three of the last four on this trip, then sweep the homestand. I also still believe they have to have the lead in either the WC or division going into the Dome. This is a real steep hill to climb.

Hitmen77
09-13-2006, 09:40 AM
Offense for this series:

2 innings: 6 runs
17 innings: zero runs.


Just when the starting pitching comes around, the offense takes a vacation. With our offense, we should be in the midst of a great run of wins dating back to Labor Day.

Time is running out fast.

batmanZoSo
09-13-2006, 09:43 AM
Sorry, but I expect the Sox to win the WS every year, and I certainly expected this group to do so.

Agreed in full, sir. Forget the playoffs--even if we do get there and lose, the season is a failure. As of right now, the prospect of even getting there becomes closer to a miracle with each wasted opportunity.

If others want to be happy with last year, that's their prerogative. I save my sentimentality for the winter offseason. Right now is a new year and last year means nothing. For a team this good to miss the playoffs is a crime and it's not often that the White Sox put out a team this talented.

batmanZoSo
09-13-2006, 09:46 AM
Exactly. This is their fourth straight extra inning loss. Along with bad relief pitching, the offense comes up with no key hits in the late innings.(Except for Dye.) You can't go to the playoffs compiling one game winning streaks. It is over. It has been over.

This is the first day where I have no reason for arguing against that. It's all about faith now. Nothing to do but keep watching and hoping something just happens.

PaulDrake
09-13-2006, 09:54 AM
We're a very jaded group at this point. The one bad thing about winning the World Series is that it can really only go down from there. One World Series in 88 years and many of us turn into Yankee-like fansNo, it's just that they don't look like anything close to a playoff team, and we don't want to wait another 88 years to celebrate. This team is built to win now and has underperformed. KW has his work cut out for him this off season.

batmanZoSo
09-13-2006, 09:55 AM
No, it's just that they don't look like anything close to a playoff team, and we don't want to wait another 88 years to celebrate. This team is built to win now, and has underperformed badly. KW has his work cut out for him this off season.

That's the bright side to this mess, if indeed we don't make it. Heads will roll.

samram
09-13-2006, 09:58 AM
That's the bright side to this mess, if indeed we don't make it. Heads will roll.

Yeah, this offseason will not lack for activity. I don't blame KW for this mess. He put together a championship caliber club (on paper, but that's his job) and filled in the biggest hole, the bullpen, with guys with pretty decent track records.

Dan Mega
09-13-2006, 10:02 AM
The season isn't over yet but the window of opportunity is closing fast. This was the worst time of the season to lose.

Thome25
09-13-2006, 10:04 AM
Yeah, this offseason will not lack for activity. I don't blame KW for this mess. He put together a championship caliber club (on paper, but that's his job) and filled in the biggest hole, the bullpen, with guys with pretty decent track records.

That's the bright side to this mess, if indeed we don't make it. Heads will roll.

I don't agree with the opinion that heads will roll. This team doesn't need a major overhaul.

Hopefully there won't be any addition by major subtraction. Look what the Red Sawx did by "Rebuilding" their World Series team from 2004. They suck this year.

As a die-hard White Sox fan, I don't want any part of that. We need a new leadoff hitter/LF, a new SS, and some bullpen help and that should take care of this mess.

SoxFan78
09-13-2006, 10:07 AM
Last year when the Sox were in a close game, I knew they were gonna win.

This year when the Sox are in a close game, I had no idea if they would win or lose.

I had a sinking feeling when the game went to extra innings that the Sox wouldn't score anymore, and I was right.

Im as big as a opitimist as anybody, but im not sure what to think anymore.

kevingrt
09-13-2006, 10:13 AM
This is the first day where I have no reason for arguing against that. It's all about faith now. Nothing to do but keep watching and hoping something just happens.

That is all I have right now, faith. I'll still watch the game on WGN today, but I don't have that confidence, well never really have the whole second half of this season. But I do have faith.

I have no clue what I just said.

batmanZoSo
09-13-2006, 10:20 AM
I don't agree with the opinion that heads will roll. This team doesn't need a major overhaul.

Hopefully there won't be any addition by major subtraction. Look what the Red Sawx did by "Rebuilding" their World Series team from 2004. They suck this year.

As a die-hard White Sox fan, I don't want any part of that. We need a new leadoff hitter/LF, a new SS, and some bullpen help and that should take care of this mess.

That's how you run a baseball team from year to year. Don't use an inept organization as an example. One could just as easily look at the Yankees, who make myriad personell changes every year, yet manage to make the postseason every year. What did we start 06 with, eleven different players from the team that won the World Series? Hm, you'd think we'd avoid fixing what isn't broken at a time like that. This team definitely needs a "major overhaul," by definition of makeup not necessarily in quantity. There are a few obvious weak links that aren't up to snuff and whose subtraction alone might pay dividends before their replacements are even factored into the equation.

palehozenychicty
09-13-2006, 10:21 AM
As I heard it went to extra innings, I knew that we wouldn't pull it out. If we get today's game, we can keep pace. But detroit has to continue scuffling, or we have some tough odds.

0o0o0
09-13-2006, 10:22 AM
I agree, i was thinkin the same thing. Oh well me and my freind will be at the game tomorrow, guarenteed victory with me in attendance! :bandance:

Were facing a LH we've never seen before, That's a Guaranteed loss unfortunately

The end of the world is here. :mg:

G-Ville Sox
09-13-2006, 10:25 AM
Go Bears!

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 10:28 AM
Thome:

Just my opinion but Kenny's going to change a third of the roster. That means eight or nine new guys.

He could be looking at anything and everything including getting a shortstop, a left fielder, a center fielder, a lead off hitter, guys who can run and bunt at the top and bottom of the order, two arms for the bullpen and another starter if he deals one.

To me that's a 'major' overhaul. And I can't argue with him over it.

Lip

Thome25
09-13-2006, 10:37 AM
That's how you run a baseball team from year to year. Don't use an inept organization as an example. One could just as easily look at the Yankees, who make myriad personell changes every year, yet manage to make the postseason every year. What did we start 06 with, eleven different players from the team that won the World Series? Hm, you'd think we'd avoid fixing what isn't broken at a time like that. This team definitely needs a "major overhaul," by definition of makeup not necessarily in quantity. There are a few obvious weak links that aren't up to snuff and whose subtraction alone might pay dividends before their replacements are even factored into the equation.

Only time will be able to answer this question but, maybe Kenny did a little too much tinkering in the wrong areas before this season on a team that had just won the world series.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think last year's team would've won it all this season but the team didn't need to be changed so drastically into a team with questionable pitching (bullpen especially) and a lineup of sluggers who swing for the fences and clog up the basepaths.

I'd hate to see him do something too dramatic in the off-season. I think we need some better hitting, speed, and defense from the LF and SS positions (Dave Roberts and Julio Lugo anyone?) and some more bullpen studs and everything else should take care of itself.

I'd hate to see Kenny go bananas breaking up a team that won the World Sries in the not too distant past.

As far as your example of the Yankees goes. Yeah they made the playoffs every year for the last 10 years by changing their roster year in and year out. But obviously that's just not how it's done anymore. They haven't won the World Series in 6 years.

Simply making the playoff just isn't good enough anymore. We as fans want a team that can win every year. A dynasty of core players that are going to stay together for a little while and do some damage.

palehozenychicty
09-13-2006, 10:42 AM
Simply making the playoff just isn't good enough anymore. We as fans want a team that can win every year. A dynasty of core players that are going to stay together for a little while and do some damage.

Indeed. This team, with a little tinkering, can compete for the next two-three years. They just need a little more speed and fundamentally sound players e.g. Freel and Brady Clark would be perfect for this team and the grinder mentality.

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 10:45 AM
Thome:

Making the playoffs in ten or twelve straight years is certainly 'good enough' for me.

Hell I'd settle for doing something like five out of eight years.

Considering this club has NEVER made the post season in consecutive years in 106 years they've been playing that's a hell of an accomplishment.

It sure beats waiting every 40 years or so for a World Series.

Lip

spiffie
09-13-2006, 10:47 AM
Agreed in full, sir. Forget the playoffs--even if we do get there and lose, the season is a failure. As of right now, the prospect of even getting there becomes closer to a miracle with each wasted opportunity.

If others want to be happy with last year, that's their prerogative. I save my sentimentality for the winter offseason. Right now is a new year and last year means nothing. For a team this good to miss the playoffs is a crime and it's not often that the White Sox put out a team this talented.
Problem is this is not that good. Oh it looked that good at the beginning of the year, but when you see what you are actually dealing with it is not as imposing. We have a bullpen with 2-3 dependable arms and a bunch of crapshoots. Starting pitching that is not able to approach last year's numbers. Gaping holes at the top and bottom of the order. And in-game management from Ozzie which, now that his pitching isn't papering over his mistakes, is being exposed as not exactly top of the heap. If we had the Pods, Cotts, Hermanson, Politte, Buehrle, Garcia, and McCarthy of last year, then yeah, we'd be unstoppable. But instead we have a leadoff hitter who ranks nearly dead last in everything, 4 bullpen arms with no ability to consistently pitch good innings, the heart of our pitching rotation is gutted by Buehrle and Garcia being nowhere close to last season's output, and while I expect Brian Anderson to one day be an all-star CF, for the first few months of the year we were carrying a guy hitting .170 in the starting lineup, along with Uribe who is slowly sinking towards .230 and below.

Right now, this is not the best team in baseball. It is not even the best team in the division. That doesn't mean they can't win the division, or make the playoffs, hell they can still win the World Series. But I think we're far enough into the season that we can say the results tell the tale more than the potential. This is a good team with some major holes that need to be addressed this offseason if we are going to compete in the best division in baseball.

Thome25
09-13-2006, 10:52 AM
Thome:

Making the playoffs in ten or twelve straight years is certainly 'good enough' for me.

Hell I'd settle for doing something like five out of eight years.

Considering this club has NEVER made the post season in consecutive years in 106 years they've been playing that's a hell of an accomplishment.

It sure beats waiting every 40 years or so for a World Series.

Lip

I'd have to agree with making the playoffs at the same rate the Braves did would be an accomplishment.

But, at the same time we can't go back to the same old mentality before we won it all which was: "cool we won the division and made it to the playoffs and got knocked out in the first round but, at least we made it to the post season."

There's a major difference between what you're pointing out and what I'm saying.

I want the team to have a core of players and management that stays together for a while, has an identitiy, and has a prolonged run of success. i.e. Smoltz, Andruw and Chipper Jones and Bobby Cox in Atlanta and Torre, Jeter and company in NY.

Not the usual hit-or-miss revolving door of players and management that we're used to.

The Sox have caught lightning in a bottle. Now they have to hang onto it and not mess things up.

viagracat
09-13-2006, 10:57 AM
I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, but Owens ****ed up big time when AJ hit that single in the 9th. He stopped and started to go back right as the ball got to Guerrero, which was stupid. If Vlad catches that, Owens is doubled off by 30 feet. He should have kept on running, and he might have been able to score.

Good point.

Jerko
09-13-2006, 11:23 AM
Ya know, when we were "carrying a .170 hitter" at the beginning of the year, we had a damn good record. Maybe because the same lineup was used every once in a while? We're in a playoff chase and I continually see names like Haeger, Owens, Gload, Mackowiak, Sweeney etc. in these threads. Since the all-star break, has the "opening day" lineup started 10 games together? They were 17-3 before the break with that lineup, so in effect, the DEFENDING CHAMPS have used their "starting" linuep less than 40 times, with 2 and a half weeks left. That's pitiful, especially since we've been the chasers, not the chase-ees most of the year. The time for experimentation is.............NOT NOW!!!! I like all those players I mentioned earlier, but this is crunch time now. I know the players are bustin their butts, but sometimes it looks like Oz is the one who is "not really trying" by some of the moves he makes. That's when the frustration level kicks in and you get all the "he's done" or "he has to go" posts.

FedEx227
09-13-2006, 11:30 AM
Ya know, when we were "carrying a .170 hitter" at the beginning of the year, we had a damn good record. Maybe because the same lineup was used every once in a while? We're in a playoff chase and I continually see names like Haeger, Owens, Gload, Mackowiak, Sweeney etc. in these threads. Since the all-star break, has the "opening day" lineup started 10 games together? They were 17-3 before the break with that lineup, so in effect, the DEFENDING CHAMPS have used their "starting" linuep less than 40 times, with 2 and a half weeks left. That's pitiful, especially since we've been the chasers, not the chase-ees most of the year. The time for experimentation is.............NOT NOW!!!! I like all those players I mentioned earlier, but this is crunch time now. I know the players are bustin their butts, but sometimes it looks like Oz is the one who is "not really trying" by some of the moves he makes. That's when the frustration level kicks in and you get all the "he's done" or "he has to go" posts.

I agree completely. Although the pitching has truly been our downfall, I think tinkering the lineup Jerry Manuel-esque every single day is just annoying. We're preparing our bench guys for the postseason... but...eh... one problem, we're in third place.

Jjav829
09-13-2006, 11:33 AM
Ya know, when we were "carrying a .170 hitter" at the beginning of the year, we had a damn good record. Maybe because the same lineup was used every once in a while? We're in a playoff chase and I continually see names like Haeger, Owens, Gload, Mackowiak, Sweeney etc. in these threads. Since the all-star break, has the "opening day" lineup started 10 games together? They were 17-3 before the break with that lineup, so in effect, the DEFENDING CHAMPS have used their "starting" linuep less than 40 times, with 2 and a half weeks left. That's pitiful, especially since we've been the chasers, not the chase-ees most of the year. The time for experimentation is.............NOT NOW!!!! I like all those players I mentioned earlier, but this is crunch time now. I know the players are bustin their butts, but sometimes it looks like Oz is the one who is "not really trying" by some of the moves he makes. That's when the frustration level kicks in and you get all the "he's done" or "he has to go" posts.

And if Konerko would have stayed in the game and AJ grounded into a DP, or if Konerko only got to second on AJ's hit, you probably would have complained about Ozzie not pinch-running.

That was absolutely the right move. I don't know what you are complaining about. The starting lineup had all the usual players. And if you're going to complain complain about Mackowiak over Anderson, remember Mackowiak had a big hit in the middle of our 3-run 5th.

Jerko
09-13-2006, 11:43 AM
And if Konerko would have stayed in the game and AJ grounded into a DP, or if Konerko only got to second on AJ's hit, you probably would have complained about Ozzie not pinch-running.

That was absolutely the right move. I don't know what you are complaining about. The starting lineup had all the usual players. And if you're going to complain complain about Mackowiak over Anderson, remember Mackowiak had a big hit in the middle of our 3-run 5th.

Nah, if I would have complained about anything, I would have said "if Konerko was still in the game he might have fielded that grounder that Gload didn't get to".

I'm not only talking about yesterday's game Jjav; it's been a season long issue with me, plus I said I liked all those guys (mack, gload, etc). Just not now. Hawk keeps talking about a "ryhthm", which is hard to accomplish when your main guys are together less than 1/4 of the time.

southside rocks
09-13-2006, 12:13 PM
Remember being excited about this O??

Seems soooooo long ago!

Now it's just a team of easy outs flailing away

remember when we thought we had 5 aces? seems sooooo long ago

Remember when we were ahead of the Twins?

....

Remember losing 10 straight to start the season in 1968?

Remember Terry Bevington as manager?

Remember the strike of 1994 ripping away the best season the Sox had put together in forever?

Remember Jerry Reinsdorf's persistent attempts to move the White Sox out of Chicago, and how close he came to succeeding a couple of times?

I remember those things, and as a senior citizen of fandom, may I say, graciously and with no personal animosity, suck it up and **** with the "remembers". This is a very good team. They're having a very good season. Are they great? No. Why not? Oh, who knows, and who cares. It is what it is, for pete's sake.

Take a look at the 8 teams that won the divisions and wild cards last year. Are THEY all kicking butt and the Sox the only team that's not a mile ahead? Uh, hardly!

The Red Sox are a collapsed souffle, 10 games out of first place.

The Yankees are repeating, but I suggest that the Yankees payroll puts them in a class that does not allow comparisons.

The Sox are still in the race.

The Angels are still in the race, but they are farther back in their division than the Sox are in theirs.

The Braves are 19 games out of first place. No repeat there!

St. Louis is repeating, but not at last year's 100-win pace, that's for sure.

The Astros -- who? where? Not eliminated yet, but 6 back.

The Padres might do it again, but they're in second place, not ahead by a mile.

REPEATING ISN'T EASY!

slavko
09-13-2006, 12:18 PM
That may be, but the whole time he has been here, he hasn't been able to avoid contact, causing him to a) not get a throw off, b) throw it wide, or c) make a weak throw. I heard that they play differently in Japan, and guys don't go into second hard like they do here. Either way, he should have adjusted by now.

You're on to something there. They don't slide going into second. My memory bank is telling me that one time Sox SS Alan Bannister, playing as a high schooler against a Japanese team (touring Japan?, can't recall) hit a baserunner in the forehead with a double play throw, killing him. Anyone remember this?

Currently, we can't manufacture runs any more. Our speed guys at the top and bottom of the lineup are killing us. That's why we only have big innings. We're back to 2004. Still....it's not too late.

RowanDye
09-13-2006, 12:40 PM
I still hold out hope that with the improved starting pitching, that this team can rattle off eight in a row or something.

Eight in a row may not do it...

JB98
09-13-2006, 01:33 PM
Yeah, this offseason will not lack for activity. I don't blame KW for this mess. He put together a championship caliber club (on paper, but that's his job) and filled in the biggest hole, the bullpen, with guys with pretty decent track records.

If we don't make the playoffs, KW will be more furious than anyone here at WSI. I look at that as a good thing. Even if the team rallies and wins the World Series, he will make changes. He proved that last offseason. In the event that this team fails, we can take solace in knowing that KW will not accept the losing, and he will not trot the same exact team out there next year and expect a different result.

samram
09-13-2006, 01:38 PM
If we don't make the playoffs, KW will be more furious than anyone here at WSI. I look at that as a good thing. Even if the team rallies and wins the World Series, he will make changes. He proved that last offseason. In the event that this team fails, we can take solace in knowing that KW will not accept the losing, and he will not trot the same exact team out there next year and expect a different result.

I agree. I haven't lost any confidence in KW. The interesting thing to see will be whether he accomodates Ozzie's, uh, tendency to use guys in other than their natural positions by making sure every position can be played by someone on the bench, or if he tells Ozzie to put the guys he gives him in the best position to contribute. Maybe one in the same.

Lip Man 1
09-13-2006, 02:26 PM
Slavko:

Actually the fatality took place when Bannister was in college. I think he went to either Arizona or Arizona State.

Lip

WizardsofOzzie
09-13-2006, 02:36 PM
Eight in a row may not do it...

8 in a row, we gain an absolute minimum of 3 games on Detroit, most likely more since i doubt they would be keeping pace. That would put either us or the twinkies in first, with the other having the wildcard lead......how would 8 in a row not do it again? :dunno:

CLR01
09-13-2006, 03:00 PM
8 in a row, we gain an absolute minimum of 3 games on Detroit, most likely more since i doubt they would be keeping pace. That would put either us or the twinkies in first, with the other having the wildcard lead......how would 8 in a row not do it again? :dunno:


You're not thinking dark enough.

TDog
09-13-2006, 03:08 PM
Slavko:

Actually the fatality took place when Bannister was in college. I think he went to either Arizona or Arizona State.

Lip

Both of the White Sox Bannisters (but not the 4-minute-mile guy) played for ASU. There were large pictures of them ins some sports complex I registered in as a graduate student years ago.

PorkChopExpress
09-13-2006, 03:33 PM
I forgot to bring this up last night/today, but with all this talk about Tito not turning double plays at second, did anyone else notice that slide Vlad took on the double play they did turn? He was no where near the bag and just went right into Iguchi. I dislike crap like that whether it mattered or not. Can you tell I am bored at work today?

FielderJones
09-13-2006, 04:41 PM
Were facing a LH we've never seen before, That's a Guaranteed loss unfortunately

Another brilliant dark cloud prediction. Well played,sir. :rolleyes:

assrevolution
09-13-2006, 04:50 PM
8 in a row?! How about we start with 3 in a row? maybe even 2.

slobes
09-13-2006, 05:00 PM
Eight in a row may not do it...

We've been playing .500 ball for quite a while and haven't lost any ground the past couple of weeks. I would think 8 in a row would put us at least in the lead for the wild card, if not the division. Neither the Tigers nor Twins are playing stellar baseball at the moment.

assrevolution
09-13-2006, 05:02 PM
We've also been playing under .500 ball for well over the last 50+ games. These are many different ways to look at it however you carve up the number of games in a particular streak. Also, 1 winning series in the last 8 is tough for morale.

hawkjt
09-13-2006, 07:19 PM
well, now its 2 winning series in the last 9

1.5 back with 16 to play. no progress yet this week but I feel a lot better today. Garland,Javvy, and Jose have to pitch their arses off again this weekend. Just get us to the detroit series 2 back so we wont absolutely have to sweep the tigers. Be nice if we did tho.

Loaiza tomorrow vs JonG. Estaban has been very hot lately. Go Sox.

slavko
09-14-2006, 12:58 AM
Slavko:

Actually the fatality took place when Bannister was in college. I think he went to either Arizona or Arizona State.

Lip

Thanks, Lip. I was in the ballpark though about not sliding in Japan.